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Was bought because he scored a few set piece goals in the world cup. Not a very good player in my eyes, he's like Bambi on ice and my heart is always in my mouth when he goes in for a tackle.

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17 hours ago, Bill said:

Was bought because he scored a few set piece goals in the world cup. Not a very good player in my eyes, he's like Bambi on ice and my heart is always in my mouth when he goes in for a tackle.

There's always a couple of players at the World Cup that over perform and are massively overpaid for and are then exposed at their new clubs.  I like Mina a lot, but my great fear is that Mina is going to be one of them.  I've never known such a tall and massive player be so dogshit at heading, he can't even jump.  Hope I am proved wrong!

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https://www.google.com.au/amp/s/amp.hitc.com/en-gb/2019/03/15/marco-silva-says-everton-ace-yerry-mina-needs-to-be-better-in-tr/

 

Marco calling for Mina to become more consistent. I like Mina but concerns are there. Surely we are establishing with chelsea if Zouma is available before the season ends - if he’s not we need to find out what role Mina will play next year and What kind of CB we need next year.

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I think he will come good, he’s got a good mentality just needs to keep injury free and get a good run in the team which will help him adapt to the PL  

After all you don’t get to play for Barca if you have nothing to offer. 

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50 minutes ago, Palfy said:

I think he will come good, he’s got a good mentality just needs to keep injury free and get a good run in the team which will help him adapt to the PL  

After all you don’t get to play for Barca if you have nothing to offer. 

I agree with you but Sandro Ramirez has put doubts in my mind of that last point!

 

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1 hour ago, Btay said:

https://www.google.com.au/amp/s/amp.hitc.com/en-gb/2019/03/15/marco-silva-says-everton-ace-yerry-mina-needs-to-be-better-in-tr/

 

Marco calling for Mina to become more consistent. I like Mina but concerns are there. Surely we are establishing with chelsea if Zouma is available before the season ends - if he’s not we need to find out what role Mina will play next year and What kind of CB we need next year.

Suspect with the timing the manager is trying to distract from his own failings, already knows the lad is getting flack for Newcastle and now is indirectly adding fuel. What was he saying before last week? 

 

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2 hours ago, Btay said:

https://www.google.com.au/amp/s/amp.hitc.com/en-gb/2019/03/15/marco-silva-says-everton-ace-yerry-mina-needs-to-be-better-in-tr/

 

Marco calling for Mina to become more consistent. I like Mina but concerns are there. Surely we are establishing with chelsea if Zouma is available before the season ends - if he’s not we need to find out what role Mina will play next year and What kind of CB we need next year.

Mina isn'tt inconsistent; he's been shite as long as he's been here.  If he was inconsistent he would at least have a good game every now and then.

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40 minutes ago, badaids said:

Mina isn'ttt inconsistent; he's been shite as long as he's been here.  If he was inconsistent he would at least have a good game every now and then.

Though he started “ok”. Clean sheet against Chelsea away first game. It’s never an easy league to settle into but I think he could be an asset - we just need to iron out a few aspects of his game.

I for one, may be seeing something completely different but I don’t think he loses as many headers as made out but definitely think he is gangly and awkward often.

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40 minutes ago, badaids said:

Mina isn'ttt inconsistent; he's been shite as long as he's been here.  If he was inconsistent he would at least have a good game every now and then.

Though he started “ok”. Clean sheet against Chelsea away first game. It’s never an easy league to settle into but I think he could be an asset - we just need to iron out a few aspects of his game.

I for one, may be seeing something completely different but I don’t think he loses as many headers as made out but definitely think he is gangly and awkward often.

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1 hour ago, pete0 said:

Suspect with the timing the manager is trying to distract from his own failings, already knows the lad is getting flack for Newcastle and now is indirectly adding fuel. What was he saying before last week? 

 

Think he is addressing a fair point for me. I don’t think Marco dresses things up - calls it how he sees it in my opinion. 

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40 minutes ago, Btay said:

Think he is addressing a fair point for me. I don’t think Marco dresses things up - calls it how he sees it in my opinion. 

Could the players have done anything differently?

“It’s a good question. But you can always do something different when you analyse the match.

“We decided to put Mina in in that second half, to control the first ball better.

