littlejoe Posted July 6, 2011 Report Share Posted July 6, 2011 As some of you may know, we have started a camaign on twitter lately to try and raise awareness in the media regarding the ongoing situation with our board We have in the last half hour started a facebook page http://www.facebook.com/pages/The-Peoples-Group/201753756543925 We also have just started a twitter page @thepeoplesgroup and you can see the link through http://www.themerseyjuror.co.uk/2011/07/06/efc-exclusive-the-peoples-group/ The aims of the group, the original letter and the information are all on there to see. If you are interested please follow, we will do all we can and we will be open and honest with everyone. we are fed up of feeling down and moaning and so we thought we would try and do something about it. This may or may not work, but we are giving it a go and the opening feedback is positive We appreciate not everyone feels like this, but please respect what we are trying to do. We respect everyone's opinion but we have quite literally had enough now. Have a look at the page, the more followers the better and hopefully we can get the media interested in Everton football club once again and put some pressure on this board Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeO Posted July 6, 2011 Report Share Posted July 6, 2011 Both pages "not found." Out of interest what position are you in to have "better awareness" of what's going on at board level than the media do? And would you not be better off just joining Evertonians for change, who I guess have a similar agenda, rather than setting up another group? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Louis Posted July 6, 2011 Report Share Posted July 6, 2011 I've corrected links in opening post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeO Posted July 6, 2011 Report Share Posted July 6, 2011 I've corrected links in opening post. Thank you Louis...was having trouble sleeping but I'm drifting off nicely now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pax Posted July 7, 2011 Report Share Posted July 7, 2011 I'm sorry but 'the peoples group' and 'Everton for change' really need a large bite of reality and common sense. 1) Bill Kenwright hasn't got access to the funds needed to make Everton into serious and consistent competition winners. So we need a take over and we need a person or group who is willing to spend around £500 million (conservative estimate considering the a new stadium is needed), of which they will receive a likely return of nothing. Everton do not have the European or Global standing to eb able to generate significant revenue streams that could support a club aiming to win major competitions without hand outs from a wealthy benefactor. So bearing in mind anyone who buys Everton would either never seen a penny back or how to spend upwards of a billion to create significant revenue streams (which is not guaranteed) you might start to wonder what idiot in his right mind would even consider such an 'investment'. Add in that to have this kind of money in the first place you either need to be financially astute or inherited it and you are basically looking looking at two possible buyers for Everton. 1) an incredibly wealthy supporter of the club who is willing to throw money down a drain, or 2) Someone who inherited an obscene amount of money and wants a toy. Also when you look at nearly every takeover there has ever been in recent times, i'll be willing to bet that upwards of 90% of them end in failure. 2) Answers and clarity. it seems to have gone right over the heads of a lot of forum moaners but Everton is a privately owned company. The information the supporters are entitled to is nothing. Rightly so. A lot of information needs keeping out of the public domain is it could be extremely damaging for the football club. I've seen people calling for the club to announce who has shown interest in buying the club. Why? No one has made an offer for the club, no one has been able to prove funds and not one person has made public their burning desire to buy Everton football club. So why on earth do we need to know who the tyre kickers and liars are? If an individual or group, with serious funds available to them, wanted to buy Everton football club, offered good money for the club and a long term strategy and Kenwright said no. There are ways and means of putting pressure on Kenwright and forcing his hand to sell. It would be incredibly easy. I personally would sit down with every major media company and lay on the table, publicly,the offer i had made, the proof of funds and an outline of the long term strategy. Kenwright's hand would be forced quicker than he could say boys pen'. This has not happened, which shows no serious buyer, who could take Everton forward for many years to come has made on offer on the club, or even had an offer rejected rejected for the club. What about Keith Harris, if someone very serious and credible had anted to buy Everton and had been knocked back, you think he'd sit on his backside and watch his commission walk off? 3) The board have no ambition. Well ambition is one thing, having the money and the opportunities to actually deliver on your ambition are completely different. Like it or not, the stadium move to Kirkby was the board showing ambition. They were trying to find a stadium that would allow Everton make more money on a matchday. This got rejected by a decent % of the fans. I supported this rejection, but you cannot refuse the board showed pro-active ambition with this project. We seem to have bought numerous players in recent years too. Howard, Baines, Distin, JH, Fell, Billy, Yak have all joined. It might have been on the money from selling players but