Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
duncanmckenzieismagic

Baines

Recommended Posts

I think Roy's comments that Cole and Shaw are the ones he 'needs to look at in an England shirt' tonight, pretty much mean that Baines is first choice now for the foreseeable, and he's just deciding whether to effectively retire Cole or give him one more tournament as back up

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think Roy's comments that Cole and Shaw are the ones he 'needs to look at in an England shirt' tonight, pretty much mean that Baines is first choice now for the foreseeable, and he's just deciding whether to effectively retire Cole or give him one more tournament as back up

 

He shouldn't need to. He should just take Shaw and leave Cole at home. Being around the squad at a tournament will be good for Shaw when it comes to the next one as he's likely to be first choice by then.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

He shouldn't need to. He should just take Shaw and leave Cole at home. Being around the squad at a tournament will be good for Shaw when it comes to the next one as he's likely to be first choice by then.

Agree. Although Baines will still be there for the 2016 Euros I would think, if we qualify of course, then Shaw first choice by the next World Cup. Although things can obviously change depending on form at any time

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Anyone else notice The way Baines claps the fans as he goes to take a corner? Very feminine clap to say the least.

 

If i would have opened the rubbish post thread a few days earlier this would have been a dead cert!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

If i would have opened the rubbish post thread a few days earlier this would have been a dead cert!

to be fair, if he had made a different point to the "feminine clap" it wouldve been fine. Certainly has better candidate posts for your new thread ;)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

haha dont think i havent noticed Matt!

 

On topic, in a way, I'd take Cole over Shaw. Only for the safe bet. If i was Hodgson and something happened to Baines, i'd be happy to put in a player like Cole who has been there done that and picked up 100 caps on the way, rather than Shaw who has a half cap and little experience. Shaw might bottle it and panic at the WC, or he could be amazing. We dont know. But we do know Cole will be calm and collected and do a good job.

In terms of defence i'd go with the steady Eddies, take the risks with the forward players. Just my opinion.

 

Oh, and Chris Smalling should not be in that squad! The lad is crap, he isnt even a youngster with potential any more, the minute Moyes sells him he wont get in the England team again.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

haha dont think i havent noticed Matt!

 

On topic, in a way, I'd take Cole over Shaw. Only for the safe bet. If i was Hodgson and something happened to Baines, i'd be happy to put in a player like Cole who has been there done that and picked up 100 caps on the way, rather than Shaw who has a half cap and little experience. Shaw might bottle it and panic at the WC, or he could be amazing. We dont know. But we do know Cole will be calm and collected and do a good job.

In terms of defence i'd go with the steady Eddies, take the risks with the forward players. Just my opinion.

 

Oh, and Chris Smalling should not be in that squad! The lad is crap, he isnt even a youngster with potential any more, the minute Moyes sells him he wont get in the England team again.

Never in a million years mate. England arent going to win the World Cup anyway, so Id much rather start to blood in the youth, like the Germans and Spanish did from 2006-2008 - look at them now!

 

The fact that Cole got to 100 caps just shows how bad the team has been, even through the "Golden Generation". Hes a media pick, chosen because of his name and not his ability.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I would take Cole as well tbh... Cole was pretty good from what I saw against Denmark and his stats coming out of the game were superior.

 

Shaw is the future that's for sure but Hodgson has left it too late to get the experience into him IMO.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I would take Cole as well tbh... Cole was pretty good from what I saw against Denmark and his stats coming out of the game were superior.

 

Shaw is the future that's for sure but Hodgson has left it too late to get the experience into him IMO.

im lost. What difference will Cole make? Because unless it's winning the World Cup, surely we should be looking to the future now.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

im lost. What difference will Cole make? Because unless it's winning the World Cup, surely we should be looking to the future now.

 

We should be looking to finish as high as we possibly can IMO regardless of whether we can win it. If by some magic we got to the semi finals it would be a huge boost to the country and if you asked me who I would rather have in that type of game, especially given the relative inexperience at international level of the CB's, I would go with Cole who has been there and done it. Cole isnt as good as he used to be but you can rely on him in the big games.

