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#1 MikeO

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Posted 21 Jun 2007 - 17:44

From KEIOC today...

As a result of today's meeting with Keith Wyness at Everton Football Club, the Keep Everton in Our City campaign group are pleased to announce that the club have agreed to our request that any vote on the proposed move to Kirkby be on a basis of "one fan, one vote."

The club have decided that any fan who has held a season ticket at any point in the last three years, or hold at least one share in the club, will get one vote in the forthcoming ballot.

Sadly, match-going blues who have not held a season ticket during this time, or do not hold a share in the club will not be included in this vote by the club. KEIOC also asked that fans who attend home games on a regular basis were included, but this request was declined.

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#2 Ian

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Posted 21 Jun 2007 - 20:44

Well I can vote :D :D
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#3 Louis

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Posted 22 Jun 2007 - 07:13

Does this mean even kids with season tickets can vote?
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#4 MikeO

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Posted 22 Jun 2007 - 08:33

Does this mean even kids with season tickets can vote?


Good question, not answered by the full report of the meeting.

Today, representatives from KEIOC met with Everton Football Club officials, Keith Wyness and Ian Ross this morning at Keith Wyness' office with a one-item agenda - the ballot of Evertonians on the proposed ground move to Kirkby and the eligibility criteria.

The opening salvo was fired by KEIOC who thanked the club for giving them the opportunity to feedback their observations and thoughts, we also informed the club of our stance of being positive and not negative, of working with the club and not against the club, and that we are all members of the Everton "family" and share the same hopes and aspirations.

Keith Wyness stated that the club were not forced by KEIOC into having any ballot, he went on to say that it was always the club's intention to ballot the fans. He supplemented this by saying that although the ballot proceedures were not set in stone, that they were happy to share their views with us and generalise as long as we respected their confidence. We explained that we were unwilling to respect anything that they told us in confidence and that we would be informing the wider Evertonian community of our dicussions because of our deeply held desire to be open and transparent.

Ian Ross added that he had been entrusted with organising the ballot in conjunction with the Electoral Reform Ballot Services (ERBS) and that he had been working on this for the past six months. To date, and as a rough guideline, the proposals are that any Evertonian who has held a season ticket at any time over the past 3 years and / or holds shares in EFC will be entitled to one vote. If fans hold multiple shares or season tickets, they will still be entitled to one vote only. They also envisage posting a Q&A leaflet with the ballot paper and that they would be happy for KEIOC to have input into that document.


The club also stressed that at this moment in time that there are no blueprints and that they are currently only working from rough drafts, and contrary to popular belief, the ground move is not a done deal.

Once plans were in place, they will then need to go before a board meeting for endorcement. Only then would the ballot proceedure be instigated.

KEIOC then asked what, if any, consultation had taken place to date, and what plans were in place for more. Much to our surprise, the club claimed that the only consultation to date had come from Toffeeweb.com's online poll of fans posted earlier this year, a meeting with shareholders groups, and today's meeting with ourselves.

Ian Ross then went on to say that he envisaged somewhere in the region of 35,000 fans taking part in the ballot and that unfortunately they have to draw a line in the sand somewhere. We gave a number of examples of Evertonians who travel the length and breadth of the country, and in fact further afield, who for various reasons have never been season ticket holders, and by the club's own eligibilty do not fit the criteria for this vote. We have to ask ourselves the question, should we disenfranchise long time, loyal Evertonians so readily? We don't think so, do you?

The final question was "Is the club for sale?" Keith Wyness stated that all things in life have a price and if the owner received the right offer, he would accept it. He finished his contribution by saying that it was not financially viable to redevelop Goodison Park, and that the "only deal in town is Kirkby, there is no plan B."



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#5 Everton_Worshiper

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Posted 22 Jun 2007 - 09:52

Well I can vote in favour of the move then :)
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#6 Blue 250

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Posted 22 Jun 2007 - 21:01

Never had a season ticket!.....probably never will.But I'll still come when I can.
I will still champion the name Everton when ever and where ever I can.I'll wear
my Everton shirt around town and stick my chest out at the numerous glory
hunting rs shirts!...........The hundreds/thousands of Blue fans around the world
who will never get the vote........are watching the situation very closely!

Will it really matter if the fans vote overwhelmingly to stay in the city?

What should you vote with your head or your heart?
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#7 Louis

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Posted 23 Jun 2007 - 12:40

Well I can vote in favour of the move then :)


Out of interest - what are your reasons for voting in favour of the move ?
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#8 GoldfishMemory

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Posted 23 Jun 2007 - 12:56

Out of interest - what are your reasons for voting in favour of the move ?


and are you voting in favour of a move or of moving to kirkby??
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#9 sheedysheedysheedy

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Posted 23 Jun 2007 - 13:46

and are you voting in favour of a move or of moving to kirkby??

