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Weirdness Abounds (or the Idrissa Gana Gueye Thread)

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Good article. Bit that stood out for me was Sherwood saying “ he’s a good kid” though. 

 

What is wrong with managers calling men “kids”.

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Yeah gueye was shite at villa supposedly...... Sherwood says not. 

Funny though.... this week sarri started critiquing kante for not being technical.. talk about shooting yourself in the foot.  What the fuck is wrong with some people? The game has gone fuckin bonkers.   Maybe he needs to focus on crusty the clown - the defender who can't defend but looks nice on the ball. 

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1 hour ago, hafnia said:

Yeah gueye was shite at villa supposedly...... Sherwood says not. 

Funny though.... this week sarri started critiquing kante for not being technical.. talk about shooting yourself in the foot.  What the fuck is wrong with some people? The game has gone fuckin bonkers.   Maybe he needs to focus on crusty the clown - the defender who can't defend but looks nice on the ball. 

Bet you wouldn’t complain if he said it about Lukaku 😉

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2 hours ago, Palfy said:

Bet you wouldn’t complain if he said it about Lukaku 😉

He hasn't managed lukaku. Lukaku has had 4 prem clubs.... he's had more combined sub appearances for the other 3 clubs than he did in his whole time at Everton. 

 

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6 hours ago, hafnia said:

Yeah gueye was shite at villa supposedly...... Sherwood says not. 

Funny though.... this week sarri started critiquing kante for not being technical.. talk about shooting yourself in the foot.  What the fuck is wrong with some people? The game has gone fuckin bonkers.   Maybe he needs to focus on crusty the clown - the defender who can't defend but looks nice on the ball. 

I get Sarri’s point. In our team Gomes has been the deeper of the two, with Gana defending from the front. Sarri wants Jorginho playing how we play Gomes. I don’t see why heads are falling off because of it. Kanye just doesn’t suit his system but he’s playing him for his legs and his ability to defend high up the pitch. 

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29 minutes ago, StevO said:

I get Sarri’s point. In our team Gomes has been the deeper of the two, with Gana defending from the front. Sarri wants Jorginho playing how we play Gomes. I don’t see why heads are falling off because of it. Kanye just doesn’t suit his system but he’s playing him for his legs and his ability to defend high up the pitch. 

Kanye is in football now?! Fuck me...

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20 minutes ago, Matt said:

Kanye is in football now?! Fuck me...

I assume you're referring to the "artist" previously known by that name, he is now "YE" (short for "YEs I'm a complete twat" I understand).

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Now that's a hard one to judge when Gana doesn't hold a position, I think Gomes is meant to be more forward of the 2 because of his ability to create more when in possession of the ball, but I can understand why there's confusion when Gana follows the ball all over the pitch.

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1 hour ago, MikeO said:

I assume you're referring to the "artist" previously known by that name, he is now "YE" (short for "YEs I'm a complete twat" I understand).

I wouldn't kick his Mrs out of bed for farting.

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8 hours ago, Bill said:

No Steve, I wouldn't say Gomes is playing deeper than Gana. 

Sorry Bill, you’re wrong. Gomes is back between the centre halves while Gana is closing down with the forwards. Gana’s game is more defensive, but he is doing it higher up the pitch. Gomes needs to dictate the play from a deeper position. 

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6 hours ago, Palfy said:

Now that's a hard one to judge when Gana doesn't hold a position, I think Gomes is meant to be more forward of the 2 because of his ability to create more when in possession of the ball, but I can understand why there's confusion when Gana follows the ball all over the pitch.

Gomes isn’t meant to be further forward Palfy, he’s meant to be in space to pick the ball up and pass it forward. Gana’s role is now to close down higher up, hence him following the ball more. 

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16 hours ago, StevO said:

I get Sarri’s point. In our team Gomes has been the deeper of the two, with Gana defending from the front. Sarri wants Jorginho playing how we play Gomes. I don’t see why heads are falling off because of it. Kanye just doesn’t suit his system but he’s playing him for his legs and his ability to defend high up the pitch. 

Gana would disagree with you, Steve.

Quote

“I have to play a little bit further back this season because Andre is more of a forward player than me. Sometimes I have to control the game and allow him to decide when to go forward and when to stay. But it is a good balance playing with Andre. 

http://www.evertonfc.com/news/2018/11/30/gana

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19 hours ago, Palfy said:

Now that's a hard one to judge when Gana doesn't hold a position, I think Gomes is meant to be more forward of the 2 because of his ability to create more when in possession of the ball, but I can understand why there's confusion when Gana follows the ball all over the pitch.

 

12 hours ago, StevO said:

Sorry Bill, you’re wrong. Gomes is back between the centre halves while Gana is closing down with the forwards. Gana’s game is more defensive, but he is doing it higher up the pitch. Gomes needs to dictate the play from a deeper position. 

