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Vellios was moved to the reserves for having unauthorised one on one training sessions with Ferguson after training had finished.

It went on for a few weeks when he was getting games, when Ferguson told Moyes how well Vellios had progressed in these session he gave them both down the banks for not informing him what was going on .Vellios hasn't had a look in since.

That came from Duncans mouth.

 

nana i got it!

 

Velious was dropped to the reserves because he scored a goal for us and moyes didnt think it was the "type" of goal that he wanted Everton to be scoring, and Velios has not had a look in since.

 

Honestly thats what happened.

 

Oh come on!

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Vellios was moved to the reserves for having unauthorised one on one training sessions with Ferguson after training had finished.

It went on for a few weeks when he was getting games, when Ferguson told Moyes how well Vellios had progressed in these session he gave them both down the banks for not informing him what was going on .Vellios hasn't had a look in since.

That came from Duncans mouth.

 

Moyes puts his own self importance before that of the club - unfortunately I can well believe that. I have often thought that 'average' journey men players turned managers can have a tendancy to be jealous of players who have a bit of skill and class about them, "I had to work hard at my game and stay disciplined - so should everyone else"

 

Interesting to see Dunc being marked by Moyes in a training match - I think he would apply a few tricks of the trade on Davie and bully him with a mixture of power, know how and finesse.

 

Vellios looks to me like he has the tools to be a classic number 9... taking lessons off the best latter day number 9 is only going to benefit him, unless Davies intention was to turn him into a forward defender...

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With all due respect thats garbage. Bannished to the reserves because he was taking extra lessons from one of our forward coaches.. Yeah sure.

 

Well i've no reason to make it up.

The problem wasnt that he was taking extra coaching, it was that it was unauthorised.

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Well i've no reason to make it up.

The problem wasnt that he was taking extra coaching, it was that it was unauthorised.

 

The fact is no one wants to believe it's true bcause it is ridiculous - I do believe it. Moyes has to have a handle on everything.

 

Ronaldo used to show Nani his ball striking technique and stay behind working on free kicks relentlessly - did that require authorising by SAF? I doubt it.

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1:33 Moyes would run on the pitch and punch him. I like that he trys the passes forward but thats why Moyes is probs reluctant to play him as he'll lose possession a lot, it's a trade-off I'd be willing to risk against lower teams who we can more easily win the ball back from. Last 10-20 mins against better opposition depending on our players fitness to make the runs/get the ball back.

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Great ability however for me far too much showboating - done some nice things but losts coiunt of the amount of sloppy passes he made.

 

Based on that alone he needs to show a little more respect for possession - do it in the right places. Playing passes across the defence etc, not good. Talent nop doubt though.

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Yeah I was a bit dissapointed with his preformances.

 

John Lundstram however looked superb against Greece

i like that lundstram has kept a low profile,hardly any news about him he could be the dark horse.

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He tries to do too much imo, still looks good though but rough round the edges, maybe like pete says, against the smaller teams give him a run out and see what happens it will be good experience for him.

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The good: Available for everything, always coming short, making intelligent runs into space in the midfield, everyone seems to want to give him the ball.

 

The bad: Forces passes that aren't on and loses possession, tries to beat one too many. Hard to tell from just that clip, but looked like England should have been working a few more shooting opportunities from the edge of the area based on how Greece were parking the bus.

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seems arrogant..possible reason he didn't play much last year? i certainly wouldn't want to see those kind of passes in a prem game..and agree duncan i said as i was watchin it that lundstram looked the far better player on the day

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seems arrogant..possible reason he didn't play much last year? i certainly wouldn't want to see those kind of passes in a prem game..and agree duncan i said as i was watchin it that lundstram looked the far better player on the day

 

I heard he is nice and apparently he cried after the blackburn game I believe.

 

He has had his troubles and after some experience i think he can make an incredible impact

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Ok, i'll start with the negatives.