“But we as a team have to react in a different way if you look at the goals we conceded.”

On Pickford criticism:

“I don’t like to go particularly on one player. It’s not fair.

“I’m here [in the press conference] to give me face to you. My players are always behind me.

“I’m the first one to take responsibilities for my players on the pitch.

“It’s a matter of collective behaviour.

“I understand what people are saying about Jordan."

https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/everton-news-transfers-live-latest-15976543

Says he doesn't like singling players out then goes on to name two. 

Listen to his post match and it's even worse. The man excepts no responsibility in one of the worse managerial performances in my lifetime. (Moyes v Wigan in the FA cup being the only other that springs to mind). Before last week we'd only lost after taking on a two nil lead once out of the previous 365 occasions yet our manager isn'tt burdening the blame. 

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6 minutes ago, pete0 said:

Could the players have done anything differently?

“It’s a good question. But you can always do something different when you analyse the match.

“We decided to put Mina in in that second half, to control the first ball better.

“But we as a team have to react in a different way if you look at the goals we conceded.”

On Pickford criticism:

“I don’t like to go particularly on one player. It’s not fair.

“I’m here [in the press conference] to give me face to you. My players are always behind me.

“I’m the first one to take responsibilities for my players on the pitch.

“It’s a matter of collective behaviour.

“I understand what people are saying about Jordan."

https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/everton-news-transfers-live-latest-15976543

Says he doesn't like singling players out then goes on to name two. 

Listen to his post match and it's even worse. The man excepts no responsibility in one of the worse managerial performances in my lifetime. (Moyes v Wigan in the FA cup being the only other that springs to mind). Before last week we'd only lost after taking on a two nil lead once out of the previous 365 occasions yet our manager isn'tttt burdening the blame. 

He’s asked a question about 2 players and answers them? He supports jordan whilst acknowledging where he needs to improve - same with Mina. I don’t think anyone would disagree with the points he raised about both. 

Alternatively we can say how phenomenal both are and that they never do wrong?

 

I find all the points he made about the players doing better fair. Kean out jumped by Perez is absolute shit. 

You can always analyse a game for improvement and I agree with the last point. It’s not like he has directly gone after anyone person there.

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Just now, Btay said:

He’s asked a question about 2 players and answers them? He supports jordan whilst acknowledging where he needs to improve - same with Mina. I don’t think anyone would disagree with the points he raised about both. 

Alternatively we can say how phenomenal both are and that they never do wrong?

He was asked

Could the players have done anything differently?

He's then gone on to name the players. He should be holding his hand up and protecting the players like Mourinho used to at Chelsea. Silva is on damage control, and has been since Christmas, only looking after his own reputation. The overreacting at the ref at the end looked forced not emotional. 

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The players do need to take responsibility as well IMO. I dont agree with bringing Mina on but this is a guy rated as one of the best young defenders in South America, who has played for Barcelona. This isnt a Sunday league player coming in to the team. They were all so weak and passive rather than aggressive and proactive. Silva must be tearing his hair out with them.

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Just now, Bailey said:

The players do need to take responsibility as well IMO. I dont agree with bringing Mina on but this is a guy rated as one of the best young defenders in South America, who has played for Barcelona. This isnt a Sunday league player coming in to the team. They were all so weak and passive rather than aggressive and proactive. Silva must be tearing his hair out with them.

The players aren't innocent of the mess. They do lack fight but ultimately that's the managers job to get them motivated. Atm we're managed by a weak loser and it's reflected in the attitude of the team on the pitch. 

On the team in general I'm unsure if another manager would get the best out of some of these mercenaries but at least they'd have the balls to drop them. Even Alladyce, he brought Davies in for a little bit of bite. No one in this team looks scared for their position. You've got good pros in Digne, Coleman, Pickford, and DCL who are giving their all but that's down to them loving football as far as I can see. 

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15 minutes ago, pete0 said:

He was asked

Could the players have done anything differently?

He's then gone on to name the players. He should be holding his hand up and protecting the players like Mourinho used to at Chelsea. Silva is on damage control, and has been since Christmas, only looking after his own reputation. The overreacting at the ref at the end looked forced not emotional. 