I will be voting but still undecided. I hate the thought of moving outside the city but see the need for a move away from the old lady Goodison. Genuine question then, especially for the KEIOC fans, if it was Kirkby or nothing (on the basis that Kirkby with the Tesco deal is the best we could afford), what would you choose?

I need some help deciding.
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#10 CraccerC

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Posted 25 Jun 2007 - 11:26

im for a move to kirkby, i don't see what the fuss is about ...
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#11 GoldfishMemory

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Posted 25 Jun 2007 - 12:29

I will be voting but still undecided. I hate the thought of moving outside the city but see the need for a move away from the old lady Goodison. Genuine question then, especially for the KEIOC fans, if it was Kirkby or nothing (on the basis that Kirkby with the Tesco deal is the best we could afford), what would you choose?

I need some help deciding.


That would be an extreamly hard decision to make but I would make it if need be. For the time being I just want all the options to be made public so the people who have been led blindly into supporting this kirkby project can see that it is in fact only one of many and BK is backing it because it means no debt for the club.

The deal at kirkby is Knowsley Council sell us the land cheap which we then sell on to Tesco at a profit. This means Tesco get a foothold in Knowsley which they can't currently get because the council are not allowed to directly sell the land to the supermarket chain. We then lease a large part of the land from Tesco and build a stadium with the profit we made on the sale of the ground meaning we own our stadium but pay a lease fee to Tesco for the land.

So Knowsely get to sell some land which they are currently restricted from selling to Tesco, they also get a football stadium & superstore with all the increased revenue that brings. Tesco get a superstore they currently have no hope of getting under their own steam & a lease fee from Everton each year they will also be on a percentage deal of any other activities held at the satdium. Everton get a shiney new ground!

Now I'm not definate on any of this but that's the way it's been outlined to me!

So the other option of staying in Liverpool is looked down on by BK because it has no retail opportunity but it would be a case of Liverpool Council give us a new site in exchange for Goodison Park or we sell Goodison & buy the new land, either way we will own it. We than use a long term morgage to build the new ground and are left paying a morgage rather than a lease to Tesco.

So the 2 options are extreamly similar except one means moving the club out of the city and making money for Tesco & Knowsely in the process. The other means we build our own ground and stand on our own 2 feet giving the supporters what they want and deserve.

We were once leaders in ground building inovation and at the moment we are in danger of becomming sheep and rushing in to stumping up the cash for the first shiney idea put on the table. My other serious issue over all this is over the past few years Tesco have played every underhand tactic available in a quest to monopolise the grocery industry in this country, are they the best people for BK to be tucking Everton into bed with??
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#12 Zed

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Posted 25 Jun 2007 - 13:37

Eloquently put Goldy, I also await the full proposals from all sides

Dont think this is such a Coup that KEIOC suggest, think the club have always said they will give the fans a vote

As for Tesco and your last point, in the world of big business I dont think tesco are any more or less underhand than any other ruthless money making organisation, but I think thats probably your point
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#13 GoldfishMemory

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Posted 25 Jun 2007 - 13:51

Eloquently put Goldy, I also await the full proposals from all sides

Dont think this is such a Coup that KEIOC suggest, think the club have always said they will give the fans a vote

As for Tesco and your last point, in the world of big business I dont think tesco are any more or less underhand than any other ruthless money making organisation, but I think thats probably your point


My point is in Liverpool we would have a morgage but be kings of our own castle whereas in Knowsley we would have a lease and be Tesco's (a ruthless money making organisation) bitch!
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#14 Everton_Worshiper

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Posted 26 Jun 2007 - 07:52

Out of interest - what are your reasons for voting in favour of the move ?


I have been to many stadiums across Europe and each time I walk into Goodison I think how old looking the stadium is. I managed to get my wife to finally go to watch the blues and her first comments "wow, this place is old".

The stadium move to the docks would have been amazing, shame that didn't come off.

I am in favour of a move, even out of the city. Let's not forget that Everton is a business (I run my own business) and you have to think of the financial situation and oppurtunities that a move could bring. Can you see concerts being hosted at Goodison? How many times is Goodison used for tournaments? All these activites mean extra revenue.

The one thing I will say though is the atmosphere will probably suffer as it has with most new stadiums that are built, the worst I have been to is the city of manchester stadium...absolutely awful place.