Gave the ball away for too many times, especially around his own half and the centre circle. Dont mind a player giving it away around the opposition box, normally when trying to pull off something creative. But, if he didnt make these mistakes he would have been playing for the first team in the Euros rather then the U19s, so all in a little bit of perspective.

Positives, he clearly has a lot of ability, he likes to pick a pass and doesnt mind the odd trick here or there. If he could just tidy up his game and cut out a few mistakes he wont go far wrong. He keeps a lot of his passing simple and on the floor, making it easy for his team mates. And in fairness to the U19 coach, the whole team seem to play it on the deck, good to see from an England team.

 

Overall, not his best performance, but can see there is a talent there.

 

Lets just let him develop in his own time. With players like Ossie and hopefully Pienaar in the first team there will be no rush to get him in there, and some good examples to learn from. Training with them two (similar types of player to him IMO) everyday can only be a help.

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I've been one of the "get Barkley in now, he's better than anything else we have" - however based on that performance alone he makes it difficult for me to continue that argument. Yes, he can do some things none of our first teamers can - and he looks very swift footed, excellent vision etc, but if he gave a ball away like he almost did passing along the back four and we lost as a result, our opinions would change.

 

He needs a big brother to talk him through games, ossie would be the most suitable candidate IMO, arteta previously.

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I havent seen the game but it does sound like he had a bit of a stinker! However, its one game. How many of our players last season played 4 or 5 games in a row just as poorly!?

 

Give the lad some time, Im not suggesting he should start, but he needs to learn on the pitch and in the Premier League. Give him 20 mins here or 30 mins there with a start in the early cup games. He has bags of ability but he will never learn how to use it if he isnt given the time to learn it where it counts!

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Are you people seriously having these reactions based on one game? Let alone after a pretty good one for as far as I can tell. Look at his balance and close control, impressive, especially for a tall lad like him. If that vid shows me one thing, it's that he's got what it takes. You shouldn't be expecting a finished product!

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I think he might benefit from some time with Fellaini myself, if you remember when he first joined he used to give the ball away an awful lot and over the last couple of seasons has stopped all that and is much better. At the same time it's clear that Barkley has skill and ability that members of the first team don't have, he is always looking for the pass forward like Xavi and he will get stuck in like Gerrard he just needs to pick his passes a bit better.

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Are you people seriously having these reactions based on one game? Let alone after a pretty good one for as far as I can tell. Look at his balance and close control, impressive, especially for a tall lad like him. If that vid shows me one thing, it's that he's got what it takes. You shouldn't be expecting a finished product!

 

not at all..but people seem to think he's a saviour after 2-3 games so it's a fair opinion if that's the case for the positives

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not at all..but people seem to think he's a saviour after 2-3 games so it's a fair opinion if that's the case for the positives

 

People were excited about him and rightfully so because he was the best man on the pitch against Bremen, Villareal and QPR. I think people being negative about him now, like you calling arrogant because he plays a pass over the width of the pitch, might have more to do with people "thinking he's a saviour" then with Barkley's play itself.

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I dont think anyone is being negative, everyone is being constructive. Everyone is saying he has potential but needs time to grow. God knows what you've been reading Steve.

 

I have been reading:

  • "wouldn't blame him [running onto the pitch and hitting him]..dodgy pass against any opposition..thought he was poor myself from what i saw"
  • "Yeah I was a bit dissapointed with his preformances. John Lundstram however looked superb against Greece." and "i like that lundstram has kept a low profile,hardly any news about him he could be the dark horse." sounded to me like people were already writing him off. As dit the following bullet:
  • "I've been one of the "get Barkley in now, he's better than anything else we have" - however based on that performance alone he makes it difficult for me to continue that argument. Yes, he can do some things none of our first teamers can - and he looks very swift footed, excellent vision etc, but if he gave a ball away like he almost did passing along the back four and we lost as a result, our opinions would change." That shows a completely wrong attitude towards youth players to me.
  • "seems arrogant..possible reason he didn't play much last year?"

