Expectations for our Offensive Prowess

[CobblestoneBoulevard]

While we are only four matches into League Season, our last three matches have provided a rather toothless offensive front. I, for one, am a patient fan, but am at a loss for which idea/concept best suits the adjustments necessary to continue considering our stake as a club looking to break into the top six. 

I forsee a number of plausible options, but our vast collective knowledge may yield a truly better choice. 

Personally, Koeman should be considering a two-striker front with wingbacks as wide options/cover and a midfield three (two Def, One Off or Def, B-to-B, Off). Sandro, DCL, Rooney, Lookman, even Naisse are all better played within a front duo rather than as a lone CF imo. Baines and Holgate/Kenny (lord behold his much welcomed first team inclusion) would service our wide options (boy are we missing Coleman right now). Schneiderlin, Gana, Klassen, Davies, and a centralized Siggy would serve well as a cyclic midfield three with much more appropriate offensive options ahead of them. 

All in all, does a change need to be enacted and if so, is there a better option than the one suggested above? 

 

[pete0]

If Rooney plays he should be instructed to sit on the shoulder of their defence. He's not as pacey anymore but his movement is clever enough to get him the extra yard of space. Against the bottom half teams I'd like us to try the old 442 diamond of the 90's.

_________Pickford 

Davies Holgate Keane Baines 

__________Besic

Vlasic_____________Sigurdssen 

________Klaassen 

________DCL Rooney 

When Baines goes forward Besic to drop into lb as we concede a lot of goals down the left, and Davies to come into midfield and give us more of a chance of keeping possession or creating going forward. Leaves the RB position exposed however its rare to lose the ball then get caught out by a cross field pass compared to how often we get caught when Baines is scurrying back into position. 

[Cornish Steve]

In the absence of an obvious front man, I'd like to see Sandro and DC-L play together for a few games and see how that develops.

[Sibdane]

Likewise. Sandro has the footwork to create but he needs an outlet. He's also not made for the lone striker role. I think it could be a very formidable partnership.

[markjazzbassist]

bench rooney.  play DCL Sandro and Gylfi as the front 3.

[Newty82]

So far in the league, we've scored 2 goals.

DCL has 2 assists. Rooney 2 goals.

Is the answer there?

[barryj]

I read somewhere we've had the least shots this season thus far. Not surprised by that. 

[Shukes]

Just now, barryj said:

I read somewhere we've had the least shots this season thus far. Not surprised by that. 

Don't think that's true, our players look like they been lining up the shots for nights on end before a match.

[Newty82]

7 minutes ago, barryj said:

I read somewhere we've had the least shots this season thus far. Not surprised by that. 

Nope. But not far off!

The final 3rd is our big problem so far.

[Bailey]

17 minutes ago, Newty82 said:

Nope. But not far off!

The final 3rd is our big problem so far.

I couldn't tell you an area that isn't a problem at the moment!  

[MC11]

The main problem area is Koemans head.

[pete0]

11 minutes ago, Bailey said:

I couldn't tell you an area that isn't a problem at the moment!  

The bench..it's the strongest part of the team. 

[London Blue]

4 hours ago, Cornish Steve said:

In the absence of an obvious front man, I'd like to see Sandro and DC-L play together for a few games and see how that develops.

This.

Sandro and DCL could make a very effective strike force.

[London Blue]

                    Pickford

Holgate     Keane     Williams     Baines

Davies        Schniederlin     Gana

                     Klaassen

        DCL                         Sandro

[CobblestoneBoulevard]

53 minutes ago, MC11 said:

The main problem area is Koemans head.

Koeman is not dumb though so I'm not entirely sold on that being our focused argument. His style of play calls for a CF and I do believe these top-six matches are merely highlighting the ineffective nature of lining up in such a manner. 

We were well-off in preseason, held our own against Stoke, and somewhat handled our Europa playoff matches with ease; all incorporating a CF style offensive front. 

Its when we need to drop our "wide" players a bit deeper against heavy-hitting offensive units like MC, Chelsea, and Tot that lacking an out-and-out CF really presents itself as an issue. A two-striker set-up may give us a little more bite up too without sacrificing too much defensive coverage. If anything, at least holding possession for longer periods of play against powerhouse squads would eliminate a fraction of pressure placed on our CMs and Back Line! 

