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MikeO

Marco Silva

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9 minutes ago, Haiku said:

They don't need to know anything. Do you think Mansour knows how to run a club? These stupid Arab cheikhs can't manage a newspaper kiosk if there isn'ttt someone who do it for them.

Exactly it took them what 4-5 years before winning stuff.  Farhad has been here about 3 I think, still too early to tell.

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4 hours ago, markjazzbassist said:

Usmanov doesn’t know shit, he never did anything with arsenal, he is the same as moshiri was there.  Kroenke kept them on the outs and off the board.  he would be learning on the job just like farhad, no difference.

 

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Usmanov was on the board Moshiri tried to get on the board for years they wouldn’t have him I wonder why that was not hard to work out really is it, so he comes here because he wants to be involved with a PL club not because he supports us or cares about us he’s in it for the money, like most owners in this league. 

Like I said money doesn’t automatically buy you success when you haven’t got a clue how to work or operate in what ever industry you buy into you end up like us failing, he’s made a catalogue of errors misjudgments and come out with ridiculous statements about players, it’s quite frankly embarrassing the position this club finds its self in since he arrived. 

And let’s not credit him for the stadium it was on the horizon along time before he arrived, and if Kenwright sold to someone else it would be in the same position as a is now. 

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54 minutes ago, StevO said:

Any billionaire who’s in football for the money is an idiot, no one makes money owning a football club anymore. It costs them a fortune, unless you own Man Utd and you leverage your assets it’s very very hard to make money and be competitive at the same time. 

I don’t see why you think we are failing Palfy? Yeah haven’t won anything but we aren’t any worse off than we were under Bill. We’re just about the same, but with a bit of muscle in the market. 

Of course they make money some might not see very much until they sell, and some take millions out of the clubs each year as well, they don’t buy for the love of the game they buy for the investment on the basis they can make a club be worth considerably more than they paid for it. And to think Moshiri is here for the love of the club or football in general is ridiculous trust me Steve he’s here to make a lot of money on his investment  

The trouble with him is he thought it would be easy by throwing money at it and it hasn’t worked, why because he doesn’t know what he’s doing he reminds me of the banking sector of 90s and 00s just throw money at people and it will come back in droves, financially the club is technically in a worse position than before he came in it owes millions to him and the banks, the money for Stones Lukaku and others has been literally thrown away about 150 million then he loaned us 100 million whether that all went on players who knows, but we have spent 300 million on players since he arrived god knows what we’ve spent on top of that in managers and football directors.

That’s why we are worse off than before he arrived 350-400 million spent on playing staff and playing the worse football I’ve seen for years and we’re not worse off were the same no way mate it’s a lot worse all the way through the club and going by this season we haven’t hit the bottom of the big hole he’s bought us yet.

Yes the club did need someone to come in but we ended up with a totally clueless dick another Fred the shred he’s responsible for every manager since he arrived, I could go on for ever but I’m boring myself now he as proven to be a calamitous owner and in my opinion we haven’t paid the final price of his fuck ups but to many just see the pound signs and not the performance of what his money has or should I say hasn’t done. 

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1 hour ago, StevO said:

These billionaires do it for the bravado, for their ego, so they can tell their other rich mates they have a premier league football club to match the yacht. 

To say the club is in a worse financial state is ridiculous, have you read the last two years accounts? We are financially stronger. He put money in, with loans that have no repayment date and no interest. We were paying millions in interest alone for the last twenty years. 

As a businessman surely you can see the difference he has made to how the company is now run? The complete corporate restructure, removing poor performance and bringing in experts in their fields. Yes the on field performance has been poor, he hired the managers, but that’s all he’s guilty of as far as I’m concerned. I know plenty of other shareholders who feel a whole lot more comfortable with what he’s doing than they have for the last two decades of amateurs running the club. People like Denise and Sasha are making a difference, he needs Brands to make the difference on the pitch now. 

