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Protest prior to Aston Villa game


FairWooney

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You can post whatever you like...fact is that in the Lerner era Villa have finished above us once.

 

What you think of the individual players is irrelevant....love to hear your reaction if, in a couple of years time, England line up with Baines, Jagielka, Barkley, Rodwell and...er...Ossie in a serious competitive match and none of them are Everton players.

 

I'd join the f'king Blue Union if that happeed!

 

Spot on. Fare enough about another team getting investment over us, but this is a perfect example that a new owner is not gonna magically fix everything. Villa we're very similar to us league position wise and still are(if not further behind). This ruins any argument for how well the chairmans done, when ultimately he has failed to finish higher than 6th and only once above us in his reign.

 

Associating on pitch performance with the chairman is what has brought kenwright so much time.

 

Villa needed a striker, what did they do? go and buy £24m Darren bent. They sold downing for £20m, replaced him with nzogbia (choke). They have delph coming through who they outbid us for.

 

They have albrighton who is touted as the next big thing. ciaran Clark etc etc

 

The players they sold: Milner - man city and he wanted to go. Downing £20m come on?!, young £14m last year of contract.

 

Us? Well we have to sell don't we? It will be a matter of time before baines, jags and Barkley join Rooney, and lescott on international duty. If rodwell gets his head right, he will be cashed in also.

 

I will also argue the point that all villa players who represented England were acquired using lerners money.. Bar Gary Cahill, who was from the academy based at bodymore Heath. Interesting point about that is villa own it. Till Lerner took over, Ellis downgraded the redevelopment of the complex based on poor league finishes. Lerner soon changed that, revisited plans and upgraded every aspect.

 

Throw into the mix that Lerner has overseen Continued improvement if villa park, with it heading for 50k seater status then yeah, job done.

 

I don't see the point you're making about player sales, to me it reads they have sold their best players(in positive way) and we are going to sell our best players( in a negative feel). You say there ex-players represent England as a good thing for them, but we have a team full of internationals that we haven't sold yet. I don't get what you mean?

You point out Gary Cahill but they let him go, because they bought Curtis Davies for £10m but you think they have been doing great business.

To compare youth teams is laughable. Would you swap ours for theirs?

 

Haf, I think we're complete opposites it seem we disagree on everything.

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Spot on. Fare enough about another team getting investment over us, but this is a perfect example that a new owner is not gonna magically fix everything. Villa we're very similar to us league position wise and still are(if not further behind). This ruins any argument for how well the chairmans done, when ultimately he has failed to finish higher than 6th and only once above us in his reign.

 

 

 

I don't see the point you're making about player sales, to me it reads they have sold their best players(in positive way) and we are going to sell our best players( in a negative feel). You say there ex-players represent England as a good thing for them, but we have a team full of internationals that we haven't sold yet. I don't get what you mean?

You point out Gary Cahill but they let him go, because they bought Curtis Davies for £10m but you think they have been doing great business.

To compare youth teams is laughable. Would you swap ours for theirs?

 

Haf, I think we're complete opposites it seem we disagree on everything.

 

Again another one who fails to separate the role of the board and that of the manager. Forget league position, forget who they bought, look at what the board has done to support the manager and develop the club. Unless chairmen are to be appraised on their ability to spot a good player can we please drop that nonsense argument.

 

It's was common knowledge for quite some time that Martin O'neill believed his stock was far higher than it actually was. He was backed by his chairman to the hilt, lerner turned the tap off when the news of dressing room unrest, favouritism, players being ignored became apparent. He collected 25 players and used a fraction of them, had them on daft wages. Villa ordered him to sort it out, reduce the wage bill and he went about it like the odious petulant child you seen on the BBC. He even tried for constructive dismissal. The villa fans despise what he did.

 

You should know that I have a fair amount of knowledge regarding villa, a mate in work is villa daft and sits feet away. For the record their youth system is top notch, They don't have a Barkley at the moment, but they do have Albrighton, bannan, Clark, and delfounso.

Nor will they have to sell these players when united come sniffing to appease the banks.

 

Villa outperform us in every aspect barring the pitch, that is only to be a matter of time whilst our club can't afford to buy anyone with it's net spend of £0 over ten years. They will soon have a 50,000 seater stadium, have even more corporate facilities. The own their stadium, own their training ground, They even went about restoring the holte hotel to give the fans pride in seeing a traditional pre match meeting place restored after being left to rot since the 70's.