Anyway, time to get with the times and build a new stadium even out of the city.
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#15 StevO

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Posted 26 Jun 2007 - 07:55

i was all for the move, but now i want to see plans and financial situations before i make up my mind. if it will be cutting edge design then i'd maybe get swayed, but the club needs to not get fucked over in any deal.

one thing is for sure, we need to keep the gwladys street together. make it known the stand to the left of the dug out will be for the noise!
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#16 Zed

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Posted 26 Jun 2007 - 12:10

Protesting today outside knowsley council

BBC LINK
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#17 MikeO

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Posted 26 Jun 2007 - 12:51

Campaigners who want Everton to remain in Liverpool are telling local residents about the congestion and disorder a new stadium might bring to Kirkby town centre.

They were also showing them CCTV video footage from Merseyside Police of Everton and Manchester United fans fighting.


Really nice way of going about things guys, "You don't want us here, we're nasty bastards." Just the image of Evertonians we want to portray to the world at large. KEIOC just lost a lot of respect from me (guess they'll not lose any sleep over it). KRAG and KEIOC....unlikely bedfellows..."my enemies enemy is my friend," I suppose!
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#18 GoldfishMemory

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Posted 26 Jun 2007 - 12:54

I have to side with you although the context of whets happened isnt explained very clearly.

However scupper the Kirkby project at all costs is my deep running opinion on all this!
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#19 Zed

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Posted 26 Jun 2007 - 13:36

I think the "vidoe nasty " was being shown be the local residents assosiation, there are two separate groups protesting
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#20 Everton_Worshiper

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Posted 26 Jun 2007 - 15:01

I am sorry but showing a video of footballers fighting is not going to stop the move...bring on the new stadium where ever its situated :)
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#21 RuffRob

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Posted 26 Jun 2007 - 15:02

What really makes a football club? What is the most important thing that gives it its identity.

The management?
The players?
The location of the ground
The stadium itself
The Fans

To me it is by and large its the fans - its we who make the club and the atmosphier

Secondly, its the players and the managment and what they are able to produce on the pitch for us and the trophies collected by them.

Thirdly, its the stadium itself - careful consideration and design is needed to ensure as much as possible the right atmospher in the stadium can be made. A tour of new stadiums should be done in order to check out the designs that produce the right atmosphier.

If we as fans embrace the new stadium and the football we see it in, it should make no difference if the stadium is in Kirby or within the limits of the city.

I hope none cut of there noses to spit their faces - with "..if they move to Kirby, then I am not going.." Its those fans that will miss out in my opinion.
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#22 Everton_Worshiper

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Posted 26 Jun 2007 - 15:08

What really makes a football club? What is the most important thing that gives it its identity.

The management?
The players?
The location of the ground
The stadium itself
The Fans

To me it is by and large its the fans - its we who make the club and the atmosphier

Secondly, its the players and the managment and what they are able to produce on the pitch for us and the trophies collected by them.

Thirdly, its the stadium itself - careful consideration and design is needed to ensure as much as possible the right atmospher in the stadium can be made. A tour of new stadiums should be done in order to check out the designs that produce the right atmosphier.

If we as fans embrace the new stadium and the football we see it in, it should make no difference if the stadium is in Kirby or within the limits of the city.

I hope none cut of there noses to spit their faces - with "..if they move to Kirby, then I am not going.." Its those fans that will miss out in my opinion.


You know what, I agree with that 100%. Well said...
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#23 GoldfishMemory

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Posted 26 Jun 2007 - 15:26

You know what, I agree with that 100%. Well said...


Not entirely true, fans are embracing Goodison at the moment but killing the atmosphere there are many factors that influence moving a passionate crowd into a new stadium and the fans wanting to move is a very small percentage of that!
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#24 StevO

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Posted 26 Jun 2007 - 15:27

Not entirely true, fans are embracing Goodison at the moment but killing the atmosphere there are many factors that influence moving a passionate crowd into a new stadium and the fans wanting to move is a very small percentage of that!


whats your thoughts on the "safe standing" ideas liam?
would you want it in a new stadium?
just out of interest while your a lower gwladys fan (im upper gwladys myself)
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#25 GoldfishMemory

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Posted 26 Jun 2007 - 15:29

It's a goer for me but more improtantly I want a designated singing area with a huge block of unreserved seating and a bit of give and take from the plod & stewards!!
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#26 StevO

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Posted 26 Jun 2007 - 15:32

im all for that. ive thought a bit about the safe standing area, and the designated unreserved seating/singing section. i think if this was put together it might help bring back the atmosphere we've been missing
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#27 Everton_Worshiper

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Posted 26 Jun 2007 - 15:43

It's a goer for me but more improtantly I want a designated singing area with a huge block of unreserved seating and a bit of give and take from the plod & stewards!!


