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I find it quite depressing to be honest.

 

Not the sort of signals we want to be sending out while trying to convince our best players to sign new deals either imo.

maybe theres no more money for players because we are concentrating on giving our best players a new deal?

 

Why is there any surprise? We're always skint, big whoop. But if we keep the same team and form as last year (the one with the 3rd best record in 2010) whats the worry?

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To be honest, if we dont lose anybody this summer we really dont need to buy anyone, the squad is bigger and better than it has been for years.

Could possibly do with a cover at left back and i think Moyes knows that, in Oz against Melbourne he tried Hibbert at left back in the 1st half, and Neville in the 2nd half.

They might have to cover for left and right back this season because it looks as tho Coleman could be our surprise weapon, and might get in ahead of them both this season. ;)

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Why is there any surprise? We're always skint, big whoop.

 

 

So we should just accept that and go on our merry way as all of the sides around us spend to progress? This side finished 8th last season, injuries or no injuries that's a fact, so we should be looking to tweak the side at least. I don't class signing nobodies from the lower leagues of England, Portugal and France as improving a side that should be challenging for European places.

 

None of us should be happy to stand still, we are Everton Football Club, that should still mean something!

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To be honest, the only thing I feel we really need is cover for left back. A loan or bosman at left back for back up would be brilliant, not essential, but should anything happen to Baines like it did to Jags or arteta, I would dread palyign distin or coleman at left back for a full season.

 

Other than that, I think we should just aim to keep peanuts and tets and we should be fine, I don't see a problem in not having money to spend. Besides Moyes is shrewd, there probably is a few mil kicking around but he's probably told them what he needs not what he wants and he's got that, a decent shot stopper for back up and a few forwards to get some competition and more importantly goals. As well as we play when we play well, we're nowhere near clinical. How many 2-2 draws did we have towards the end of last season? Wolves, Brimingham, West Ham?

 

I'm sure if the perfect player at the perfect price came up Moyes would swoop, other than that, I don't think any current players or fans are really worried about the impression it gives off. We've always been skint and Moyes ahas always worked wonders. He always will too.

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So we should just accept that and go on our merry way as all of the sides around us spend to progress? This side finished 8th last season, injuries or no injuries that's a fact, so we should be looking to tweak the side at least. I don't class signing nobodies from the lower leagues of England, Portugal and France as improving a side that should be challenging for European places.

 

None of us should be happy to stand still, we are Everton Football Club, that should still mean something!

We finished 8th because of the shocking start to the season due to injuries and a squad morale screwed over by a greedy bastard, end of. This team finished 3rd in the 2010 rankings, without spending stupid money. City will fail to gel properly again next season, Villa had their peak and will implode like they usually do, Liverpool... hopefully Hodgson is a bad choice for them (though i fear not), Spurs will be tough again.

 

1 slip in the last how many seasons of other teams spending big money around us? Sunderland have a constant source of funds, what do they do? Money doesnt make you a better team, City have proved that. IF we keep our team together and carry on like we did last season, with no money, i will think we will be moving forward.

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I did say all along that I would be happy if we kept the current squad together so I should be quite content.

But to be honest I am a little dissapointed that we have not made at least one addition that could be comsidered

a first team player, if we had snapped up Donovan I would have been happy!

 

As has been said how are we meant to convince Arteta & Piennar that we are a progressive club and that there future

lies here if we cant even afford one single addition to the first XI?

 

To me thats like saying, look lads we know we have gone as far as we possibly can but will you sign anyway?

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Are we now counting the cost of not qualifying for Europe? Even in the Europa, I bet that extra TV revenue goes a long way in convincing the bank manager to loosen the ourse strings a little. Saying that, apart from Man City and Chelsea, I dunno where these clubs are getting their money from, banks won't lend to anyone. Maybe we're better off living within our means before more clubs go the way of pompey when their debts get called in.

