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Weirdness Abounds (or the Idrissa Gana Gueye Thread)


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7 hours ago, pete0 said:

 

 

See Baileys posts from the match day thread. Never trust Everton highlights for a fair reflection, it's even more one sided than our commentary, but tbf to them not many fans want to rewatch the bad bits. 

They are critiques of what’s gana could have done better though, not chances that he gave away. Massive massive difference.

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10 hours ago, hafnia said:

In which case for a grand total of one goal and one assist and an increase of 0.8 key passes per game over gana i would say he either isn'ttt playing advanced or shouldn't be playing advanced.... as overall ganas stats piss all over his from a DM perspective and are pretty much similar in all other areas with Kante having 3% higher pass completion with an average of 3 less passes per game. 

Refer to my previous post on Kante’s stats 2 titles player of the year voted best player by the teams he played for in the 2 seasons he won the title, his value in money is more than double that of Gana, now let’s look at Gana’s honours in the Prem one relegation being as you can only critique players by using on site stat based information your wrong Kante is the better player. 

Now I never started this debate of Kante V Gana you did and all you’ve achieved is a massive own goal but your use to that by now so it shouldn’t really bother you. 

But if your going to press me on this question yes I do think Kante is a better player than Gana has I expect most of the country would, especially Aston Villa fans. 

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1 hour ago, Palfy said:

Refer to my previous post on Kante’s stats 2 titles player of the year voted best player by the teams he played for in the 2 seasons he won the title, his value in money is more than double that of Gana, now let’s look at Gana’s honours in the Prem one relegation being as you can only critique players by using on site stat based information your wrong Kante is the better player. 

Now I never started this debate of Kante V Gana you did and all you’ve achieved is a massive own goal but your use to that by now so it shouldn’t really bother you. 

But if your going to press me on this question yes I do think Kante is a better player than Gana has I expect most of the country would, especially Aston Villa fans. 

I'm not saying gana is better than Kante, I dont think I ever have... I'm agreeing that Kante is a great DM..... won 2 titles and 2 POTY.....I'm also saying that Gana overshadowed this great DM in a game that you said he would get found out in. Did he get found out? No. 

How can such a shit player overshadow such a great player in a game that he was meant to get found out in? Maybe there isn'tt a great deal of difference between them... the stats certainly seem to indicate that.

Are you saying Roy Keane was shite? Di canio, juninho, defoe, kinkladze, viduka, Scott Parker?... all got relegated.  

Whilst you are on about villa fans - they rated him on the whole. Have a look at villa talk they are pissed off that he was surrounded by shite... player of the year for many and his stats were similarly impressive.

https://www.eurosport.co.uk/football/premier-league/2015-2016/the-kante-gueye-conundrum-how-are-leicester-so-good-and-villa-so-bad_sto5440821/story.shtml

A nice article that puts it all into context...

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You don’t get reply’s to facts. Only debate is when there is no evidence or facts to back it up. Take the Gana giving away clear cut chances against Fulham haha!

I actually took the time out to watch the extended highlights again to see if it was just me missing them, as I missed them when I watched the whole match.

Guess what! Nowhere to be seen. Just didnt happen did it haha.

But when I pointed this out, it was apparently because the Everton TV highlights are obviously biased ( though they did show the actual chances that did happen). So I missed them first time round, the cameras missed them, so did everyone else. But because Palfy and PeteO are more eagle eyes than the rest of the world, they saw them haha.

 

Before we refer back to Baileys post again, his post was very well put together with evidence to show his point. But it didn’t show a single chance that Gana gave away, just chances that had already been given away and Gana could have done better to defend, just like the rest of the defence and midfield.... and that’s forgiving he players that ACTUALLY gave away the chances. 

Taking bookings now.

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Interesting reading that Haf, it shows that in the year Villa got relegated he made more interceptions and more forward passes per game than Kante in his premier  winning year. Also his performance before joining Villa were consistently at the top of his game. 

This is one thing he doesn’t get credit for. His consistency.

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36 minutes ago, hafnia said:

I'm not saying gana is better than Kante, I dont think I ever have... I'm agreeing that Kante is a great DM..... won 2 titles and 2 POTY.....I'm also saying that Gana overshadowed this great DM in a game that you said he would get found out in. Did he get found out? No. 

How can such a shit player overshadow such a great player in a game that he was meant to get found out in? Maybe there isn'ttt a great deal of difference between them... the stats certainly seem to indicate that.

Are you saying Roy Keane was shite? Di canio, juninho, defoe, kinkladze, viduka, Scott Parker?... all got relegated.  

Whilst you are on about villa fans - they rated him on the whole. Have a look at villa talk they are pissed off that he was surrounded by shite... player of the year for many and his stats were similarly impressive.

https://www.eurosport.co.uk/football/premier-league/2015-2016/the-kante-gueye-conundrum-how-are-leicester-so-good-and-villa-so-bad_sto5440821/story.shtml

A nice article that puts it all into context...