It’s a fair debate.  I think Palfy’s several points are spot on — hard to judge, Gana follows ball, so Gomes is meant to move the ball forward.  I see SteveO’s point that Gomes does regularly receive the ball back toward our defenders, but Gomes wants to move the ball by his feet and by his passing toward the opponent’s goal.   Mostly this results in Gomes himself moving forward, even if temporarily he has started toward the back.  Because Gana has free rein to close down all over the pitch, yes, sometimes he is defending pretty high up.  But when Gomes is controlling the ball — his intended role all match long — Gana can’t regularly stay ahead of the ball; he has to fall back as Gomes moves forward.

It’s surely not all one thing or the other.  But Gomes seems more a CM than a DCM, whereas Gana is a very different, even weird (seriously), DCM.

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Just now, Palfy said:

Well how poor was he today worse player by far. 

Thought he improved slightly in the  second half. But no doubt about it he was poor today. Maybe if he and Coleman were ticking we could have got something out of that game.

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He was terrible today, they completely exploited him but thats him, its going to happen. 

In terms of his position Gana is on average playing deeper that Gomes. In terms of average position in every game he has been deeper however in 2 games they have been very similar. 

Gomes is the one who has more license to break forward and move possession upfield but they are both central midfielders and both have to be able to sit in the hole, press the ball and get forward.

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1 hour ago, Aidan said:

Thought he improved slightly in the  second half. But no doubt about it he was poor today. Maybe if he and Coleman were ticking we could have got something out of that game.

He did improve in the second half and halted a few promising attacks from them.

But I have it agree, it wasn’t enough after a terrible first half.

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He still was a part of 2 of their best attacks in the 2nd half. One not tracking Mane who ran right past him and then first passing into trouble before then turning into more trouble about 30 yards from goal. 

I am hoping that it will be the worst midfield performance we will see for the rest of this season.

 

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1 hour ago, Bailey said:

He still was a part of 2 of their best attacks in the 2nd half. One not tracking Mane who ran right past him and then first passing into trouble before then turning into more trouble about 30 yards from goal. 

I am hoping that it will be the worst midfield performance we will see for the rest of this season.

 

I hate to be the bearer of bad news but...

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29 minutes ago, Palfy said:

I hate to be the bearer of bad news but...

But what??? No one has said he had a good game, had a poor game so where's the news?

I mean... I'm sure you would like this game to marr all the good work he's done this season but it's not gonna happen.  Enjoy your moment of glory. 

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5 hours ago, hafnia said:

But what??? No one has said he had a good game, had a poor game so where's the news?

I mean... I'm sure you would like this game to marr all the good work he's done this season but it's not gonna happen.  Enjoy your moment of glory. 

Doh read Bailey's last comment I apologise for making it hard for you, but just take a minute to think about it and I'm sure it will come to you in the end.

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21 minutes ago, Palfy said:

Doh read Bailey's last comment I apologise for making it hard for you, but just take a minute to think about it and I'm sure it will come to you in the end.

That he was involved in 2 of their best attacks in the second half? He was involved in one of their best in the first half when he passed it to mane imo- so what? We've already fuckin said he had a poor game.  We lost because of a keeper fuck up and yet here we are talking about gana when No one has contested he had a bad game.

He had a bad game.... he's had many good games this season.... move on. Ffs

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Don't see how Gana played any differently. He gives away a clear chance nearly every game. 

Only difference from that match to any other is Liverpool press high which made it easier for him to hide in midfield. Only midfielder in the world scared of the ball. 

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7 minutes ago, pete0 said:

Don't see how Gana played any differently. He gives away a clear chance nearly every game. 

Only difference from that match to any other is Liverpool press high which made it easier for him to hide in midfield. Only midfielder in the world scared of the ball. 

Funny how he seems to intercept it all the time though eh?

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50 minutes ago, Matt said:

Funny how he seems to intercept it all the time though eh?

Anyone can run like a headless chicken, you could put out a yorkie terrier to just as 'good'. 

Look where Gana positions himself when we have the ball. School boy stuff is you move a yard forward or backwards to create space to pass past, Gana doesn't and b it makes it 10x harder for everyone around him. 

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38 minutes ago, Bill said:

More tackles, more interceptions, and covers more miles than anyone else on the pitch

That just emphasis he runs round a lot out of position. 

He kills the tempo of our forward play, and defensively he's a liability. Often he wins a tackle but the opposition still end up with the ball, he'd be better off staying on his feet and jockeying the opposition forcing them into a mistake. His stats would do down but we'd be better off defensively. 

More tackles does not equal better defence. If anything if you over tackle you are leaving a gap while you're on the deck and creating loose balls that could create a chance. Add to that there's no intelligence or conviction in Gana's, he's just a yappy dog. 

