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#1 Everton_Worshiper

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Posted 08 Apr 2008 - 13:17

OK been away for a while, so thought I would come back with a debate.

http://www.evertonfc...sonal-goal.html

For me, he can take a run and jump off a cliff (IMHO) - his interview sums this up for me. I just get the impression he is not one for the club and doesn't give a stuff about Everton in the slightest.

Your thoughts?
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#2 BlueToffee

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Posted 08 Apr 2008 - 14:10

OK been away for a while, so thought I would come back with a debate.

http://www.evertonfc...sonal-goal.html

For me, he can take a run and jump off a cliff (IMHO) - his interview sums this up for me. I just get the impression he is not one for the club and doesn't give a stuff about Everton in the slightest.

Your thoughts?


Sums his attitude up for me.He is 22 and has already played at 4 clubs- he is more trouble than he is worth.Even laying aside his comments about playing for himself, he has been useless.I have noticed alot of people suggesting we may be4 paying £8 million or so for him in the summer.That is over double what I would pay for him.He is greedy, lazy, gives the ball away and can't tackle or track back.Let's get rid.
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#3 EFCfanatic

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Posted 08 Apr 2008 - 15:45

Totally agree with both of you. His history shows me he has no loyalty. Before people start banging on about theres no real loyalty by footy players, I believe that all our other players would fight for the cause. Don't believe he has at all this season and it looks like a lack of effort to me. Im not doing it for everton only me. Fuck u 'en.

Im not havin that at all. Get rid indeed.

Edited by EFCfanatic, 08 Apr 2008 - 15:46.

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#4 adz09

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Posted 08 Apr 2008 - 15:48

Bit harsh. He may not of been at his best. But we all know he is a quality midfielder. for all his faults. he is good on the ball, can play a killer pass. can strike the ball from distance, good vision. I would take him. As Moyes has said he might just need a little nurturing. Remember he is only 22 Yrs old.
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#5 chicagoblue

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Posted 08 Apr 2008 - 15:52

I'm going to continue to reserve judgment through the end of the season. I do think we need to consider that he's been struggling with a couple of rather hindering injuries and has only just started to get into the side. He's got the ability and talent that we need. Now we just need to find out if his under performance this term is due to lack of desire or if it is more related to his setbacks. I'm still hopeful and would like to see him really settle into the side. In any case I don't think we'll be paying more than 8 for him, and I think he may be available for that as long as Koeman stays in the job at Vallencia.
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#6 aaron

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Posted 08 Apr 2008 - 16:05

i like the lad, after what i saw last season then im all for him signing. After what ive seen this season im not too sure. I'll decided come end of season and the price tag is more known.
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#7 jamiemaher85

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Posted 08 Apr 2008 - 16:28

Got to agree with you. Loved him last season but this season he has been hit and miss, i think that expectation has run so high that he was never going to do as well as any of us had hoped, even so he has been a disspointment on his second spell here. Saying that though he has still shown signs and touches of real quality, i would still like to see him here permanantly but only for the right price.

personally i think that what this lad needs is some stability. He is jumping around from club to club, league to league, its going to be hard for him to settle in anywhere if he doesn't know where his future lies. I think that if we keep him we will start to see what we got glimpses of last year, he needs to stay at a club for more than 6 months if he is going to do anything with his career. I just hope he stays with us (but only for the right price of course :P )
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#8 thebluenose

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Posted 08 Apr 2008 - 17:59

hes improved in the last 2 games. still needs to work hard though and impress in games. we know what hes capable of. he needs to pull his finger out and start assisting goals and scoring man utdesque goals in the next 5 games.
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#9 BlueBri

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Posted 09 Apr 2008 - 08:08

Hi Guys. Been away a very long time. Just trying to catch up on what is going on, but had to coomment on this.

Manny was a sensation last season and we woul have all been very pleased had the transfer gone through. Following the questionable circumstances, everyone's opinion was split. What wasn't c;ear was just how much influence Manny had on the farce. His comments were misleading and didn't convince me he was a straight shooter (sorry).

On his return, Moyes has obviously thought he would try him again and at the very least hope for a repeat. However, this time, it's not just Manny's ability that is under scrutiny and I think his true colours are showing. He seems to be a bit of a drifter and has to be 'loved' a litle too much. I don't think he will now fit in to our team ethic and will be moved on, gratefully on recent showings. His distribution and pass completion have been abismal, although, he has shown he can string a pass occasionally (pass for Osman was sublime).