 

Shaw hasnt even played a competitive international yet and his time will come.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Wow didn't expect that! Very interesting, it sounds like he's been planning this a while. So if Barry does sign it would be a 2 year contract anyway probably, due to his age, with Baines phasing into his new position gradually during that second season? Or alternatively do we think Barry might not sign now, and Roberto might go with this from next season onwards, Brian playing left back??

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Very interesting, after reading the article I can understand where he's coming from. Also if you look at our roster we are very strong at LB (Baines, Oviedo, Garbutt) so it does make sense to move one of them elsewhere to utilize the talent to the fullest.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Love it. To have a manager who even contemplates this just fills me with excitement tbh. For him to take an already pretty experienced player to a match and say to him, "you could do this", is unconventional but it makes sense! It speaks volumes of both Martinez and Baines as professionals.

 

Marco, I agree baines is a "phenomenal" (:P) left back but so was Lahm! (RB I know) I'm sure eye brows were raised by Bayern fans when he was played in CM but there is only one way to find out. It's like he's got the player who we know is an amazing full back but he see's more than what he can do at full back and what he can bring to other areas of the field with what he is good at.

 

I think Alaba has also played CM for Bayern and International level as well so it seems it may be the way football is evolving that we see things like this.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

At some point Baines will lose some speed and acceleration, and do not forget about Bryan Oviedo. It could be interesting, just another option to the side.

 

Lahm also plays RB nowadays, Guardiola alternates him betweem CM and RB.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Dont people be thinking that this is an imminent thing.

 

This is forward thinking at its best.

 

What do you do with a top class player who plays in a hugely energy sapping and and demanding position? Most would just let them slowly rot away in the same position.

 

But what if you can see qualities that can be utilised in other areas of the team and help to prolong his career? Theres nothing wrong with exploring it, might not happen and might not work.

 

The holding role is becoming useful for a number of players who no longer have the legs but can still offer loads to a team....Barry, Lahm, Gerrard, Pirlo.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I don't think he'd be physically imposing enough to play in midfield. On the other hand, I'd have said the same thing about Lahm before Guardiola played him there and he has done brilliantly.

 

His ability to build up play in tighter spaces (which he's done a lot of combining with Pienaar near the sideline) is something we could use in midfield. I think we've been sterile at times this season when teams have pressed us high up and Barry and McCarthy haven't been able to find a pass forward. Like in the first half against Fulham where we only managed to get the ball forward with long balls that often went nowhere. Tough I think a lot of that is just Barkley staying too high up and too near the opposition's centre backs (and we did much better against Fulham as well when Naismith came on and dropped into those pockets of space).

 

I wouldn't mind us experimenting with it, but I hope they don't use this to justify passing up on Barry if his wage demands are high.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Personally, I think it's a ridiculous idea and he'd not manage the change whatsoever. But that's just me.

I'm with you on this one baines has tried left mid before and to be fair he was out of his depth. In fact he was poor and don't think he wants to play midfield.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

But isnt martinez on about a holding role not ledt mid???

 

I think its a few years away anyway, so no need to panic too much. Thats if it even happens.

 

Got to applaud him though for trying to get every pennys worth out of his players!!!

 

At this rate, they'll be like us normal folk....not allowed to retire until we are 80!!!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest Nikica

Lahm's a bit of an anomaly, he's just a wonderfully intelligent footballer and one of the few who genuinely could play most positions on the park.

 

Baines wouldn't adapt as well to that role, but I admire the fact that Martinez is receptive to what other managers are trying. Baines may or may not do well there if it is attempted, but the fact it may be being considered is great news for the club, as it shows Martinez as a progressive, humble coach who is willing to try new things.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

A feature of our holding centre mids is covering the full-back positions (especially Barry) - when his legs have gone a little and he can't get up and down the flank as he does then this will be an excellent option for him to still be useful to us.

 

A lot of players can play in a defensive midfield role and full-back - this is not a new concept at all... love Roberto coming out and saying this though.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

His point about Baines ball retention is something that is underrated at times, and maybe Rm has something there.

Baines always seems to hold the ball comfortably.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Baines is in the the same size category as iniesta, xavi, arteta, nasri, carzola. Etc etc.

