David Moyes On Sky Sports News

[StevO]

if bk went public that the club was up for sale then im pretty sure someone will come forward.

none of this i'll sell if the right investor comes along, buyers dont want to invest, they want to own. just like blue bill does

[johnalderson]

if bk went public that the club was up for sale then im pretty sure someone will come forward.

none of this i'll sell if the right investor comes along, buyers dont want to invest, they want to own. just like blue bill does

 

 

Like ive said before, there are numours multi millionaires or if not billionaires with money tied to our club through LOANS, each expecting their guaranteed returns and increasing the debt we owe.

 

I totally agree with this post, if Kenwright publicly declared his wish to sell, i would strongly fancy our chances of being snapped up.

 

Kenwright is a true blue (apparently), but premiership football is very quickly becoming as high money earning globaly, although still nowhere near as basketball and baseball are in the US which is why so many american tycoons are looking to th premiership. EFC even thou very high in debt seeminly, would surely be a great assett to any tycoon, with their global fan count.

 

Surely we would be better off without Kenwrights on going loan hunting, debt building plans, hoping the new stadium will attract more investors (or shall i say more multi millionaire loan lenders).

 

As posted previously, Kenwright wants to be seen as the face of EFC, but at what price for the club.

 

Barry Hearn has publically said that he is more than happy to plod along at Leyton Orient cos he loves his club, Kenwright may well be taking us to play them the way things are going.

 

I personally hope we can compete at the highest level, and the only way that seems possible is with new owners.

[Randomness]

Question: Why does it Matter That BK is an Evertonian? I mean no-one would have a go at the Panasonic boss if he owned a Sony TV?

 

It Doesnt Matter if he is blue he Can't Take us Forward any More.

[johnalderson]

I would love to see what Moyes could actually do with us if he was given a decent backing, sadly we may well be watching how well he is doing at Man U in a couple of years time.

 

I have to say, even all the shit they took when they bought Man U, The Glaziers are doing a fantastic job there,

[Jimmy the blue]

I would love to see what Moyes could actually do with us if he was given a decent backing, sadly we may well be watching how well he is doing at Man U in a couple of years time.

 

I have to say, even all the shit they took when they bought Man U, The Glaziers are doing a fantastic job there,

 

 

It certainly helps to have a supporter in charge as they feel the same passion as you and I, a money man never could.

 

BK is by no means perfect, no one in their right mind would say he was but until this mystery buyer is named I'll stick with him. Steve, how do you know that BK has never put any money into the club, lets see your evidence as the club accounts suggest he has, if he has told a porkie on that one then he would be in trouble. I know that Johnson, like Moore's and all the other super rich only underwrote loans and when he sold he made a gain on the sale. Johnson actually epitomized a none supporting owner, ask Nigel Martin when Joe Royle tried to sign him and Johnson wouldn't sign the cheque

Edited August 27, 2008 by Jimmy the blue

[johnalderson]

It certainly helps to have a supporter in charge as they feel the same passion as you and I, a money man never could.

 

BK is by no means perfect, no one in their right mind would say he was but until this mystery buyer is named I'll stick with him. Steve, how do you know that BK has never put any money into the club, lets see your evidence as the club accounts suggest he has, if he has told a porkie on that one then he would be in trouble. I know that Johnson, like Moore's and all the other super rich only underwrote loans and when he sold he made a gain on the sale. Johnson actually epitomized a none supporting owner, ask Nigel Martin when Joe Royle tried to sign him and Johnson wouldn't sign the cheque

 

 

The premiership is 100% about money now, and we aint got none.................

[carlmc25]

i'll happily remind anybody of the state we were in with johnson, as right now we are in a worse position than he left us in. read the info published by the club year on year since he left, as we have got deeper and deeper each year gone by.

 

and were not just having a bad preseason, bk has run his course. he is at the limit if his borrowing capability, after selling everything we can. he has hit his limit. the only things left to sell are the players and Goodison park.

 

and for the record, saying johnson didnt put a penny in, neither has bk.

So how much deeper are we supposedly in debt since BK took over? off the pitch is it about £15m or something? We may have sold off the training ground (virtually worthless) and have slightly more debt, but all our assets are now in the most important place - on the pitch.

 

Here is our embarrassing squad from 1999

 

http://www.toffeeweb.com/season/99-00/squad.asp

 

and we all know what our current squad is.