I don't think he is playing for the team he left last year and it shows, as he is not as much of a 'star'. Personally, in this situation, I think it is better not to go backwards and would have much preferred Appiah or players of that ilk rather than go with Manny again. There is no denying he is talented but he can't seem to get the attitude or the consistency right. Hate to say it, but I told you so.
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#10 BlueToffee

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Posted 09 Apr 2008 - 11:49

Bit harsh. He may not of been at his best. But we all know he is a quality midfielder. for all his faults. he is good on the ball, can play a killer pass. can strike the ball from distance, good vision. I would take him. As Moyes has said he might just need a little nurturing. Remember he is only 22 Yrs old.


I disagree with everything you have said there.He isn't that good on the ball, instead he delays delivering the ball and gets caught in possession frequently.Aside from the pass for Osman, which I admit was impressive, he hasn't proved a thing.The argument that he is injured and needs match fitness is false hope for me.The argument is disregarded when applied to Arteta, yet everyone clings to it where Fernandes is concerned.

We do not know he is a quality midfielder and hence shouldn't sign him, based on cureent evidence.
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#11 StevO

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Posted 09 Apr 2008 - 16:03

he has been poor since he came back, but if we could get him for £6m maybe less id go for him. the lad does have quality, we have seen it before, and in glimpses this season, we need him confident and in a stable position and i think we would see the potential come through.

edit:
if you watch the interview on evertontv, i think hes being very honest. id rather him be saying hes playing for himself, trying to prove he is upto it, rather than just waxing lyrical about i love this club and all the usual cliche shit footballers come out with.

Edited by StevO, 09 Apr 2008 - 16:05.

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#12 adz09

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Posted 10 Apr 2008 - 09:06

I disagree with everything you have said there.He isn't that good on the ball, instead he delays delivering the ball and gets caught in possession frequently.Aside from the pass for Osman, which I admit was impressive, he hasn't proved a thing.The argument that he is injured and needs match fitness is false hope for me.The argument is disregarded when applied to Arteta, yet everyone clings to it where Fernandes is concerned.

We do not know he is a quality midfielder and hence shouldn't sign him, based on cureent evidence.


Did you not watch him one bit last season?
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#13 Philinsuffolk

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Posted 10 Apr 2008 - 20:12

Ask Rangers fans what they made of Arteta when he was younger.

Fernandes is a player good enough to play CL football. So, if we want to move on to the next level this is the kind of player we will need to work with...those with the talent but not quite the temperament yet to play for the regular CL clubs. We won't be able to aford Central Midfielders who have it all, so we have to take a chance. Or go for someone with slightly less talent but a better ethic naturally.

Before shooting me down, I would have been disgusted if we had bought Barton so don't think I'm someone easy on the difficult players. Just my thoughts.
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#14 Guest_blueboy122_*

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Posted 10 Apr 2008 - 20:22

Nope!! Agree With You Phil In London!
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#15 Blue4Ever

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Posted 10 Apr 2008 - 20:32

Ask Rangers fans what they made of Arteta when he was younger.

Fernandes is a player good enough to play CL football.
So, if we want to move on to the next level this is the kind of player we will need to work with...those with the talent but not quite the temperament yet to play for the regular CL clubs. We won't be able to aford Central Midfielders who have it all, so we have to take a chance. Or go for someone with slightly less talent but a better ethic naturally.

Before shooting me down, I would have been disgusted if we had bought Barton so don't think I'm someone easy on the difficult players. Just my thoughts.

I couldnt say 7 players in our current team that are good enough to do a decent job in the CL.
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#16 StevO

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Posted 11 Apr 2008 - 11:18

I couldnt say 7 players in our current team that are good enough to do a decent job in the CL.


howard
baines
yobo
lescott
arteta (on form)
pienaar
cahill
yak

anybody think kevin nolan worth a shout when bolton go down?
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#17 Bill

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Posted 11 Apr 2008 - 11:46

howard
baines
yobo
lescott
arteta (on form)
pienaar
cahill
yak

anybody think kevin nolan worth a shout when bolton go down?




Yeah, should be within Daveys budget, and that centre half Haangeland that Fulham got for a couple of Million as squad back-up, cos i think this Gardner from Spurs is another Scarlet Pimpernel in the VD Meyde mould.
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#18 Guest_blueboy122_*

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Posted 11 Apr 2008 - 13:59

What Sort Of Player Is Kevin Nolan? Eg Creative?Defensive?
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#19 Bill

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Posted 11 Apr 2008 - 14:24

Just a hard working Midfielder who scores a few goals, a bit like the Leon Osman mould and the same age i would say......


