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Matt

Cuco Martina

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Good going forward, but I'm not sure I've ever seen a defender give less of a shit about defending than him. A ball could be 5 yards away from him and I wouldn't feel confident he'd bother going towards it.

Glad you said that , I thought defensively he was absolutely shite. I was breaking out in a cold sweat thinking about how he will get on in our next run of games

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Glad you said that , I thought defensively he was absolutely shite. I was breaking out in a cold sweat thinking about how he will get on in our next run of games

Sane (or whichever other pacy winger they go with) is going to absolutely destroy him on Monday. Whoever plays RM for us better be prepared to help out.

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Sane (or whichever other pacy winger they go with) is going to absolutely destroy him on Monday. Whoever plays RM for us better be prepared to help out.

I'm just hoping Koeman plays Holgate, knowing that we'll be on the back foot for most of this game.

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I'm just hoping Koeman plays Holgate, knowing that we'll be on the back foot for most of this game.

Would be a nice tactical option, bring in Holgate to sure up defence when required (I think Holgate's defensive positioning is poor at times, much like Stones was when playing for Everton, looses his player or gets pulled out of shape).

 

Martina currently seems to be trusted to be used as an aggresive attacking outlet. He must have attempted around 10 crosses tonight.

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Sane (or whichever other pacy winger they go with) is going to absolutely destroy him on Monday. Whoever plays RM for us better be prepared to help out.

I don't think the winger needs to be pacy, they could just walk past him. They could play Summerbee(Nicky or Mike) on Monday and they would destroy him. I don't think I've ever seen a fullback so easily beaten

All the Southampton fans I know laughed when we signed him and I'm starting to see why

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I think you are being way to hard on him. Does he need to improve defensivly? Yes and by a lot! But he did look like a good player going forward and i think Koeman signed him thinking we would use three CBs and 2 wingbacks.

 

Was Cafu a great defender? (And im not saying that Martina is as good)

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I think you are being way to hard on him. Does he need to improve defensivly? Yes and by a lot! But he did look like a good player going forward and i think Koeman signed him thinking we would use three CBs and 2 wingbacks.

 

Was Cafu a great defender? (And im not saying that Martina is as good)

 

Did Cafu at least make an effort to defend?

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I'm holding off on the criticism - I've seen him improve and that is what I want to see. He's nowhere near as bad as he is being made out to be.

 

I'm pretty sure if he cost a few bob and had a reputable name he wouldn't be getting so much stick.... his crossing and passing is pretty good.

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I'm holding off on the criticism - I've seen him improve and that is what I want to see. He's nowhere near as bad as he is being made out to be.

 

I'm pretty sure if he cost a few bob and had a reputable name he wouldn't be getting so much stick.... his crossing and passing is pretty good.

 

I'm not doubting his attacking play, Haf, that is improving with each game, but his defending is horrendous.

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I'm holding off on the criticism - I've seen him improve and that is what I want to see. He's nowhere near as bad as he is being made out to be.

 

I'm pretty sure if he cost a few bob and had a reputable name he wouldn't be getting so much stick.... his crossing and passing is pretty good.

 

that's where i'm at too. he was free, he is a backup and stand-in. for that he is well worth the wages, great crossing. once seamus is healthy we won't see him again but maybe the cups. when we sign a player on a free i don't expect to get Lahm like quality at RB, i expect an ok player.

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Hes cover and clearly better as a RWB with a back 3 than a proper RB.

 

Would rather Holgate got time if we're playing a back 4 though

 

My sentiment as well. As a wing-back he is fine; the less defending he has to do the better.

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He was better than Lookman who really struggled to get into the game. I'd happily play him right mid in front of Holgate against City.

 

He needs a voice next to him to coach him through his defensive duties. Is Coleman fit enough to run up and down the sidelines telling him what to do?

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I'm holding off on the criticism - I've seen him improve and that is what I want to see. He's nowhere near as bad as he is being made out to be.

 

I'm pretty sure if he cost a few bob and had a reputable name he wouldn't be getting so much stick.... his crossing and passing is pretty good.

His fee has fuck all to do with it, after all the guy he is filling in for only cost £60k and most people love him

The issue is he can't defend and doesn't look as though he gives a shit about that fact

I admit part of my frustration isn't just that he is crap , it's the fact he is blocking the progression of Kenny and Holgate. At Coco's age he isn't suddenly going to switch on and develop the defensive side of his game. He is at his peek now and it's nowhere near good enough

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His fee has fuck all to do with it, after all the guy he is filling in for only cost £60k and most people love him

The issue is he can't defend and doesn't look as though he gives a shit about that fact

I admit part of my frustration isn't just that he is crap , it's the fact he is blocking the progression of Kenny and Holgate. At Coco's age he isn't suddenly going to switch on and develop the defensive side of his game. He is at his peek now and it's nowhere near good enough

Solid post.