 

I would say our old squad was worth about £54m and that's being generous and I'd say our current squad is worth:

 

Howard £6m

Baines £5m

Jags £6m

Lescott £12m

Yobo £7m

Neville £3m

Hibbert £2.5m

Valente £500k

Arteta £12m

Cahill £12m

Pienaar £4m

Osman £5m

Yakubu £14m

Anichebe £3m

Vaughan £3.5m

 

Total £95.5m

 

based on that our current squad is worth £40m more and that's without any further signings, without including Rodwell, Gosling, Turner etc and bearing in mind we've just raked £15m in for AJ/McFadden.

 

I don't think I've been overly generous with those valuations either. So if you're saying we're more than £40m in debt off the pitch (bearing in mind we've raked in £15m as I just said) than before, then I'd be surprised.

[StevO]

It certainly helps to have a supporter in charge as they feel the same passion as you and I, a money man never could.

 

BK is by no means perfect, no one in their right mind would say he was but until this mystery buyer is named I'll stick with him. Steve, how do you know that BK has never put any money into the club, lets see your evidence as the club accounts suggest he has, if he has told a porkie on that one then he would be in trouble. I know that Johnson, like Moore's and all the other super rich only underwrote loans and when he sold he made a gain on the sale. Johnson actually epitomized a none supporting owner, ask Nigel Martin when Joe Royle tried to sign him and Johnson wouldn't sign the cheque

 

jim - kenwright has always been honest about this, he has always said he doesnt have the money to invest. he said from the off he doesnt have money to put into the club. the club accounts have never suggested kenwright has put any of his own money in. im not having a go at him for this, as he has no lied about this at all. but people assume he has used his own cash for things, he hasnt, and he has been honest about this since day one. he had underwritten loans against season ticket sales and club assets, again, he has been open and honest about this. once again, not having a go at him for this. i wont get on bks back for anything he has been honest about. only the like of fortress sports fund, the lies about the kirkby deal, i'll jump on his back for any of the lies he has told, and i often do, which im not alone on my thoughts on bk.

 

just to reitterate, the clubs accounts do not suggest he has put his own money in, neither has his mouth.

 

So how much deeper are we supposedly in debt since BK took over? off the pitch is it about £15m or something? We may have sold off the training ground (virtually worthless) and have slightly more debt, but all our assets are now in the most important place - on the pitch.

So if you're saying we're more than £40m in debt off the pitch (bearing in mind we've raked in £15m as I just said) than before, then I'd be surprised.

 

erm, £15m??? and the rest!!! the club has lost money year on year, and then borrowed to balance the books.

if the training ground is worthless then why did we sell it? we have the option to buy it back, Louis knows the figure, im not sure so i wont quote. but finch farm is worth more than Goodison park. and the idea of our biggest assets being on the pitch is worrying to me, as they are the only assets left to sell.

 

i'm wasting my breath as some people seem to have blue tinted glasses on, are happy to accept the lies of the board on the grounds that bk is blue or has made more profit in his life than any of us so he must know what hes doing.

 

the lies are out on the table, the fortress sports fund never existed, why do we accept that lie and move on? there were numerous lies before the vote for kirkby, they were all put out in the open when the planning application was put it, are people not bothered about this?

 

i'll finish on this question, and id really like a bk supporter to answer this, and honestly. are you not mad about the lies that were told to the fans regarding the kirkby move? (thats if any of the bk supporters are actually aware of these lies)

Edited August 27, 2008 by StevO

[carlmc25]

jim - kenwright has always been honest about this, he has always said he doesnt have the money to invest. he said from the off he doesnt have money to put into the club. the club accounts have never suggested kenwright has put any of his own money in. im not having a go at him for this, as he has no lied about this at all. but people assume he has used his own cash for things, he hasnt, and he has been honest about this since day one. he had underwritten loans against season ticket sales and club assets, again, he has been open and honest about this. once again, not having a go at him for this. i wont get on bks back for anything he has been honest about. only the like of fortress sports fund, the lies about the kirkby deal, i'll jump on his back for any of the lies he has told, and i often do, which im not alone on my thoughts on bk.

 

just to reitterate, the clubs accounts do not suggest he has put his own money in, neither has his mouth.

 

 

 

erm, £15m??? and the rest!!! the club has lost money year on year, and then borrowed to balance the books.

if the training ground is worthless then why did we sell it? we have the option to buy it back, Louis knows the figure, im not sure so i wont quote. but finch farm is worth more than Goodison park. and the idea of our biggest assets being on the pitch is worrying to me, as they are the only assets left to sell.

 

i'm wasting my breath as some people seem to have blue tinted glasses on, are happy to accept the lies of the board on the grounds that bk is blue or has made more profit in his life than any of us so he must know what hes doing.