I understand where you are coming from with what he said. For me, he’s saying we weren’t dealing with the first ball well enough - I take that as a dig at keane more so than anyone for losing a header to Perez of all players for the first goal. Secondly he’s been asked about Pickford - he didn’t bring him up but he’s honest enough to say where Pickford needs to improve and I agree 100% with those points. 

He looked genuinely frustrated to me, rightly so. Yeh you can argue he got some bits wrong but I understand the process of bringing another centre back to protect against the long ball to Rondon but ultimately it lays with the players. I just feel our players have been wrapped in cotton wool since Martinez and they need to own up a bit more or go.

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4 hours ago, Bailey said:

The players do need to take responsibility as well IMO. I dont agree with bringing Mina on but this is a guy rated as one of the best young defenders in South America, who has played for Barcelona. This isnt a Sunday league player coming in to the team. They were all so weak and passive rather than aggressive and proactive. Silva must be tearing his hair out with them.

Silva surrendered the game to Newcastle he maybe pulling his hair out at a lack of strength in the mentality of the players, surely he has worked with them long enough to have instilled what he wants into them by now.

I'm a great believer in that a team goes onto the pitch with a lot of the managers personality if they are weak it's because he is weak, if they lose because as individuals they don't have the ability of there opponent's then fair enough the better team won you have to accept and respect that, but if they lose because they are weak then for me the manager is weak, and the substitution of Richarlison for Mina was a weak decision from a weak manager, and Mina should not be shouldering any of the blame for that, a poor decision from a poor manager.

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1 hour ago, Palfy said:

Silva surrendered the game to Newcastle he maybe pulling his hair out at a lack of strength in the mentality of the players, surely he has worked with them long enough to have instilled what he wants into them by now.

I'm a great believer in that a team goes onto the pitch with a lot of the managers personality if they are weak it's because he is weak, if they lose because as individuals they don't have the ability of there opponent's then fair enough the better team won you have to accept and respect that, but if they lose because they are weak then for me the manager is weak, and the substitution of Richarlison for Mina was a weak decision from a weak manager, and Mina should not be shouldering any of the blame for that, a poor decision from a poor manager.

I get what you are saying but Martinez was slammed for Kiev - for playing the same style when we needed to be compact and defensive and we would have gone through. Football is brilliant in hindsight but if we lost that game without making any defence minded substitutes then Marco gets slammed as well. 

I don’t quite agree with the mentality point fully. Micheal Keane for me isn’t going to become the aggressive, dominating centre back under any manager - if anything Marco has gotten the best out of him ( and Zouma for that matter ) our defence is generally let down by individual battles lost or mistakes.

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2 hours ago, Btay said:

I get what you are saying but Martinez was slammed for Kiev - for playing the same style when we needed to be compact and defensive and we would have gone through. Football is brilliant in hindsight but if we lost that game without making any defence minded substitutes then Marco gets slammed as well. 

I don’t quite agree with the mentality point fully. Micheal Keane for me isn’t going to become the aggressive, dominating centre back under any manager - if anything Marco has gotten the best out of him ( and Zouma for that matter ) our defence is generally let down by individual battles lost or mistakes.

I was talking in general that the whole team are weak with no fight or passion because they are the image of their manager, it's his responsibility to get the team to fight as a team when needed to go that extra mile to do the dirty stuff, it's not all about trying to do the pretty stuff.

Like I said the team are weak because the manager is weak sometimes you have to be hard and an arse hole for the want of a better word, he's not and his team is a representation of that.

So for me it's not just about individual mistakes they happen that's football some players are technically better than others that's a fact and the only way to combat that is to buy a better player, but you can't buy team effort or hard work or the will to win from everyone on the pitch you instil that, that is your job as the manager to make sure the team you put out represent who you are as a manager if they fail through individual errors then you can't help that, if they fail because of lack of hard work team spirit tactically inept then you as the manager have failed and that is what we are seeing imo.

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39 minutes ago, Palfy said:

I was talking in general that the whole team are weak with no fight or passion because they are the image of their manager, it's his responsibility to get the team to fight as a team when needed to go that extra mile to do the dirty stuff, it's not all about trying to do the pretty stuff.

Like I said the team are weak because the manager is weak sometimes you have to be hard and an arse hole for the want of a better word, he's not and his team is a representation of that.