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Hahahahaha.... the boys have found their derby consolation prize.....

Not that we played well at anfield and had them well and truly rattled.... but Gana had a bad game.  

Lads, keep your mobiles on... I'm sure if our manager who has transformed our team thinks he needs to know where he's going wrong he will give you a call. 

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9 minutes ago, hafnia said:

I'm sure if our manager who has transformed our team thinks he needs to know where he's going wrong he will give you a call

He could've done with a call during the Derby to make better subs. 

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9 hours ago, hafnia said:

That he was involved in 2 of their best attacks in the second half? He was involved in one of their best in the first half when he passed it to mane imo- so what? We've already fuckin said he had a poor game.  We lost because of a keeper fuck up and yet here we are talking about gana when No one has contested he had a bad game.

He had a bad game.... he's had many good games this season.... move on. Ffs

I’ll spell it out to you Haf I was responding to Baileys comment that he hoped that would be his worst game this season, I responded by saying I hate to be the bearer of bad news but . 

Which means I don’t think it will be his worst game this season, you then start spouting your usual shit and attacking and defending things I never said. 

So in answer to your first question but what??? It was quite simple really I don’t think that will be his worst game this season. 

So no more strawman antics please just so you can make a noise and sound off, l never mentioned anything about his game play in the derby good or bad in that post. 

So stop inventing stories for effect, because I’m rolling round here like the laughing policeman reading your posts to what I said 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂 thanks for the entertainment anyway mate. 

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22 minutes ago, Palfy said:

I’ll spell it out to you Haf I was responding to Baileys comment that he hoped that would be his worst game this season, I responded by saying I hate to be the bearer of bad news but . 

Which means I don’t think it will be his worst game this season, you then start spouting your usual shit and attacking and defending things I never said. 

So in answer to your first question but what??? It was quite simple really I don’t think that will be his worst game this season. 

So no more strawman antics please just so you can make a noise and sound off, l never mentioned anything about his game play in the derby good or bad in that post. 

So stop inventing stories for effect, because I’m rolling round here like the laughing policeman reading your posts to what I said 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂 thanks for the entertainment anyway mate. 

Maybe you need to work on your post structure... maybe I'm the only one who read it as i know many just skip alot of these posts...but the meaning of your post was ambiguous. 

 

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13 minutes ago, hafnia said:

Maybe you need to work on your post structure... maybe I'm the only one who read it as i know many just skip alot of these posts...but the meaning of your post was ambiguous. 

 

It was one line, so post structure?! It was clear as day for me what he meant. 

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37 minutes ago, hafnia said:

Maybe you need to work on your post structure... maybe I'm the only one who read it as i know many just skip alot of these posts...but the meaning of your post was ambiguous. 

 

Ok mate maybe I shouldn’t try and be so smart with my posts but where all good, and you are right he was better 2nd half and he made a really important tackle wide on our right, in game time I was the only one who mentioned it but if he hadn’t made they were in, now what a dick that made me feel one of the Ps and the only person to say well done Gana I got a reputation to up hold 👍😀

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2 hours ago, Palfy said:

Ok mate maybe I shouldn’t try and be so smart with my posts but where all good, and you are right he was better 2nd half and he made a really important tackle wide on our right, in game time I was the only one who mentioned it but if he hadn’t made they were in, now what a dick that made me feel one of the Ps and the only person to say well done Gana I got a reputation to up hold 👍😀

I didn't point out anything good he done all game.... I actually pointed out he played mane through in second half.

I'm writing it off as a bad game where you had already written him off as a bad player.  That's the issue.

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Gueye's a good defensive midfielder. He didn't have a good game in the Derby but overall he's been good this season. He just doesn't have the quality on the ball required to get to the next level. It's more obvious with Gomes alongside him too. There's nothing more frustrating than giving the ball away under no pressure and he can epitomise that sometimes. The difference in quality players (or someone like Gomes) is that they keep the ball when they are under pressure.

Unfortunately Gueye will never possess this quality but he is definitely the best we have right now and he will suffice for a push to the top 6. Beyond that though, we need an upgrade.

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1 hour ago, hafnia said:

I didn't point out anything good he done all game.... I actually pointed out he played mane through in second half.

I'm writing it off as a bad game where you had already written him off as a bad player.  That's the issue.

Not so much bad just not good enough to get us where we want to be, the good thing about having Gomes in the team is he raises the bench mark and highlights the difference between good and average players, but he can’t get us there on his own we need people playing with him who can match him or we don’t move on, and wasn’t it you who said with Gomes we could be pushing for 2nd in the league we could but not with Gana by his side. 

In my opinion he has to many flaws in his game to take us to the next level, in your opinion he doesn’t great crack on I’m not upset by that I respect you views even though they differ from mine. 