Maybe I misinterpreted some things.

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Lundstram did look very handy on them clips... He certainly looks like he is thinking a half a second quicker than his team mates and the opposition. I had heard he was decent but he has actually surprised me with that. I will be interested to see if he gets any game time in pre-season.

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I have been reading:

  • "wouldn't blame him [running onto the pitch and hitting him]..dodgy pass against any opposition..thought he was poor myself from what i saw"
  • "Yeah I was a bit dissapointed with his preformances. John Lundstram however looked superb against Greece." and "i like that lundstram has kept a low profile,hardly any news about him he could be the dark horse." sounded to me like people were already writing him off. As dit the following bullet:
  • "I've been one of the "get Barkley in now, he's better than anything else we have" - however based on that performance alone he makes it difficult for me to continue that argument. Yes, he can do some things none of our first teamers can - and he looks very swift footed, excellent vision etc, but if he gave a ball away like he almost did passing along the back four and we lost as a result, our opinions would change." That shows a completely wrong attitude towards youth players to me.
  • "seems arrogant..possible reason he didn't play much last year?"

Maybe I misinterpreted some things.

 

Yes hes being criticised, but everyone is saying he is young and needs time to learn. No one is saying hes shite and will never make it. The lad isnt perfect and is still a kid, so he should be treated that way. No point in everyone saying wow hes great play him now! Lets be realistic, give him time to grow and see how he develops. Right now he has massive potential, with the right work and attitude he could be a world beater.

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Yes hes being criticised, but everyone is saying he is young and needs time to learn. No one is saying hes shite and will never make it. The lad isnt perfect and is still a kid, so he should be treated that way. No point in everyone saying wow hes great play him now! Lets be realistic, give him time to grow and see how he develops. Right now he has massive potential, with the right work and attitude he could be a world beater.

 

Agreed, he's a £20m plus player already based on many reports - he will be a top player, we don't need to go on about that, but we can certainly point our glaring errors he is making against opposition that are a lot less than he would face in the premier league.

 

He's on a good contract and expectations of his attitiude, performance and certainly decision making are high - for every good pass there was near enough a misplaced simple pass. It's a big year for the lad and he needs to focus - that was a sloppy performance by his standards.

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Agreed, he's a £20m plus player already based on many reports - he will be a top player, we don't need to go on about that, but we can certainly point our glaring errors he is making against opposition that are a lot less than he would face in the premier league.

 

He's on a good contract and expectations of his attitiude, performance and certainly decision making are high - for every good pass there was near enough a misplaced simple pass. It's a big year for the lad and he needs to focus - that was a sloppy performance by his standards.

To be fair to Ross though, Fellaini was doing that in the first team when he first joined us, the guy could'nt pass over a few yards without giving the ball away(he has vastly improved this and i think would be a great person for Ross to learn from)

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To be fair to Ross though, Fellaini was doing that in the first team when he first joined us, the guy could'nt pass over a few yards without giving the ball away(he has vastly improved this and i think would be a great person for Ross to learn from)

 

Ai not disputing that pris, but felli got mullered for it. This lad has got to understand that showboating mixed with shite passes ain't the way to please fans. He has a lot of support and shouldn't confuse it with freedom to do what he wants.

 

He will be class, it's just what journey does he want to take to get there.

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Just as a matter of interest do people still think Moyes deserves all the flack he got in here for taking Barkley out of the limelight and getting as maney games in to him as he could at resreve / youth level?

Think that was more about the fact that the team in general were shite at that time, and Barkley wasn't playing any worse than any of the rest of them tbh, it seemed like Moyes was pushing the blame on to him a bit, that's how i saw it anyway, others may have a different view.

 

Hopefully it will have made a difference to Ross's game, although he does still look a bit raw, i think let him have a run against the smaller teams, and then give him 15-20mins against the bigger ones.