 

the lies are out on the table, the fortress sports fund never existed, why do we accept that lie and move on? there were numerous lies before the vote for kirkby, they were all put out in the open when the planning application was put it, are people not bothered about this?

 

i'll finish on this question, and id really like a bk supporter to answer this, and honestly. are you not mad about the lies that were told to the fans regarding the kirkby move? (thats if any of the bk supporters are actually aware of these lies)

When I said £15m in debt, I meant £15m MORE in debt than when BK took over? If so, then we have £40m (probably more like £50m) more of assets, at least, on the pitch so in reality that would mean we are actually at least £25m better off under BK. That was my point. Your whole argument about BK seems to centre around how we're in more debt, I'm asking the question - are we really or are you just basing this on cold hard cash rather than assets on the pitch as well?

 

edit: I've just looked at the accounts for 2007 and unless I misunderstand what I'm reading our net debt is approx £26.4m, which means that as we were already in debt when BK took us over and we now have a MASSIVELY superior squad to when he took over, worth at least £40-50m more, in real terms we are far better off financially than when Johnson was in charge. Our assets are on the pitch and that's how I like it. By the way, did we even own Finch Farm when BK took over? I suspect not, which means it's irrelevant whether that has been sold off as we only bought it under BK in the first place. We did have Bellefield but how much did that sell for? £2m or something (total guess alert) which is less than the value of Tony Hibbert.

Edited August 28, 2008 by carlmc25

[StevO]

carl, the problem is that our only assets are on the field. so when people start wanting money back, the only way to get that back wil then be to sell the4 players. with the massive boost to premiership money why have we had to go down the route of increasing debt and selling assets at the same time?

 

and i see you didnt answer the question regarding the kirkby lies??? most of bk's fans dont tend to talk about that apart from slagging keioc. but im genuinely interested in peoples opinions of saviour bill after this sambles

[carlmc25]

carl, the problem is that our only assets are on the field. so when people start wanting money back, the only way to get that back wil then be to sell the4 players. with the massive boost to premiership money why have we had to go down the route of increasing debt and selling assets at the same time?

 

and i see you didnt answer the question regarding the kirkby lies??? most of bk's fans dont tend to talk about that apart from slagging keioc. but im genuinely interested in peoples opinions of saviour bill after this sambles

I don't know enough about Kirkby to comment, it's all rumours and innuendo at this point as far as I can see so I'm reserving judgement until the enquiry. All I'm saying is that you have constantly belittled Kenwright, beating him with the 'We're more in debt stick' yet in reality, we're far better off and most importantly our assets are on the pitch, plus we have a state of the art training facility and a brilliant manager. Just look at the team we had in 1999, it was an absolute joke and nearly all the (few) decent players were home grown or just about to retire/worthless. At the end of the day, if we are indeed £26m in debt (bearing in mind this may not be accurate as we've just recouped £15m) we could easily wipe this out by selling Lescott and Arteta and still have a better team than we had in 1999. Investing in training grounds, off field products is not going to help us get into Europe/Champions League, success on the pitch will bring the biggest income. Anyway, we'll just have to agree to disagree. I agree with a lot of what you say in most topics, but can't help feel that you've lost the plot a bit with Kenwright, he's not perfect but I can't believe any Everton fan could try and claim he's worse than Peter Johnson.

[StevO]

its not rumour that the price of the stadium increased by £78m , and its not rumours that kirkby will be a no park zone, its not rumour that the train station cant handle the extra traffic. but you seem not to believe it unless its on the OS. accept it, we were lied to.

 

finch farm was worthless - now state of the art.

assets on the pitch and none off the pitch is dangerous for a business, do you not see that the only assets left to sell are Goodison park and the players? and you dont see this as an issue.

 

i know we have a very good manager, i know we have very good players, but football in this day and age isnt just played on the pitch. of the field we are losing the game, badly.

 

your saying that £26m debt isnt bad, because we just got in £15m, and we can wipe this out by selling arteta and lescott, how is this even remotely acceptable.

 

if ive lost the plot with kenwright then im in a group of many. it seems to me the people who admit to not knowing the ins and outs of his failings are the ones who support him. but believe me, the majority of blues have already had enough of it.

[carlmc25]

its not rumour that the price of the stadium increased by £78m , and its not rumours that kirkby will be a no park zone, its not rumour that the train station cant handle the extra traffic. but you seem not to believe it unless its on the OS. accept it, we were lied to.

 

finch farm was worthless - now state of the art.

assets on the pitch and none off the pitch is dangerous for a business, do you not see that the only assets left to sell are Goodison park and the players? and you dont see this as an issue.