 

Are you seriously telling me you would have kenwright over Lerner? Try if you can imagine Lerner doing those things at everton and supplying moyes with the money he has put into villa.

Edited by Hafnia
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<p>

 

European qualification, rules were clear yet they still got to play with out. Wait for it... qualifying. There is a clear division between the common sense reality and the world the kopites live in.

Wheres the conspiracy theory? Could their previous owners payed the arrears. Yes. Was the sale forced through? Yes. Should they be entitled to compensation?

You brought Liverpool up as the model to follow, and it was a bad point. How is me pointing that out, bitter? Your another level of cunt with that passive piece of shit line. Seriously what the fuck!? Don't be coming back with a whiny, why you aiming an attack at me crap either, you've threw the bait and i've bit.

Here's a conspiracy BU didn't tape Kenwright, and also discovered he's snuck £25m out the club and hid it in Greenes bank account, but BU dont want him sacked, no just an intermediary team brought in because although we blame Kenwright for everything and barely mentioned the CEO who would have been able to answer our financial questions better-but that would have been no fun recording, oops- it's him who the 'fans' want replacing.

Common sense, reality and completely rational explanations, and not a daft conspiracy in sight within all your BU posts. You're just a sheep who's jumped on a band wagon thats slowly realising behind all the ruckus they're making, that they have the opinion of the minority.

 

Where to start? Ok, they changed the rules but mainly because the UEFA idiots hadn't worked out that they'd set up a system that would not have the winners in the next year's competition. If we'd been champions, we'd have demanded the same & UEFA changed the system afterwards so they wouldn't be embarrassed again. It didn't affect us, we got the place we earned so why should we care and go on about it?

 

Yes, Hicks & Gillette had the money all the time and the High Court are such massive Liverpool fans that they broke English law and stole the club off them. Then they took Gillette's Nascar team off him & forced him into bankruptcy. Next they took the Dallas Stars & the Texas Rangers off Hicks & bankrupted Hicks Sports Group. There's no compensation case because the High Court told them to produce evidence & then stole that evidence from Hicks & Gillette - the bastards. Take your tin foil hat off for a few minutes & look at what actually happened.

 

Switch off your hatred for a minute & think about what might be best for our club. Every financial expert that's commented on our accounts states that our business model is unsustainable & heading for bankruptcy. We need to act now before it's too late. Liverpool had owners with bank debt that fell out with their bank (sound familiar?), came close to administration & came through it. We can learn from what happened & it might help us. The other example you need to be looking at is Portsmouth. Have a look at what happened when Barclays (again, sound familiar?) demanded all their loans back because they lost faith in the owners.

 

What is going on is bigger than our rivalry, our long-term future is at stake. If your hatred & bitterness stops us learning what we can from all other clubs & fans then we reduce our chances of being able to help our club survive. When we're financially stable, when we're safe & when we're able to make progress towards truly competing again, then we can get back to our rivalry with the other half of town.

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Again another one who fails to separate the role of the board and that of the manager. Forget league position, forget who they bought, look at what the board has done to support the manager and develop the club. Unless chairmen are to be appraised on their ability to spot a good player can we please drop that nonsense argument.

 

That's fine. But David Moyes didn't buy the players with money from his own back pocket though, or did he? Moyes deserves a lot of credit for the way he's run tthis ship yes, but Kenwright being not included in any credit is rubbish!

 

He made one too many fuck ups that have cost the club a long term goal but in the short term (at the beginning) he did a blinding job of getting things sorted from the previous board. To even say Everton are still in the EPL without spending a penny in three years, is remarkable, and yes you could say that was all Moyes doing but that what be blinded. BK has done alot for this club but i agree that its time for change.

 

I hope that if a new owner did come along that BK would be involved in someway

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That's fine. But David Moyes didn't buy the players with money from his own back pocket though, or did he? Moyes deserves a lot of credit for the way he's run tthis ship yes, but Kenwright being not included in any credit is rubbish!

 

He made one too many fuck ups that have cost the club a long term goal but in the short term (at the beginning) he did a blinding job of getting things sorted from the previous board. To even say Everton are still in the EPL without spending a penny in three years, is remarkable, and yes you could say that was all Moyes doing but that what be blinded. BK has done alot for this club but i agree that its time for change.