So for me it's not just about individual mistakes they happen that's football some players are technically better than others that's a fact and the only way to combat that is to buy a better player, but you can't buy team effort or hard work or the will to win from everyone on the pitch you instil that, that is your job as the manager to make sure the team you put out represent who you are as a manager if they fail through individual errors then you can't help that, if they fail because of lack of hard work team spirit tactically inept then you as the manager have failed and that is what we are seeing imo.

We’ve been pretty much the same under 4 managers - hence why I believe it’s the players individual errors more than the manager. Both Liverpool games tell me it’s not lack of effort. I actually believe we’ve had a lot of small margins cost big momentum.

Jags red

Bernard miss v United 

offside goal arsenal killed the game

pickford @ anfield

pickford v Tottenham 

kean mistake for vardy’s Goal 

Pickford @ Newcastle 

these are all just straight off the top of my head. I’m not saying Marco is perfect by any means but the players have cost far more points than Silva’s management in my opinion.

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But seeing as this is becoming more about Silva than Mina I’ll get it back on topic. I hope we see enough of Mina to determine what we have before next season. I would play Mina over jags for this reason for the remainder of the season.

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8 hours ago, pete0 said:

The players aren't innocent of the mess. They do lack fight but ultimately that's the managers job to get them motivated. Atm we're managed by a weak loser and it's reflected in the attitude of the team on the pitch. 

On the team in general I'm unsure if another manager would get the best out of some of these mercenaries but at least they'd have the balls to drop them. Even Alladyce, he brought Davies in for a little bit of bite. No one in this team looks scared for their position. You've got good pros in Digne, Coleman, Pickford, and DCL who are giving their all but that's down to them loving football as far as I can see. 

 

4 hours ago, Palfy said:

Silva surrendered the game to Newcastle he maybe pulling his hair out at a lack of strength in the mentality of the players, surely he has worked with them long enough to have instilled what he wants into them by now.

I'm a great believer in that a team goes onto the pitch with a lot of the managers personality if they are weak it's because he is weak, if they lose because as individuals they don't have the ability of there opponent's then fair enough the better team won you have to accept and respect that, but if they lose because they are weak then for me the manager is weak, and the substitution of Richarlison for Mina was a weak decision from a weak manager, and Mina should not be shouldering any of the blame for that, a poor decision from a poor manager.

Btay has covered my main point in that we have had the same problems under 4 managers now. They have all brought in, switched and changed players around in those spells but we still get the same mess. 

Re Palfy, you cant instill the desire for a defender to go and win a header, to track a runner into the box or for a keeper not to drop a simple ball and the rugby tackle a defender. Any manager in football from u15s up expects this from his players. These players have been coached to do these thigs from as soon as they learnt how to play serious football and it certainly shouldnt need a Premier League manager to get these players to do the basics. Look at the touch from Richarlison when he was through on goal to seal the game. I think it was even Bernard who gave away a basic ball for one of Newcastles goals and as a manager what can you do about that? We have been through every winger at the club, we have had different variations in midfield, full bakcs have changed, CBs have switched, the striker position has rotated. Im not absolving Marco of blame because I do think he has to shoulder a chunk of the responsibility but there are times when these players make Sunday league sides look good.

 

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2 hours ago, Bailey said:

 

Btay has covered my main point in that we have had the same problems under 4 managers now. They have all brought in, switched and changed players around in those spells but we still get the same mess. 

Re Palfy, you cant instill the desire for a defender to go and win a header, to track a runner into the box or for a keeper not to drop a simple ball and the rugby tackle a defender. Any manager in football from u15s up expects this from his players. These players have been coached to do these thigs from as soon as they learnt how to play serious football and it certainly shouldnt need a Premier League manager to get these players to do the basics. Look at the touch from Richarlison when he was through on goal to seal the game. I think it was even Bernard who gave away a basic ball for one of Newcastles goals and as a manager what can you do about that? We have been through every winger at the club, we have had different variations in midfield, full bakcs have changed, CBs have switched, the striker position has rotated. Im not absolving Marco of blame because I do think he has to shoulder a chunk of the responsibility but there are times when these players make Sunday league sides look good.

 

Okay you can't so why does the manager buy players that can't do the basics because he's a fool clueless fucking idiot shit manager take your pick.