 

Yeah it's disappointing we aren't splashing cash on big names, but it's hardly a surprise. I agree Romey, we are Everton FC and yeah that means something, but I don't think we're standing still at all. This is the best squad we've had in a quarter of a century, I have no doubts that this time next year we'll be getting ready for another tilt at Europe, and if we're lucky we'll have a trophy in our back pocket to boot. Just keeping my fingers crossed Pienaar or Arteta don't walk the second week of August :blink:

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I did say all along that I would be happy if we kept the current squad together so I should be quite content.

But to be honest I am a little dissapointed that we have not made at least one addition that could be comsidered

a first team player, if we had snapped up Donovan I would have been happy!

 

As has been said how are we meant to convince Arteta & Piennar that we are a progressive club and that there future

lies here if we cant even afford one single addition to the first XI?

 

To me thats like saying, look lads we know we have gone as far as we possibly can but will you sign anyway?

 

I don't agree to this, Coleman and Rodwell 2 young upcoming talents in british football, have pledged their futures to us. Why arteta, who has played for us for years and is happy here, and pienaar, someone who only this year had his best season with us after we helped him develop as a player, won't sign because we can't progress is rubbish. We need money for a bigger better squad, granted, but so does everyone. We have a starting 11 capable of beating anyone in the league, that's a fact. What we need are younger, enthusiastic players to give competition for places, if arteta gets complacemnt fine, stick rodwell in because he'll play his best every second. Pienaar acting up, that's fine, put magaye gueye on and let him run his arse off for us because he wants to play for us.

 

We have the tools to win the league if we really go for it, and lest we forget peinaar and arteta were worth a combined £4mil when we bought them, the same as a player who decided to move to greener pastures and is now with the barcodes who will finish what, 15th or 16th?

 

Cahill pledged his future immediately, that's a player with ambition. He wants to succeed with us, if peinaar and arteta don't fine, but us not having money does not mean we can't succeed. After all, if we loan Donovan in January again I don't think there's a team in the league on our day who wouldn't be afraid of us.

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To be honest, the only thing I feel we really need is cover for left back. A loan or bosman at left back for back up would be brilliant, not essential, but should anything happen to Baines like it did to Jags or arteta, I would dread palyign distin or coleman at left back for a full season.

 

 

To be honest, I can't complain with Hibbert's performance there on Wednesday!

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So we should just accept that and go on our merry way as all of the sides around us spend to progress?

 

I don't think anyone is saying that Mark, nor is everyone necessarily happy.

Whilst we all want the very best for the club it his to be looked at with realism too.

If Moyes says there is no money then we have to accept there is no money (it could just be a smokescreen) although he does say "There's no cash to sign any more players for the club for the time being" which to me says there may well be a sale or two (Pienaar and/or Arteta?) which would allow more transfers to take place.

To be honest I would rather be in the situation where (we are led to believe) the debt is managable than gamble the future of the club by borrowing too much and everything going tits up ala Pompey/Leeds.

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To be honest, I can't complain with Hibbert's performance there on Wednesday!

 

Fair enough, but would you be happy to play a player out of position for a full season if Baines gets a serious injury? I know we have players capable fo playing that position, and well, for a short time, but for a full season I can see plenty of problems arising from it, especially with playing teams with good wingers, like Lennon, Johnson, Nani, Milner, Walcott etc

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City will fail to gel properly again next season, Villa had their peak and will implode like they usually do, Liverpool... hopefully Hodgson is a bad choice for them (though i fear not), Spurs will be tough again.

 

 

This one bit is what really gets to me about the mentality of a lot of Everton fans, not just you Matt. Why do a lot of Everton fans concentrate on the negative aspects of other clubs for a way for Everton to achieve the grand position of 4th/5th/6th? Why can't we talk about Everton doing something special next season just because we're that fucking good? Lets believe we can sweep all before us not because City failed to gel, Villa got knackered, Spurs faded, or Hodgson buys a bunch of donkeys, but because we're a damn good team and on our day can beat any one. I want to shit on the rest of the league from a great height, not just on the shite like Wigan from a mid-table position.

