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Richarlison

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The stuff about sweating blood for the club and putting his life on the line ticks a lot of Toffees fans boxes. 😊 We need a lot more of that. If he could see his way to standing up to a few more challenges from centre backs he might end up making a decent CF! 

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1 hour ago, Palfy said:

Great news, but I can’t help thinking was he sort of promised that Silva was going nowhere, because it’s no secret he only joined us because of his respect for Silva. 

He must understand that there's is a strong probability that Silva will leave in the coming weeks though. 

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8 hours ago, Romey 1878 said:

His finish yesterday was as good as it gets really. Absolute top quality.

Not many can do that. The ball was practically under his feet when he struck it too, surprised he could bend it in.

For whatever flaws he might have he is by far the best fnisher in the box for us. I do however prefer him on the wing as more of a wide forward, his tracking back is much more effective there.

If we can either get Kean to start taking his chances or get a natural goal scorer in, coupled with a proper out and out winger on the right (someone of the same style of James for United) we can start to make waves up front. At the minute we are relying heavily on goals from Richt and Dom, we need another striker to take the pressure off them and a physical box to box CM who can chip in every now and then (like a doucoure).

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23 hours ago, Aidan said:

Not many can do that. The ball was practically under his feet when he struck it too, surprised he could bend it in.

For whatever flaws he might have he is by far the best fnisher in the box for us. I do however prefer him on the wing as more of a wide forward, his tracking back is much more effective there.

If we can either get Kean to start taking his chances or get a natural goal scorer in, coupled with a proper out and out winger on the right (someone of the same style of James for United) we can start to make waves up front. At the minute we are relying heavily on goals from Richt and Dom, we need another striker to take the pressure off them and a physical box to box CM who can chip in every now and then (like a doucoure).

I couldn't disagree more about his position. He plays the 2nd striker role so well, he hasn't had a bad game behind DCL yet. He comes back and helps out and still covers the wing too. He made the most tackles or something like that at the weekend. 

Out wide he is hamstrung by only being able to dribble one way and he isn't a creative player as such, not like Bernard is and therefore moves can break down with him wide because he tends to dribble first and pass second. 

At the moment he has that position nailed down and I would rotate Kean with DCL ahead of him who both appear to be players that want to lead the line and don't contribute as much in the build up.

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3 hours ago, Bailey said:

I couldn't disagree more about his position. He plays the 2nd striker role so well, he hasn't had a bad game behind DCL yet. He comes back and helps out and still covers the wing too. He made the most tackles or something like that at the weekend. 

Out wide he is hamstrung by only being able to dribble one way and he isn't a creative player as such, not like Bernard is and therefore moves can break down with him wide because he tends to dribble first and pass second. 

At the moment he has that position nailed down and I would rotate Kean with DCL ahead of him who both appear to be players that want to lead the line and don't contribute as much in the build up.

I know it's got mixed opinions, but I really see him as a wide forward and think he's more effective there. I'm not saying I want him to dribble past 4 people, I know he rarely has that in his game, but he can find more space out wide when attacking the box and beat full backs in the air. 

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Just now, Aidan said:

I know it's got mixed opinions, but I really see him as a wide forward and think he's more effective there. I'm not saying I want him to dribble past 4 people, I know he rarely has that in his game, but he can find more space out wide when attacking the box and beat full backs in the air. 

I can see him in a 433 where he drifts inside and the full back provides the width. So something like:

Coleman, Mina, Holgate, Dinge

         Iwobi, Davies, Gambin

        Richarlison, DCL, Bernard

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On 12/01/2020 at 18:09, Aidan said:

For whatever flaws he might have he is by far the best fnisher in the box for us. I do however prefer him on the wing as more of a wide forward, his tracking back is much more effective there.

If he’s the best finisher we have in the box then why put him on the wing where he’ll get in the box less?! Bonkers! He tracks back well as the 2nd striker regardless. What we need is a better wing option so Richarlison doesn’t need to cover that position and he can stay where he’s most dangerous - in the box.