such is life. Man Utd were forced into selling a player they didn't want to as he wanted to go onto bigger and better things, same with Torres at Liverpool. This is the reality of the premier league as a business and a lot of you better get used to it. Players have less loyalty and less patience then ever before, thats not the boards fault and it's not anyone connected to Everton's fault. We have our budgets and we work to them and if there is an opportunity to go above those budgets then the board have shown they are willing to do that. For me thats as ambitious as you can get whilst also not risking the entire existence of the football club on some new expensive signings, simply to appease some supports who quote ambition and NSNO as if they could possibly have a literal meaning and as if they have ever been taken literally. Leds United once took things like that literally. I believe they have recovered enough to now play in the Championship. What ambition, only the best did for them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lowensda Posted July 7, 2011 Report Share Posted July 7, 2011 (edited) I'm sorry but 'the peoples group' and 'Everton for change' really need a large bite of reality and common sense. 1) Bill Kenwright hasn't got access to the funds needed to make Everton into serious and consistent competition winners. So we need a take over and we need a person or group who is willing to spend around £500 million (conservative estimate considering the a new stadium is needed), of which they will receive a likely return of nothing. Everton do not have the European or Global standing to eb able to generate significant revenue streams that could support a club aiming to win major competitions without hand outs from a wealthy benefactor. So bearing in mind anyone who buys Everton would either never seen a penny back or how to spend upwards of a billion to create significant revenue streams (which is not guaranteed) you might start to wonder what idiot in his right mind would even consider such an 'investment'. Add in that to have this kind of money in the first place you either need to be financially astute or inherited it and you are basically looking looking at two possible buyers for Everton. 1) an incredibly wealthy supporter of the club who is willing to throw money down a drain, or 2) Someone who inherited an obscene amount of money and wants a toy. Also when you look at nearly every takeover there has ever been in recent times, i'll be willing to bet that upwards of 90% of them end in failure. 2) Answers and clarity. it seems to have gone right over the heads of a lot of forum moaners but Everton is a privately owned company. The information the supporters are entitled to is nothing. Rightly so. A lot of information needs keeping out of the public domain is it could be extremely damaging for the football club. I've seen people calling for the club to announce who has shown interest in buying the club. Why? No one has made an offer for the club, no one has been able to prove funds and not one person has made public their burning desire to buy Everton football club. So why on earth do we need to know who the tyre kickers and liars are? If an individual or group, with serious funds available to them, wanted to buy Everton football club, offered good money for the club and a long term strategy and Kenwright said no. There are ways and means of putting pressure on Kenwright and forcing his hand to sell. It would be incredibly easy. I personally would sit down with every major media company and lay on the table, publicly,the offer i had made, the proof of funds and an outline of the long term strategy. Kenwright's hand would be forced quicker than he could say boys pen'. This has not happened, which shows no serious buyer, who could take Everton forward for many years to come has made on offer on the club, or even had an offer rejected rejected for the club. What about Keith Harris, if someone very serious and credible had anted to buy Everton and had been knocked back, you think he'd sit on his backside and watch his commission walk off? 3) The board have no ambition. Well ambition is one thing, having the money and the opportunities to actually deliver on your ambition are completely different. Like it or not, the stadium move to Kirkby was the board showing ambition. They were trying to find a stadium that would allow Everton make more money on a matchday. This got rejected by a decent % of the fans. I supported this rejection, but you cannot refuse the board showed pro-active ambition with this project. We seem to have bought numerous players in recent years too. Howard, Baines, Distin, JH, Fell, Billy, Yak have all joined. It might have been on the money from selling players but such is life. Man Utd were forced into selling a player they didn't want to as he wanted to go onto bigger and better things, same with Torres at Liverpool. This is the reality of the premier league as a business and a lot of you better get used to it. Players have less loyalty and less patience then ever before, thats not the boards fault and it's not anyone connected to Everton's fault. We have our budgets and we work to them and if there is an opportunity to go above those budgets then the board have shown they are willing to do that. For me thats as ambitious as you can get whilst also not risking the entire existence of the football club on some new expensive signings, simply to appease some supports who quote ambition and NSNO as if they could possibly have a literal meaning and as if they have ever been taken literally. Leds United once took things like that literally. I believe they have recovered enough to now play in the Championship. What ambition, only the best did for them. :jump for joy: Who is this guy?? I like him Edited July 7, 2011 by tenaciousj Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted July 7, 2011 Report Share Posted July 7, 2011 holy crap! common sense and well formed answers in defence of BK and the board?! Dude, well written and fair play. Now be prepared for the doom merchants to pick away with the same ol' same ol' boring arguments.