 

I hope that if a new owner did come along that BK would be involved in someway

 

Sorry j, no manager buys players from their own back pockets, and no players have been bought from bills back pocket. We took out loans to do that. As elstone said at kirby enquiry, not one penny from the board has been invested in the club bar the shares they bought.

 

Lerner has been a shining light in the times of rich oil sheikhs and dodgy quick buck opportunists and restores my faith in new ownership not being a Portsmouth doom story.

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Sorry j, no manager buys players from their own back pockets, and no players have been bought from bills back pocket. We took out loans to do that. As elstone said at kirby enquiry, not one penny from the board has been invested in the club bar the shares they bought.

 

Lerner has been a shining light in the times of rich oil sheikhs and dodgy quick buck opportunists and restores my faith in new ownership not being a Portsmouth doom story.

Agree with the 1st bit but Lerner has spent masses of money (must be 100m+) and achieved sweet FA. Our board, despite not spending anything have achieved sweet FA too but finish above them each time. Same for Sunderland. Will be the same for Stoke too and maybe even Spurs this year.

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Lerner has been a shining light in the times of rich oil sheikhs and dodgy quick buck opportunists and restores my faith in new ownership not being a Portsmouth doom story.

Martin O'Neill would probably have a different view.

 

But, bottom line, it's what you do on the pitch that matters. If we got a "shining light" new owner and five years down the line we squeezed into the top half of the table with a last day win would you (and the good people of the BU) be happy?

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Agree Ten

 

I would like to think BK might be able to carry on in some sort of role for the club. If he had a vast personal fortune he might have been prepared to pour it into the club but he hasnt.

 

He did offer us some stability when he first joined the board and this shouldnt be forgotten. He just lacks the nous for running a club and some decisions have set us back.

 

All in all it probably is time for change but I wouldnt want BK leaving with a bitter taste in his mouth, we should be thankful for the good and remember it

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i too am greatful to bill for the early days, but he hasnt covered himself in glory in recent years. his employees have not helped the club financially, gone a bit too far trying to fund the team but short term measures.

i fear bill will leave under a very bad light.

 

not getting into the randy learner debate but he has made villa very stable and that is something we can only hope for right now.

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Martin O'Neill would probably have a different view.

 

But, bottom line, it's what you do on the pitch that matters. If we got a "shining light" new owner and five years down the line we squeezed into the top half of the table with a last day win would you (and the good people of the BU) be happy?

 

Martin O'Neil's view is probably as deluded as he himself is... good article from Mr Reade

 

http://www.mirrorfootball.co.uk/opinion/columnists/brian-reade/Brian-Reade-column-Aston-Villa-flop-Martin-O-Neill-is-not-even-the-new-Kevin-Keegan-let-alone-Brian-Clough-article554051.html

 

 

Agree with the 1st bit but Lerner has spent masses of money (must be 100m+) and achieved sweet FA. Our board, despite not spending anything have achieved sweet FA too but finish above them each time. Same for Sunderland. Will be the same for Stoke too and maybe even Spurs this year.

 

 

It seems that we are judging the chairmen on who the managers spend their money on and how they perfrom on the pitch (still)

 

I appraise managers on their performance on the resource they are given, and judge the chairmen (board) on how they go about providing the financial ability for the manager to operate - nothing too complicated.

 

Based on what we are discussing:

 

O'Neill squandered the cash his chairman provided him and sulked when not given anymore to blow. = O'Neil failure

 

Lerner supported O'Neil in the trasnfer market to the tune of £120m, whilst improving the infrastructure of the club, increasing revenue streams significantly. The Holte Hotel is a big money making corporate facility - would Bill think of doing the same with the Wilmslow? Whilst providing money he has also ensured he has kept an eye on things, been straight about forthcoming transfer funds etc. = lerner pass

 

Moyes and kenwright.... well need I say any more? Moyes has worked relative miracles on peanuts, whilst Kenwright has provided him with a net spend of zilch whilst selling off most our assets whilst increasing debt over time.

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Lerner would have had the final say in transfers and wages it's his own fault for letting MO'N squander it, and his fault alone for employing him in the first place.

 

Moyes has worked miracles on peanuts, 70,000 peanuts a week, he's one of the highest earners in his profession most clubs would have sacked him already so I don't see why Kenwright doesn't deserve any credit, Kenwright sticking with Moyes is enough of a reason to claim he's done a better job than Lerner. You're argument is a total mockery. Anything Villa have done good is the chairmans doing, and the bad was all M'ON, and the opposite for Everton although the points your making for each situation mirror.