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9 minutes ago, c1982 said:

If he’s the best finisher we have in the box then why put him on the wing where he’ll get in the box less?! Bonkers! He tracks back well as the 2nd striker regardless. What we need is a better wing option so Richarlison doesn’t need to cover that position and he can stay where he’s most dangerous - in the box.

He's able to get into the box from a wide position. Salah, sterling, rashford, mane are all very adept finishers... you don't have to play centrally to score goals. Ronaldo has made a living out of scoring from the left flank (not that I'm comparing). 

I don't think people understand what I'm saying. I don't want him as an orthodox winger, in that case he would be better off in the centre. 

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1 hour ago, London Blue said:

I can see him in a 433 where he drifts inside and the full back provides the width. So something like:

Coleman, Mina, Holgate, Dinge

         Iwobi, Davies, Gambin

        Richarlison, DCL, Bernard

The problem is he barely passes to the full back. I think the wide player and full back need to have a strong relationship with each other and the only stroganoff relationship I have seen with Richarlison is alongside DCL.

38 minutes ago, c1982 said:

If he’s the best finisher we have in the box then why put him on the wing where he’ll get in the box less?! Bonkers! He tracks back well as the 2nd striker regardless. What we need is a better wing option so Richarlison doesn’t need to cover that position and he can stay where he’s most dangerous - in the box.

Agreed. Best finisher and most direct player. He wants to score goals so put him in a position to do so!

25 minutes ago, Aidan said:

He's able to get into the box from a wide position. Salah, sterling, rashford, mane are all very adept finishers... you don't have to play centrally to score goals. Ronaldo has made a living out of scoring from the left flank (not that I'm comparing). 

I don't think people understand what I'm saying. I don't want him as an orthodox winger, in that case he would be better off in the centre. 

I get the second paragraph but you can't say about Ronaldo scoring goals in this post and then about Richarlison tracking back in the original. Ronaldo never tracks anyone and never has, he is on the team to score goals only, whereas Richarlison will put himself about for the team. 

Even Salah, Sterling and to some extent Mane are all the finishers. They don't track back as much as we would make Richarlison do, partly of course because we don't have the possession those sides do (yet). 

The bottom line for me is that the best I have seen him play is alongside DCL. If we are going to play 442 then that is where he should play. If we play 433 then I agree its up for debate.

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4 minutes ago, Bailey said:

I get the second paragraph but you can't say about Ronaldo scoring goals in this post and then about Richarlison tracking back in the original.

I was more referring to the fact that a teams biggest goal threat doesn't have to play centrally.

His goals against wolves, Southampton, City, Leicester are all good examples of why I think he's best suited to drifting inside from the flank. Either getting a run on the centre half or challenging against the full back.

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2 hours ago, c1982 said:

More evidence to support that he needs to be in the box - he’s a striker and a very good one at that - wasted on the wing!

 

 

I said it before, just because he's in a wide position doesn't mean he's a winger who's going to attempt 10 crosses a game. His crossing ability is not the best, that is clear to see, but he's not 'that' player. 

To put that stat perspective (and before I go on I am aware that the two players are on different levels) Mane has attempted 2 fewer crosses than Richarlison in total, and has 3 more accurate crosses than Richarlison, with those figures being taken from the two playing in wide positions (mane has actually played 7 more games in a wide position). 

I prefer Richy on the wing, he's much better suited finding space in the box from a wide position and isn't a natural centre forward. In my opinion he's more of a threat out wide than he is centrally. 

Ancelotti seems to like one winger stretching the opposition with chalk on his boots, and the other wide player sitting narrow linking up play. From what I've he heard Carlo is adaptable and has no fixed style, so who knows if we will see Richarlison wide with Dom and Kean up front. Not sure how that would work as a 442 but we will see. 

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1 hour ago, Aidan said:

I said it before, just because he's in a wide position doesn't mean he's a winger who's going to attempt 10 crosses a game. His crossing ability is not the best, that is clear to see, but he's not 'that' player. 