 

[Guest]

I'd like to see DCL and Sandro up top together, working on a partnership. Both can interchange, pace, power, and at least one can hit the target.

[CobblestoneBoulevard]

9 minutes ago, London Blue said:

                    Pickford

Holgate     Keane     Williams     Baines

Davies        Schniederlin     Gana

                     Klaassen

        DCL                         Sandro

Creative, but maybe misplaced a bit as Davies and Gana are not true wingers. they both are known for positional awareness mistakes as well and this aspect of their gameplay may call into concerns regarding a well-organized midfield. I'd rather have an issue in the attacking third than the middle third of the pitch! 

See what you can come up with that would make use of our naturally gifted wide players (Baines, Kenny, Lookman, Mirallas, Vlasic, Siggy maybe) without pulling centered players just because we love them on the pitch.

I mean who wouldn't want to put Gana and Davies in EVERY line-up though?!? Haha This is the conundrum though, maybe our best XI doesn't always include their presence. 

[London Blue]

Just now, CobblestoneBoulevard said:

Creative, but maybe misplaced a bit as Davies and Gana are not true wingers. they both are known for positional awareness mistakes as well and this aspect of their gameplay may call into concerns regarding a well-organized midfield. I'd rather have an issue in the attacking third than the middle third of the pitch! 

See what you can come up with that would make use of our naturally gifted wide players (Baines, Kenny, Lookman, Mirallas, Vlasic, Siggy maybe) without pulling centered players just because we love them on the pitch.

I mean who wouldn't want to put Gana and Davies in EVERY line-up though?!? Haha This is the conundrum though, maybe our best XI doesn't always include their presence. 

I haven't played them as wingers, more as central midfielders with Davies getting forward as a box to box players. The width comes from Holgate and Baines.

I agree we have players who can use width better like Lookman and Siggy and I would swap Gana or Morgan for Siggy in games where we are not going to be under the kosh.

Problem is we still don't know what are best side or formation is! 

[Bailey]

15 minutes ago, CobblestoneBoulevard said:

Koeman is not dumb though so I'm not entirely sold on that being our focused argument. His style of play calls for a CF and I do believe these top-six matches are merely highlighting the ineffective nature of lining up in such a manner. 

We were well-off in preseason, held our own against Stoke, and somewhat handled our Europa playoff matches with ease; all incorporating a CF style offensive front. 

Its when we need to drop our "wide" players a bit deeper against heavy-hitting offensive units like MC, Chelsea, and Tot that lacking an out-and-out CF really presents itself as an issue. A two-striker set-up may give us a little more bite up too without sacrificing too much defensive coverage. If anything, at least holding possession for longer periods of play against powerhouse squads would eliminate a fraction of pressure placed on our CMs and Back Line! 

 

It was the same last season with a CF. A striker can only do so much without support. The way he wants us to play at the moment requires us to be on the front foot. When we are it's fine but when we aren't we have no control on the game and get pinned back.

[Newty82]

21 minutes ago, yamar said:

I'd like to see DCL and Sandro up top together, working on a partnership. Both can interchange, pace, power, and at least one can hit the target.

Problem is, at the moment, neither of them can hit the target. Sandro has 0 shots on target from 5, and DCL has 33% on target from 8.

Rooney has 60% on target, and 2 goals.

So as there seems to be a lot of, let's say knee jerk, comments out there about the 'today', then surely Rooney has to play a role up top? Somewhere. Somehow.

How can it be that it is said Koeman doesn't know what he's doing etc, so the solution is to drop the one man who can get shots off and score goals?!

For the future, Sandro and DCL have a huge role to play (hopefully). For the present, you can't doubt that Rooney has been playing with more will than most.

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, Newty82 said:

Problem is, at the moment, neither of them can hit the target. Sandro has 0 shots on target from 5, and DCL has 33% on target from 8.

Rooney has 60% on target, and 2 goals.

So as there seems to be a lot of, let's say knee jerk, comments out there about the 'today', then surely Rooney has to play a role up top? Somewhere. Somehow.

How can it be that it is said Koeman doesn't know what he's doing etc, so the solution is to drop the one man who can get shots off and score goals?!

For the future, Sandro and DCL have a huge role to play (hopefully). For the present, you can't doubt that Rooney has been playing with more will than most.

