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Martinez won't last the season


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haha, we've beaten them 3 times in our last 4 home league games!

 

We've not beaten them away from home since 1994.

 

Moyes record against the top 4 might not have always been great and we struggled away from home against those teams but can't knock that home record against Chelsea. Or the 4 wins in 4 seasons at home to Man City.

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haha, we've beaten them 3 times in our last 4 home league games!

 

We've not beaten them away from home since 1994.

 

Moyes record against the top 4 might not have always been great and we struggled away from home against those teams but can't knock that home record against Chelsea. Or the 4 wins in 4 seasons at home to Man City.

 

Excluding Man City, Moyes total 11 year prem record against the top 4/key clashes is shocking... out of 22 fixtures per team here are the stats... Including City does distort the numbers somewhat as they were considered a mid/lower team until the sheikhs buyout in 2008 when they went through a big transition to top 4.

 

Arsenal:- W3 D5 L14

Man United: W3 D5 L14

Chelsea: W3 D8 L11

Liverpool: W3 D6 L12

 

A win rate of 13.6%.... a loss rate of 58%....

 

after witnessing his two games for United against Chelsea and Liverpool I do not think it was player related, more the fact that he has absolutely no bottle or nous as to how to beat the more elite teams

Edited by Hafnia
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I think United have taken more points of us than any other team in SKy era. Other than City the others mentioned have largely feasted un us but in fairness we have gone down to some quality goals from richly talented individuals like Drogba, Henry, Torres pre transfer and Van Persie. I am sorry to say it but our record at Anfield under the Wizzard was pitiful.

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I think United have taken more points of us than any other team in SKy era. Other than City the others mentioned have largely feasted un us but in fairness we have gone down to some quality goals from richly talented individuals like Drogba, Henry, Torres pre transfer and Van Persie. I am sorry to say it but our record at Anfield under the Wizzard was pitiful.

 

 

His comments since joining Man United regarding his approach to to the Man United game and Liverpool game have been a disgrace:-

 

'Oh no, we're going to Manchester United'. I want it to continue that way. I remember going there as a manager. You want to get out of Old Trafford alive, that used to be our saying, you know,"

 

 

Moyes believes victory at Anfield is finally within his grasp.

“I’m going there with a different situation now,” said Moyes. “I’m going with the champions to Anfield now, so it’s a different situation from where I was before.

“I’m going there certainly with a different group of players.

“I always went to Anfield confident, but I always knew they had a good team.

“It [his failure to win at Anfield] was down to the fact Liverpool had really good teams with people like Xabi Alonso, Javier Mascherano, Fernando Torres at his pomp and Steven Gerrard.

“They had really good teams at that time and were one of the teams that went on to win the European Cup.

“That’s why it was very difficult to win regular games at Anfield - because of the quality of the side they had.

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That is very disappointing to hear. Hopefully the Martinez plan for this season's trip to Anfiled is to have a go at winning.

 

I made the point earlier in the week but it bares repeating. Moyes always talked a lot about what we didn't have. Accentuating the positive seems to be a strong point with RM - which I find refreshing

Edited by weebittight
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To be fair, those comments are really bad. It's like there was always an 'excuse' for reasons, not to approach a game in a certain way.

 

I hope, with whatever resources the Everton manager had, that he'd always want to win and always have the attitude that it shouldn't matter what their 'status' is and that they're just 11 men vs 11 men.

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To be fair, those comments are really bad. It's like there was always an 'excuse' for reasons, not to approach a game in a certain way.

 

I hope, with whatever resources the Everton manager had, that he'd always want to win and always have the attitude that it shouldn't matter what their 'status' is and that they're just 11 men vs 11 men.

 

To me those comments answer all the questions asked of Moyes inability to set his teams up to have a real go at the so called 'super teams'. Is it any coincidence that we appeared to lack the belief to beat these teams when it really did matter?

 

Why was it we could beat city??? Mindset, they say "belief creates reality" - the team believed they could beat city because they did it with once a great performance - after that the belief was there. If it wasn't for Rodger Bannister the 4 minutes mile would have been some mythical unrealistic target - how many times must he have heard "it can't be done" - as soon as he did it it was beaten by many - the belief was there.

 

Back to Moyes... how did he expect to beat united and Liverpool at their gaffs when he was coming out with that negative "can't be done" attitude. It seeps through to the players and is seen by the fans in the way the team just had no belief nor bottle.

 

He even managed to get his crappy sandbagging soundbites to affect the mindset of his sheeple "look at how much Liverpool have spent, blah blah blah, I'd take a draw now" - he turned Everton fans into pessimists - content to ignore the results against top 4 in order to take solitude from a 2-0 win against Fulham. Good job he never managed us against Bayern Munich in 85, Man United in 95 eh...