To put that stat perspective (and before I go on I am aware that the two players are on different levels) Mane has attempted 2 fewer crosses than Richarlison in total, and has 3 more accurate crosses than Richarlison, with those figures being taken from the two playing in wide positions (mane has actually played 7 more games in a wide position). 

I prefer Richy on the wing, he's much better suited finding space in the box from a wide position and isn't a natural centre forward. In my opinion he's more of a threat out wide than he is centrally. 

Ancelotti seems to like one winger stretching the opposition with chalk on his boots, and the other wide player sitting narrow linking up play. From what I've he heard Carlo is adaptable and has no fixed style, so who knows if we will see Richarlison wide with Dom and Kean up front. Not sure how that would work as a 442 but we will see. 

In Carlo 442 the LW is the playmaker cutting in to find players and through balls.  That is Bernard and he is perfect for that role.  The LB bombs the blank.  The RW acts more like a wingback offering to Defend and put in crosses while the RB is the hybrid CB in the 3 or RB in the 4 depending on the phase of play.

 

richarlison fits neither winger roles for Carlos system.  He fits the striker role for his system.  I think that’s why he’s playing there for him.

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9 hours ago, markjazzbassist said:

In Carlo 442 the LW is the playmaker cutting in to find players and through balls.  That is Bernard and he is perfect for that role.  The LB bombs the blank.  The RW acts more like a wingback offering to Defend and put in crosses while the RB is the hybrid CB in the 3 or RB in the 4 depending on the phase of play.

 

richarlison fits neither winger roles for Carlos system.  He fits the striker role for his system.  I think that’s why he’s playing there for him.

In his current system.

If Kean starts firing and I think Dom will keep his place maybe he will change things up to accommodate Richarlison, because I doubt DCL will be dropped and I also doubt he will start Kean and Richarlison as a pairing. 

As London Blue said he'd be suited as a wide forward in a 433. But yeah I'm not sure he would fit into a 442 as a wide player. 

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I think against teams like Watford this weekend we could play Richarlison on the right with DCL and Kean up front and Bernard on the left. But if we had them four then the midfield two have to be very defensively minded.

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Just now, barryj said:

That is a huge bid and I’m sure us rejecting it will divide views. 

in a snarky way we could accept and then in a year when they've under utilized him and bought the next shiniest thing we can buy him back at a cut rate deal and net a good deal of money and still keep him (bar the one year).  but that's not a good gameplan :)

 

i'd be surprised who wants him sold, he's easily our best player, just signed a new deal, and is still young and improving.  there is no downside to him right now for me.

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1 minute ago, markjazzbassist said:

what's your rational for the first point?

£85m is good money for him but we’d have no chance of getting a replacement with only a few days of the window left. I didn’t really think I’d need to explain tbh!

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Just now, Romey 1878 said:

£85m is good money for him but we’d have no chance of getting a replacement with only a few days of the window left. I didn’t really think I’d need to explain tbh!

as was shown by lukaku, everyone knows you have money and you get held hostage buying average players.  like we did and we never recovered.  i am surprised you would think we would sell him.  in a couple years sure, but not now.

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10 minutes ago, markjazzbassist said:

as was shown by lukaku, everyone knows you have money and you get held hostage buying average players.  like we did and we never recovered.  i am surprised you would think we would sell him.  in a couple years sure, but not now.

They’ll know we’ve got money whenever we sell him. 

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Alan Myers in Twitter broke this story. They came in for him in the summer and got fucked off. Another came in early in the week and was knocked back. I can see him wanting to go. I wouldn’t sell him at all but maybe in the summer we will have no option. 

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8 minutes ago, Romey 1878 said:

They’ll know we’ve got money whenever we sell him. 

that's why you get the replacement in early.  but we are everton and that is not likely to happen.

6 minutes ago, Finn balor said:

Alan Myers in Twitter broke this story. They came in for him in the summer and got fucked off. Another came in early in the week and was knocked back. I can see him wanting to go. I wouldn’t sell him at all but maybe in the summer we will have no option. 

he just signed a new contact, the ink is still wet.  why would we sell him?  he's our best player, we need him. barca only wants him because suarez is injured.  he's a stop gap.