Nolan was brought up in a football playing family, and wanted to be a footballer from a young age. By the age of 14, he was playing for the City of Liverpool's schoolboys team. As a child, he supported Liverpool, although, conversely, his favourite players were Eric Cantona and Lee Sharpe of Liverpool's rivals, Manchester United.

He was asked to come to a Bolton youth team session by a friend, and was soon signed up to the club's books. At the age of 16 he was handed a year-to-year contract, co-inciding with the opening of Bolton's academy. At the age of 17 he signed professional terms and made his first team début.

In his first season in the Premiership (2001-02), Nolan scored 8 goals in the league including 2 at Leicester City on the opening day of the season. The following season Nolan's only goal was the winner at Old Trafford in the game which Bolton recorded their second shock win at the ground. Manchester United manager Alex Ferguson has been seen scouting Nolan.[1] In his third season he amassed a total of 12 goals as Bolton had their best season for 45 years.

Kevin Nolan has previously been called-up to the England Under-21s, but also has Irish ancestry, so could also play for the Republic of Ireland at the full international level. Some commentators have acknowledged that Nolan could be a future candidate for the England squad.[2] There were reports in a local paper, The Bolton Evening News, that he could play for Holland, due to distant Dutch ancestry.[
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#20 Romey 1878

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Posted 11 Apr 2008 - 15:43

anybody think kevin nolan worth a shout when bolton go down?



No thanks. He's gone downhill from a few season a go and tbh I'd prefer someone younger who'll probably cost less i.e. Bradley.
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#21 chicagoblue

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Posted 17 Apr 2008 - 18:14

Well Valencia just wont the Copa Del Rey which leaves Koeman in with a fighting chance if they can just survive relegation. Coupled with Manny's lackluster performances this season I think he might be on the block in the 6 - 8 millions pound range.

At that price I think we'd have to take a serious look at him. I for one will be keeping my fingers crossed that he comes good tonight against Chelsea and that Valencia can just win a few league games to stay in it.
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#22 saaby

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Posted 17 Apr 2008 - 21:37

if valenica do go down then they are forced to sell at whatever price. Im sure fernandes dosent want to play in second devision
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#23 chicagoblue

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Posted 18 Apr 2008 - 14:58

You speak the truth. No idea what I was thinking. Though on the other hand if Koeman was out I'd imagine whoever came in would want the loan players back and who knows what ability Manny has to get out of Valencia if no buyer steps up.
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#24 Romey 1878

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Posted 22 Apr 2008 - 19:10

Well Koeman has been sacked
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#25 Blue4Ever

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Posted 22 Apr 2008 - 19:35

were fucked :(
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#26 Raccyboy

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Posted 22 Apr 2008 - 20:55

still not fussed about this guy - hardly a consistently outstanding performer before and if he were to become one, he'd f*ck off the minute a champions league club started sniffing around

Edited by Raccyboy, 22 Apr 2008 - 20:56.

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#27 jamiemaher85

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Posted 23 Apr 2008 - 15:22

I'd still like him here, shame koeman has got the chop as it makes it harder for us to keep him, anywya i still reckon they would try and charge an inflated price. If manny really wants to stay here then he needs to prove his is worth it over the next few weeks, he has just said he is fullt fit for the first time this year. he has no excuses anymore

all we can do is wait and see what happens, i hate doing that though.
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#28 chicagoblue

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Posted 23 Apr 2008 - 15:24

Well. Not much we can do about the situation at the moment. Let's hope he plays well for us through the next three games and we can go from there.
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#29 Adam

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Posted 24 Apr 2008 - 07:36

Guess thing we don't know is when we took the loan did we agree a price with them anyway and have the option to buy. A bit like with Pienaar.

I am sure that Dortmund would have wanted to charge more than the £2mish that we just paid for him and if he had not signed for us and other clubs offered for him then it would have gone up a lot more than the £2m.

If got a deal in place to sign him if we want then surely the manager getting sacked is not going to matter.

For me I don't think that he will stay. Don't think that he wants to stay over here anyway.
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#30 Everton_Worshiper

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Posted 24 Apr 2008 - 07:58

I don't think he will stay and I hope he doesn't stay. :)
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#31 gwladys

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Posted 24 Apr 2008 - 08:21

I don't think he will stay and I hope he doesn't stay. :)


Agreed, i think 8 million could be spent on another equally (if not more so) talented player.