Yep...they should clump the hardcore singing together, imagine the roar if they did!
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#28 MikeO

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Posted 26 Jun 2007 - 15:50

I think the "vidoe nasty " was being shown be the local residents assosiation, there are two separate groups protesting


But with a single purpose....if KRAG were showing the vid fair enough but if it was KEIOC (as the article says) then it's unacceptable IMO.
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#29 RuffRob

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Posted 26 Jun 2007 - 16:07

With a new stadium only at the drawing board stage. We have got a golden chance for the designers to have a real good go at making it the with the best atmosphier in the Premiership - Everton is not just about the numbers game, we don't have the 'biggest' following in the county, so we don't need to make the biggest - lets hope they concentrating on making is the best.

Lets make sure the people employed to do the design have done there homework on what has worked and what has not worked in other stadiums built of the last 10 years (there are plenty to choose from) What stiffles atmosphire and what promotes it.

If they are able to get this right, I am sure the location, howver controversial with some people, will become erelevent in a short period of time.
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#30 GoldfishMemory

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Posted 27 Jun 2007 - 07:12

But with a single purpose....if KRAG were showing the vid fair enough but if it was KEIOC (as the article says) then it's unacceptable IMO.


A KEIOC statement this morning,

Itís been brought to our attention via various web forums that KEIOC has been accused of showing CCTV footage of an incident involving fans of Everton Football Club on Everton Valley as part of our argument at the Kirkby Consultation today. This is a total fabrication against our group to try and undermine the good work our group is trying to achieve.

The KEIOC group is made up entirely of Evertonians who are proud of the reputation our fans take across Europe as the Pride of Merseyside, and many of our members have travelled throughout the World with Everton, continuing this good name. From the streets of Rotterdam playing football with local police, to enjoying drinks with Spanish fans in Villarreal and Bucharest, KEIOC have every faith that wherever the Blues play their football, locals can be safe in the knowledge that the fans will always endeavour to behave impeccably.

http://www.keioc.net/

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#31 Everton_Worshiper

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Posted 27 Jun 2007 - 07:54

that the fans will always endeavour to behave impeccably.


Even in Kirkby :D So let's move stadium....
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#32 GoldfishMemory

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Posted 27 Jun 2007 - 08:12

Even in Kirkby :D So let's move stadium....


I'm becomming a stuck reccord so I wont go on.

You would rather be in Kirkby than on walton hall park or in a redeveloped Goodison??

Why?
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#33 Everton_Worshiper

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Posted 27 Jun 2007 - 08:16

No...I would rather be in a modern stadium that can generate extra revenue for the club than an ageing ground that hinders the progression of the club - whether it is in Kirkby or not. As far as I can tell, Goodison redevelopment is a non-starter but this would be my preffered option by far.
I am not though going to stand protesting with a sign saying "Kenwright is the devil" because he wants to modernise Everton and provide a solid financial base...

Edited by Everton_Worshiper, 27 Jun 2007 - 08:17.

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#34 GoldfishMemory

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Posted 27 Jun 2007 - 08:28

No...I would rather be in a modern stadium that can generate extra revenue for the club than an ageing ground that hinders the progression of the club - whether it is in Kirkby or not. As far as I can tell, Goodison redevelopment is a non-starter but this would be my preffered option by far.
I am not though going to stand protesting with a sign saying "Kenwright is the devil" because he wants to modernise Everton and provide a solid financial base...


The whole backing for my opinion & that of KEIOC is not that we don't massivly need the move because we do. It is that there are many options available and BK seems blinkered into the Kirkby project, now add in Tesco's involvement, the obvious merits for Knowsley as an area & this "exclusivity agreement" all stink.

If BK wants whats best for the club he'd be exploring every oprion in a transparent process rather than hiding behind an exclusivity agreement, consulting with kirkby residents before Everton supporters and burying his head in the sand every time anyone mentions staying in Liverpool!

I have no problem moving to Kirkby as long as it's the best option for the club and I mean that in every sense not just in terms of money.
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#35 Leadline

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Posted 27 Jun 2007 - 09:25

The whole backing for my opinion & that of KEIOC is not that we don't massivly need the move because we do. It is that there are many options available and BK seems blinkered into the Kirkby project, now add in Tesco's involvement, the obvious merits for Knowsley as an area & this "exclusivity agreement" all stink.