 

I don't dispute for one second that Moyes is one of the most hard working, analytical managers out there. The problem is when you analyse "what threat the other team pose" so much you become beaten before you begin. Focus on "How is Hibbert going to stop Ronaldo" rather than "They have John O'shea playing at the back" and you will be 90% of your way in setting up a completely defensive team that will at one stage leak a goal or 2. Oops - need to score now.... "oh well we lost 2-0, came away alive ish I suppose"

 

Apologies if I harp on about the same old, I've got 11 years of anger (ok subtract the years where we went through a rebuild) to get out, this is therapy, but for the sake of my sanity, if anyone tries to defend that mans approach which seen the anfield mob chant "10 more years" - then just think back to that night at Anfield, if that ain't enough just ask a random Red about what they thought of our second half surrender at Wembley in the FA Cup semi final...

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To me those comments answer all the questions asked of Moyes inability to set his teams up to have a real go at the so called 'super teams'. Is it any coincidence that we appeared to lack the belief to beat these teams when it really did matter?

 

Why was it we could beat city??? Mindset, they say "belief creates reality" - the team believed they could beat city because they did it with once a great performance - after that the belief was there. If it wasn't for Rodger Bannister the 4 minutes mile would have been some mythical unrealistic target - how many times must he have heard "it can't be done" - as soon as he did it it was beaten by many - the belief was there.

 

Back to Moyes... how did he expect to beat united and Liverpool at their gaffs when he was coming out with that negative "can't be done" attitude. It seeps through to the players and is seen by the fans in the way the team just had no belief nor bottle.

 

He even managed to get his crappy sandbagging soundbites to affect the mindset of his sheeple "look at how much Liverpool have spent, blah blah blah, I'd take a draw now" - he turned Everton fans into pessimists - content to ignore the results against top 4 in order to take solitude from a 2-0 win against Fulham. Good job he never managed us against Bayern Munich in 85, Man United in 95 eh...

 

I don't dispute for one second that Moyes is one of the most hard working, analytical managers out there. The problem is when you analyse "what threat the other team pose" so much you become beaten before you begin. Focus on "How is Hibbert going to stop Ronaldo" rather than "They have John O'shea playing at the back" and you will be 90% of your way in setting up a completely defensive team that will at one stage leak a goal or 2. Oops - need to score now.... "oh well we lost 2-0, came away alive ish I suppose"

 

Apologies if I harp on about the same old, I've got 11 years of anger (ok subtract the years where we went through a rebuild) to get out, this is therapy, but for the sake of my sanity, if anyone tries to defend that mans approach which seen the anfield mob chant "10 more years" - then just think back to that night at Anfield, if that ain't enough just ask a random Red about what they thought of our second half surrender at Wembley in the FA Cup semi final...

 

Not far off where I stand on Moyes thiis. All the " Liverpool have spent this and that " after a defeat rang hollow very quickly with me. I don't miss him and I think given time with this new boss we will come back stronger and far more watchable which is important to me.

Edited by weebittight
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To me those comments answer all the questions asked of Moyes inability to set his teams up to have a real go at the so called 'super teams'. Is it any coincidence that we appeared to lack the belief to beat these teams when it really did matter?

 

Why was it we could beat city??? Mindset, they say "belief creates reality" - the team believed they could beat city because they did it with once a great performance - after that the belief was there. If it wasn't for Rodger Bannister the 4 minutes mile would have been some mythical unrealistic target - how many times must he have heard "it can't be done" - as soon as he did it it was beaten by many - the belief was there.

 

Back to Moyes... how did he expect to beat united and Liverpool at their gaffs when he was coming out with that negative "can't be done" attitude. It seeps through to the players and is seen by the fans in the way the team just had no belief nor bottle.

 

He even managed to get his crappy sandbagging soundbites to affect the mindset of his sheeple "look at how much Liverpool have spent, blah blah blah, I'd take a draw now" - he turned Everton fans into pessimists - content to ignore the results against top 4 in order to take solitude from a 2-0 win against Fulham. Good job he never managed us against Bayern Munich in 85, Man United in 95 eh...

 

I don't dispute for one second that Moyes is one of the most hard working, analytical managers out there. The problem is when you analyse "what threat the other team pose" so much you become beaten before you begin. Focus on "How is Hibbert going to stop Ronaldo" rather than "They have John O'shea playing at the back" and you will be 90% of your way in setting up a completely defensive team that will at one stage leak a goal or 2. Oops - need to score now.... "oh well we lost 2-0, came away alive ish I suppose"

 

Apologies if I harp on about the same old, I've got 11 years of anger (ok subtract the years where we went through a rebuild) to get out, this is therapy, but for the sake of my sanity, if anyone tries to defend that mans approach which seen the anfield mob chant "10 more years" - then just think back to that night at Anfield, if that ain't enough just ask a random Red about what they thought of our second half surrender at Wembley in the FA Cup semi final...

