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Youth Initiative


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#1 Tricky Trev

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Posted 12 Nov 2009 - 19:45

With the crappy state in our finances and small squad i have realised there have been some posters unhappy with our recent "big" signings and i was wondering should Davey go back to buying "potential" as he seems to have more success buying in the lower leagues. Granted, we should be aiming high but we have no money and the recent injury crisis proves we have no numbers to fill the squad out. Maybe instead of signing one "marquee" signing we buy four or five cheaper players that could make the step up. I got to thinking this after watching the Leeds game the other night, there was a young kid on loan from Leicester called Gradel. Took all the free kicks and looked a confident young player. I'd go for Victor Moses(Palace), Gradel(Leicester),Rhodes(Huddersfield), Westwood (Coventry), Ranger(Newcastle) and in the prem i'd go for Collison, Tompkins and Hines(West Ham), Henderson (Sunderland) none of them might come off but its another option. What do you guys think?
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#2 The Beard

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Posted 12 Nov 2009 - 20:53

I understand what you're saying but that list you mentioned does nothing for me. I don't think I would be looking at any of them apart from Collison and if he goes anywhere you can bet you're bottom dollar he will stay in London. Aim high, I say, aim high!!!
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#3 Blue4Ever

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Posted 12 Nov 2009 - 21:12

I understand what you're saying but that list you mentioned does nothing for me. I don't think I would be looking at any of them apart from Collison and if he goes anywhere you can bet you're bottom dollar he will stay in London. Aim high, I say, aim high!!!

agreed
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#4 Tricky Trev

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Posted 12 Nov 2009 - 21:13

Not to sure about that, Collison is welsh and only got snapped up into West Hams youth academy so he could come. The list is not supposed to make you spunk in your pants. Thats the point they are UNPROVEN. You are buying potential. The way it's going we are going drop further down the league not upwards without investment.
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#5 The Beard

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Posted 12 Nov 2009 - 21:26

Trev, me old mate, I don't soil my silk boxers over anything, well apart from .........nah! that would be telling.

Anyway, you mention the only way is down without investment. Rather counteracts your first post because if we get investment then we don't need to go for untried youth but rather established, quality players. Investment and quality means my friend, as Yazz and her Plastic Population would decree, the only way is up. ;)
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#6 Tricky Trev

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Posted 12 Nov 2009 - 21:34

Trev, me old mate, I don't soil my silk boxers over anything, well apart from .........nah! that would be telling.

Anyway, you mention the only way is down without investment. Rather counteracts your first post because if we get investment then we don't need to go for untried youth but rather established, quality players. Investment and quality means my friend, as Yazz and her Plastic Population would decree, the only way is up. ;)

What i said was that at the moment we have no investment and for the past two seasons we have struggled with a squad that is vastly short of numbers. Probably the biggest dissenters on the forum are about Felliani and occasionaly Billy and the fee we paid. Again, without investment we will be allowed one "big" signing and we will struggle. All i'm doing is suggesting an alternative. Its ok saying think big think big but its ok thinking, what about the practicalities? We have a decent squad when evertybody is fit so we could pad the squad out with young hungry players.
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#7 Bailey

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Posted 12 Nov 2009 - 22:02

The problem is now that most lower league clubs are a bit wiser than they were a handful of years back when we got the likes of Cahill and to some extent Arteta. We can still get youth in cheap but it has to be really young with the likes of Mustafi and Garbutt who are around the 16 mark and I think will still cost around 1 mil, espeically with all the debacle there has been recently (Kakuta/Pogba etc). The prices of young players, especially English, has risen quite a bit. Just look at the summer with Delph and the Kyles at Sheffield Utd not to mention the price of 6mil for Nugent.

I think the only place where players are cheap but it is very much a gamble is in S. America or around that way. Just look at the lads Wigan have brought in who have cost them very little such as Palacios, and some of the other lads whose names I have forgotten :rolleyes: .