Surely these players have been scouted and watched before being bought and considered that they are good enough, then they come here and there woeful, same player different manager different system different different instructions.

He's a poor manager and when he's shown the door here his career will be finished in this country.

And as I said he can't do anything about individual mistakes but he can give a team the will to win he can make them a strong unit, but we are weak because he is weak, we put out a first team against Millwall and got humiliated because they wanted it more than us, there manager sent his team out with a plan a belief in it and a passion and will to win, can you honestly say you see that in Silva's team.

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3 hours ago, Palfy said:

Okay you can't so why does the manager buy players that can't do the basics because he's a fool clueless fucking idiot shit manager take your pick.

Surely these players have been scouted and watched before being bought and considered that they are good enough, then they come here and there woeful, same player different manager different system different different instructions.

He's a poor manager and when he's shown the door here his career will be finished in this country.

And as I said he can't do anything about individual mistakes but he can give a team the will to win he can make them a strong unit, but we are weak because he is weak, we put out a first team against Millwall and got humiliated because they wanted it more than us, there manager sent his team out with a plan a belief in it and a passion and will to win, can you honestly say you see that in Silva's team.

The manager doesn't buy the players, he doesn't conduct the scouting.

History shows plenty of examples where lower league teams beat premier league teams through their will to win. All the best managers in the world have been humbled, it doesn't make them shit managers. Its one of the things that is great about football.

As an example, look back at the 2nd goal for Newcastle. We had just changed to 5 at the back. We have a 2 man midfield and we should be sat deep soaking up the pressure looking to counter attack. The two men in midfield, regardless of whether the manager has told them to, should know to hold their position and sit in front of the 3 centre backs, let the full backs create the width and release the front 3 into space wherever possible. You then watch it and you have Gana appearing to chase Shelvey into the opposition half 30 yards ahead of Gomes, a bit of a tame header from Zouma and Gomes is not aware of the Newcastle player next to him who wins the ball, which starts the counter, then you have Kenny and Mina failing to recognise the danger and they originally start dropping deeper, rather than getting close to him. Pickford doesn't get the ball away from goal from the shot and then Zouma just watches Perez stroll past him. I watch that and I just can't not blame the players. I would agree with an argument which said the 5 at the back would have added to some of the confusion, but in all honesty if Mina and Kenny were in that position as a back 4 they would probably do the same. Kenny should realise he doesn't have a man and go flying out to Almiron, who I would have thought would have been his main opposition at that time.

They would have done hours of work on the training ground, working on the exact opposite of what happened in that sequence of events, but its football. Its humans having to make split second decisions in an every changing environment and that is why I prefer intelligent players over athletes.

 

 

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13 minutes ago, Bailey said:

The manager doesn't buy the players, he doesn't conduct the scouting.

History shows plenty of examples where lower league teams beat premier league teams through their will to win. All the best managers in the world have been humbled, it doesn't make them shit managers. Its one of the things that is great about football.

As an example, look back at the 2nd goal for Newcastle. We had just changed to 5 at the back. We have a 2 man midfield and we should be sat deep soaking up the pressure looking to counter attack. The two men in midfield, regardless of whether the manager has told them to, should know to hold their position and sit in front of the 3 centre backs, let the full backs create the width and release the front 3 into space wherever possible. You then watch it and you have Gana appearing to chase Shelvey into the opposition half 30 yards ahead of Gomes, a bit of a tame header from Zouma and Gomes is not aware of the Newcastle player next to him who wins the ball, which starts the counter, then you have Kenny and Mina failing to recognise the danger and they originally start dropping deeper, rather than getting close to him. Pickford doesn't get the ball away from goal from the shot and then Zouma just watches Perez stroll past him. I watch that and I just can't not blame the players. I would agree with an argument which said the 5 at the back would have added to some of the confusion, but in all honesty if Mina and Kenny were in that position as a back 4 they would probably do the same. Kenny should realise he doesn't have a man and go flying out to Almiron, who I would have thought would have been his main opposition at that time.

They would have done hours of work on the training ground, working on the exact opposite of what happened in that sequence of events, but its football. Its humans having to make split second decisions in an every changing environment and that is why I prefer intelligent players over athletes.