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Lerner would have had the final say in transfers and wages it's his own fault for letting MO'N squander it, and his fault alone for employing him in the first place.

Moyes has worked miracles on peanuts, 70,000 peanuts a week, he's one of the highest earners in his profession most clubs would have sacked him already so I don't see why Kenwright doesn't deserve any credit, Kenwright sticking with Moyes is enough of a reason to claim he's done a better job than Lerner. You're argument is a total mockery. Anything Villa have done good is the chairmans doing, and the bad was all M'ON, and the opposite for Everton although the points your making for each situation mirror.

 

sorry but lerner may have signed the cheques but he employed MON to choose which players he wanted to sign.

its the managers responsibility for players coming in, thats why they are emplyed in the first place.

the rest of the quote im not arsed about, just seems like bickering to me, bored to death of it.

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Martin O'Neil's view is probably as deluded as he himself is... good article from Mr Reade

 

http://www.mirrorfoo...icle554051.html

 

It seems that we are judging the chairmen on who the managers spend their money on and how they perfrom on the pitch (still)

 

I appraise managers on their performance on the resource they are given, and judge the chairmen (board) on how they go about providing the financial ability for the manager to operate - nothing too complicated.

 

Based on what we are discussing:

 

O'Neill squandered the cash his chairman provided him and sulked when not given anymore to blow. = O'Neil failure

 

Lerner supported O'Neil in the trasnfer market to the tune of £120m, whilst improving the infrastructure of the club, increasing revenue streams significantly. The Holte Hotel is a big money making corporate facility - would Bill think of doing the same with the Wilmslow? Whilst providing money he has also ensured he has kept an eye on things, been straight about forthcoming transfer funds etc. = lerner pass

 

Moyes and kenwright.... well need I say any more? Moyes has worked relative miracles on peanuts, whilst Kenwright has provided him with a net spend of zilch whilst selling off most our assets whilst increasing debt over time.

ok, lets make it simple. I want a yes or no answer only from you for the following:

 

EFC (which as a team and company includes many elements such as the board, the chairman and the manager) have improved dramatically in the last 10 years?

 

EFC (which as a team and company includes many elements such as the board, the chairman and the manager) performed better than AVFC (could be Sunderland, Stoke etc) despite no money?

 

I recognize you want a successful board + a successful manager combo. Everyone does. You believe change of the board and chairman is needed to achieve this (though I think its only members of the board considering they do the running of the club). I also recognize that this board has failed in certain aspects, 1 particular colossal cock up.

 

What I dont see you grasping is how far we have come under this reign and giving credit where credit is due, or if you do you quickly dismiss it. The reason I keep butting heads with you is because your argument, though understandable, comes across as ungrateful. Same feeling for the BU. Im assuming youre of an older generation of supporters who got to see the heights of EFC in the mid 80s, I was brought up through the 90s with PJ and his cronies. BK and the board have taken us from last gap goals to save us from relegation to European contenders. Theyve dramatically improved the squad on the pitch, which is what makes the money, whilst sacrificing other areas. Not ideal by a long way, but it all goes back to my 1st Q - have we dramatically improved over the last 10 years.

 

Theres only 1 answer there and the people these guys are protesting against are the people who got us there.

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Yes we are in a better position than 10 years ago & Bill should have some credit for that

 

My questions would be

 

1) Is the future important to you?

 

2) Is our current business model sustainable?

 

3) Are the financial experts correct that we at risk from bankruptcy if we do not change?

 

4) Do you trust the current board to make these changes?

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Yes we are in a better position than 10 years ago & Bill should have some credit for that

 

My questions would be

 

1) Is the future important to you?

 

2) Is our current business model sustainable?

 

3) Are the financial experts correct that we at risk from bankruptcy if we do not change?

 

4) Do you trust the current board to make these changes?

1. Of course

2. After kicking 13m a year of the wage bill it should start improving. Last 3 years weve lost 5m a year*, now it should be 8m profit a year right?

3. Before we got rid of the 13m wages yes. Now I think we should see how the books come out next year. I bet we see a stark improvement and not only because we sold a couple of players but because 3 players were taking up an 8th of the clubs income*

4. Board, not sure, at least not Elstone (purely gut reasons). Do I think theyre capable? Yes. Do I think Bill can find a buyer? Yes.