Im pretty sure Moyes does look but he probably better off buying semi proven quality than unproven and paying a little bit more for it, and if that doesnt work I say bring Gazza back! :P
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#8 Romey 1878

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Posted 13 Nov 2009 - 07:55

The thing is though, buying just potential means while they realise that potential we'll drop down the league and our senior players (Yak, Cahill, Arteta, Jagielka etc) will get digruntled and leave for a side doing well, and we'll replace them with even more youth and potential which results in a further drop down the league for a while at least.

Can we afford to drop down the league?
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#9 CraccerC

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Posted 13 Nov 2009 - 11:28

i think we can't afford it either way, the risks outweigh the benefits, how many will make it? how many will make it at the level we're trying to achieve? all of a sudden cheap isn't so cheap and you've got half a dozen goslings and jukeboxs about
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#10 c1982

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Posted 13 Nov 2009 - 22:18

A lot of youngsters are mentioned after looking good in a couple of games - i'm sure gosling would look class in league1 and prob in championship too! Unless these youngsters a true quality and 'wonderkids' who will have a 1st team chance now, then they're not going to be much better than what we've already got in baxter, agard, wallace, duffy, etc... why not give them a chance? Probably because they're not quite ready yet the same as which could be said for many of the afore mentioned.
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#11 sheedysheedysheedy

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Posted 13 Nov 2009 - 22:45

i think we can't afford it either way, the risks outweigh the benefits, how many will make it? how many will make it at the level we're trying to achieve? all of a sudden cheap isn't so cheap and you've got half a dozen goslings and jukeboxs about

Totally agree, there is such a step up from the championship to the prem that it is always a big gamble. Some players can look like world beaters a league down but donkeys (harsh?) in the big league (David Nugent and closer to home Stuart Barlow). Also, Collison has been fairly regular in the west ham team fo a couple of season so I would guess he would be a £5m+ gamble.
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#12 Blue4Ever

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Posted 14 Nov 2009 - 12:00

What i said was that at the moment we have no investment and for the past two seasons we have struggled with a squad that is vastly short of numbers. Probably the biggest dissenters on the forum are about Felliani and occasionaly Billy and the fee we paid. Again, without investment we will be allowed one "big" signing and we will struggle. All i'm doing is suggesting an alternative. Its ok saying think big think big but its ok thinking, what about the practicalities? We have a decent squad when evertybody is fit so we could pad the squad out with young hungry players.

so lets just buy a load of championship players who are no where near the standard this league has proved its at then ;) do itallian teams all go out and buy the lower league players and hope for potential? no English players are all about passion and effort, we have enough headless chickens at the club we need players who have good technique to keep the ball on the floor and pass it. no one on that list would get near our best 11 and moyes probably knows that or we might have got in a few of them.
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#13 Tricky Trev

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Posted 14 Nov 2009 - 22:31

so lets just buy a load of championship players who are no where near the standard this league has proved its at then ;) do itallian teams all go out and buy the lower league players and hope for potential? no English players are all about passion and effort, we have enough headless chickens at the club we need players who have good technique to keep the ball on the floor and pass it. no one on that list would get near our best 11 and moyes probably knows that or we might have got in a few of them.

No your quite right right italian teams don't do that they are very similar to spanish teams. They loan out theyr'e best young players or sell them with a buy back clause because they would rather go out and spend theyre wedge on a "name" and realise they had the real deal all the time. But thats irrelevant just like your post. Its a different league with different financial issues. The whole point of the post was to give another option and to discuss. At the end of the day the way Bill is going we have to sell and make profit to stay around the front six and staying in touch with the young talented players may be the way forward
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#14 SharpysVolley

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Posted 16 Nov 2009 - 13:15

We signed 4 players in the summer who were considered 'potential' - 2 who've gone into the reserves and 2 into the youth academy. So it seems to me that we're looking to sign 'potential' and first team players?
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