Romey 1878 Posted September 19, 2018 Report Share Posted September 19, 2018 14 minutes ago, Bailey said: Gana and Siggy made Davies look like Makelele this weekend they were that all over the place. How others play doesn't actually make him a disciplined player. EFC-Paul and nyblue23 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EFC-Paul Posted September 19, 2018 Report Share Posted September 19, 2018 Not about having two attacking midfielders it's about having one as said the other two can interchange prominently Sigurdsson sitting deeper than Bernard where he's better at driving forward picking a pass etc We can't stick to the same system it doesn't work as seen with Gana and Davies Morgan and Gana Morgan and Davies and so on Gana is the best defensive midfielder out of the three the other two offer very little ATM especially Davies Also questioning a players appetite to defend when they've not been played in such a way is premature especially considering Davies and Morgan run around like headless chickens Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nogs Posted September 19, 2018 Report Share Posted September 19, 2018 7 minutes ago, EFC-Paul said: Not about having two attacking midfielders it's about having one as said the other two can interchange prominently Sigurdsson sitting deeper than Bernard where he's better at driving forward picking a pass etc We can't stick to the same system it doesn't work as seen with Gana and Davies Morgan and Gana Morgan and Davies and so on Gana is the best defensive midfielder out of the three the other two offer very little ATM especially Davies Since when has Davies been considered a defensively minded midfielder? I agree with you though, at moment I'd be picking two of Sigurdsson, Bernard and Gomes when he's fit with Gana in front of the back four. Not because I think Gana is good enough but purely because I think he puts his foot in a lot more than Schneiderlin. I'm also hoping Gomes has something about him physically because I don't really see Bernard and Sigurdsson offering us enough defensively. The main issue though is we still have zero balance in the middle and we're not going to get very far until Gana and Schneiderlin are replaced by someone a lot better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EFC-Paul Posted September 19, 2018 Report Share Posted September 19, 2018 7 minutes ago, nogs said: Since when has Davies been considered a defensively minded midfielder? I agree with you though, at moment I'd be picking two of Sigurdsson, Bernard and Gomes when he's fit with Gana in front of the back four. Not because I think Gana is good enough but purely because I think he puts his foot in a lot more than Schneiderlin. I'm also hoping Gomes has something about him physically because I don't really see Bernard and Sigurdsson offering us enough defensively. The main issue though is we still have zero balance in the middle and we're not going to get very far until Gana and Schneiderlin are replaced by someone a lot better. Never said he was I was referring to Gana and Morgan in previous posts and I think it was Bailey mentioned Davies so threw all three into the mix In my recent reply I'm talking about a central pairing non of them work so just throwing an idea of something that "might" out there I'll be honest as much as I'm looking forward to seeing what Gomes can offer without getting to carried away we should have brought in a player like N'Zonzi or N'Diaye to fill the void and offer competition Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bailey Posted September 19, 2018 Report Share Posted September 19, 2018 3 hours ago, Romey 1878 said: How others play doesn't actually make him a disciplined player. My original point was that our most disciplined midfield comes from Schneiderlin and Davies ahead of the rest of the fit players. I didnt say he was disciplined as such but I accept it may not have come across clearly! 3 hours ago, EFC-Paul said: Not about having two attacking midfielders it's about having one as said the other two can interchange prominently Sigurdsson sitting deeper than Bernard where he's better at driving forward picking a pass etc We can't stick to the same system it doesn't work as seen with Gana and Davies Morgan and Gana Morgan and Davies and so on Gana is the best defensive midfielder out of the three the other two offer very little ATM especially Davies Also questioning a players appetite to defend when they've not been played in such a way is premature especially considering Davies and Morgan run around like headless chickens This isnt Fifa. You cant just drop an attacking midfielder into deeper positions and expect them to play like a deeper midfielder should play, at least not without a lot of coaching. I would have thought that Siggy could become a deeper midfielder, he has the size and work rate but he didnt really care who ran past him at the weekend and when he did he couldnt do anything about it. I would be almost certain that Bernard is worse at his defensive responsibilities. I accept that when we have the ball for large periods of the game the two players mentioned will enhance our chances of scoring / creating but we arent Man City and we arent going to retain 65-70+% of possession and with someone like Gueye chasing the ball you will leave a revolving door in midfield for the opposition to exploit. Gana is the best at tackling and intercepting, not the best defensive midfielder as there is a big difference. Schneiderlin is positionally the best player we have in there. Gana is the only headless chicken, at least at the weekend, which can have its plusses and minusses because it gives him the opportunity to win the ball back more but then also leaves us exposed. Its not premature at all. I have seen Siggy for 18 months now and Bernard doesnt have the physicality