Romey 1878 Posted December 10, 2016 Report Share Posted December 10, 2016 He did look a bit of a donkey today. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bailey Posted December 10, 2016 Report Share Posted December 10, 2016 Bloke can't win a header. Ball watching for the first as well. Awful signing. He didn't even attempt to win a couple which is worse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MC11 Posted December 10, 2016 Report Share Posted December 10, 2016 Really worrying watching him try to win a header. He literally can't compete in the air. You can also tell he's been schooled in the lower leagues. Not good enough Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted December 10, 2016 Report Share Posted December 10, 2016 Dog shit today. Â Looked like he's been eating KFC with lukaku and Barkley. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Posted December 10, 2016 Report Share Posted December 10, 2016 He was just the player we needed, a no nonsense defender who would settle us down. Or so it was said by lots of people, I disagreed and got a bit of stick for it, he's been shown up to be just another average defender, not just this game but every game he has played since he came here. Â But if you shop in the bargain basement that's all you're likely get. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted December 10, 2016 Report Share Posted December 10, 2016 He was just the player we needed, a no nonsense defender who would settle us down. Or so it was said by lots of people, I disagreed and got a bit of stick for it, he's been shown up to be just another average defender, not just this game but every game he has played since he came here.  But if you shop in the bargain basement that's all you're likely get.  Best defender in the euros, been a tremendous prem defender.... £11m ain't bargain basement.   Was poor today... is he a shite player? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Posted December 11, 2016 Report Share Posted December 11, 2016 Called him a dud when we signed him. Looks like as usual I was right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted December 11, 2016 Report Share Posted December 11, 2016 Called him a dud when we signed him. Looks like as usual I was right. Well done Eric... we should have a table for being right. Fancy being our director of football? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Posted December 11, 2016 Report Share Posted December 11, 2016 Haf, i refer you back to the motm votes, I know it's not the Bible but it's a good indication of how good or bad players perform. Â Williams has played about 14/15 games, in one of those games he played reasonable and received 5 votes, nowhere near motm but 5 points nonetheless. Now up to date he still only has 5 votes so in the other 13/14 games he hasn't been given a single vote, not one person thought he was good enough to vote for him. Pretty damming don't you think. Â Forget what he done in the the euros or what he did previously in the prem, what he is now is an ageing average defender. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted December 11, 2016 Report Share Posted December 11, 2016 Haf, i refer you back to the motm votes, I know it's not the Bible but it's a good indication of how good or bad players perform. Â Williams has played about 14/15 games, in one of those games he played reasonable and received 5 votes, nowhere near motm but 5 points nonetheless. Now up to date he still only has 5 votes so in the other 13/14 games he hasn't been given a single vote, not one person thought he was good enough to vote for him. Pretty damming don't you think. Â Forget what he done in the the euros or what he did previously in the prem, what he is now is an ageing average defender. not even close Bill, Gana has taken most of the votes because he's been so good. You've gone on about this for a while - he didn't get votes early on because others were even better, he hasn't got them recently because he's been poor. He's still a very good player and someone we absolutely needed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted December 11, 2016 Report Share Posted December 11, 2016 Haf, i refer you back to the motm votes, I know it's not the Bible but it's a good indication of how good or bad players perform. Â Williams has played about 14/15 games, in one of those games he played reasonable and received 5 votes, nowhere near motm but 5 points nonetheless. Now up to date he still only has 5 votes so in the other 13/14 games he hasn't been given a single vote, not one person thought he was good enough to vote for him. Pretty damming don't you think. Â Forget what he done in the the euros or what he did previously in the prem, what he is now is an ageing average defender. I believed him to be a great signing. Thought we would get 2-3 years till Galloway was ready ... I still think it's something to do with the system. It's not just him jags and mori look shocking too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Posted December 11, 2016 Report Share Posted December 11, 2016 Sorry to bring out stats to back my argument, gana has won several MOTM awards but at the same time other players have also received votes in those games. Williams has not received one. I think he is the lowest voted for defender, Holgate has more, also Jags who just been dropped has more. Whatever you say will not change my opinion of him, very average and not the sort of player to improve us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete0 Posted December 11, 2016 Report Share Posted December 11, 2016 Jags was dropped and has more votes. Sort of dispels the motm votes as bible. It's a good indicator, but does not reward a player who is putting in a shift every week without being the star. You'd have rank the players best to worst every game, and I don't think any of us would be arsed to do that every week. He's not been great, but Stek, Jags, Coleman, Baines, and Gana have been responsible for more goals. I'd say only Barry hasn't let the side down as often. My only concern so far is the amount of headers that he's missed, but with the amount Baines lets go he's going to get caught out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted December 11, 2016 Report Share Posted December 11, 2016 Bill... never mind  Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Posted December 11, 2016 Report Share Posted December 11, 2016 Well done Eric... we should have a table for being right. Fancy being our director of football?I reckon I'd do a better job than Walsh did in the summer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted December 11, 2016 Report Share Posted December 11, 2016 I reckon I'd do a better job than Walsh did in the summer. Who would you sign? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Posted December 11, 2016 Report Share Posted December 11, 2016 (edited) Matt ... OK. I rest my case. Edited December 11, 2016 by Bill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c1982 Posted December 11, 2016 Report Share Posted December 11, 2016 Forget what he done in the the euros or what he did previously in the prem, what he is now is an ageing average defender. He's a great signing on the basis of what he did at the Euros and what he's done previously in the Prem... that's how you judge a signing. Unless someone has a crystal ball what basis should we sign players on? Hindsight shows he's not done as well as he can this season but that's not just down to him and Koeman did want a 2nd CB too whether it was Kone or Kouabaily. Personally I think he'll take over from Jags/Barry as captain and be our main senior figure in the next few seasons. If we can get van Dijk in alongside him (if the £25m release clause is true) and a reliable keeper then I still think he can rekindle what we've seen previously. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Finn balor Posted December 11, 2016 Report Share Posted December 11, 2016 I think Williams has been our most solid defender. He's had a couple of poor games but who hasn't? I think he has realised he has walked into a dressing room full of prima Donnas who don't care. I blame this fully on one man. Players knew they were on easy street with Martinez. We need to clear out lukaku, mirrallas etc and get in fully commited Young players Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted December 11, 2016 Report Share Posted December 11, 2016 Matt ... OK. I rest my case.which is TT voted = accurate representation of a player? Don't be a lawyer then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Palfy Posted December 11, 2016 Report Share Posted December 11, 2016 For me he's a good average player no better or no worse than we've got, not worth the fee we paid for him due to his age very expensive for a short term fix. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Posted December 11, 2016 Report Share Posted December 11, 2016 which is TT voted = accurate representation of a player? Don't be a lawyer then. Here we go again, If you mean what I think you mean the TT motm is indeed a good representation, if not of a player it definately is of the members who choose to vote. If you search the motm forum you will see that in some cases even though the motm might have won it easily, there are sometimes 5-6 and even 7 other players who receive votes but nobody votes for Williams. Â I think this is a good representation of the TT voters who thinks that he doesn't play well enough to get a vote. On regular occasions the total amount of voters goes over the 30/40 mark, if you multiply that by the amount of games he's played the total is over 500 voters so I say again Not a single vote from 500 voters is a good representation of him not being very good. Â Others can be of the opinion that he is a decent player, that's fair enough but it's my opinion that he isn't, and I think the figures go a long way to making that very clear. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted December 11, 2016 Report Share Posted December 11, 2016 I rarely if ever vote for a defender... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shukes Posted December 12, 2016 Report Share Posted December 12, 2016 To be fair I have looked through the comments and at the start Williams seems to have a lot of mentions if not votes. He seems to get credit a lot through the match day threads to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markjazzbassist Posted December 12, 2016 Report Share Posted December 12, 2016 everyone goes through bad runs of form, no reason to write him off yet when he was outstanding for Swansea and Wales. Not to mention we have some real dross on the field that doesn't help him. He needs a better CB partner than Jags or Mori. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shy_Talk Posted December 12, 2016 Report Share Posted December 12, 2016 He'd have to be Atlas to be able to single handedly shoulder all the pressure the rest of the side cant cope with. Couple that with the possibility every player can have a bad day and suddenly when one of (or both) our two CB's are off the pace of a game the never ending cycle of aerial pressure cannot be fought off. Â Been a baptism of fire for Williams and no ones called the fire brigade yet. Sibdane and Matt 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cornish Steve Posted December 13, 2016 Report Share Posted December 13, 2016 He has become disillusioned like the rest of them. He signed initially full of positivity. I have a theory about this, because he is a good player. I'm guessing that Koeman is micromanaging some players, dictating how they play based on his own playing years. They diligently follow instruction despite knowing it overlooks or even contradicts their strengths. A few weeks of that, and a player would lose all motivation. I mentioned this phenomenon over the weekend regarding McCarthy. Only when he returned to a role he knows and loves did he perform. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romey 1878 Posted December 13, 2016 Report Share Posted December 13, 2016 I have a theory about this, because he is a good player. I'm guessing that Koeman is micromanaging some players, dictating how they play based on his own playing years. They diligently follow instruction despite knowing it overlooks or even contradicts their strengths. A few weeks of that, and a player would lose all motivation. I mentioned this phenomenon over the weekend regarding McCarthy. Only when he returned to a role he knows and loves did he perform. Â What do you think he's been telling Williams to do that's so different that has made him incapable of winning a header? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cornish Steve Posted December 13, 2016 Report Share Posted December 13, 2016 Â What do you think he's been telling Williams to do that's so different that has made him incapable of winning a header? Â It's one thing to be weak in an area; it's something else to not really try. The latter is about motivation, and that's what I'm beginning to see is lacking. Matt 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romey 1878 Posted December 13, 2016 Report Share Posted December 13, 2016 It's one thing to be weak in an area; it's something else to not really try. The latter is about motivation, and that's what I'm beginning to see is lacking. If it's about effort and trying then I'll be happy when we get shut of Williams. Sibdane 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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