 

 

Not having a go mate, I'm just a passionate fellow :P.

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I don't agree to this, Coleman and Rodwell 2 young upcoming talents in british football, have pledged their futures to us. Why arteta, who has played for us for years and is happy here, and pienaar, someone who only this year had his best season with us after we helped him develop as a player, won't sign because we can't progress is rubbish. We need money for a bigger better squad, granted, but so does everyone. We have a starting 11 capable of beating anyone in the league, that's a fact. What we need are younger, enthusiastic players to give competition for places, if arteta gets complacemnt fine, stick rodwell in because he'll play his best every second. Pienaar acting up, that's fine, put magaye gueye on and let him run his arse off for us because he wants to play for us.

We have the tools to win the league if we really go for it, and lest we forget peinaar and arteta were worth a combined £4mil when we bought them, the same as a player who decided to move to greener pastures and is now with the barcodes who will finish what, 15th or 16th?

 

Cahill pledged his future immediately, that's a player with ambition. He wants to succeed with us, if peinaar and arteta don't fine, but us not having money does not mean we can't succeed. After all, if we loan Donovan in January again I don't think there's a team in the league on our day who wouldn't be afraid of us.

 

 

Fair enough but then watch us struggle to finish mid table

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Fair enough, but would you be happy to play a player out of position for a full season if Baines gets a serious injury? I know we have players capable fo playing that position, and well, for a short time, but for a full season I can see plenty of problems arising from it, especially with playing teams with good wingers, like Lennon, Johnson, Nani, Milner, Walcott etc

 

No doubt, just look at last season where we had a handful of players, playing out of position. I don't think Hibbert will ever be able to 'replace' Leighton Baines but, with little funds I doubt we'd be able to find a defender who is as good as Hibbert, even if that's not his natural position. But let's bare in mind Toby Hibbert started out with us as a Striker, so maybe RB isn't his natural position either.

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This one bit is what really gets to me about the mentality of a lot of Everton fans, not just you Matt. Why do a lot of Everton fans concentrate on the negative aspects of other clubs for a way for Everton to achieve the grand position of 4th/5th/6th? Why can't we talk about Everton doing something special next season just because we're that fucking good? Lets believe we can sweep all before us not because City failed to gel, Villa got knackered, Spurs faded, or Hodgson buys a bunch of donkeys, but because we're a damn good team and on our day can beat any one. I want to shit on the rest of the league from a great height, not just on the shite like Wigan from a mid-table position.

 

 

Not having a go mate, I'm just a passionate fellow :P.

No worries mate, i know :) I agree with you too, i want to see us crapping on all the opposition like we did against Utd Chelsea etc, and from what we saw last season we did that quite well. My point is, we dont need money to do this. If the season had started from Jan, we wouldve finished 3rd! I point out these other teams as they are the big spending teams with money to attract players and show ambition, and i point out that despite all the money they spend, theyre not light years ahead, in fact based on the 2010 ratings, we were better without spending mega money! i know i keep coming back to this, the reason is that the 1st half of the season we were ripped apart by so many injuries. if we keep the same team and form, get a good start... we are pushing arsenal for 3rd.

 

got to go the airport now, im playing taxi! Will be back in a few hours!

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I don't want or even think we need to spend buckets of money, I just feel that spending less than £2million in a transfer window and then saying we've got nothing more to spend is a bit pathetic. Moyes can't work miracles forever, what do we do when our best players (like Cahill, Arteta etc) who have carried us to where we are now need to be replaced? The times when you could pick up bargains from the Championship are long gone. And our lack of money makes our best players easy pickings for other clubs.

 

It's just so frustrating that we're so close to being able to achieve anything we want (IMO), it relly wouldn't take that much to make it happen because we have one hell of a nucleus of a team, but we're incapable of that little extra push and to me that's holding us back.

