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Matt

Cuco Martina

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13 hours ago, c1982 said:

I think Holgate will start vs Atalanta and possibly Man U then Kenny will get a chance vs Sunderland (with Martina at left back). Hopefully Kenny (or Holgate) will stake a claim and get a decent run of games.

I hope you mean left back at home. Him anywhere near our team is a fucking nightmare.

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He was hung out to dry yesterday, no one in front of him so kept getting doubled up on. He had no support from Gana who keeps getting on the wrong side of his man (really don't see how this hasn't been addressed when they rewatch the games) or Keane who is bang average with the only thing he is 'better' than Holgate at is being tall. 

Not saying he isn't shite, just the problem is much bigger than him. 

 

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I actually envy those that can't go the game and get to watch it on tv, or through streams, because seeing what this clown does off the ball is frightening. I kept saying to the fella next to me "what's he doing?" "where's he going?" :lol:

Again though, it's more about his effort than a lack of ability that really gets up my nose. I've watched him so many times give up on balls that are stupidly close to him only to let the opposition player have it instead. That sort of thing is unforgivable.  

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15 minutes ago, Romey 1878 said:

I actually envy those that can't go the game and get to watch it on tv, or through streams, because seeing what this clown does off the ball is frightening. I kept saying to the fella next to me "what's he doing?" "where's he going?" :lol:

Again though, it's more about his effort than a lack of ability that really gets up my nose. I've watched him so many times give up on balls that are stupidly close to him only to let the opposition player have it instead. That sort of thing is unforgivable.  

Maybe this is what we're not seeing. On TV he looked one of our better players. When he is on the ball he is pretty solid. He also stopped an easy goal and blocked another good effort.

what we don't see on TV is exactly what your seeing off the ball.

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19 minutes ago, Romey 1878 said:

I actually envy those that can't go the game and get to watch it on tv, or through streams, because seeing what this clown does off the ball is frightening. I kept saying to the fella next to me "what's he doing?" "where's he going?" :lol:

Again though, it's more about his effort than a lack of ability that really gets up my nose. I've watched him so many times give up on balls that are stupidly close to him only to let the opposition player have it instead. That sort of thing is unforgivable.  

I'm glad I'm not the only one who saw this- the fella behind me kept saying he was being hung out to dry when time and time again there was only Ali in our box (Kane) over by the right corner flag and he kept wandering off and half marking Ali when Keane had him and Baines and Williams were dealing with Kane leaving their full back literally 30 yards of space every time. I was thinking maybe he's told him to double up on Ali but he was just standing in no mans land- not marking Ali or Erikssen and the left full back was like he was playing on his own- it was fucking shocking. 

 

I'm still shocked today.

 

 

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42 minutes ago, Paddock said:

I'm glad I'm not the only one who saw this- the fella behind me kept saying he was being hung out to dry when time and time again there was only Ali in our box (Kane) over by the right corner flag and he kept wandering off and half marking Ali when Keane had him and Baines and Williams were dealing with Kane leaving their full back literally 30 yards of space every time. I was thinking maybe he's told him to double up on Ali but he was just standing in no mans land- not marking Ali or Erikssen and the left full back was like he was playing on his own- it was fucking shocking. 

 

I'm still shocked today.

 

 

He kept passing the Spurs player onto our CB's but then proceeded to follow that player, abandoning Davies. I thought I was going to have an aneurysm :lol: 

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45 minutes ago, Shukes said:

Maybe this is what we're not seeing. On TV he looked one of our better players. When he is on the ball he is pretty solid. He also stopped an easy goal and blocked another good effort.

what we don't see on TV is exactly what your seeing off the ball.

On the ball he's alright, but defensively... he will be the end of me!

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1 hour ago, Shukes said:

Maybe this is what we're not seeing. On TV he looked one of our better players. When he is on the ball he is pretty solid. He also stopped an easy goal and blocked another good effort.

what we don't see on TV is exactly what your seeing off the ball.

It's on TV as well Shukes, he looked just as shite then. Waltzing around, just no engagement from him. If you just watched him in isolation on TV you might think different, but when you look at the gaps he leaves, his lack of commitment to the tackle, his general attitude to defending he shouldn't be anywhere near the side. Niasse is a better striker than Martina is a right back... well it's at least very close!

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41 minutes ago, Romey 1878 said:

He kept passing the Spurs player onto our CB's but then proceeded to follow that player, abandoning Davies. I thought I was going to have an aneurysm :lol: 

I wanted to strangle the fella behind me (stranger off stubhub I think) he kept saying "he's playing well e's being left 2 on 1 because we don't have a right midfielder" Erikksen ran our midfield 2 ragged granted but Martina was marking nobody all fucking game he just stood there wide eyed and kept drifting towards the cb position. Davies must have thought it was Christmas.

 

my 8 year old said "Dad Martina is crap isn't he- who's he supposed to be marking and why has their left back got so much space- he's 8!!

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He puts a lovely cross in but unfortunately we often don't have anyone in the box to aim at.

Defenesively, he's very poor (to be polite). His positioning is hopeless, he's a ball watcher and not very brave. You can see his teammates have no trust in him whatsoever.