 

*(assuming the 80m earned and 85m spent figures that were sent out sometime back in May/June were accurate)

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matt, im only 27 and have only had an interest since i was about ten (was always a blue but was more just going to the match as my dad just took me until i was interested)

so i have obly seen the premier league years.

i dont think its as straight forward as have we improved or not. the way i see it we have improved on the pitch massively, and credit is due. but it has been at the expense of the finances of the company, and selling off a hell of a lot of assets.

i think the on the pitch performance has improved dramatically, but the off field performance has gone down just as much from what i can see.

i think the on field performance will be affected by the very small, and shrinking each year, squad we have and thats when it will really hit the fan.

even after clearing a massive chunk of wages, we wont be able to put it back into the squad or we will go back to losses.

Edited by StevO
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1. Of course

2. After kicking 13m a year of the wage bill it should start improving. Last 3 years weve lost 5m a year*, now it should be 8m profit a year right?

3. Before we got rid of the 13m wages yes. Now I think we should see how the books come out next year. I bet we see a stark improvement and not only because we sold a couple of players but because 3 players were taking up an 8th of the clubs income*

4. Board, not sure, at least not Elstone (purely gut reasons). Do I think theyre capable? Yes. Do I think Bill can find a buyer? Yes.

 

*(assuming the 80m earned and 85m spent figures that were sent out sometime back in May/June were accurate)

 

I hope you're right. The problem I have with the accounts is that you don't see them for so long. We won't discover whether the £13m savings on the wage bill make a big difference until February 2013 & that could be too late.

Certainly on the evidence so far we have a right to be concerned. In the last accounts we made £19m profit on player trading but still had a loss, a negative cash flow & the debt increased by £7m. All we know at the moment is that since the last accounts, we gained cash from Bellefield & player sales without being able to spend any, & still Bill has to borrow £12m to see us through the season & go to the bank with proof that we are capable of seeing the season out.

 

You're happy to trust the board that these actions have been enough. Maybe I worry too much but I'm not convinced

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matt, im only 27 and have only had an interest since i was about ten (was always a blue but was more just going to the match as my dad just took me until i was interested)

so i have obly seen the premier league years.

i dont think its as straight forward as have we improved or not. the way i see it we have improved on the pitch massively, and credit is due. but it has been at the expense of the finances of the company, and selling off a hell of a lot of assets.

i think the on the pitch performance has improved dramatically, but the off field performance has gone down just as much from what i can see.

i think the on field performance will be affected by the very small, and shrinking each year, squad we have and thats when it will really hit the fan.

even after clearing a massive chunk of wages, we wont be able to put it back into the squad or we will go back to losses.

the on the pitch assets are responsible for us finishing in the positions we have finished in. Wasnt each place 850k this year? Assets were sold to get us a team that would go up the table, which it has for the most part, which in turn has meant we get more money from competitions. Sounds like a good and feasible business strategy to me, providing the players win the games.

 

I hope you're right. The problem I have with the accounts is that you don't see them for so long. We won't discover whether the £13m savings on the wage bill make a big difference until February 2013 & that could be too late.

Certainly on the evidence so far we have a right to be concerned. In the last accounts we made £19m profit on player trading but still had a loss, a negative cash flow & the debt increased by £7m. All we know at the moment is that since the last accounts, we gained cash from Bellefield & player sales without being able to spend any, & still Bill has to borrow £12m to see us through the season & go to the bank with proof that we are capable of seeing the season out.

 

You're happy to trust the board that these actions have been enough. Maybe I worry too much but I'm not convinced

I read 5m but im not going to nit pick - just shows that everyone is getting their figures from somewhere and theres no 1 answer, so then how do we all know the big picture?

 

Didnt mean to imply im happy to trust the board either. Im not happy, but I think they can do it and I dont see an alternative, an interim board for me doesnt make sense.

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I read 5m but im not going to nit pick - just shows that everyone is getting their figures from somewhere and theres no 1 answer, so then how do we all know the big picture?

 

Didnt mean to imply im happy to trust the board either. Im not happy, but I think they can do it and I dont see an alternative, an interim board for me doesnt make sense.

 

How do we see the big picture? Good question, we certainly don't ever get to see everything - we just have to make judgements based on what info & expert opinion we have. You & I have reached different conclusions, but there you go - maybe one of us will change our minds at the next set of accounts.