That was a good read but like most opinions it’s based on conjecture more than facts, but having said that I do accept that stats are facts and the Gana’s stats are excellent I’ve never denied that, but for me they give you just part of a players ability or worth, and maybe the opinions and conjecture of others is why Kante got player of the year was sort after by some of the biggest clubs in Europe, then went to Chelsea and repeated what he achieved at Leicester to dispel what the author of that article suggested that Kantes performance at Leicester could  have been a one off. 

But that was conjecture on his part but time proved that statement to be wrong but that was his opinion at the time and it’s not wrong to voice your opinions whether later they were proven to be right or wrong, and in that same vein I made comment that Gana in my opinion didn’t show up for the games against the top 6 and I thought he would have a poor game, I was wrong he didn’t have a poor game but he never had the brilliant game you illustrated, which I believe you over exaggerated to add more weight to your point and try to as you said make me look ridiculous. 

 

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32 minutes ago, Shukes said:

You don’t get reply’s to facts. Only debate is when there is no evidence or facts to back it up. Take the Gana giving away clear cut chances against Fulham haha!

I actually took the time out to watch the extended highlights again to see if it was just me missing them, as I missed them when I watched the whole match.

Guess what! Nowhere to be seen. Just didnt happen did it haha.

But when I pointed this out, it was apparently because the Everton TV highlights are obviously biased ( though they did show the actual chances that did happen). So I missed them first time round, the cameras missed them, so did everyone else. But because Palfy and PeteO are more eagle eyes than the rest of the world, they saw them haha.

 

Before we refer back to Baileys post again, his post was very well put together with evidence to show his point. But it didn’t show a single chance that Gana gave away, just chances that had already been given away and Gana could have done better to defend, just like the rest of the defence and midfield.... and that’s forgiving he players that ACTUALLY gave away the chances. 

Taking bookings now.

Sometimes it depends on what your looking for which gives you your opinion of a player, I personally don’t think stats give you the full picture but that’s my opinion, I will fully admit that I cast a critical eye on Gana only because this thread as made watch every move he makes in every game which isn’t good, but if every time you make a post on this subject you use my name as some form of proof that that makes you right your very misguided and your just jumping on the band wagon because it safer to be in a crowd isn’t it Shukes. 

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We have more than enough midfielders to choose from now...  Gomes, gana, Davies, McCarthy, schneiderlein that's 5 for 2 spots.....  we all know what gana brings and where his strengths don't lie. 

At this moment our manager is giving him the nod and he is doing a lone defensive midfielder role which is what we have been crying out for rather than 2... it's meant we can have a more expansive player like Gomes instead of a master of nothing in schneiderlein.  We look loads better for it.... Gana isn'tt overloaded he is doing a fine job. The team look loads better and far more balanced. 

I trust the manager.  The manager trusts Gana. End of story. 

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24 minutes ago, hafnia said:

We have more than enough midfielders to choose from now...  Gomes, gana, Davies, McCarthy, schneiderlein that's 5 for 2 spots.....  we all know what gana brings and where his strengths don't lie. 

At this moment our manager is giving him the nod and he is doing a lone defensive midfielder role which is what we have been crying out for rather than 2... it's meant we can have a more expansive player like Gomes instead of a master of nothing in schneiderlein.  We look loads better for it.... Gana isn'ttt overloaded he is doing a fine job. The team look loads better and far more balanced. 

I trust the manager.  The manager trusts Gana. End of story. 

Yes 5 good mids with different strengths which gives the manager options should he require it. 

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2 hours ago, Palfy said:

Sometimes it depends on what your looking for which gives you your opinion of a player, I personally don’t think stats give you the full picture but that’s my opinion, I will fully admit that I cast a critical eye on Gana only because this thread as made watch every move he makes in every game which isn’t good, but if every time you make a post on this subject you use my name as some form of proof that that makes you right your very misguided and your just jumping on the band wagon because it safer to be in a crowd isn’t it Shukes. 

No Palfy not at all. I mention your name as your not just in a minority, your in a duo. It would be wrong if me to label a group of people as it’s only two peoples opinion. You get that right?

I do t use your name as any sort of proof, as generally I think you are a very good poster. But in this thread I do believe you try to hard to find fault, and often it isn’t here. So proof is very far from it haha.

If I could offer you any advice it would be this. Just because you say something, doesn’t make it real or true. 

Im not sure if your meaning to do it, or if your just very good at it, but you come across as very deflective Palf. Like i say, not sure if it’s intentional. 

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15 minutes ago, Shukes said:

No Palfy not at all. I mention your name as your not just in a minority, your in a duo. It would be wrong if me to label a group of people as it’s only two peoples opinion. You get that right?

