Hafnia Posted April 15, 2016 Report Share Posted April 15, 2016 Ffs this thread has become a fuckin joke. Jags can in no way whatsoever be accused of being a poor pro, a bad leader, a shit defender. He is a solid player right the way through. At his best he's brilliant, at his worst he has the odd mistake. At his average he will not let you down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newty82 Posted April 15, 2016 Report Share Posted April 15, 2016 Jags is a fine captain for this club. Barry is equally as good as a back up. Two great pros there that I am sure players look up to and respect. The role of captain isn't just about being an angry mob enforcer on the pitch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MC11 Posted April 15, 2016 Author Report Share Posted April 15, 2016 Ffs this thread has become a fuckin joke. Jags can in no way whatsoever be accused of being a poor pro, a bad leader, a shit defender. He is a solid player right the way through. At his best he's brilliant, at his worst he has the odd mistake. At his average he will not let you down. He can't be considered a good leader either. Definitely needs replacing next season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted April 15, 2016 Report Share Posted April 15, 2016 Ffs this thread has become a fuckin joke. Jags can in no way whatsoever be accused of being a poor pro, a bad leader, a shit defender. He is a solid player right the way through. At his best he's brilliant, at his worst he has the odd mistake. At his average he will not let you down. agreed. Bullying a ref is not the way I want to see our club go, to do so would attack our integrity. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duncanmckenzieismagic Posted April 15, 2016 Report Share Posted April 15, 2016 (edited) You've got a lot to learn. Barry deserves to be captain more than Jags. Why would you prefer Jagielka? Pete there is more to being a leader than moaning at the referee and picking up yellow cards I can assure you that given my background I know a fair bit about leadership and trust me Im not the one who has a lot to learn Edited April 15, 2016 by duncanmckenzieismagic Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MC11 Posted April 15, 2016 Author Report Share Posted April 15, 2016 Ones blowing smoke up ones own arse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duncanmckenzieismagic Posted April 15, 2016 Report Share Posted April 15, 2016 Ones blowing smoke up ones own arse.If that's aimed at me then you are wrong again . I have 25 years in the armed forces behind me and have taught leadership skills for the past 5 years so I know what I'm talking about and have the qualifications to prove it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete0 Posted April 15, 2016 Report Share Posted April 15, 2016 Pete there is more to being a leader than moaning at the referee and picking up yellow cards I fairly certain that given my background I know a fair bit about leadership and trust me Im not the one who has a lot to learn Responsibility and control are important. I don't care about your back ground your last post was nasty, I could have reacted much worse than a sarky comment back. Any how, I some what doubt your self assessment. Proper leaders are able to clearly explain their direction and guide others, whereas your arguments are always supercilious and lacking in any actual facts, tbh theres barely anything to substantiate your opinion. Moaning and picking up yellows is not the only part of leading on a pitch, but it's definitely a plus. Where was Jags when Mirallas took the pen off Baines? Where is Jags when our players are being bullied? Where is Jags pain when we go a goal down? I'd bet on him having the least yellow cards of any outfield captain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete0 Posted April 15, 2016 Report Share Posted April 15, 2016 If that's aimed at me then you are wrong again . I have 25 years in the armed forces behind me and have taught leadership skills for the past 5 years so I know what I'm talking about and have the qualifications to prove itThat helps explain your arrogance. Guess we're all 'civies' to you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newty82 Posted April 15, 2016 Report Share Posted April 15, 2016 I don't get this argument! It's one of the more bizarre ones that happen on here every so often. Good luck chaps!!! Romey 1878 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sibdane Posted April 16, 2016 Report Share Posted April 16, 2016 Jags is solid (less so now) in the backline, but he's not a leader. He's too nice and doesn't inspire the team, at least that's how it seems on the outside looking in. We're really missing that passionate player who is willing to fight tooth-and-nail for the club. What member in the squad fits that bill? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duncanmckenzieismagic Posted April 16, 2016 Report Share Posted April 16, 2016 Responsibility and control are important. I don't care about your back ground your last post was nasty, I could have reacted much worse than a sarky comment back. Any how, I some what doubt your self assessment. Proper leaders are able to clearly explain their direction and guide others, whereas your arguments are always supercilious and lacking in any actual facts, tbh theres barely anything to substantiate your opinion. Moaning and picking up yellows is not the only part of leading on a pitch, but it's definitely a plus. Where was Jags when Mirallas took the pen off Baines? Where is Jags when our players are being bullied? Where is Jags pain when we go a goal down? I'd bet on him having the least yellow cards of any outfield captain. In what way was it nasty? You still seem to think picking up yellow cards is some sort of required criteria to be a leader. Fair enough in certain situations 'taking one for the team' can be a good thing but that doesn't make you a leader You also don't have to scream and shout to be a leader. Ever heard of the phrase leading by example? Oh and yes you are a civvi but how is that offensive? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romey 1878 Posted April 16, 2016 Report Share Posted April 16, 2016 I think I'm still drunk from last night. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete0 Posted April 16, 2016 Report Share Posted April 16, 2016 In what way was it nasty? You still seem to think picking up yellow cards is some sort of required criteria to be a leader. Fair enough in certain situations 'taking one for the team' can be a good thing but that doesn't make you a leader You also don't have to scream and shout to be a leader. Ever heard of the phrase leading by example? Oh and yes you are a civvi but how is that offensive? Taking one for the team would encourage players top so the same, leading by example as you say. There are many forms of leading, but I can't think of many football captains that didn't support their teammates in a ruckus. I remember Tim Howard rushing past him to go help a young Seamus Coleman who was getting out numbered. That intimidation could have effected the rest of his game if a teammate hadn't come to support him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newty82 Posted April 16, 2016 Report Share Posted April 16, 2016 Mirrallas has the most reds for us this season...he should be captain!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EFC-Paul Posted April 16, 2016 Report Share Posted April 16, 2016 (edited) Simply put he's a solid defender a poor man's Terry if you will and he's the steadiest we have at the moment I think over a period of years he's been one of our better players and unless things went severely south in what ever time he has left with us I'll always regard him as a very good signing Edited April 16, 2016 by EFC-Paul Romey 1878 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete0 Posted April 16, 2016 Report Share Posted April 16, 2016 Simply put he's a solid defender a poor man's Terry if you will and he's the steadiest we have at the moment I think over a period of years he's been one of our better players and unless things went severely south in what ever time he has left with us I'll always regard him as a very good signing Jagielka has been given 13 yellows at Everton in the league, over the same period Terry has 42. Maybe if he showed more passion like Terry he wouldn't be a poor man's version. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newty82 Posted April 16, 2016 Report Share Posted April 16, 2016 Jagielka has been given 13 yellows at Everton in the league, over the same period Terry has 42. Maybe if he showed more passion like Terry he wouldn't be a poor man's version. Is that Terry who fucked his team mates missus while also having his own missus and kids? Is that Terry who has been done for assault/affray? Terry who has been accused of acting in a racist manner? Ah yes. But because he has more yellow cards, he's a better captain. And we wonder why society is on the slide!!! Stop the world...I want to get off!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MC11 Posted April 16, 2016 Author Report Share Posted April 16, 2016 Is that Terry who fucked his team mates missus while also having his own missus and kids? Is that Terry who has been done for assault/affray? Terry who has been accused of acting in a racist manner? Ah yes. But because he has more yellow cards, he's a better captain. And we wonder why society is on the slide!!! Stop the world...I want to get off!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sibdane Posted April 16, 2016 Report Share Posted April 16, 2016 Rather have Jags than Terry any day based off of principles alone. But that point is moot. I wish we had a Cahill personality in the group -- a player who oozes passion for the club. You'd think we see that from Ross but nope. Lately, everyone on the pitch for Everton has been running with their shoulders shrugged. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted April 16, 2016 Report Share Posted April 16, 2016 This thread is fucking insane. If jags was having a shit season and was doing stones brain facts, giving away penalties, getting caught ball watching, losing his battles, being a lazy fucker then yeah let's slate him... but what the fuck is this thread all about??? He doesn't get enough yellow cards?! Fuck it let's sign noble from west ham, the yard dog at Norwich, put them in with mirallas, Barry and mccarthy and give the team talk... "Right lads, I'm fucking disgusted in you lot... I know we've been on a good run of form and we are sitting high up the table with 80 goals and 10 clean sheets... but you just dont get it do you?! Where's the yellow cards!!! I don't wanna see perfectly timed tackles that sees us set up a counter attack... I want clumsy fouls on the edge of the box. You know how we are defending set pieces and how shit it is playing on a yellow just thinking that next one gets you the early bath... but I wanna see it so it shows you care...." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sibdane Posted April 16, 2016 Report Share Posted April 16, 2016 (edited) I wouldn't say he's had a shit season, but obviously -- as a whole -- the squad has. That means every players' quality will be inevitably be questioned. I like Jags, but I don't like that he's our best defender, because his standard isn't as high as was anymore. ...But I don't get the argument abut the yellow cards either, even though their probably is a correlation somewhat between receiving a yellow card and being passionate. Edited April 16, 2016 by TonkaRoost Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted April 16, 2016 Report Share Posted April 16, 2016 I wouldn't say he's had a shit season, but obviously -- as a whole -- the squad has. That means every players' quality will be inevitably be questioned. I like Jags, but I don't like that he's our best defender, because his standard isn't as high as was anymore. ...But I don't get the argument abut the yellow cards either, even though their probably is a correlation somewhat between receiving a yellow card and being passionate. McCarthy wasn't stupid the other night... he was just very passionate. The same goes for that mcgeady against West ham... just too passionate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sibdane Posted April 16, 2016 Report Share Posted April 16, 2016 McCarthy wasn't stupid the other night... he was just very passionate. The same goes for that mcgeady against West ham... just too passionate.Good job picking out a couple of instances that fit your stance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted April 16, 2016 Report Share Posted April 16, 2016 Good job picking out a couple of instances that fit your stance. I can really go to town if you want? A yellow card Is often petulance, lack of skill, lack of discipline, see Kevin Nolan, Lee cattermole. Passion is busting a gut for the team, winning your battles, firing up the team, being vocal... see Peter Reid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sibdane Posted April 16, 2016 Report Share Posted April 16, 2016 I can really go to town if you want? A yellow card Is often petulance, lack of skill, lack of discipline, see Kevin Nolan, Lee cattermole. Passion is busting a gut for the team, winning your battles, firing up the team, being vocal... see Peter Reid. Did you even read the part where I said I don't get the yellow card argument either? Apparently not. My point was that Everton is lacking passion, so why you'd pick out two Everton players is beyond me. Obviously there's an element of stupidity to a yellow card, but to say that being passionate doesn't often result in a yellow card is wrong. See Dzeko sticking up for Besic for example. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sibdane Posted April 16, 2016 Report Share Posted April 16, 2016 What's most annoying is I'm not trying to get hung up on yellow cards. My point is that there isn't a leader in the team, yellow cards or not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete0 Posted April 16, 2016 Report Share Posted April 16, 2016 Was I saying I want mistimed tackles? I'd like to see some professional fouls to stop goals than half arsed attempts at the ball, or backing off giving an easy shot, or being walked past. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shukes Posted April 16, 2016 Report Share Posted April 16, 2016 Is that Terry who fucked his team mates missus while also having his own missus and kids? Is that Terry who has been done for assault/affray? Terry who has been accused of acting in a racist manner? Ah yes. But because he has more yellow cards, he's a better captain. And we wonder why society is on the slide!!! Stop the world...I want to get off!!! Ye we want a complete cunt as captain...that's how far our fans....not our team has fallen. Sad. We are no longer the fans team....were just the same as any other team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shukes Posted April 16, 2016 Report Share Posted April 16, 2016 Was I saying I want mistimed tackles? I'd like to see some professional fouls to stop goals than half arsed attempts at the ball, or backing off giving an easy shot, or being walked past. Professional foul is an automatic red card.....are you saying you want to see more....your words. Obviously I'm expecting you didn't mean it that way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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