Jesus, if your that pissed at the last 10 years then you must have been suicidal in the 5-6 years before that!! :lol:

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He must have been making a noose out of an angry rattlesnake at half time in the last day Wimbledon game.

 

It's true that Moyes deserves castigation for the inability to win away at the venues we are all aware of, or even his irritating defensive policies, but for the last time, in the bigger picture, we thank him for making the club recognized again and doing an outstanding job for the most part in the league at least, with little to work with or lack of money at his disposal.

 

Sometimes a great manager, sometimes a frustrating manager, sometimes a bemusing manager, sometimes worthy of plaudits, sometimes worthy of outright condemnation. It was all those things, but at least now, he has taken it with him to another club.

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At the time of relegation last day survival etc - we all knew were we where. Every evertonian was singing from the same hymn sheet and we stood together and willed the team through.

 

Moyes did come in and reinvigorated the club. After it had been reinvigorated he pretty much stagnated, same tactics, same approach and a back room staff that shared his mentality.

 

I actually made the point that he needed synergy - a number 2 that would "challenge" him. The polar opposite approach - a tactician with a bit of gung ho. Nah.... There is only one boss in the alpha Moyes camp. Amazingly the fool took round with him and rene meulensteen left.... There's always Pip though

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I have liked the style of football under Martinez I like the cut of his jib I don't give a fuck about moyes he is proving himself a prize twat.

 

I openedthis thread realistically because I felt RM could ruin it defensively but the irony it's the other end we are failing. Lukaku could be a bonus in that area. Things that annoy me about RM are buying Kone.

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I still don't think we are defensively sound though. In the 0-0 games they could have easily snatched a win, even though wr dominated and should have won. The concerning thing is these arnt half chances that every team get in a game, these are clear cut chances, through on goal, where they've just ballsed up. Am being really picky here but just think the likes of Chelsea today will put those chances away.

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To me those comments answer all the questions asked of Moyes inability to set his teams up to have a real go at the so called 'super teams'. Is it any coincidence that we appeared to lack the belief to beat these teams when it really did matter?

 

Why was it we could beat city??? Mindset, they say "belief creates reality" - the team believed they could beat city because they did it with once a great performance - after that the belief was there. If it wasn't for Rodger Bannister the 4 minutes mile would have been some mythical unrealistic target - how many times must he have heard "it can't be done" - as soon as he did it it was beaten by many - the belief was there.

 

Back to Moyes... how did he expect to beat united and Liverpool at their gaffs when he was coming out with that negative "can't be done" attitude. It seeps through to the players and is seen by the fans in the way the team just had no belief nor bottle.

 

He even managed to get his crappy sandbagging soundbites to affect the mindset of his sheeple "look at how much Liverpool have spent, blah blah blah, I'd take a draw now" - he turned Everton fans into pessimists - content to ignore the results against top 4 in order to take solitude from a 2-0 win against Fulham. Good job he never managed us against Bayern Munich in 85, Man United in 95 eh...

 

I don't dispute for one second that Moyes is one of the most hard working, analytical managers out there. The problem is when you analyse "what threat the other team pose" so much you become beaten before you begin. Focus on "How is Hibbert going to stop Ronaldo" rather than "They have John O'shea playing at the back" and you will be 90% of your way in setting up a completely defensive team that will at one stage leak a goal or 2. Oops - need to score now.... "oh well we lost 2-0, came away alive ish I suppose"

 

Apologies if I harp on about the same old, I've got 11 years of anger (ok subtract the years where we went through a rebuild) to get out, this is therapy, but for the sake of my sanity, if anyone tries to defend that mans approach which seen the anfield mob chant "10 more years" - then just think back to that night at Anfield, if that ain't enough just ask a random Red about what they thought of our second half surrender at Wembley in the FA Cup semi final...

 

Lol You really do symbolise the bitter in the term bitter blue

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I'd hate to have seen how angry Haf was when we geniunely were shite!!

 

11 years of anger! We're you happy before then when we had gascoigne/ginola et al?!

See above point...

 

When we were shite there was no disputing it, no anger - just concern and a feeling of we're in this together.

 

Under Moyes over the last 6-7 years I have felt like a wife getting taken on holiday to Blackpool every year by a husband with £50k in the bank. The sad reality many fans felt that this holiday was better than getting the house repossessed so tolerated the negativity.