But Steve there still debts that have to be repaid when he chooses to call them in, he’s an account mate he knows how to make accounts look good that’s his job, trust me he’s here for the money you paint him as some friendly benefactor of the club he’s not like you said he’s a business man not a football man but his big ego as you pointed out is that he thinks he’s a football man and that’s the reason with all the money we are worse off. 

Who’s the owners he’s having a friendly competition with its not the owners of Arsenal Chelsea Utd or City they are well above his league when it comes to wealth, he couldn’t even get an audience with Kronke.

yes I do own my own businesses and I run them well that’s because I know my industry if I ran my company’s like he’s run this club I would have been bankrupt years ago, you seem to think he’s playing with his own money and the club a free from any of the costs, well it’s all at  the risk of the club the club have loaned the money from him and the banks and sold their best assets to support his fuck up, we are in a far worse position financially. 

And I'm a supporter not a shareholder or a employee I'm someone who has supported this club for nearly 52 years I’ve been a season ticket holder a couple of times now I go to the odd games most away from home than home, and I would like to become a season ticket holder again hopefully in the new stadium, but he has to be the most incompetent owner in the PL and in all my years as a supporter I have never felt as low as I do now about the club and I squarely lay that at his door it’s a complete and utter embarrassment what he’s done since joining shocking truly  abysmal. 

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We aren’t in a worse position though Palfy. 

You may feel more despondent and down, but I suggest that’s more to going on, on the pitch rather than off it. And that’s clouding your judgment. 

We can only go on the accountancy sheets submitted. And they say that we are in a healthier position than we have been for a good few years. The club set up is in a much more healthy position also. We have a good structure and this will help us in regards to stadium and expansion. 

Not all businessmen are cold hard ass’s. Some enjoy what they do. Some do it to show they are capable of doing it. Some do it for others. 

Mom not arguing whether or not Moshiri has the acumen to run this club or not, for me the jury is still out. But we ARE in a better position financially than pre Moshiri.

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1 hour ago, Shukes said:

We aren’t in a worse position though Palfy. 

You may feel more despondent and down, but I suggest that’s more to going on, on the pitch rather than off it. And that’s clouding your judgment. 

We can only go on the accountancy sheets submitted. And they say that we are in a healthier position than we have been for a good few years. The club set up is in a much more healthy position also. We have a good structure and this will help us in regards to stadium and expansion. 

Not all businessmen are cold hard ass’s. Some enjoy what they do. Some do it to show they are capable of doing it. Some do it for others. 

Mom not arguing whether or not Moshiri has the acumen to run this club or not, for me the jury is still out. But we ARE in a better position financially than pre Moshiri.

Ok post the accounts pre Moshiri and now. 

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3 hours ago, Palfy said:

But Steve there still debts that have to be repaid when he chooses to call them in, he’s an account mate he knows how to make accounts look good that’s his job, trust me he’s here for the money you paint him as some friendly benefactor of the club he’s not like you said he’s a business man not a football man but his big ego as you pointed out is that he thinks he’s a football man and that’s the reason with all the money we are worse off. 

Who’s the owners he’s having a friendly competition with its not the owners of Arsenal Chelsea Utd or City they are well above his league when it comes to wealth, he couldn’t even get an audience with Kronke.

yes I do own my own businesses and I run them well that’s because I know my industry if I ran my company’s like he’s run this club I would have been bankrupt years ago, you seem to think he’s playing with his own money and the club a free from any of the costs, well it’s all at  the risk of the club the club have loaned the money from him and the banks and sold their best assets to support his fuck up, we are in a far worse position financially. 

And I'm a supporter not a shareholder or a employee I'm someone who has supported this club for nearly 52 years I’ve been a season ticket holder a couple of times now I go to the odd games most away from home than home, and I would like to become a season ticket holder again hopefully in the new stadium, but he has to be the most incompetent owner in the PL and in all my years as a supporter I have never felt as low as I do now about the club and I squarely lay that at his door it’s a complete and utter embarrassment what he’s done since joining shocking truly  abysmal. 