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Just as a matter of interest do people still think Moyes deserves all the flack he got in here for taking Barkley out of the limelight and getting as maney games in to him as he could at resreve / youth level?

 

Yeah I think he did. He had McFadden, anichebe, half injured Cahill playing when Barkley could have had some education time. It was ridiculous at times.

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Yeah I was a bit dissapointed with his preformances.

 

John Lundstram however looked superb against Greece

Went to school with him he has improved alot now but to say he will play in midfield for us in the next 5 years cant see it if im honest

 

Most people probably want naismith behind jelevic but i want to see ross play a few games there, hes got that killer pass when anyone shows a bit of movement but its probably unrealistic given moyes doesnt like flair players and if he does he trys to change the way they play.

 

I think he might benefit from some time with Fellaini myself, if you remember when he first joined he used to give the ball away an awful lot and over the last couple of seasons has stopped all that and is much better. At the same time it's clear that Barkley has skill and ability that members of the first team don't have, he is always looking for the pass forward like Xavi and he will get stuck in like Gerrard he just needs to pick his passes a bit better.

 

agree

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He recieved a yellow card for that tackle...seemed harsh as it looked a solid tackle to me.

 

Ross was dissapointing in that match but he is a young guy and i am sure he will have watched that back with the coaching staff and learned a few valuable lessons. Honestly, matches like that are the best thing for him at the moment as it will highlight what is needed to become a prem player.

 

There are a few moments during those highlights where he looked like he was trying to hard to measure the simple passes...maybe nerves or even a concious effort to work on his weak area's.

 

Agree that lundstrum looked good...he has looked good for the last 12 months to be honest. he looks like a man playing with boys at times.

 

This is going to be a big year for Ross and i think we all need to have patience with him. He could turn out to be a world class player.

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He recieved a yellow card for that tackle...seemed harsh as it looked a solid tackle to me.

 

Ross was dissapointing in that match but he is a young guy and i am sure he will have watched that back with the coaching staff and learned a few valuable lessons. Honestly, matches like that are the best thing for him at the moment as it will highlight what is needed to become a prem player.

 

There are a few moments during those highlights where he looked like he was trying to hard to measure the simple passes...maybe nerves or even a concious effort to work on his weak area's.

 

Agree that lundstrum looked good...he has looked good for the last 12 months to be honest. he looks like a man playing with boys at times.

 

This is going to be a big year for Ross and i think we all need to have patience with him. He could turn out to be a world class player.

 

I totally agree, and I think that is precisely why Moyse took him out of the first team picture and had him playing in every game he possibly could at reserve and youth level

 

people need patience and trust with moyes more than barkley

 

 

Yep thats my take on it also

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Unless we sign another centre midfielder I think we will see him play alot more this season. I imagine Moyes will want to get the team settled and please God off to a good start before he brings him in. Hopefully he will start in leauge cup matches and cameos in leauge matches until the new year when he plays a bit more frequently.

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I think we will see a lot of him too, it's easy to forget that he's just 18 though.

I think we'll see more of Neville/Heitinga in midfield with Fellaini, Naismith, and Osman ahead of Barkley :(. Hope I'm wrong.

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My thinking is that the main reason Moyes agreed to Rodwell's sale is because he knows that we have a younger, better player comign through (Barkley) and he would rather give him the opportunites than have Rodwell standing in his way.

So to get £12-£15m for our second best young midfielder is good business

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My thinking is that the main reason Moyes agreed to Rodwell's sale is because he knows that we have a younger, better player comign through (Barkley) and he would rather give him the opportunites than have Rodwell standing in his way.

So to get £12-£15m for our second best young midfielder is good business

Barkley has arguably more potential, but he doesn't replace Rodwell. He's an attacking mid, whereas Rodwell is a box-to-box that are a lot rarer these days.

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I recall Rodwell being played out wide the season after her made some awesome performances, his form just totally dropped.

 

Hopefully he plays Barkley in a central role where he can do more damage with throughballs - the learning would be dramatic.

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