It's the effort to get back and help his teammates that I struggle with. He isn't that bad when a player try's to run past him.

It's just if the player gets past him.... it becomes an ... oh well, someone else can deal with it now, I wonder if there are any Marathon bars left in the chocky machine?

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His fee has fuck all to do with it, after all the guy he is filling in for only cost £60k and most people love him

The issue is he can't defend and doesn't look as though he gives a shit about that fact

I admit part of my frustration isn't just that he is crap , it's the fact he is blocking the progression of Kenny and Holgate. At Coco's age he isn't suddenly going to switch on and develop the defensive side of his game. He is at his peek now and it's nowhere near good enough

 

blocking their progression? if they are so good they would play ahead of him. Barkley played ahead of Mirallas many times last season, Holgate ahead of Jags and Mori, etc. People act like we need to roll out the red carpet for poor old kenny, he's been shafted. fuck that. if the lad's any good he will take his place in the lineup by storming the keep and showing everyone how good he is. he hasn't. mediocre at best in preseason.

 

not sure why everyone worships the ground kenny walks on, he was playing against 23 year old most of who will never see a first team in any top league.

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Calm down Mark! You don't half go on the verbal sometimes!!!

 

sorry dunc i did go a bit nasty there. i just don't know why everyone has to protect little kenny, he's a man, he can win his own spot. martina isn't great, so it's not like it wouldn't take much to win the spot.

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sorry dunc i did go a bit nasty there. i just don't know why everyone has to protect little kenny, he's a man, he can win his own spot. martina isn't great, so it's not like it wouldn't take much to win the spot.

Peeps just want to give the young ones a chance. I'm the same. I've always been against bringing in cheapo's to fill a gap as I believe a youngun should be given the chance.

 

However, I do understand the flip side that the manager and coaching staff work with these guys daily so you have to take their view on it.

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sorry dunc i did go a bit nasty there. i just don't know why everyone has to protect little kenny, he's a man, he can win his own spot. martina isn't great, so it's not like it wouldn't take much to win the spot.

i would simply rather give minutes to Kenny or Holgate to aid theiir development than watch people stroll past Coco

I'm not one for playing youngsters for thr sake of it but neither can be any worse than Martina

I like the look of Kenny but it's clear he has no future here but Koeman does seem to rate Holgate so it's baffling that he isn't getting the nod ahead of Coco

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i would simply rather give minutes to Kenny or Holgate to aid theiir development than watch people stroll past Coco

I'm not one for playing youngsters for thr sake of it but neither can be any worse than Martina

I like the look of Kenny but it's clear he has no future here but Koeman does seem to rate Holgate so it's baffling that he isn't getting the nod ahead of Coco

Koeman prefers to stand by his signings it seems, even if it's clear to see that what was already here would seem better.

Am I the only one who's noticed that, or am I miss reading some of his decisions.

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His fee has fuck all to do with it, after all the guy he is filling in for only cost £60k and most people love him

The issue is he can't defend and doesn't look as though he gives a shit about that fact

I admit part of my frustration isn't just that he is crap , it's the fact he is blocking the progression of Kenny and Holgate. At Coco's age he isn't suddenly going to switch on and develop the defensive side of his game. He is at his peek now and it's nowhere near good enough

Spot on.

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Koeman prefers to stand by his signings it seems, even if it's clear to see that what was already here would seem better.

Am I the only one who's noticed that, or am I miss reading some of his decisions.

Stek over Joel was a poor one. Joel was pulled a lot easier as well.

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Koeman prefers to stand by his signings it seems, even if it's clear to see that what was already here would seem better.

Am I the only one who's noticed that, or am I miss reading some of his decisions.

Yeah this is the main thing don't like about him so far. For whatever reason he seems to have a couple long-term favorites who he brings from club to club who aren't worth their weight, and he stands by them with an almost defensive religiosity. It almost surprises me that Stekelenburg isn't starting in front of Pickford.

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Yeah this is the main thing don't like about him so far. For whatever reason he seems to have a couple long-term favorites who he brings from club to club who aren't worth their weight, and he stands by them with an almost defensive religiosity. It almost surprises me that Stekelenburg isn't starting in front of Pickford.

That's the thing though. Who's his favorites now? Martina will be benched immediately once Seamus is fit. Not even a question. So he's not a favorite. Stek has been benched. Schneiderlin? He's earned his place. So who then?

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That's the thing though. Who's his favorites now? Martina will be benched immediately once Seamus is fit. Not even a question. So he's not a favorite. Stek has been benched. Schneiderlin? He's earned his place. So who then?