Rooney is a liability in the 3 attacking mid roles. He has no movement and latches onto the nearest everton player demanding the ball to play a killer pass. Those three should be interchanging for 90 mins, making openings for other players.

[MikeO]

4 minutes ago, Newty82 said:

DCL has 33% on target from 8.

That's a mathematical impossibility, sorry; means he has 2.64 shots on target.

[Newty82]

6 minutes ago, yamar said:

Rooney is a liability in the 3 attacking mid roles. He has no movement and latches onto the nearest everton player demanding the ball to play a killer pass. Those three should be interchanging for 90 mins, making openings for other players.

Then for the purpose of this thread, don't play him in there. Put him up just behind DCL.

There you have the assister and scorer playing together. The master and the pupil.

Easy this footy shit. When is Footy Manager 18 out? I'm ready to come out of retirement.

[Guest]

1 minute ago, Newty82 said:

Then for the purpose of this thread, don't play him in there. Put him up just behind DCL.

There you have the assister and scorer playing together. The master and the pupil.

Easy this footy shit. When is Footy Manager 18 out? I'm ready to come out of retirement.

Haha

[Newty82]

6 minutes ago, MikeO said:

That's a mathematical impossibility, sorry; means he has 2.64 shots on target.

It's averaged out over his games? And the 33% won't be bang on 33%?

Nah...your right. No idea how that's worked out.

Point is still valid though, even if the sums are a bit off.

[CobblestoneBoulevard]

49 minutes ago, London Blue said:

I haven't played them as wingers, more as central midfielders with Davies getting forward as a box to box players. The width comes from Holgate and Baines.

I agree we have players who can use width better like Lookman and Siggy and I would swap Gana or Morgan for Siggy in games where we are not going to be under the kosh.

Problem is we still don't know what are best side or formation is! 

Right on, I'm glad you don't see them as wingers either! 

Using Baines and Holgate as our only wide players leaves us with the main issue witnessed in the Tot match though. Any opppsing squad with offensive-minded fullbacks can overload the wings. Either one/two of our center players gets inappropriately drawn out into a wide position and opening up room for a creative CAM (Dele Alli) in the center of our defensive third or we sit center and fight off crosses all match hoping Any decent CF such as Kane doesn't get his beautifully gifted feat on the end of one of them. Either way, we are in trouble against any high-quality opponent with a four-back and no additional wide coverage. 

We don't possess the offensive talent to play with a front three that would provide wide def coverage and still fully support our CF options. That leaves us considering a back three/five and, as such, now Davies and Gana are areguably rather unlikely to both make the starting XI. 

True claim to wrap that up though, hence all of us wantabe managers confidently throwing the next greatest line-up around like chimps throw shite! 

[pete0]

36 minutes ago, yamar said:

Rooney is a liability in the 3 attacking mid roles. He has no movement and latches onto the nearest everton player demanding the ball to play a killer pass. Those three should be interchanging for 90 mins, making openings for other players.

That's why he should be the man up top to score the chances. 

[Cornish Steve]

2 hours ago, London Blue said:

                    Pickford

Holgate     Keane     Williams     Baines

Davies        Schniederlin     Gana

                     Klaassen

        DCL                         Sandro

I'd make a small number of changes, bringing in more youth and placing more emphasis up front.

                  Pickford

Kenny       Keane     Holgate       Baines

            Davies        Schniederlin

                    Sigurdsson

   Vlasic           DC-L              Sandro

 

Then again, I've always been a bit of a risk-taker and someone who'd prefer to go for broke.

[Cornish Steve]

2 hours ago, Newty82 said:

Problem is, at the moment, neither of them can hit the target. Sandro has 0 shots on target from 5, and DCL has 33% on target from 8.

Rooney has 60% on target, and 2 goals.

So as there seems to be a lot of, let's say knee jerk, comments out there about the 'today', then surely Rooney has to play a role up top? Somewhere. Somehow.

How can it be that it is said Koeman doesn't know what he's doing etc, so the solution is to drop the one man who can get shots off and score goals?!

For the future, Sandro and DCL have a huge role to play (hopefully). For the present, you can't doubt that Rooney has been playing with more will than most.

33% of 8 is 2-2/3. What does 2/3 a shot look like?

PS - I see Mike already asked that question!

[barryj]

Maybe when the shot is so bad the statistician isn't sure whether it's a shot, pass or cross. ?