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romey 1878 Posted July 7, 2011 Report Share Posted July 7, 2011 Dude, well written and fair play. Now be prepared for the doom merchants to pick away with the same ol' same ol' boring arguments.... I'm not really usre why you have to be a cunt about it tbh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted July 7, 2011 Report Share Posted July 7, 2011 I'm not really usre why you have to be a cunt about it tbh. Hes a newbie and was just warning him there would be backlash. Whats cuntish? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lowensda Posted July 7, 2011 Report Share Posted July 7, 2011 holy crap! common sense and well formed answers in defence of BK and the board?! Dude, well written and fair play. Now be prepared for the doom merchants to pick away with the same ol' same ol' boring arguments.... I'm not really usre why you have to be a cunt about it tbh. Ladies, please? No snide comments or names please people. We ain't Bluekipper, so respect each others opinions. It's a forum to vent frustration but no-need to get personal Not everyone will agree with what each other is saying and counter arguments are fine, this stuff ain't needed. Peace Please :I surrender: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lowensda Posted July 7, 2011 Report Share Posted July 7, 2011 (edited) Second of all, The 'C' bomb can only be used in threads that Marco has started. Thank you Edited July 7, 2011 by tenaciousj Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted July 7, 2011 Report Share Posted July 7, 2011 Ladies, please? No snide comments or names please people. We ain't Bluekipper, so respect each others opinions. It's a forum to vent frustration but no-need to get personal Not everyone will agree with what each other is saying and counter arguments are fine, this stuff ain't needed. Peace Please :I surrender: I didnt mention names! I made a statement based on fact - there are doom merchants here. Just like people like me who are "BK sympathizers" etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romey 1878 Posted July 7, 2011 Report Share Posted July 7, 2011 Hes a newbie and was just warning him there would be backlash. Whats cuntish? The way you are about the opinions against BK, you belittle the negative views like they're from cloud cuckoo land, when in reality they have a lot of basis. I'm sick of hearing him being defended but I still listen to what you (and others) say and take it on board. Ladies, please? No snide comments or names please people. We ain't Bluekipper, so respect each others opinions. I'm not saying Matt is a cunt, but he's acting like one precisely by not respecting a differing opinion to his. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romey 1878 Posted July 7, 2011 Report Share Posted July 7, 2011 And. btw, I'm not falling out with you Matt. I'm capable of having an argument with you and then be quite prepared to bend you over and give you a good seeing to tomorrow . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marcopaulo Posted July 7, 2011 Report Share Posted July 7, 2011 yeah fuck off with my word you cunt both right..there are people who will ignore what the other side of the argument says..you two aren't like them so don't argue like kids you're both much better than that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted July 7, 2011 Report Share Posted July 7, 2011 The way you are about the opinions against BK, you belittle the negative views like they're from cloud cuckoo land, when in reality they have a lot of basis. I'm sick of hearing him being defended but I still listen to what you (and others) say and take it on board. I'm not saying Matt is a cunt, but he's acting like one precisely by not respecting a differing opinion to his. If I belittled in the sentence I apologize, like I said was just giving the new guy a heads up. Not sure how this is disrespecting opinions..... I read and respect the decisions against BK and the board, I really do no matter how mad it makes me. Im also sick of them being criticized for every little thing that goes wrong because theyre the easiest people to make out as a scapegoat. Are they responsible for situation we are in? Partially, but not completely and there are people on here that want to blame them completely, or at least its how I interpret their opinions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted July 7, 2011 Report Share Posted July 7, 2011 And. btw, I'm not falling out with you Matt. I'm capable of having an argument with you and then be quite prepared to bend you over and give you a good seeing to tomorrow . aaaaw, you always know the right things to say, you sweet-talker you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romey 1878 Posted July 7, 2011 Report Share Posted July 7, 2011 (edited) If I belittled in the sentence I apologize, like I said was just giving the new guy a heads up. Not sure how this is disrespecting opinions..... By saying people who don't support BK are doom merchants when there's a list as long as a black man's dick for why there are fans who want rid of him. For me, it's the board as a whole who need getting shut of, they're all useless, but BK is their figurehead and put the board together so he's going to get the brunt of the flak from supporters. Edited July 7, 2011 by Romey 1878 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lowensda Posted July 7, 2011 Report Share Posted July 7, 2011 So...Welcome to TT PAX Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted July 7, 2011 Report Share Posted July 7, 2011 By saying people who don't support BK are doom merchants when there's a list as long as a black man's dick for why there are fans who want rid of him. For me, it's the board as a whole who need getting shut of, they're all useless, but BK is their figurehead and put the board together so he's going to get the brunt of the flak from supporters. Certainly didnt meant to say that anyone against BK and the board are all doom merchants. Anyway, i'll stop before I go around in circles.