As a supporter of 34 years, season ticket holder of over ten and a shareholder (I think 16 years but I’m not sure) I’ve seen the club in a much worse state than this, pretty much every year Bill owned the club we were worse off and run with a very low standard of expectation at the top of the club. I’ve seen that all change massively since he’s come in. The risks may be the clubs, but the greater the clubs risk the less his shares are worth, which then puts the risk back on his toes too.

You know I’ll always respect your opinion and you’re fully entitled to it, I just completely disagree with every single point you’ve made. We won’t change each other’s view, so not worth us carrying on the debate. I hope he proves you wrong and I’m sure you’ll be happy about it if he does.

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1 hour ago, Palfy said:

Ok post the accounts pre Moshiri and now. 

They used to be on the club website, I think the shareholders association still keep them on the website though. 

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1 minute ago, StevO said:

As a supporter of 34 years, season ticket holder of over ten and a shareholder (I think 16 years but I’m not sure) I’ve seen the club in a much worse state than this, pretty much every year Bill owned the club we were worse off and run with a very low standard of expectation at the top of the club. I’ve seen that all change massively since he’s come in. The risks may be the clubs, but the greater the clubs risk the less his shares are worth, which then puts the risk back on his toes too.

You know I’ll always respect your opinion and you’re fully entitled to it, I just completely disagree with every single point you’ve made. We won’t change each other’s view, so not worth us carrying on the debate. I hope he proves you wrong and I’m sure you’ll be happy about it if he does.

Fully agree and of course it goes with out saying I would be delighted to be proved wrong, and I hope you get a good return on your shares if you ever decide to sell. 

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1 hour ago, StevO said:

As a supporter of 34 years, season ticket holder of over ten and a shareholder (I think 16 years but I’m not sure) I’ve seen the club in a much worse state than this, pretty much every year Bill owned the club we were worse off and run with a very low standard of expectation at the top of the club. I’ve seen that all change massively since he’s come in. The risks may be the clubs, but the greater the clubs risk the less his shares are worth, which then puts the risk back on his toes too.

You know I’ll always respect your opinion and you’re fully entitled to it, I just completely disagree with every single point you’ve made. We won’t change each other’s view, so not worth us carrying on the debate. I hope he proves you wrong and I’m sure you’ll be happy about it if he does.

 

1 hour ago, Palfy said:

Fully agree and of course it goes with out saying I would be delighted to be proved wrong, and I hope you get a good return on your shares if you ever decide to sell. 

Waaaaaay to civil for me. 

Someone throw a punch! 

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2 hours ago, Palfy said:

Fully agree and of course it goes with out saying I would be delighted to be proved wrong, and I hope you get a good return on your shares if you ever decide to sell. 

Can’t sell them really, well, it. I’ve got one share, it was a gift from an auntie who isn’t with us anymore. My Dad has one too. May be a hostile take over one day haha

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12 hours ago, Palfy said:

Usmanov was on the board Moshiri tried to get on the board for years they wouldn’t have him I wonder why that was not hard to work out really is it, so he comes here because he wants to be involved with a PL club not because he supports us or cares about us he’s in it for the money, like most owners in this league. 

Like I said money doesn’t automatically buy you success when you haven’t got a clue how to work or operate in what ever industry you buy into you end up like us failing, he’s made a catalogue of errors misjudgments and come out with ridiculous statements about players, it’s quite frankly embarrassing the position this club finds its self in since he arrived. 

And let’s not credit him for the stadium it was on the horizon along time before he arrived, and if Kenwright sold to someone else it would be in the same position as a is now. 

Usmanov has never been on the Board at Arsenal has he?

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16 hours ago, Haiku said:

They don't need to know anything. Do you think Mansour knows how to run a club? These stupid Arab cheikhs can't manage a newspaper kiosk if there isn'ttt someone who do it for them.

Don’t know about that, what they have done around Manchester is really  impressive. Bit harsh to call them stupid 

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5 minutes ago, duncanmckenzieismagic said:

Usmanov has never been on the Board at Arsenal has he?

I thought he had maybe I’m wrong and getting mixed up with he was the 2nd largest shareholder, have you looked ? I haven’t if so let me know. 