 

 

The manager isn'tt just told out of the blue we've just bought XYZ he casts his eyes over the players suggested to him and will have the final say if they are what he wants.

History does show what we would call giant killings, but most are against bigger teams putting out a 2nd team we put out our 1st team and got done because we were weak at defending the set ball plays weak at battling to win the ball and weak spirited, and to top that we have a manager who can't inspire or lift his players.

Bailey you keep going on about individual mistakes that lead to goals not far off every goal conceded in football all over the world is down to a mistake by 1 or 2 individuals no one is arguing that we all know that, I'm talking about a team that is being sent out with little desire or passion that is so brittle it's embarrassing I'm talking about a team that reflects it's manager, were not taking about a team who's players make mistakes because of their ability were talking about a team with no heart no passion no drive no will to do everything think it takes, and when you look at the manager it's not hard to see why a poor weak manager adds up to a poor weak team.

You yourself have said on many occasions that the team were weak or poor but you obviously don't think that's down to the manager were as I do..

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34 minutes ago, Btay said:

Do they think he's a Dacoure type of player beats me not sure of their logic or who they would compare him to, like you I think it's pure fantasy.

You wait Silva will try it and prove us wrong 😃

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23 minutes ago, Palfy said:

Do they think he's a Dacoure type of player beats me not sure of their logic or who they would compare him to, like you I think it's pure fantasy.

You wait Silva will try it and prove us wrong 😃

Look if Silva tried Mina at CDM I’d be critical of his tactics ( unless by some sort of mirical Mina is secretly elegant and agile enough ). It’s not the same as Jags/Heitinga who (albeit not great) could do a job there. In fact of our Centre halves id only suggest holgate could do the role ( potentially ) but I wouldn’t want it!

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22 hours ago, Palfy said:

The manager isn'ttt just told out of the blue we've just bought XYZ he casts his eyes over the players suggested to him and will have the final say if they are what he wants.

History does show what we would call giant killings, but most are against bigger teams putting out a 2nd team we put out our 1st team and got done because we were weak at defending the set ball plays weak at battling to win the ball and weak spirited, and to top that we have a manager who can't inspire or lift his players.

Bailey you keep going on about individual mistakes that lead to goals not far off every goal conceded in football all over the world is down to a mistake by 1 or 2 individuals no one is arguing that we all know that, I'm talking about a team that is being sent out with little desire or passion that is so brittle it's embarrassing I'm talking about a team that reflects it's manager, were not taking about a team who's players make mistakes because of their ability were talking about a team with no heart no passion no drive no will to do everything think it takes, and when you look at the manager it's not hard to see why a poor weak manager adds up to a poor weak team.

You yourself have said on many occasions that the team were weak or poor but you obviously don't think that's down to the manager were as I do..

The point is that they have been weak under different managers, so its either an issue with 4 managers or an isssue with the players. 

To keep this short, I dont disagree about there being failures in the manager, but fuck me these players are soft. 

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2 hours ago, Bailey said:

The point is that they have been weak under different managers, so its either an issue with 4 managers or an isssue with the players. 

To keep this short, I dont disagree about there being failures in the manager, but fuck me these players are soft. 

Not today if that 2nd half performance was because of dressing down from Silva then that's what he needs to do on a regular basis, if you want the players to grow some balls then the manager needs some as well, maybe just maybe Silva's dropped today I really hope so but time will tell, or will we revert to being a bunch of pussy's again sincerely hope not.

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On 17/03/2019 at 19:33, Palfy said:

Not today if that 2nd half performance was because of dressing down from Silva then that's what he needs to do on a regular basis, if you want the players to grow some balls then the manager needs some as well, maybe just maybe Silva's dropped today I really hope so but time will tell, or will we revert to being a bunch of pussy's again sincerely hope not.

Unfortunately you cant continue to motivate players by giving them a rollicking. It wares off pretty quickly!

The players shouldnt need that to play a half decent game of football. That performance basically proved everything I have been saying. 

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25 minutes ago, Bailey said:

Unfortunately you cant continue to motivate players by giving them a rollicking. It wares off pretty quickly!

The players shouldnt need that to play a half decent game of football. That performance basically proved everything I have been saying. 

Your having a laugh Bailey completely opposite to what you have been saying, read it back mate your way off the mark.

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