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I don't want or even think we need to spend buckets of money, I just feel that spending less than £2million in a transfer window and then saying we've got nothing more to spend is a bit pathetic. Moyes can't work miracles forever, what do we do when our best players (like Cahill, Arteta etc) who have carried us to where we are now need to be replaced? The times when you could pick up bargains from the Championship are long gone. And our lack of money makes our best players easy pickings for other clubs.

 

It's just so frustrating that we're so close to being able to achieve anything we want (IMO), it relly wouldn't take that much to make it happen because we have one hell of a nucleus of a team, but we're incapable of that little extra push and to me that's holding us back.

 

 

 

This!

 

If we could just add one quality player to the squad each year I would be happy

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I agree we could do with one "Big Signing" but sometimes you need to look at the bigger picture.

 

We have recently signed Jan Mucha, Magaye Gueye, Jermaine Beckford, and Joao Silva, Didnt cost a lot i hear you say, but if these lads are on 25 grand a week each, its £1.2 million a year, multiplied by four is close to 5 million.

Plus you have the likes of Duffy and Baxter along with the 1st team 11 being offered improved contracts.

This is why we have to be careful with the money, so i'm quite happy with the squad we have now.

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Perhaps we are "only treading water"....making do with what we've got.

 

What have we got? IF we can keep Arteta and Pienaar that will be a good start, right!

(if we lose them, well we will probably will have a decent bit to spend)

We've got Fellaini coming back, Anichebes looking pretty good and Jagielka will even be starting this season.Bily can't play worse than last season, so that's a plus.Rodwell is a year older and we all know what he could be capable of.

Coleman may well make an impact and Hibbert is fit again(I threw that in becaus I like a fight)

 

So "treading water".......yeh well treading water might look nice when a couple of the rich boys who've bought wrong, and haven't got team spirit slip below the water.

 

Lets see the likes of Spurs and Villa, and possibly add City and liverpool tread water when it gets a bit rough.

 

Remember no one treads water like Everton.........hell Bob Latchford could even friggin walk on the stuff.

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I'm pretty happy with our squad to be honest if Pienaar and Arteta stay.

 

If they don't then we'll have the money to spend to replace them.

 

As has been said, apart from Left back we have good cover in every position, lots of good up and coming players that fill the squad out well and while a "quality signing" might be very pleasing to us all I don't think any of our first choice 11 need changing and we have decent players that can play different positions, offer different options etc.

 

I'd say our strikers can be a bit hit and miss but we have plenty of competition there now and potential journey men like Saha and Yak know that the likes of Beckford, Vaughan and Anichebe as well as plenty of other potential in attacking mid that can steal their places.

 

I'm happy for us not to spend money we don't have rather than buy more players to keep fans happy.

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Everybody keeps pointing out that its the best squad that we have had for years and they are correct but are we really moving forward?

 

We have added Mucha who hopefully wont get near the first team, Beckford who has done well in the lower leagues and is a bit of a gamble, Silva who I think is more one for the future and Gueye who again is more about potential.

 

Lets say Bill has got his calculations right thats an outlay of a pathetic £5M

 

Now I understand that most if not all of the money has gone on securing most of our current squad on long term contracts and Im all for that.

At the end of the day if there is no dosh left then we just gave to get on with what weve got, which is a pretty good side

 

But my worry is can we honestly say to Piennar and Arteta that the club is moving forward.

 

Its clutching at straws to say Coleman is more experienced now and that Rodders is a year older. is that really going to be enough?

 

As much as Im looking forward to the new season I really dont think we will challenge the top 4 with the current squad. IMO we need cover at LB, a decent RW and a class CF and then we could be in business.

 

 

Its not all doom and gloom because the bottomline is that Moyse has assembled a very good squad of players but its imperative that we keep hold of Piennar & Arteta.

I know people will say if they do go we will get decent money for them but those are the same people who are writting off the likes of Man City because they wont gel in time, surely if we lose our only 2 creative players then there replacements will also need time to gel

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Everybody keeps pointing out that its the best squad that we have had for years and they are correct but are we really moving forward?

 

We have added Mucha who hopefully wont get near the first team, Beckford who has done well in the lower leagues and is a bit of a gamble, Silva who I think is more one for the future and Gueye who again is more about potential.