 

On the question of a sale though, would you be averse to appointing a specialist group focused purely on doing this? We could pay them based on results so not necessarily a huge extra expense. It wouldn't mean Bill would have to stop his efforts either. So what harm would it do?

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the on the pitch assets are responsible for us finishing in the positions we have finished in. Wasnt each place 850k this year? Assets were sold to get us a team that would go up the table, which it has for the most part, which in turn has meant we get more money from competitions. Sounds like a good and feasible business strategy to me, providing the players win the games.

 

i know matt, i see do see your point. but we borrowed to get to these places but the prize money hasnt been enough to keep us there.

selling the assets is good until there are no assets left, players and goodison are the only remains of our assets.

 

leeds are the highest profile example of borrowing to strengthen the team, only they went a lot further than we did. when they didnt get the prize money they hoped for they had to start selling off their players. we have already done the same.

 

if we finish fourth this year, we will be fine if we get past a CL qualifier. but we could also struggle and get relegated. if we do happen to get relegated we will be in administration pretty much over night. we wont be able to repay the loans that rely on tv money as it will drop, the loans on season tickets as numbers and prices will drop, and loans against league position money as that will be a hell of a lot less.

 

can i ask one question though matt. what makes you think the board we currently have can turn it around?

im not being funny about that, its just as ive lost faith with them i would like to see another point of view presented.

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can i ask one question though matt. what makes you think the board we currently have can turn it around?

im not being funny about that, its just as ive lost faith with them i would like to see another point of view presented.

because at the end of the day, they are the only ones with all the info mate, accurate info, and whether its believed or not, most are there as experts in their fields. Then theres the almost blind faith to be honest and thats there because I see no alternative at the moment. Interim I wouldnt trust and theres no other suggestion.

 

off for Guinness mate :)

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Lerner would have had the final say in transfers and wages it's his own fault for letting MO'N squander it, and his fault alone for employing him in the first place.

Moyes has worked miracles on peanuts, 70,000 peanuts a week, he's one of the highest earners in his profession most clubs would have sacked him already so I don't see why Kenwright doesn't deserve any credit, Kenwright sticking with Moyes is enough of a reason to claim he's done a better job than Lerner. You're argument is a total mockery. Anything Villa have done good is the chairmans doing, and the bad was all M'ON, and the opposite for Everton although the points your making for each situation mirror.

 

"Lerner would have had final say in transfers and wages - it's his fault letting Martin O'Neill squander it" and then you accuse my argument of being a mockery? yeah Lerner has his coaching badges too and oversees training as well I guess? Wrong, Lerner is the Chairman, along with Paul Faulkner they discuss budget with the manager who works within that budget. - Unless Lerner decided to not play Habib Beye after paying £2.6m for him and £40k a week wages?

 

He gives the manager the budget to work within, flashes his pen across and trusts that the manager has made the correct judgement he has paid him too. The time came where the managers judgement had become very expensive for the results they were achieving and when challenged to operate within the manager decided to try and play him. TA TA Martin O'Neil, Clough won the league before playing hard ball with his chairman.

 

As for Kenwright sticxking with Moyes? Isn't that a little bit like Andrew Ridgley saying he stuck with George Michael???

 

Listen, you love Bill, you really do, I get it - but he's a grown boy, just accept he isn't Chairman of Everton material

 

chairman of the board maybe... they sung "GIVE ME JUST A LITTLE MORE TIME" ironically enough they haven't done anything for a long time

 

 

Chairmen-Of-The-Board-93.jpg

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because at the end of the day, they are the only ones with all the info mate, accurate info, and whether its believed or not, most are there as

experts in their fields. Then theres the almost blind faith to be honest and thats there because I see no alternative at the moment. Interim I wouldnt trust and theres no other suggestion

 

off for Guinness mate :)

 

I don't think they are experts to be honest mate. Bill is a play writer, woods is a computer games programmer, earl runs restaurants and elstone is in the biggest job of his career, he's worked for sky sports and for the rugby league.

To be honest I do like elstone, always have but he seems worn down by the job over the last year or so.

 

I don't see any harm in bringing in people to work alongside the board to help find a buyer, might be the best of both worlds then.