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16 minutes ago, duncanmckenzieismagic said:

Usmanov has never been on the Board at Arsenal has he?

Just looked and your right he hasn’t been on the board Arsenals set up is or was fairly strange. 

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22 minutes ago, Palfy said:

Just looked and your right he hasn’t been on the board Arsenals set up is or was fairly strange. 

I told you that a few posts back,  he’s the same thing as moshiri.  Give me your next candidate please since he offers no known improvement.

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1 hour ago, Finn balor said:

Don’t know about that, what they have done around Manchester is really  impressive. Bit harsh to call them stupid 

I meant they have the right people to do the job and the cheikh is there to provides the funds. I don't think Mansour alone takes important decisions at City. 

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1 hour ago, Palfy said:

Just looked and your right he hasn’t been on the board Arsenals set up is or was fairly strange. 

Usmanov has impressive portfolio, just look at all the businesses he started or is/was involved in. Moshiri is just an accountant, I believe Usmanov will know better how to run a club, because let's face it... Being an owner of football club is a business above anything else.

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1 hour ago, markjazzbassist said:

I told you that a few posts back,  he’s the same thing as moshiri.  Give me your next candidate please since he offers no known improvement.

He’s not my candidate for anything you can’t put people forward to buy football clubs it doesn’t work like that, the club gets put up for sale then people who are interested make an offer you don’t go round saying you’ve got to make an offer. 

And why is it that when someone says they don’t think the owner the manager or certain players are right or good enough for the club, the stock reply is who we going to get then as if we should be lucky to have anyone and accept failures because no one who’s any good would possibly want to come to our club, what rubbish that sort believe is that there’s no one better for us than Moshiri or Silva even though there doing so poor. 

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1 hour ago, Palfy said:

He’s not my candidate for anything you can’t put people forward to buy football clubs it doesn’t work like that, the club gets put up for sale then people who are interested make an offer you don’t go round saying you’ve got to make an offer. 

And why is it that when someone says they don’t think the owner the manager or certain players are right or good enough for the club, the stock reply is who we going to get then as if we should be lucky to have anyone and accept failures because no one who’s any good would possibly want to come to our club, what rubbish that sort believe is that there’s no one better for us than Moshiri or Silva even though there doing so poor. 

Moshiri has made mistakes in manager appointments, but he has rectified this by appointing Brands giving him control over signings and making him his footballing brain, as well as a seat on the board.

With regards to the running of the club Moshiri has replaced the board with what I can see experts and removed idiots like Elstone. He has progressed our move to a new stadium and funded improvements to Finch Farm.

Moshiri is doing well in my opinion.

Silva as has been discussed ad nauseam, I still believe he needs time, and will be a successful manager for us.

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13 hours ago, Palfy said:

But Steve there still debts that have to be repaid when he chooses to call them in, he’s an account mate he knows how to make accounts look good that’s his job, trust me he’s here for the money you paint him as some friendly benefactor of the club he’s not like you said he’s a business man not a football man but his big ego as you pointed out is that he thinks he’s a football man and that’s the reason with all the money we are worse off. 

Who’s the owners he’s having a friendly competition with its not the owners of Arsenal Chelsea Utd or City they are well above his league when it comes to wealth, he couldn’t even get an audience with Kronke.

yes I do own my own businesses and I run them well that’s because I know my industry if I ran my company’s like he’s run this club I would have been bankrupt years ago, you seem to think he’s playing with his own money and the club a free from any of the costs, well it’s all at  the risk of the club the club have loaned the money from him and the banks and sold their best assets to support his fuck up, we are in a far worse position financially. 

And I'm a supporter not a shareholder or a employee I'm someone who has supported this club for nearly 52 years I’ve been a season ticket holder a couple of times now I go to the odd games most away from home than home, and I would like to become a season ticket holder again hopefully in the new stadium, but he has to be the most incompetent owner in the PL and in all my years as a supporter I have never felt as low as I do now about the club and I squarely lay that at his door it’s a complete and utter embarrassment what he’s done since joining shocking truly  abysmal. 