to play in central midfield in the Premier League week in week out and to be honest I think you want him find space to create rather than tie him down to defensive work. I think we can both confidently say that the sooner Gomes / McCarthy are fit the better! pete0 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EFC-Paul Posted September 19, 2018 Report Share Posted September 19, 2018 Bailey with all due respect mate I know it's not FIFA but you quote stats and all sorts of information as if this is Football Manager that are in the main more akin to a simulated game, for me to suggest playing two midfielders in midfield in roles they have played for club and country isn'ttt in the slightest bit FIFA related mate Sigurdsson played behind the strikers with a fairly free rain in midfield where he's at his best that's purely what I'm suggesting he's not Flash but he's quicker and more agile than Tom and Morgan so will/could get about more and Bernard is far more technical and creative than either I do want Bernard to find space and create that's the type of player he is, was Countinho built like a brick shithouse did he track back and defend does Silva do it often did Mahrez and so on? They have a specific role for their skillset I see Bernard as no different he's that kind of player Gana is the best defensive midfielder for me he does what they are supposed to as you say tackling and intercepting but as we know there's no cohesion with having sub par midfielders to pick the ball up and move it forward. That's why I'd like to see him on his own playing deep doing what he's good at then playing it simple to someone who can carry the ball up field Either way I hope something changes or clicks soon as we look dogshit markjazzbassist 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Palfy Posted September 19, 2018 Report Share Posted September 19, 2018 6 hours ago, Bailey said: FFS... I didnt say it doesnt work ever but unless I have missed something we arent managed by Pep and we arent Barcalona. This isnt football manager. Rakitic isnt a 10 either he is an all round midfielder. Its about a players appetite to defend and the system they play in. We dont keep the ball well enough nor invert the full backs nor have the mobility at 6 to afford ourselves 2 attacking midfielders in the same time. Siggy showed at the weekend that he isnt disciplined and I doubt Bernard will either. Gana and Siggy made Davies look like Makelele this weekend they were that all over the place. Have they ever been anything else when they play together, I look forward to the day when we get 2 CB who don’t need a DM sat in front of them for 90 minutes, then we can have a MF that has more freedom to be creative. nyblue23 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markjazzbassist Posted September 19, 2018 Author Report Share Posted September 19, 2018 glad to see some others aren't sold on the 2 DM system as well. and for the record bailey i don't play video games ala football manager (any at all really). it works for plenty of teams (like i said look at Leeds in a league below us much more physical league). nyblue23 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nyblue23 Posted September 20, 2018 Report Share Posted September 20, 2018 5 hours ago, Palfy said: Have they ever been anything else when they play together, I look forward to the day when we get 2 CB who don’t need a DM sat in front of them for 90 minutes, then we can have a MF that has more freedom to be creative. That’s what I keep thinking reading all of these. A yard dog like Gana frankly shouldn’t have to be nearly as worried about his positional sense; he should be free to run around, get the ball back and pass it upfield to a creative mid. As is, he and Schneiderlin get in each other’s way, Schneiderlin contributes not much defensively, and Gana gets constantly caught out all because our CB pairing has been consistently shit for the better part of 2 years. Not since Williams first arrived have we had any assurance at the back, and that was extremely short-lived. EFC-Paul 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brisbaneblue Posted September 20, 2018 Report Share Posted September 20, 2018 Would be surprised if he didn't tweak the midfield 3 and yank Tosun. Expecting something along the lines of this: Pickford Kenny Zouma Mina Digne Gueye Sigurdsson Bernard Walcott Richarlison Calvert-Lewin Bench: Stekelenburg, Holgate, Baines, Schneiderlin, Lookman, Niasse, Tosun Personally, I'd keep the faith with Tosun for one more match. The combination of Walcott, Tosun and Richarlison looked good up until Richarlison's red card. EFC-Paul and Shukes 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete0 Posted September 20, 2018 Report Share Posted September 20, 2018 14 hours ago, Bailey said: Gana is the best at tackling and intercepting, not the best defensive midfielder as there is a big difference. Schneiderlin is positionally the best player we have in there. Gana is the only headless chicken, at least at the weekend, which can have its plusses and minusses because it gives him the opportunity to win the ball back more but then also leaves us exposed. Nail on the head. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nogs Posted September 20, 2018 Report Share Posted September 20, 2018 How about Bainsey being converted into a Phillip Lahm-like midfield general from left back? Romey 1878 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romey 1878 Posted September 20, 2018 Report Share Posted September 20, 2018 1 hour ago, nogs said: How about Bainsey being converted into a Phillip Lahm-like midfield general from left back? Stop it. rubecula 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeO Posted September 20, 2018 Report Share Posted September 20, 2018 Be interesting to see what sort of team Arse put out tonight, sure they'll rest a lot of players unfortunately. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rubecula Posted September 20, 2018 Report Share Posted September 20, 2018 1 hour ago, nogs said: How about Bainsey being converted into a Phillip Lahm-like midfield general from left back? lets go the whole hog roast then and try Pickford as centre forward after all it worked well for half a game with George Wood. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markjazzbassist Posted September 20, 2018 Author Report Share Posted September 20, 2018 2 hours ago, nogs said: How about Bainsey being converted into a Phillip Lahm-like midfield general from left back? hows belgium bob? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeO Posted September 20, 2018 Report Share Posted September 20, 2018 4 hours ago, MikeO said: Be interesting to see what sort of team Arse put out tonight, sure they'll rest a lot of players unfortunately. Not exactly full strength. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
London Blue Posted September 20, 2018 Report Share Posted September 20, 2018 6 first team members + subs? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markjazzbassist Posted September 20, 2018 Author Report Share Posted September 20, 2018 honestly i hope arsenal win big so they are full of themselves and we knock them down. i don't want them humiliated and then trying to prove themselves against us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romey 1878 Posted September 20, 2018 Report Share Posted September 20, 2018 4 minutes ago, markjazzbassist said: honestly i hope arsenal win big so they are full of themselves and we knock them down. i don't want them humiliated and then trying to prove themselves against us. We haven’t won there for more than 20 years, so I’m not sure it’ll make a difference what they do tonight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markjazzbassist Posted September 20, 2018 Author Report Share Posted September 20, 2018 52 minutes ago, Romey 1878 said: We haven’t won there for more than 20 years, so I’m not sure it’ll make a difference what they do tonight. didn't we beat them with roberto? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rubecula Posted September 20, 2018 Report Share Posted September 20, 2018 2 minutes ago, markjazzbassist said: didn't we beat them with roberto? no we have never won at the emirates Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romey 1878 Posted September 20, 2018 Report Share Posted September 20, 2018 4 minutes ago, markjazzbassist said: didn't we beat them with roberto? We haven’t won away at Arsenal since 1996. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markjazzbassist Posted September 20, 2018 Author Report Share Posted September 20, 2018 13 minutes ago, rubecula said: no we have never won at the emirates 13 minutes ago, Romey 1878 said: We haven’t won away at Arsenal since 1996. yikes, well let's put em to the sword then Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cornish Steve Posted September 21, 2018 Report Share Posted September 21, 2018 3 hours ago, Romey 1878 said: We haven’t won away at Arsenal since 1996. West Ham hadn't won at Goodison for some time either, so there's a precedent for us to win. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nogs Posted September 21, 2018 Report Share Posted September 21, 2018 19 hours ago, nogs said: How about Bainsey being converted into a Phillip Lahm-like midfield general from left back? Some of you lot rise to the bait way too easily Although a lot of 'progressive' managers do like converting full backs into central midfielders on the grounds that they can usually defend and pass. It's highly debatable any of our CMs at moment can do both. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeO Posted September 21, 2018 Report Share Posted September 21, 2018 14 minutes ago, nogs said: Some of you lot rise to the bait way too easily Although a lot of 'progressive' managers do like converting full backs into central midfielders on the grounds that they can usually defend and pass. It's highly debatable any of our CMs at moment can do both. Dinosaurs too, Harry Redknapp changed Gareth Bale from a left back into a striker, stick Bainsey up front I say! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romey 1878 Posted September 21, 2018 Report Share Posted September 21, 2018 17 minutes ago, nogs said: Some of you lot rise to the bait way too easily Although a lot of 'progressive' managers do like converting full backs into central midfielders on the grounds that they can usually defend and pass. It's highly debatable any of our CMs at moment can do both. When we're in need of a powerhouse box to box midfielder, playing a scrawny, coming to the end of his career Baines isn'tt progressive. It's downright suicidal. markjazzbassist and London Blue 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nogs Posted September 21, 2018 Report Share Posted September 21, 2018 5 minutes ago, MikeO said: Dinosaurs too, Harry Redknapp changed Gareth Bale from a left back into a striker, stick Bainsey up front I say! That was a disaster, wasn't it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nogs Posted September 21, 2018 Report Share Posted September 21, 2018 4 minutes ago, Romey 1878 said: When we're in need of a powerhouse box to box midfielder, playing a scrawny, coming to the end of his career Baines isn'ttt progressive. It's downright suicidal. I wasn't really being serious, but I don't think age has anything to do with it. We let Barry go a season too soon and I'd have Milner in our midfield any day of the week. What our midfielders lack more than anything is intelligence. pete0 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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