If BK wants whats best for the club he'd be exploring every oprion in a transparent process rather than hiding behind an exclusivity agreement, consulting with kirkby residents before Everton supporters and burying his head in the sand every time anyone mentions staying in Liverpool!

I have no problem moving to Kirkby as long as it's the best option for the club and I mean that in every sense not just in terms of money.



I was told the other day that when Everton first started they weren't even sistuated in Liverpool anyway, it was only later that Everton became part of Liverpool so to me it m,akes no difference I'd go anywhere the Blue Boys go. We do badly need a new bigger and better stadium to go with our new and immense Training facility on Finch Farm.
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#36 GoldfishMemory

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Posted 27 Jun 2007 - 09:58

I was told the other day that when Everton first started they weren't even sistuated in Liverpool anyway, it was only later that Everton became part of Liverpool so to me it m,akes no difference I'd go anywhere the Blue Boys go. We do badly need a new bigger and better stadium to go with our new and immense Training facility on Finch Farm.


Again record & stuck come to mind. . . . . . . .

I'm not the slightest bit bothered in the in or out of liverpool debate. It is not my opinion the club needs to stay within a council boundry that could quite easily be redifined as it has been so many times before. It is however my opinion that BK seems determined to get us out of Liverpool and specifically into the Kirkby site in question.

I believe that it would be in the interest of the club to stay as local as possible to our current location but that is a personal opinion. I believe the sole purpose BK wants us in Kirkby is financial and thats why I have so much of an issue, any true Evertonian as BK claims himself would never look at the money issues as a starting point!

Maybe the best comparison I can give is when you purchase a product you dont buy the cheapest becase its the best value for money & you dont buy the most expensive cos it's the best quality. You infact shop around and compare pricing and specification and make an educated decision on the best value product for your needs any other decision pocess is risky and best described as an "impulse purchase" which you usually regret or never needed in the first place.

Lets not allow BK make an impulse purchase on the home of Everton for the next 100 years all because Tesco are waving pound notes at him!!
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#37 Everton_Worshiper

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Posted 27 Jun 2007 - 10:37

lol this is turning into a good debate.....


OK my angle on this.... Everton is a business, businesses are governed by money. An oppurtunity has arisen to improve the financial stability of the business - the financial situation directly affects the performance of the team in the long run (ability to buy players, youth system etc). Now by financial situation I do not mean Blackburn - loads of cash for 1 season then nothing. I mean a solid financial base so that any further investments etc can be directly used for the benefit of the club and not to help with debts. I do believe a ground move will help the financial situation.

The Tesco situation is a case of (IMO!!) an option to move ground at a reduced cost. If Tesco were not involved we would be fitting the brunt of the development bill and land purchase, where as at least this way we get the new ground without delving further into debt especially as Knowsley are supposidly giving us the land for peanuts.

Anyway, just my opinion.
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#38 GoldfishMemory

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Posted 27 Jun 2007 - 10:46

The big question surrounding all this is will the Kirkby mover benifit us financially over the long term I believe not for many reasons, I think the Kirkby option will do little for increasing revenue.

Infact with a concert arena on the docks and the shite building a 80,000 seater on stanley park will Everton ever be able to compete for other revenue? I belive not, most of the music will go to the dock & any massive music gigs will go to the massive MacDonalds Arena on the park. As for footballing events :lol: your gona hold an international or European game at the new Goosison when theres Old Trafford, the shite & COMS all competing within a very small area?? I think we are bottom of the pile when it comes to that side of things!
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#39 MikeO

MikeO

    Scars are tattoos with better stories.

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Posted 27 Jun 2007 - 11:15

Pleased to read the statement from KEIOC, but I'd be interested to know if...

This is a total fabrication against our group to try and undermine the good work our group is trying to achieve.


...then who's doing the fabricating? KRAG? The Club? The BBC?

Another thing that occurred to me. Think in an ideal world and if it was feasible (which some say it is) then every Evertonians ideal solution would be to re-develop Goodison. Under those circumstances where would we play in the interim? Totally impossible I'd have thought to build a bit at a time so closing down one stand at a time would surely not work. Groundshare presumably, but with who? I'm not even going to suggest possibilities....

Edited by MikeO, 27 Jun 2007 - 11:16.

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#40 StevO

StevO

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Posted 27 Jun 2007 - 11:18

it would be possible to rebuild and stay at GP, newcastle did it, man utd did it.
look on the KEIOC site, at the GFE plan, im sure that plan had no lower attendance than 30k at any one time.

OLD TRAFFORD REBUILD

Edited by StevO, 27 Jun 2007 - 11:22.

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