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romey 1878 Posted July 7, 2011 Report Share Posted July 7, 2011 Certainly didnt meant to say that anyone against BK and the board are all doom merchants. Anyway, i'll stop before I go around in circles.... But I used to love going on the merrygoround when I was a kid! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lowensda Posted July 7, 2011 Report Share Posted July 7, 2011 But I used to love going on the merrygoround when I was a kid! Is this you, you evil child Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romey 1878 Posted July 7, 2011 Report Share Posted July 7, 2011 I have no comment to make on that . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SimonButtle Posted July 7, 2011 Report Share Posted July 7, 2011 Is this you, you evil child replace the dog with Marks local shite fan, would be more suitable Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pax Posted July 7, 2011 Report Share Posted July 7, 2011 So...Welcome to TT PAX Why thank you My username is rather ironic considering the way this thread wanted to go Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pax Posted July 7, 2011 Report Share Posted July 7, 2011 (edited) By saying people who don't support BK are doom merchants when there's a list as long as a black man's dick for why there are fans who want rid of him. For me, it's the board as a whole who need getting shut of, they're all useless, but BK is their figurehead and put the board together so he's going to get the brunt of the flak from supporters. I would really like someone to list the reasons for getting rid of our board and Bill Kenwright. I'd like to see genuine reasons that can't be attributed to the creation of the Premier league, the distribution of tv money since the creation of the premier league and Everton as a football clubs failure to promote the club through out different markets through out the world when they had opportunity. Genuine failures, by Kenwright and his Board where blame can solely be placed at their feet. Edited July 7, 2011 by pax Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blue 250 Posted July 7, 2011 Report Share Posted July 7, 2011 As above, welcome PAX! A new member to the forum with his own mind, can only be good. Well thought out comments......rearange the following, air, breath, of, fresh! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Louis Posted July 7, 2011 Report Share Posted July 7, 2011 I would really like someone to list the reasons for getting rid of our board and Bill Kenwright. I'd like to see genuine reasons that can't be attributed to the creation of the Premier league, the distribution of tv money since the creation of the premier league and Everton as a football clubs failure to promote the club through out different markets through out the world when they had opportunity. Genuine failures, by Kenwright and his Board where blame can solely be placed at their feet. The biggest one is spending money on players before expected money was available. As a result the club had to sell players and take out a 25 year mortgage. It'll take £50m+ to pay back. The Chairman at the time, Sir Philip Carter is still a director at the club, at the time Bill Kenwright was a major shareholder having bought into the club via True Blue Holdings. Present director Jon Woods was also a director at the time. Not offering Dan Gosling a contract in writing and missing out on any possible compensation. Not having an agreement in writing with promoters Alexander Ross for the 2007 Vodacom Challenge, Alexander Ross later opted to take Spurs to South Africa instead. Everton took Alexander Ross to court where the case was dismissed, Everton missed out on a pre-season tour and also paid legal expenses of £300k because of it. The problems with the new building on the park end, publicly giving three reasons at differing times why it could not be done, only for it to transpire that Everton could not obtain permission from the Prudential (who hold the deeds to the land, due to the above mortgage being used to secure Goodison as collateral) to lease out to a third party. Pursuing the stadium in Kirkby when it became apparent that it was not what it was originally thought to be. An AGM was called where questions were asked because it had been looked at indepth by fans, and shareholders were told it'll be alright on the night. The failed project cost £3m spread over two years. This one is not a reason why Bill Kenwright should go but I found it odd that the board preferred to bring a retired octogenarian back onto the board, rather than elect a new director who in theory could offer a new dynamic to the board. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pax Posted July 7, 2011 Report Share Posted July 7, 2011 The biggest one is spending £20million on players before the expected money was available. As a result the club had to sell players and take out a 25 year mortgage. It'll take £50m+ to pay back. The Chairman at the time, Sir Philip Carter is still a director at the club, at the time Bill Kenwright was a major shareholder having bought into the club via True Blue Holdings. Present director Jon Woods was also a director at the time. Not offering Dan Gosling a contract in writing and missing out on any possible compensation. Not having an agreement in writing with promoters Alexander Ross for the 2007 Vodacom Challenge, Alexander Ross later opted to take Spurs to South Africa instead. Everton took Alexander Ross to court where the case was dismissed, Everton missed out on a pre-season tour and also paid legal expenses of £300k because of it. The problems with the new building on the park end, publicly giving three reasons at differing times why it could not be done, only for it to transpire that Everton could not obtain permission from the Prudential (who hold the deeds to the land, due to the above mortgage being used to secure Goodison as collateral) to lease out to a third party. Pursuing the stadium in Kirkby when it became apparent that it was not what it was originally thought to be. An AGM was called where questions were asked because it had been looked at indepth by fans, and shareholders were told it'll be alright on the night. The failed project cost £3m spread over two years. This one is not a reason why Bill Kenwright should go but I found it odd that the board preferred to bring a retired octogenarian back onto the board, rather than elect a new director who in theory could offer a new dynamic to the board. 1) Are the figures you quoted accurate? Isn't this what a lot of the clubs supporters would wrongly deem 'ambition'? I'm a bit of an old school person, you don't buy anything unless you can pay for it. Simple as that. However, is this not a mistake that the board made and has actually shaped the future financial commitments and strategy of the club? It's clearly, in retrospect, a mistake, but one that is understandable in an attempt to push Everton up the league and one that hasn't been repeated? 2) Basic, stupid and completely unacceptable. Not that i think Gosling is much of a loss but the couple of million we'd have got for him is sorely missed at a cash strapped club. Not 'life changing' though. 3) Meh 4) Answer to this is probably the same as point 1. 5) I'm not entirely sure anyone has access to the facts on this. There is plenty of conjecture but not hard facts from those involved with the decision making process. I find it hard to comment. 6) I know nothing about this. Seems strange, but surely there is a valid reason? My point about this is that none of these things are going to change the football club. None of these things are going to deliver success. The finances of football now are ludicrous. Only the rich can survive and prosper. There is and never will be any shame in being a football club that operates on strict budgets. As far as i can see, football is pretty much dead. If you are not a huge, famous club or how a billionaire owner, forget about it. The game is over. Players wages and demands are killing every single football club in the world without a sugar daddy or access to huge revenue streams. Unless world wide salary caps are introduced with quota's for home grown talent, then the bigger clubs are going to pull further and further away from the rest. The owners of the big clubs in this country have no understanding of English football, they have no sense of duty to English football. It's all about money. What delivers the most money, the Champions League. What will deliver them more money, the players more money, a European Super League. Is this the revenue stream the Arabs have had a eye on from the start with Man City, probably. You think the Glazers, The Russian, The Yanks at Liverpool, whoever is in charge at Arsenal would turn down the opportunity to compete in a European Super League? You think the biggest Italian clubs would turn down the chance to revive themselves etc etc. Everton as a football club needs to act in a financially responsible manner and ensure Premier League status. It might hit some people hard, but that is the reality of football and i don't see it getting much better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bailey Posted July 7, 2011 Report Share Posted July 7, 2011 Three of the main issues that I have with the board are lack of foresight in builing the park end stand, the kings dock missed opportunity and the bullshit that was the Fortress funds £20mil that dissapeared as quickly as it was mentioned. To me the building of the single tier park end was probably the most 'unambitious' the board have been. They had the chance to build a stand that would be able to generate much more revenue, especially with corporate facilities but they opted not for whatever reason. Although I agree that in recent times thay havent been as 'unambitious' as people claim and that is more scape-goating in my opinion. For the most part though I think your first post is spot on, but I would disagree with the amount of money that would be needed for someone to buy the club. Kenwright has effectively put none of his own money into the club, so it is therefore permissable that someone else could do a similar thing, maybe paying off large chunks of debt (because that is what is mainly causing us to lose the amount we do each year) and maybe develop the park end, which in turn would make the club more attractive to buyers. Obviously its all hypothetical but its not the case that they would have to spend as much as you claim to get the club on a better footing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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