I do t use your name as any sort of proof, as generally I think you are a very good poster. But in this thread I do believe you try to hard to find fault, and often it isn’t here. So proof is very far from it haha.

If I could offer you any advice it would be this. Just because you say something, doesn’t make it real or true. 

Im not sure if your meaning to do it, or if your just very good at it, but you come across as very deflective Palf. Like i say, not sure if it’s intentional. 

Your wrong Shukes there are more than just Pete and myself who feel Gana has some concerning frailties in his game, they have posted in the past, so my point being your having a debate with PeteO about Fulham yet you aim your response at me as well, why I have I said anywhere that I thought he gave away clear chances to Fulham. 

Really curious about why because it doesn’t make sense, and is forcing me to react to something I never said which is a pain, but I won’t standby and allow people to put words in my mouth 👄 I hope you understand where I’m coming from 👍

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I think others have got thoughts on him yes, but I honestly haven’t saw anyone in the same bracket as you two. Others are subjective even if they don’t rate him. I dont think you are at all.

And please let’s not start the old prove I said this and that again. It’s a forum post and I’m talking about your general opinion and how hard you try to find faults in a single player. I know how upset you get when you think your being picked on 😉

Im also allowed an opinion, and mine is that you unfairly critique him. You don’t have to agree, that’s your right. But I also have those same rights as you.

I know what you mean though, I also do the same as you. Because of the posts on here I feel a need to defend him. And I simply don’t, his performances do a mich better job than I ever could haha.

Anyway. Let’s move on and get back to arguing about Gana, that’s more fun.

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16 minutes ago, Shukes said:

I think others have got thoughts on him yes, but I honestly haven’t saw anyone in the same bracket as you two. Others are subjective even if they don’t rate him. I dont think you are at all.

And please let’s not start the old prove I said this and that again. It’s a forum post and I’m talking about your general opinion and how hard you try to find faults in a single player. I know how upset you get when you think your being picked on 😉

Im also allowed an opinion, and mine is that you unfairly critique him. You don’t have to agree, that’s your right. But I also have those same rights as you.

I know what you mean though, I also do the same as you. Because of the posts on here I feel a need to defend him. And I simply don’t, his performances do a mich better job than I ever could haha.

Anyway. Let’s move on and get back to arguing about Gana, that’s more fun.

🙂👍

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23 hours ago, pete0 said:

 

 

See Baileys posts from the match day thread. Never trust Everton highlights for a fair reflection, it's even more one sided than our commentary, but tbf to them not many fans want to rewatch the bad bits. 

The Everton highlights aren’t put together by the club, they are done by Premier League TV. So probably still not fair but for a different reason. 

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23 hours ago, hafnia said:

 Double blow:-

1.  You said Gana would get found out against Chelsea- he never, he looked pretty good indeed.

2. You stated that Kante is the statistically better player having won leagues and POTY.... but Gana overshadowed him.  Further highlighting his credentials as a good player... not some numbskull.

 

 

1. Gana was average.

2. Kante was also average. 

 

 

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1 hour ago, Palfy said:

Why the change of heart you have been the most prolific poster on it in the last few months?

You know when you invest hours in a computer game... complete it and then play it over and over again and you end up fighting the same monsters and zap them without thinking. That's when you know it's time to get a new game. 

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1 hour ago, hafnia said:

You know when you invest hours in a computer game... complete it and then play it over and over again and you end up fighting the same monsters and zap them without thinking. That's when you know it's time to get a new game. 

To be fair Haf we all keep going over the same arguments and nothing really changes, let’s see what Saturday brings it will hopefully freshen it up again with current points to discuss. 

But what we need to do is keep the personal insults out of it because it brings the thread down and I believe stops others who may have some good points doing so because they can’t be bothered with the crap 💩

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7 minutes ago, Bill said:

I,m astounded that any thread can go on so long, all its about is people with different opinions, some think he's good and some think he's bad. Why does it take so long to put ones point of view. ???

Lukaku thread is the same. 👻

All players have some games where they're better than others, this is a thread for discussing an Everton player and how he's playing and will continue for as long as he's still an Everton player. When he's no longer an Everton player it'll be moved to General Sport and will still get comments in all likelihood.

Same as we have a thread for every player, it's kind of the point of the forum:huh:.

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Yeah I know its the way of the forum Mike, but it doesn't matter if he's playing well or not, people are still arguing and still putting forward their opinion good or bad, nobody's going to change it.  

Put across your opinion and leave it there. No need to come back every day to repeat the same old monotonous rubbish.

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5 minutes ago, sibdane said:

7wdzrewftgz11.png

Crackin visual ...  it could be split into a 9 blocker where bottom left is shite and top right is excellent. 

It doesn't indicate what type of passes they are as per Matt's comment but it essentially says..... he wins the ball more than anyone and doesn't give it away. 

Awesome.

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