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"Lerner would have had final say in transfers and wages - it's his fault letting Martin O'Neill squander it" and then you accuse my argument of being a mockery? yeah Lerner has his coaching badges too and oversees training as well I guess? Wrong, Lerner is the Chairman, along with Paul Faulkner they discuss budget with the manager who works within that budget. - Unless Lerner decided to not play Habib Beye after paying £2.6m for him and £40k a week wages?

 

He gives the manager the budget to work within, flashes his pen across and trusts that the manager has made the correct judgement he has paid him too. The time came where the managers judgement had become very expensive for the results they were achieving and when challenged to operate within the manager decided to try and play him. TA TA Martin O'Neil, Clough won the league before playing hard ball with his chairman.

 

As for Kenwright sticxking with Moyes? Isn't that a little bit like Andrew Ridgley saying he stuck with George Michael???

 

Listen, you love Bill, you really do, I get it - but he's a grown boy, just accept he isn't Chairman of Everton material

 

chairman of the board maybe... they sung "GIVE ME JUST A LITTLE MORE TIME" ironically enough they haven't done anything for a long time

 

 

Chairmen-Of-The-Board-93.jpg

 

You mention Lerner wanting the wage bill down, but it was his fault for letting it get so big. It's not the managers fault, and he had a right to moan when asked to tighten it up, he took the job under the incentives offered and walked away once he weren't getting what he was promised. (BTW before u call me a MON lover, i think he is shit, but that is irrelevant)

Moyes head has been called for several times, most boards would have sacked him when we finished 17th. Fans were even calling for his head last season. So yes, Kenwright stood by him. The club most cited in England as the model to try and emulate is Evertons, so I dont see why you're so obsessed with Villa, and I don't see why BU are kicking up such a fuss.

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if anyone can show me a club trying to emulate us (other than bill saying so in the BU interview where he didnt give examples) then id be very surprised.

 

one question about moyes not being fired, could everton afford to pay out his contract in a lump sum?

 

a lot of people dont follow BU but im surprised if many people dont see why they are kicking up a fuss.

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You mention Lerner wanting the wage bill down, but it was his fault for letting it get so big. It's not the managers fault, and he had a right to moan when asked to tighten it up, he took the job under the incentives offered and walked away once he weren't getting what he was promised. (BTW before u call me a MON lover, i think he is shit, but that is irrelevant)

Moyes head has been called for several times, most boards would have sacked him when we finished 17th. Fans were even calling for his head last season. So yes, Kenwright stood by him. The club most cited in England as the model to try and emulate is Evertons, so I dont see why you're so obsessed with Villa, and I don't see why BU are kicking up such a fuss.

 

I think somewhere down the line I have said this many a time, moyes and kenwright are a perfect match. Moyes excels with lower expectations and kenwright provides him with that aligned to the near no budget he has to work with, for which as you say moyes is handsomely rewarded.

 

Moyes in turn has up till now made everton appear to be a frugal club led by it's wise chairman, the reality is he's borrowed to the max and the game is up.

 

A new board, new cash injection for me means raising the bar for mr moyes. It's the way it works...

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Haf

 

I can understand your frustrations, beleive me I am just as frustrated as you, and we all know that BK cant take us any further ,but to just dismiss all the good that he has done for this club is ridiculous.

 

The club is unrecogniseable from the one that BK took over , I would take top 7 finishes over relegation battles any day of the week.

 

I now your going to harp on about how the Board have stripped all the assests etc but can I just ask.... Would you rather that we still owned our training ground and Bellefield and all the other assets and were lining up against Sheffield Wednesday in League 1 tomorrow or would you rather us be skint and playing Villa in the Premiership?

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if anyone can show me a club trying to emulate us (other than bill saying so in the BU interview where he didnt give examples) then id be very surprised.

 

one question about moyes not being fired, could everton afford to pay out his contract in a lump sum?

 

a lot of people dont follow BU but im surprised if many people dont see why they are kicking up a fuss.

 

I'd say WBA, Wigan and Fulham are most similar, an Stoke, Blackburn, Bolton and Sunderland have used it as a guide as well.

 

http://www.evertonfc.com/news/archive/2011/02/25/bruce-aims-to-emulate-blues Haf will love this one, also mentions Villa

http://www.skysports.com/story/0,,11671_3331890,00+en-USS_01DBC.html

http://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/sport/football/8104892.Top_six_is_tough_to_emulate__says_Blackburn_Rovers_boss/?ref=rss

http://www.tribalfootball.com/articles/dowie-everton-are-perfect-role-model-club-1399431

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