 

Play the ball on the deck on the flanks the what's the problem? He has technical ability, brains, fitness.... He can do that role.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

i also really like when he got the captain's band when osman came off how he took the charge. when arteta elbowed barkley, he went straight at him and let him have it which then led to arteta getting a yellow. that's how you stick up for your team as a captain!

About time we had someone willing to do that. Jags doesn't stand up for his team mates enough, IMO.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

i also really like when he got the captain's band when osman came off how he took the charge. when arteta elbowed barkley, he went straight at him and let him have it which then led to arteta getting a yellow. that's how you stick up for your team as a captain!

saw him go to Arteta after the game, kind of apologetic, and I think I lip-read him sayin something like "I hear what you're saying but I'm the Captain and I will always defend Ross and the team". I smiled a lot there.

 

As for the DCM role, it makes sense if were talking when he's 32-ish (Oviedo would be well blooded and around 25), which also shows that RM is looking way into the future. For the next 2-3 years though, let's just enjoy him destroying the left flank....

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You've crushed me.

 

 

 

As a boy I supported...
Liverpool. As a local lad I used to watch from the Kop when Robbie Fowler was making his name. I started out at Liverpool's Centre of Excellence and although it was disappointing when nothing came of it, I was lucky that both Wigan and Wolves wanted to sign me.
Read more at http://www.fourfourtwo.com/features/leighton-baines-talentspotter#hGKVSOXV5Ha6blS4.99

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/teams/everton/10805357/Leighton-Baines-Why-I-stayed-at-Everton-but-feel-gutted-for-David-Moyes-after-Manchester-United-sack.html

 

It is with reluctance that Leighton Baines finds himself cast as the poster boy for those who want reassurance that not all footballers are money grabbing, self-serving egomaniacs.

There is a perception that if the Everton and England left-back was more practised in the art of agitation, he would have been aManchester United player several years ago, but those old-fashioned values of loyalty, duty and being an all-round good egg kept him on Merseyside.

The halo does not sit comfortably.

Speaking in detail for the first time about United's failed attempt to sign him, Baines says his decision to stay at Everton was more complicated than unquestioningly pledging his future to his boyhood team.

"I sat on the fence and saw how the thing played out," Baines says. "From this end, you might get credit for turning someone down that you probably don't deserve. The whole thing in the summer was letting things unfold. I could have signed a contract at any time in the summer and put it all to bed.

"It was a case of letting the business side of it get conducted, knowing you couldn't lose. The perspective was I could only win from this situation.

"I don't want to keep playing that tune of being humble. You just appreciate where you are. It was stressful because I didn't know which way it was going to play out. You just try to conduct yourself in the proper manner as much as you can. There is always that. That is a factor throughout.

"I had the important conversations myself and didn't have someone in there for me feeding back what was happening. I spoke with the manager, I spoke with the chairman and we had private conversations. They kept me in the loop all along. I just let them deal with it and I wanted to be kept informed. I guess you never know if you're doing the right thing or not but at the time, it's not your decision as a player to make those calls."

Whether Baines accepts applause or not, the fact he never asked for a transfer or issued public ultimatums is an admirable distinction from many of his peers.

Marouane Fellaini handed in a transfer request to ensure he left Everton for Manchester United, and one only had to witness the different exit strategies of Gareth Bale and Luis Suárez – with varying degrees of success. There is another shrug.

"Maybe it was just how I was brought up," says Baines. "If I was playing for a foreign club I may have acted differently but I think there is a different level of respect."

There has been no cause for regret since. What attracted Baines to United was the Champions League, annual title bids and a manager he admired. All have gone, Baines's penalty in David Moyes's final game indicative of how fate conspired against the former Everton coach.

"There are a lot of lads here who were long-serving under him. We all feel the same, we are a bit gutted for him," says Baines. "There are personal relationships there – you don't want to see anyone having a hard time. It's hard to know what to say but we know from working with him that he is a top manager. He has to do what is right for him now whether that's coming back straight away or having a little bit of time. The lads here who worked with him know he is a top manager.