Stek last year over Robles and Martina this year over Holgate/Kenny. And as much as I think Schneiderlin was a good buy and has done very well for us, he's the last person in that midfield that would be dropped, and I personally think Gana is more valuable and Davies is approaching Morgan's value.

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Jeckyl and Hyde.

 

Going forward he is great - although not in a 442 as he runs into the spaces a winger looks to get into.

 

Defensively he is very weak and has been mentioned played teammates into trouble, and his positioning is terrible.

Works best as a wing back in a 5 man defense.

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Stek last year over Robles and Martina this year over Holgate/Kenny. And as much as I think Schneiderlin was a good buy and has done very well for us, he's the last person in that midfield that would be dropped, and I personally think Gana is more valuable and Davies is approaching Morgan's value.

 

I'll give him more leeway with keepers as they typically aren't changed regularly like outfield players. Kenny has had 1 PL appearance from memory, and when he has played in pre-season hasn't been a significant step above anyone. Kenny needs games, but he'll be bought in like the other young players. Davies and DCL weren't starting every game when they came from the U23's either. Holgate started against City and I think Koeman will pick based on the RB role he wants - attacking with Martina or defensive with Holgate.

 

Koeman has his faults, but picking his favourites hasn't been as bad as the last couple of managers we've had.

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He cant defend for shit and he is suppose to be a defender. If he cant defend then he should not be in that team, yeah he can cross the ball but that's his second duty, his first is to defend which he struggled with against a team of no marks. The sooner Kenny gets his chance the better.

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I'd be interested to see him getting a chance at the winger position. He's a great crosser but lackadaisical when it comes to defending. I wonder why he's been playing there (what I assume) for his entire career.

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Bandwagon alert!

 

Critisiced him loads is far.

But have to admit he did a job last night. One particular moment in our area where he blocked the first shot and then made a tackle on the rebound. Blocked a couple of shots as I remember.

Got taken down the outside on a couple of occasions, but all fullbacks suffer that.

Good at attacking, not many critisice him for that and rightly so.

But his defending is better than average as well.

 

Again we have to bow down to the professionals on this one. Divided opinions are one thing.... but trained coaches and high paid managers rate him.... and last night he proved me wrong... for now.

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26 minutes ago, patto said:

Poor old Martina he's taking some stick on here I like holgate but every time we get on the attack he couldn't cross the ball martina can give the lad some support. 

Holgate can cross, just not as well as Coco, it was Holgate and DCL who set up Rooney against Man City. Coco is just too poor defensively. 

We tried the "Well score one more than you" under Martinez and it didn't work so well.

Coco would work well in a back 5 but in a back 4 he is a liability. 

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8 minutes ago, Romey 1878 said:

With every fibre of my being I hope he never pulls on an Everton shirt again. A wank stain wouldn't like to be called Cuco Martina. 

Done giving him a chance. Culpable for the second goal and didn't bother closing down before the cross for the third. 

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I'm perplexed by the situation . How has Koeman not known how shit he is after he's managed him at 3 different clubs? 

Didn't watch him in Holland but he has always been shite every time I've seen him for Southampton. How has he managed to move to a club supposedly on the rise??

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3 minutes ago, Lowensda said:

I'm perplexed by the situation . How has Koeman not known how shit he is after he's managed him at 3 different clubs? 

Didn't watch him in Holland but he has always been shite every time I've seen him for Southampton. How has he managed to move to a club supposedly on the rise??

Clearly he likes him. How else can you explain why he started today and why he was not substituted?

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32 minutes ago, Romey 1878 said:

With every fibre of my being I hope he never pulls on an Everton shirt again. A wank stain wouldn't like to be called Cuco Martina. 

How many times did he leave there left back today- he was sucked in constantly- I know we were over run by Erikksen at times but fuck me, he was miles out of position all game, his feeble swing of the leg for their second I thought my pulmonary artery was going to explode. 

 

He is shit- I honestly thought he's fill in for the odd game and do a Hibbert- nothing spectacular but do a job. My fucking od was I wrong.

 

he cannot play another competative game for us.

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9 minutes ago, Paddock said:

...I honestly thought he's fill in for the odd game and do a Hibbert- nothing spectacular but do a job. My fucking od was I wrong.

I totally agree and said as much before the game.

3 hours ago, Cornish Steve said:

Martina starting is a big mistake... When Martina was brought in, I assumed it was for backup, not for a starting position.

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19 minutes ago, EFC-Paul said:

Shockingly shit player tbh 

I'd love to see training ground footage of him and Niasse going up against each other it'll be like Richard Prior bumping into Gene Wilder in Hear no evil see no evil 

 

Holy shit that was funny! LOL over here. 

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If we're going to struggle to score, and we are, we need to keep clean sheets, I just can't see it happening with this bloke.

Holgate can defend, if not him let's give Kenny the opportunity to show what he can do.

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