But if the club does badly he loses money. So he has to improve us on and off the pitch to make  a profit on his investment. So for me it’s a win win. 

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19 hours ago, StevO said:

Any billionaire who’s in football for the money is an idiot, no one makes money owning a football club anymore. It costs them a fortune, unless you own Man Utd and you leverage your assets it’s very very hard to make money and be competitive at the same time. 

I don’t see why you think we are failing Palfy? Yeah haven’t won anything but we aren’t any worse off than we were under Bill. We’re just about the same, but with a bit of muscle in the market. 

Surprised how many people have liked this when it's demonstrably wrong. Just because someone structures a company in the most tax effective way ie to appear as though it's losing money does not mean its cost them anything when the value of it's shares are going through the roof.

This is not just football, CEO's don't give a shit about paying dividends, they just want to grow the business.

 

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7 hours ago, London Blue said:

Moshiri has made mistakes in manager appointments, but he has rectified this by appointing Brands giving him control over signings and making him his footballing brain, as well as a seat on the board.

With regards to the running of the club Moshiri has replaced the board with what I can see experts and removed idiots like Elstone. He has progressed our move to a new stadium and funded improvements to Finch Farm.

Moshiri is doing well in my opinion.

Silva as has been discussed ad nauseam, I still believe he needs time, and will be a successful manager for us.

And the cow 🐄 jumped over the moon 🌓 

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17 minutes ago, Shukes said:

There’s no need to mate, you read them just like everyone else did. You already know I’m right.

Your not right do the maths on what we have spent since he arrived on players wages and management, against the extra income the club is generating, and then tell me how we are better off financially. 

We are getting a few Million more on sponsorship deals from shirt sponsors and training ground sponsor and the revenue from the league went up slightly but will now start to go down slightly, just the compensation payments to Martinez Koeman Allardyce Walsh and their entourage have cost millions more than what ever they generated against what we were getting for the same items before he joined. 

Then there’s the spend of 300 million on players against the revenue of about 135 million of sales, then there’s the the cost of club wages that have spiralled by the region of 25% since he joined, that loss is being born by the club in forms of loans from him and other institutions but they have to be repaid, so how can we be better off financially when our out going’s a far out stripping our income?  

I await your response with bated breath, but trust me on this you are wrong because the purchases we have brought have a value to go against off setting the debt that’s how you balance the books you fabricate to a degree that your assets are bigger than your debts, but in reality we know that the 300 million he has over seen on the acquisition of players we will only see a fraction of that back if we could sell them players, but we can’t even give them away because of the huge wages he signed off, but in the accounts they will be written as assets on what we paid for them and know one can argue with that because he will say that’s what we paid so that what they are worth to the business. 

Without appearing to be rude or arrogant if after what I said people still believe we are financially richer than when he arrived you are clearly delusional and probably Brexit voters 😂

But get back to me Shukes it’s fair that you can post I’m wrong but show me the figures and enlighten me to were I’ve gone wrong?

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7 hours ago, Chach said:

Surprised how many people have liked this when it's demonstrably wrong. Just because someone structures a company in the most tax effective way ie to appear as though it's losing money does not mean its cost them anything when the value of it's shares are going through the roof.

This is not just football, CEO's don't give a shit about paying dividends, they just want to grow the business.

 

What are you talking about? 🤷🏼‍♀️

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57 minutes ago, Palfy said:

Your not right do the maths on what we have spent since he arrived on players wages and management, against the extra income the club is generating, and then tell me how we are better off financially. 

We are getting a few Million more on sponsorship deals from shirt sponsors and training ground sponsor and the revenue from the league went up slightly but will now start to go down slightly, just the compensation payments to Martinez Koeman Allardyce Walsh and their entourage have cost millions more than what ever they generated against what we were getting for the same items before he joined. 

Then there’s the spend of 300 million on players against the revenue of about 135 million of sales, then there’s the the cost of club wages that have spiralled by the region of 25% since he joined, that loss is being born by the club in forms of loans from him and other institutions but they have to be repaid, so how can we be better off financially when our out going’s a far out stripping our income?  