"It's really hard. The important thing is the start. When you go in everyone is sussing each other out and from both sides. If you start well as a player when a new manager comes in the first impressions are positive. It can also work the other way."

While Moyes sank, his successor Roberto Martínez has thrived at Goodison. There is still a top-four chance, albeit slim, heading into Saturday's meeting with Manchester City, although Baines recalls the early months when no one was certain that the Spanish coach's methods would work.

"We started with a few draws and everyone was kind of sitting on the fence, and then we beat Chelsea and went on a bit of a run. That game was massive," Baines says.

"Even if you look back, we nearly conceded a ridiculous goal trying to play out of defence. What if that had of gone in and you lose the game because of it? It was the tipping point. If we had lost maybe people would have started to want what they had before. But we went on a run.

"They are fine lines. Beating Chelsea gave us the lift and made us kick on. We were trying to buy into all the new ideas and concepts but it's the same with everyone. It's a results-based business and until you start getting results, you're not going to buy into it. I guess over there [Manchester United] they never quite got going and, if they had, they would probably have been flying.

"I can only be happy with the way we are going along now and the position we are in, still in with a fighting chance of getting Champions League football. We have our highest Premier League points tally in a season and that under the new manager, for a first season, is extremely positive going. The next step is to see what we can do about strengthening. I'm sure the manager is looking at that."

One of Martínez's plans is to redeploy Baines as a central midfielder, enabling him to follow the journey of Bayern Munich's Philipp Lahm from full-back to midfield.

Baines accompanied his manager on a scouting mission when Bayern played United at Old Trafford.

"No pressure!" Baines jokes. "The lads have been talking about it and I've been getting a bit of stick. I'm teacher's pet now. I've never heard of it happening before but it was good to see the game live and for him to show the things that they do and the similarities of what he wants us to do.

"I'll be excited to give it a go. I know it sounds stupid but for a few years we used to play a 'young versus old' game on a Friday and that was my position. Tim Howard was saying the other day, 'I hope you do play there because I called it two years ago'. Steve Round [former Moyes assistant] had mentioned it before so it wasn't out of nowhere but I wouldn't expect to be playing there.

"Roberto is such a contrast to what we had before, the way he wants us to play and the fact he won't compromise on it. He wants you to do what he wants and if he sees it's not really happening, he's not going to go, 'right we will play long'. We could play good stuff before but I think now there is a real tactical meaning to everything.

"There are certain triggers within the system that someone takes up a certain position knowing that another guy is going to see that trigger, and he will go into a different position himself. It is all very specific and thought out and that's the difference."

Victory over City will secure Everton's European place but whatever the outcome the impact on the title race, for Liverpool as much as City, has dominated the pre-match agenda.

Baines says the players are thinking only of winning.

"Loads of people have obviously mentioned that potential scenario [of helping Liverpool] but when the game comes around we will want to win the game, pure and simple," he says.

"You understand the fans' side of the rivalry but you shouldn't judge yourself on others' success or failure. I think Liverpool not winning the league doesn't make us any better."

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think he's an underrated player.

Much of what he does in a game goes un noticed. His ball renationalisation and calmness helps the team immensely.

 

And good to read an article where there is no bullshit. Really nice guy and a great player.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think he's an underrated player.

Much of what he does in a game goes un noticed. His ball renationalisation and calmness helps the team immensely.

 

And good to read an article where there is no bullshit. Really nice guy and a great player.

He's not underrated he just hasn't been our main outlet this season. Progression all over the pitch.

 

I don't think he's stood out this season though. Oviedo has

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm hoping his transition to central midfielder will happen sooner rather than later. He would be well suited there, and it would open the door for Bryan Oviedo.

I would guess it will be tested out in pre-season, it will be interesting to see how it goes! Roberto must feel it's a goer or he wouldn't have mentioned it to the press. I suppose Bryan as first choice LB and Baines in midfield would explain us being linked with Robertson, firstly as Oviedo's back up then see who claims the position as their own long term?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Don't like baines in midfield he's been tried a few times and hasn't done well.

on the wing yes, but this is a sitting, central position.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×