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10 hours ago, Palfy said:

Not so much bad just not good enough to get us where we want to be, the good thing about having Gomes in the team is he raises the bench mark and highlights the difference between good and average players, but he can’t get us there on his own we need people playing with him who can match him or we don’t move on, and wasn’t it you who said with Gomes we could be pushing for 2nd in the league we could but not with Gana by his side. 

In my opinion he has to many flaws in his game to take us to the next level, in your opinion he doesn’t great crack on I’m not upset by that I respect you views even though they differ from mine. 

Horses for courses simple as that.  I dont expect Gomes to produce the same ball winning stats as Gana and I don't expect gana to show the same creativity and skills as Gomes.  It's whether you see the necessity for a ball winner - I do. 

There will be a game soon where Gomes gives the ball away a lot more than we are used to seeing, where nothing goes right. Are We gonna write off Gomes? No. 

I'm more bothered about how our players react to bad games.  Lukaku (sorry) used to hide and seemingly blame others.  Gana doesn't hide.... nor do I think Gomes will just like Digne and Richarlison won't.

 

 

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Who is everyone back here. I posted weeks ago that they are waiting for him to have a bad game to justify their points. This is all expected. 

Pickford gives away a howler.... that not only gave away a clear chance, but also a goal, and also the points... along with bragging rights and more hurt.

But we all knew this would be the busiest thread, as they have been able to scrape a tiny bit of egg of their faces.

Let it go. Let it go. Blah blah blah!

 

edit: to be fair Haf... Gomes had an awful start to the game and gave away their first chance. He gave the ball away four times in the opening ten minutes. 

But then he upped his game and turned in a masterful appearance.

Gana had a truly awful first half. Mainly passing the ball forward. But had a decent second half and snuffed it two clear chances for them. 

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1 minute ago, Palfy said:

Wake me up so I don’t miss the game 😴😴😴😴😴😴

Ye you go to sleep.... I’ll wake you... honestly. This thread wouldn’t be what it is without you😉

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Good how this thread has progressed in the last twelve months though.

Gana isn’t a premier league player.

Ok he is now, but he won’t get us any higher.

Ok he has got us higher but he can’t play against top six teams.

Ok he can now, he’s proved that but he isn’t good enough to get us into Europe.

ok we’re heading there now, but once Gomes plays he’ll be out the team.

Ok he’s been credited with being integral with Gomes but he isn’t good enough to get us second!

See we told you so!

next it will be.... we told you he would never win the Ballon Dor! So he’s not good enough for us.

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29 minutes ago, Shukes said:

Ye you go to sleep.... I’ll wake you... honestly. This thread wouldn’t be what it is without you😉

Cheers mate 👌

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Shukes mate you need to take a breath rewind and have a look at the post to see who started this shit storm again, and let me tell you something it wasn’t me 😇 or PeteO, so before you go making accusations because you’ve come in near the end go back 9 or 10 posts, because your very wrong with I said weeks ago if he had a bad game they would start. 

I do except apologies but I’m not going to hold my breath till I get one but in future please follow the whole picture, and you could help the planet with our carbon footprint 👣 if you get my meaning. 

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I do apologise if I missed who started it. I’ll be honest, I didnt read all the way back as it was just a rehash if what’s been said a million times.

But I do appologise if that’s the case.

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Since then Azpilicueta, Lucas Leiva, Fernandinho, Kanté (for Chelsea), James Milner, Nacho Monreal, Victor Wanyama and Kanté (again) have been in the top ten tacklers in the league over a season.

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41 minutes ago, Palfy said:

To me that just highlights how bad we are as a team, you don’t see any players from the top teams there have you ever wondered why. 

Kante? Every top team has a ball-winner. 

Stat must be wrong though, no way he could make that amount of tackles as he has no positional sense apparently...

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1 hour ago, Matt said:

Kante? Every top team has a ball-winner. 

Stat must be wrong though, no way he could make that amount of tackles as he has no positional sense apparently...

So why aren’t those teams in the pic posted in the top six 3 aren’t even in the top half, the reason being the top 6 don’t want that enviable position of constantly having to win the ball back they prefer to have players with better ability who don’t constantly give the ball away so aren’t relying on someone who is just a ball winner, to me that’s not a stat to be proud of the one to be proud of is not giving the ball away so much and having good the best possession, against Newcastle Gana was a bystander contribution 0 because we had so much possession he had fuck all to offer he was a waste of a player. 

Yeah great have him on when we need a ball winner against the better clubs he should then be able to make a contribution, but to have him on against teams that we are going to dominate possession in then we don’t need him he has got the ability to be a play maker so becomes obsolete as was proven against Newcastle I think it was Haf who said we would have been better off with Davies in place of Gana and I totally agree. 

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