 

i know we have a very good manager, i know we have very good players, but football in this day and age isnt just played on the pitch. of the field we are losing the game, badly.

 

your saying that £26m debt isnt bad, because we just got in £15m, and we can wipe this out by selling arteta and lescott, how is this even remotely acceptable.

 

if ive lost the plot with kenwright then im in a group of many. it seems to me the people who admit to not knowing the ins and outs of his failings are the ones who support him. but believe me, the majority of blues have already had enough of it.

I never meant Finch Farm was worthless, I meant Bellefield which is what we owned under Johnson. I know a lot of Everton fans are cheesed with Kenwright - mainly because of all the sinister conspiracy theories people put round to get people on board with their ideas and because we've had a poor pre-season signing players. If we went out and signed Moutinho tomorrow then most Everton fans would no doubt be kissing Moyes and Kenwright's ass again. The truth is most fans are fickle, they change their mind like the weather - but apart from you, I can't remember the last time I heard an Everton fan who had a single good word to say about Johnson, that's where I think you've lost the plot.

 

Lots of teams have better stadiums than us, lots of teams have more assets off the pitch, the bottom line is only 4 teams finished above us last year. Which club would you rather support? I'd pick the one that puts it's money into players, especially when players values only seem to increase in general year on year and each place in the league is worth about half a million or more and success on the pitch will lead to greater exposure, greater sponsorship revenue and tv revenue. Look at Leeds, look at Nottingham forest (and nearly us under Johnson), if you don't have good players you're screwed, which is why Everton under Kenwright made the decision to invest in the players ahead of anything else. I bet if Kenwright had've paid off all our debts and left us with a shambles of a team you would have moaned at him as well. He can't win.

[StevO]

i have many reasons and problems with kenwights running of the club, most of them a put down to wyness but kenwright has to fall on his own sword for wyness problems the same as he has been praised for bringing in moyes. i have my views on johnson, some will agree and most will disgree, but if anyone looks at the problems johnson was hounded out for, we have them same problems now, only we have better players and we are doing better, im very happy about the success on the pitch, but as ive said, football is more than just on the pitch nowdays. i can only hope im not put down as fickle for not being a fan of bk as i have been against the man for as long as i can remember (i was probably too young to care about the business when he took over) i refuse to praise bk for the work moyes has done at the club becasue david himself deserves all of that. as ive said i dont know how many times, its the lies that have done it for me. and we've had pretty much one major lie a year in the last few, from the kirkby being free lies, to the fsf money ready to go into the bank, to we wont sell rooney for £50m. if the guy would just stay away from the cameras im sure he'd get less stick, or if he has to get infront of them, just tell us the story about dave hickson, i like that one, because its the only one i believe from him anymore.

 

as you said earlier carl, agree to disagree. its the toffeetalk way.

[Jimmy the blue]

i have many reasons and problems with kenwights running of the club, most of them a put down to wyness but kenwright has to fall on his own sword for wyness problems the same as he has been praised for bringing in moyes. i have my views on johnson, some will agree and most will disgree, but if anyone looks at the problems johnson was hounded out for, we have them same problems now, only we have better players and we are doing better, im very happy about the success on the pitch, but as ive said, football is more than just on the pitch nowdays. i can only hope im not put down as fickle for not being a fan of bk as i have been against the man for as long as i can remember (i was probably too young to care about the business when he took over) i refuse to praise bk for the work moyes has done at the club becasue david himself deserves all of that. as ive said i dont know how many times, its the lies that have done it for me. and we've had pretty much one major lie a year in the last few, from the kirkby being free lies, to the fsf money ready to go into the bank, to we wont sell rooney for £50m. if the guy would just stay away from the cameras im sure he'd get less stick, or if he has to get infront of them, just tell us the story about dave hickson, i like that one, because its the only one i believe from him anymore.

 

as you said earlier carl, agree to disagree. its the toffeetalk way.

 

I'll go with the agree to disagree as we are blues and have enough enemies as it is mate .

 

Anecdotally some years ago I was fundraiser for the captains charity at my golf club, the charity was Zoe's Place the baby hospice. I had organised a raffle prize of a weekend away in London for two, tickets printed prizes arranged when one sponsor when belly up and we had lost the accommodation in London. I had the idea of writing to Bill to see if he could let us have tickets for one of his London productions, I fully explained the circumstances to him, he not only gave us show tickets but also stood the cost of accommodation as well without being asked, to me that says the measure of the man. Incidentally the main idea behind that charity effort was 'lend us a hand' when many famous golfers, boxers, cricketers, keepers gave us signed gloves for auction, Arnold Palmer, Jack Niclaus, Muhamed Ali and many many others helped out. EFC, ManU, Citeh and Blackburn all gave, Liverpool didn't even have the manners to reply hence living down to their vermin reputation, they didn't even respond to their own supporters much to their embarrassment.