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28 minutes ago, Romey 1878 said:

If it hadn’t been this late in the window I think it’d have been accepted.

It'll be interesting to see if Richarlison now requests to leave. 

That’s my worry now. I’m hoping he sees the sense in staying for another year and building his profile.

Hopefully he can see what happened with Gana and how we honoured that transfer.

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1 minute ago, markjazzbassist said:

that's why you get the replacement in early.  but we are everton and that is not likely to happen.

he just signed a new contact, the ink is still wet.  why would we sell him?  he's our best player, we need him. barca only wants him because suarez is injured.  he's a stop gap.

It’s not a case of us wanting to sell him. It’s a case of us being bullied into selling him. We all know how this affects some players and I pray that this doesn’t happen to Richarlison.

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1 minute ago, Shukes said:

It’s not a case of us wanting to sell him. It’s a case of us being bullied into selling him. We all know how this affects some players and I pray that this doesn’t happen to Richarlison.

the good thing about richy is he seems very grounded and comes from a humble background.  he only left watford because marco did and he had a close relationship with him.  he didn't push to leave, he was bought and accepted because of the marco connection.  i don't see him trying to get out.  also he is the focal point and star here, he might like that over being a bit part player and then sold 1 year later at barca like most of their players are.

1 minute ago, Romey 1878 said:

Which is why I said we wouldn’t sell him now in my post that you had an issue with. 

i had an issue with it because it seemed you were in favor of selling him.  i can't understand that logic.  i had no issue with the "too late in the window" part of your post.  i agree.

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2 minutes ago, Shukes said:

It’s not a case of us wanting to sell him. It’s a case of us being bullied into selling him. We all know how this affects some players and I pray that this doesn’t happen to Richarlison.

Now isn’t the right time to sell only because we don’t have time to find a replacement, but if 85-100 million is on the table in the summer transfer window, we will take it we’d be fool’s not to. 

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1 minute ago, Palfy said:

Now isn’t the right time to sell only because we don’t have time to find a replacement, but if 85-100 million is on the table in the summer transfer window, we will take it we’d be fool’s not to. 

Arteta.

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Just now, Palfy said:

Now isn’t the right time to sell only because we don’t have time to find a replacement, but if 85-100 million is on the table in the summer transfer window, we will take it we’d be fool’s not to. 

he could be worth double that in 2 years time if we can put a better team around him.  he's still very young.  i'm strongly against selling him.

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Just now, Palfy said:

🤷‍♂️

Arteta still upsets me now. 
Selling Richarlison for anything but stupid money is a mistake for me. Stupid money is three times his value. His value is 80m now. Barca are offering what he is worth, nothing more.

Now look at your replacement for him. 
 

The Arteta comment is to show that it doesn’t matter how much you get for a player, if that player is irreplaceable. Now Richarlison isn’t quite there yet, but he could well be. I also don’t see many names around to replace him with.

Imagine selling your dream home because you were offered a good price..... you still lost your dream home.

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6 minutes ago, markjazzbassist said:

the good thing about richy is he seems very grounded and comes from a humble background.  he only left watford because marco did and he had a close relationship with him.  he didn't push to leave, he was bought and accepted because of the marco connection.  i don't see him trying to get out.  also he is the focal point and star here, he might like that over being a bit part player and then sold 1 year later at barca like most of their players are.

i had an issue with it because it seemed you were in favor of selling him.  i can't understand that logic.  i had no issue with the "too late in the window" part of your post.  i agree.

There was absolutely nothing in my original post that even hinted at that. 

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11 minutes ago, markjazzbassist said:

also he is the focal point and star here, he might like that over being a bit part player and then sold 1 year later at barca like most of their players are.

This basically. The game changed, yet many clubs have spending power and can offer ridiculous salary to players. That said, top clubs are now attractive to world class players only, who can slot in and play at the highest level. Richarlison is not a world class, nowhere near yet. Since money are not a problem for us anymore, why would he want to leave? His spot is more or less guaranteed here and we can easily double his wages after a year or so if he continues to improve. 

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