However if they want to let him go for around a 'Peanut' size price i'm sure we could accomodate!
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#32 Blue4Ever

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Posted 24 Apr 2008 - 09:36

I don't think he will stay and I hope he doesn't stay. :)

You obviously dont no much about football do you, how can you not want a player who has more or less been our best player the last 2 games and is one of the brightest prospects we have had here since god knows when. he has looked way ahead of all our other midfielders in the last few games but no he still isnt good enough in some peoples eyes, hes only 22 ffs. you tell me who we could get instead of fernandes who would actually want to come to us and would be less than 10 million who plays centermidfield?
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#33 MikeO

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Posted 24 Apr 2008 - 10:06

Don't think anyone would doubt his potential or natural ability...goal against ManU at Goodison for example...it's his attitude and desire to play for us that's in question.

Just as important as his footballing skills. VDM has/had undoubted natural ability, done him no good for the last three years.

I'll trust DM to judge the two aspects and decide what price he'd be willing to pay. £4-6m I guess would be worth the risk, not £8m.
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#34 Everton_Worshiper

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Posted 24 Apr 2008 - 10:54

You obviously dont no much about football do you, how can you not want a player who has more or less been our best player the last 2 games and is one of the brightest prospects we have had here since god knows when. he has looked way ahead of all our other midfielders in the last few games but no he still isnt good enough in some peoples eyes, hes only 22 ffs. you tell me who we could get instead of fernandes who would actually want to come to us and would be less than 10 million who plays centermidfield?


:lol: you idiot....I know nothing of football because my opinion of a player differs to yours...? Sheesh, kids these days....

Fernandes has done nothing for us, have you seen our recent form since he started playing more??? (see I do know something about football, 11 players a team you know) He is out for what he can get, has put no visible effort in since "returning" and is not a "prospect". Rooney was a "prospect" Fernandes certainly is not.
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#35 c1982

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Posted 24 Apr 2008 - 10:59

I agree - £4-6m on what he has shown this season. Last summer £8m for manny would have been a snatch - but we known a hell of a lot more about the chap now - and the major sticking point for me is his attitude and most importantly his desire to play for EFC. £8m for what he was 1st spell is fine (wouldn't get much better at that price) but we don't know what he'll be like next season and if his current form/desire is what we're judging him on, then I believe there are better players out there for Everton Football Club.
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#36 c1982

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Posted 24 Apr 2008 - 11:02

Just to add...

Fernandes is no doubt a prospect - Everton Worshiper - noted not as much as a prospect as Rooney (but who is?)

and

Does fernandes actually want to come to us? - blue 4 ever.
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#37 chicagoblue

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Posted 24 Apr 2008 - 15:15

Hard to be surprised no matter what happens now. Since Davey's asked him to step up and play properly in the press he has, but we haven't heard any congratulations from Davey either. Whether or not he'll be staying here, or even wants to, he needs to play well if he wants to get in at Valencia or anywhere else, so I think we'll see him continue to improve. This weekend will be a real test.

Also, even if Arteta is back I'd rather see Manny keep taking the free kicks.
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#38 jamiemaher85

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Posted 24 Apr 2008 - 15:40

I agree about the free kicks but can't see it happening. Think that Manny has got a tasty free kick on him and would only improve given more chances, Arteta is far too wasteful (at least this season) with his set pieces. The amount of corners that fail to beat the first man this season has been incredibly frustrating
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#39 jofanon

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Posted 24 Apr 2008 - 17:41

I agree about the free kicks but can't see it happening. Think that Manny has got a tasty free kick on him and would only improve given more chances, Arteta is far too wasteful (at least this season) with his set pieces. The amount of corners that fail to beat the first man this season has been incredibly frustrating

The guy last year was quality and is starting to get back to form this year. You can just look at him and see he has more class than the vast majority of our players.

Ok so he's is only starting to get back to being a force but these things take some time. He was by far our biggest threat against Chelsea and as far as I'm concerned if you can cause Chelsea problems then you are half a decent player.

I'd much rather we risked something on Fernandes (is that much of a risk) that waste it on a load of journeymen.
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#40 Blue 250

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Posted 24 Apr 2008 - 21:25

Buy Fernandes at the end of the season!.Is Moyes a man or a mouse?...He tells Arteta that Fernandes is taking the free kicks and corners, leaving Arteta on the edge of the area where when he is fully fit he will cause problems.
Having Fernandes up and running to prem speed will take some pressure of Arteta and we may well see him at his very best, meaning he wont be the only player who can play the killer pass or show a bit of skill.More skillfull players will bring the best out of Arteta.
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