[carlmc25]

i have many reasons and problems with kenwights running of the club, most of them a put down to wyness but kenwright has to fall on his own sword for wyness problems the same as he has been praised for bringing in moyes. i have my views on johnson, some will agree and most will disgree, but if anyone looks at the problems johnson was hounded out for, we have them same problems now, only we have better players and we are doing better, im very happy about the success on the pitch, but as ive said, football is more than just on the pitch nowdays. i can only hope im not put down as fickle for not being a fan of bk as i have been against the man for as long as i can remember (i was probably too young to care about the business when he took over) i refuse to praise bk for the work moyes has done at the club becasue david himself deserves all of that. as ive said i dont know how many times, its the lies that have done it for me. and we've had pretty much one major lie a year in the last few, from the kirkby being free lies, to the fsf money ready to go into the bank, to we wont sell rooney for £50m. if the guy would just stay away from the cameras im sure he'd get less stick, or if he has to get infront of them, just tell us the story about dave hickson, i like that one, because its the only one i believe from him anymore.

 

as you said earlier carl, agree to disagree. its the toffeetalk way.

fair enough

[linglong]

if bk went public that the club was up for sale then im pretty sure someone will come forward.

none of this i'll sell if the right investor comes along, buyers dont want to invest, they want to own. just like blue bill does

Couldnt agree more BK doesnt want to sell,but the ham actor in him just cant stand to be hated so he spins out the line of he'll sell when the right investor comes along..yeah right

 

i have many reasons and problems with kenwights running of the club, most of them a put down to wyness but kenwright has to fall on his own sword for wyness problems the same as he has been praised for bringing in moyes. i have my views on johnson, some will agree and most will disgree, but if anyone looks at the problems johnson was hounded out for, we have them same problems now, only we have better players and we are doing better, im very happy about the success on the pitch, but as ive said, football is more than just on the pitch nowdays. i can only hope im not put down as fickle for not being a fan of bk as i have been against the man for as long as i can remember (i was probably too young to care about the business when he took over) i refuse to praise bk for the work moyes has done at the club becasue david himself deserves all of that. as ive said i dont know how many times, its the lies that have done it for me. and we've had pretty much one major lie a year in the last few, from the kirkby being free lies, to the fsf money ready to go into the bank, to we wont sell rooney for £50m. if the guy would just stay away from the cameras im sure he'd get less stick, or if he has to get infront of them, just tell us the story about dave hickson, i like that one, because its the only one i believe from him anymore.

 

as you said earlier carl, agree to disagree. its the toffeetalk way.

We could maybe write a book on the spin of BK..

 

Maybe titled i wont sell rooney for less than 50 mill while waiting for the FSF money

 

Catchy title i think

 

So how much deeper are we supposedly in debt since BK took over? off the pitch is it about £15m or something? We may have sold off the training ground (virtually worthless) and have slightly more debt, but all our assets are now in the most important place - on the pitch.

 

Here is our embarrassing squad from 1999

 

http://www.toffeeweb.com/season/99-00/squad.asp

 

and we all know what our current squad is.

 

I would say our old squad was worth about £54m and that's being generous and I'd say our current squad is worth:

 

Howard £6m

Baines £5m

Jags £6m

Lescott £12m

Yobo £7m

Neville £3m

Hibbert £2.5m

Valente £500k

Arteta £12m

Cahill £12m

Pienaar £4m

Osman £5m

Yakubu £14m

Anichebe £3m

Vaughan £3.5m

 

Total £95.5m

 

based on that our current squad is worth £40m more and that's without any further signings, without including Rodwell, Gosling, Turner etc and bearing in mind we've just raked £15m in for AJ/McFadden.

 

I don't think I've been overly generous with those valuations either. So if you're saying we're more than £40m in debt off the pitch (bearing in mind we've raked in £15m as I just said) than before, then I'd be surprised.

 

 

Sorry for the third straight post..but..

 

According to Mihir Bose from the BBC we're in about 66 million pounds worth of debt..for a club our size (medium lets be honest here) thats a hell of a lot of debt to be carring around in the start of a recession (sp?)

 

For me it explains why we've not spent that much this summer..we just havent got it to spend

Edited August 29, 2008 by StevO