 

Lets say Bill has got his calculations right thats an outlay of a pathetic £5M

 

Now I understand that most if not all of the money has gone on securing most of our current squad on long term contracts and Im all for that.

At the end of the day if there is no dosh left then we just gave to get on with what weve got, which is a pretty good side

 

But my worry is can we honestly say to Piennar and Arteta that the club is moving forward.

 

Its clutching at straws to say Coleman is more experienced now and that Rodders is a year older. is that really going to be enough?

 

As much as Im looking forward to the new season I really dont think we will challenge the top 4 with the current squad. IMO we need cover at LB, a decent RW and a class CF and then we could be in business.

 

 

Its not all doom and gloom because the bottomline is that Moyse has assembled a very good squad of players but its imperative that we keep hold of Piennar & Arteta.

I know people will say if they do go we will get decent money for them but those are the same people who are writting off the likes of Man City because they wont gel in time, surely if we lose our only 2 creative players then there replacements will also need time to gel

im sorry, this is going to sound rude, and after drinking through my flight delay misery probably regrettable tomorrow, but that is the most stupid thing ive read since i left the office emails! are we going backwards, are we getting worse? Are we in exactly the same position we were 5 years ago? NO! So were not standing still. we continue to improve and add to the squad, which im pretty sure, even in this state, that that should be considered as moving forward! ok, not fantastic mega money signings, but more competition for striker spaces (dont care what y'all think of Beckford, goalscorers like him... doesnt matter what league youre in - the goal is the same size and he can hit the back of it quite well, he's got that lucky touch and knack). Weve also got someone pushing Howard to up his game. Errr sounds like improvement to me!

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Where we were six years ago....

 

http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/football/premier-league/kenwright-on-the-brink-as-rival-turns-up-heat-554387.html

 

"Everton could be relegated because of boardroom upheaval, part-time ownership and full-time shambles," says Ian MacDonald, the vice-president of the Everton Independent Supporters' Club.

 

"Moyes has just £1.5m, including wages, in his transfer kitty. It's one out and one in - which is almost impossible with just 22 professionals on Everton's books."

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Moyes says this every season - note he says no signings before the start of the season - it's almost a certainty that he will sign someone at least (for cash) before the end of the transfer window. We must get our finances sorted between the start of the season and 31st aug as he always seems to get at least 1 'expensive' 1st team signing.

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im sorry, this is going to sound rude, and after drinking through my flight delay misery probably regrettable tomorrow, but that is the most stupid thing ive read since i left the office emails! are we going backwards, are we getting worse? Are we in exactly the same position we were 5 years ago? NO! So were not standing still. we continue to improve and add to the squad, which im pretty sure, even in this state, that that should be considered as moving forward! ok, not fantastic mega money signings, but more competition for striker spaces (dont care what y'all think of Beckford, goalscorers like him... doesnt matter what league youre in - the goal is the same size and he can hit the back of it quite well, he's got that lucky touch and knack). Weve also got someone pushing Howard to up his game. Errr sounds like improvement to me!

 

 

Perhaps I should have made my self clearer. Obviously we have moved forward from 5 years ago any retard can see that

 

My point was have we moved forward from last season?

 

If you read it again you will see that I said I agreed that it was our best squad in years( hence I agree that the club has made great strides in the Kenwright/Moyes era) but IMO the squad hasnt really improved from last season. The point I was trying to make is that if the club wants to secure the futures of the likes of Arteta & Piennar then they have to show that the club is still moving forward and spending a grand total of £2M for me is not showing them that we can match thier ambitions.

 

If your happy with the new additions( a reserve keeper, a league 1 forward and 2 young lads from the lower leagues in France & Portugal) then thats up to you but do the words nil satis nisi optimum mean anything to you?

 

I realise the club is skint and as I stated before I accept that what little dosh we had has gone on securing players on long term contracts but is it really too much to ask that we bring in one decent signing a year?

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