Hands up, I thought this would be a shrewd signing providing back-up to Kenny in Coleman's absence. I do think Kenny will have a part to play very soon with him not being sent out on loan. If he's not in Koeman's plans then surely a 1 year deal for Sagna until Coleman is back would have been a wiser move...

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Poor in defence not bad going forward. Williams is a much bigger problem than this lad at the moment. 

Not for me, while Williams has been poor Coco has been a complete liability. He is a black Marc Hottiger !

Kenny is bang on form at the moment so god only knows what he must be thinking watching this clown being picked ahead of him


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I think a big reason the defense is poor is that Coco undermines their confidence when he plays. Its like they know (like the rest of us) that he is going to get caught out defensively in one of his many Don Quixote like charges forwards. I think Williams is having a poor start too, but, as someone as said he is a 6/7 out of ten player out of 10 every week, so far this season he has been mostly a 6/10 but he will get better.

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3 hours ago, duncanmckenzieismagic said:


Not for me, while Williams has been poor Coco has been a complete liability. He is a black Marc Hottiger !

Kenny is bang on form at the moment so god only knows what he must be thinking watching this clown being picked ahead of him

 

Fair enough. I agree Kenny should get a chance. However Williams was absolutely shocking on Saturday. He looks like a fraud 

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2 hours ago, London Blue said:

I think a big reason the defense is poor is that Coco undermines their confidence when he plays. Its like they know (like the rest of us) that he is going to get caught out defensively in one of his many Don Quixote like charges forwards. I think Williams is having a poor start too, but, as someone as said he is a 6/7 out of ten player out of 10 every week, so far this season he has been mostly a 6/10 but he will get better.

He was a 2/10 Saturday absolutely shocking

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1 hour ago, MC11 said:

Fair enough. I agree Kenny should get a chance. However Williams was absolutely shocking on Saturday. He looks like a fraud 

When watching Williams on Saturday, I thought back to souness being had off with that George weah cousin thing. He would have looked out of sorts in a Sunday league game from what I seen on Saturday. Looks overweight and played like he'd been on the piss the night before.

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9 hours ago, yamar said:

When watching Williams on Saturday, I thought back to souness being had off with that George weah cousin thing. He would have looked out of sorts in a Sunday league game from what I seen on Saturday. Looks overweight and played like he'd been on the piss the night before.

It's not even comparable to the George Weah cousin thing- he's not been great but he's a solid prem player.

how can you even compare the two?

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4 hours ago, Paddock said:

It's not even comparable to the George Weah cousin thing- he's not been great but he's a solid prem player.

how can you even compare the two?

Because he didn't look like footballer on the pitch.

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1 hour ago, yamar said:

Because he didn't look like footballer on the pitch.

Williams does and has looked like a footballer though Brett- there is zero comparison in Ashley Williams and that kid pretending to be Wears cousin.

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37 minutes ago, Aidan Lewis said:

As far as bad performances go, I've seen a lot worse from a lot of players this season.

He wasn't even the worst on the pitch tonight.

Plus he was played out of position.

You sound like you have played football or at least know something about the game.

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10 minutes ago, duncanmckenzieismagic said:


That was the exact question everyone sitting by me was asking, he is an unbelievably shite RB , but an even worse LB

 

The crazy thing is that it was set up for him to cross it with his right foot! There was absolutely no reason for him to hesitate. 

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The crazy thing is that it was set up for him to cross it with his right foot! There was absolutely no reason for him to hesitate. 

To be fair Sandro didn’t help in that respect but it was a proper keystone cops moment . Completely killed the game as well , the ground was bouncing and it looked liked we had them rattled,really thought we would have gone on to win it at that point


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Koeman (or his successor) must not play Martina at LB ever again.  Hope Garbutt continues to improve and can be the backup second half of season.

Until then, Baines will have to play almost every match.  Whenever we have a crowded schedule and Baines absolutely must be rested, we have no good, logical replacement.  Rather than Martina or Holgate, I’d prefer Davies or Besic.  Or when Baines must rest, go 3 at the back.

 

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6 hours ago, Elston Gunnn said:

Koeman (or his successor) must not play Martina at LB ever again.  Hope Garbutt continues to improve and can be the backup second half of season.

Until then, Baines will have to play almost every match.  Whenever we have a crowded schedule and Baines absolutely must be rested, we have no good, logical replacement.  Rather than Martina or Holgate, I’d prefer Davies or Besic.  Or when Baines must rest, go 3 at the back.

 

We have Galloway on loan at Sunderland. Why? He did a solid job covering for Baines before. Again, Koeman's judgement of players 

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8 hours ago, duncanmckenzieismagic said:


I know a few Sunderland fans and to say they are underwhelmed with him is an understatement

 

Worse than Martina? Don't remember him ever doing anything wrong for us

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24 minutes ago, nogs said:

Worse than Martina? Don't remember him ever doing anything wrong for us

Just wasn't very good at the attacking part. Bit like Holgate covering for Seamus, a young, inexperienced CB playing in an attacking FB position and replacing one of the best around in that position. 

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12 hours ago, Matt said:

Just wasn't very good at the attacking part. Bit like Holgate covering for Seamus, a young, inexperienced CB playing in an attacking FB position and replacing one of the best around in that position. 

He was well and truly found out defensively as well, which had been his saving grace.

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