 

I'm not for one second saying that kenwright has supported Moyes, the boards ambition and ability is something I'm known for despising. However based on the players that Moyes frugally assembled we should have played far better football.

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See above point...

 

When we were shite there was no disputing it, no anger - just concern and a feeling of we're in this together.

 

Under Moyes over the last 6-7 years I have felt like a wife getting taken on holiday to Blackpool every year by a husband with £50k in the bank. The sad reality many fans felt that this holiday was better than getting the house repossessed so tolerated the negativity.

 

I'm not for one second saying that kenwright has supported Moyes, the boards ambition and ability is something I'm known for despising. However based on the players that Moyes frugally assembled we should have played far better football.

Yeah fair point that Haf I guess.

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See above point...

 

When we were shite there was no disputing it, no anger - just concern and a feeling of we're in this together.

 

Under Moyes over the last 6-7 years I have felt like a wife getting taken on holiday to Blackpool every year by a husband with £50k in the bank. The sad reality many fans felt that this holiday was better than getting the house repossessed so tolerated the negativity.

 

I'm not for one second saying that kenwright has supported Moyes, the boards ambition and ability is something I'm known for despising. However based on the players that Moyes frugally assembled we should have played far better football.

 

I think that is kind of the point that some people dont understand. Moyes clearly isnt a bad manager and we played some fantastic football under his guidance. We know he can set teams up to win games with confidence but for some reason we only saw that for 25% of the season, normally when our backs were against the wall. How many starts to the season did we need to fuck up before we got back to what we could do well? How many times did we need to see the constant lumping it forward to Jelly, Saha and Yakubu before we realised that we needed to try and play with the ball on floor? How many times did we need to see Fellaini marked out of games and play clumsily before we moved him deeper to really influence the game?

 

Moyes will do well at Utd because if he could get 60+ points out of us then he can get 75+ points out of Utd but when them big games come and them season defining moments he will bottle it.

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Moyes could have been manager of the Hungarian side of the 1950s or Netherlands of the 1970s and take them on a modern day trip to Anfield or Stamford Bridge, and still come away empty handed. Not to keep on with the Scot, as this thread piece is essentially about his replacement, and in saying that, the initial thread title still seems as ridiculous tonight, as it did, when it was first inaugurated a few short weeks ago.

 

Not suggested just because the club had a standout result today and beat one of the heavyweights and also picked up one or two decent results before this such as the draw at Norwich City that we will go on and have a champions league qualifying season or great things, but there has been signs at times that you realize we really could do something this season. If we can overcome the Fulham hoodoo in the next round of the League Cup, we could go a long way in that, and with Martinez' extra attacking intent, could go a fair distance again in the FA cup next year, and if reaching the latter stages again, could overcome an opposition side, instead of just freezing on the big occasion and everything turns to shit, as it so often did before, and after nearly two decades, finally bring in that much elusive trophy, so there's reasons there to be hopeful.

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Mr D Kane.

 

Loved the point you made about Moyes and how he could,nt win at the big grounds. Very funny and spot on. He was a negative git on times.

Every time we went to those grounds under Moyes we knew what would happen, the only exception the Incredible 4-4. But if that game had of been played in

 

say August or December he would have gone for a 0-0. The infamous Anfield 3-0 surrender in my opion the most shameful.

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Mr D Kane.

 

Loved the point you made about Moyes and how he could,nt win at the big grounds. Very funny and spot on. He was a negative git on times.

Every time we went to those grounds under Moyes we knew what would happen, the only exception the Incredible 4-4. But if that game had of been played in

 

say August or December he would have gone for a 0-0. The infamous Anfield 3-0 surrender in my opion the most shameful.

He bottled that game as well, we got to 4-4 had the momentum for a 5th and Moyes was screeching on the touchline to hold on. Should have been sacked in the tunnel after that game.

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We must consider that under martinez, when he does go to these away games against the top four, he will have Everton football club on the pitch not Wigan. That in itself gathers more respect from the opposition before a ball is kicked. Then take into account the massive support unlike a Wigan which will fall onto the pitch and get into the players. Thirdly, a far stronger squad to choose from and last but not least, a manager who will go into these games to win them at best...... That's why I prefer RM over DM.

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He bottled that game as well, we got to 4-4 had the momentum for a 5th and Moyes was screeching on the touchline to hold on. Should have been sacked in the tunnel after that game.

Did you hear the story about Moyes going to the casino with sir Alex and mourinho in Kensington?

 

Mourinho won a fortune, ferguson lost his £1000, and Moyes came out level. Moyes spent most of the night watching the other two and was delighted to come out of there just knowing he hadn't lost.

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