I await your response with bated breath, but trust me on this you are wrong because the purchases we have brought have a value to go against off setting the debt that’s how you balance the books you fabricate to a degree that your assets are bigger than your debts, but in reality we know that the 300 million he has over seen on the acquisition of players we will only see a fraction of that back if we could sell them players, but we can’t even give them away because of the huge wages he signed off, but in the accounts they will be written as assets on what we paid for them and know one can argue with that because he will say that’s what we paid so that what they are worth to the business. 

Without appearing to be rude or arrogant if after what I said people still believe we are financially richer than when he arrived you are clearly delusional and probably Brexit voters 😂

But get back to me Shukes it’s fair that you can post I’m wrong but show me the figures and enlighten me to were I’ve gone wrong?

Nice post. As a businessman yourself you should know it’s better to use few, but important words. 

Financial accounts are simple. They tell you if your business is successful or not. Ours for the last year have shown an improvement over the last few years. 

Its not me writing them, just the facts. I know you don’t like facts, that’s fine. But they are facts nonetheless.

Quick point on your balancing off accounts. Players are an asset. You don’t spend that money and it disappears, it’s an asset to your business. Again, owning your own business, you should know this. 

Some we will make a loss on, some we could make a profit on if we sold them. But they are still an asset.

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And there’s no point in paying the accounts as we have a thread on them already, it shows increased revinue. Increased sponsorship, extra sponsorship, better loan repayments.

Im surprised you haven’t looked at them yourself, as your using them to support your argument.

But I would be happy for you to post them here again for me. Football is on TV and I’m too lazy.

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1 hour ago, Shukes said:

And there’s no point in paying the accounts as we have a thread on them already, it shows increased revinue. Increased sponsorship, extra sponsorship, better loan repayments.

Im surprised you haven’t looked at them yourself, as your using them to support your argument.

But I would be happy for you to post them here again for me. Football is on TV and I’m too lazy.

Shukes I’ve already highlighted those increases but they pair into significants we you look at the expenditure and loans whether interest free or other, it’s creative accounting based on the clubs assets primarily that the players such as Santo Balasie Schneiderlin and all the others that  he paid millions for and put on big contracts are worth what we paid for them. 

But the truth is we know have a bigger debt than before he came with a shed load of expensive over paid shit to show for it, and the money from Lukaku Stones Barkley Cleverly Funes and Rooney has been flushed down the toilet by the incompetence of Moshiri.

Instead of giving us an interest free loan of a 100 and something million on top of other loans, he should be holding his hands up saying I’ve fucked up my decisions have cost the club more than I’ve lent I’m going to write it off as a bad debt then I might have some respect for him, but he won’t do that because he’s here for the money not the love of the club. 

And by the way Shukes did you vote Brexit ? 

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3 hours ago, London Blue said:

Palfy you appear to of caught Haff disease, please seek the urgent medical and physiological help you clearly need.

We need to prevent this from spreading so please do not infect other threads 🤣🤢 

Okay don’t open your eyes and you won’t be infected by reality 👍😂

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7 minutes ago, Palfy said:

Okay don’t open your eyes and you won’t be infected by reality 👍😂

My eyes are open Palfy, that's how I recognise your symptoms.

Maybe time for you to readjust the silver foil hat you have started wearing...😂🤯

 

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38 minutes ago, Palfy said:

Shukes I’ve already highlighted those increases but they pair into significants we you look at the expenditure and loans whether interest free or other, it’s creative accounting based on the clubs assets primarily that the players such as Santo Balasie Schneiderlin and all the others that  he paid millions for and put on big contracts are worth what we paid for them. 

But the truth is we know have a bigger debt than before he came with a shed load of expensive over paid shit to show for it, and the money from Lukaku Stones Barkley Cleverly Funes and Rooney has been flushed down the toilet by the incompetence of Moshiri.

Instead of giving us an interest free loan of a 100 and something million on top of other loans, he should be holding his hands up saying I’ve fucked up my decisions have cost the club more than I’ve lent I’m going to write it off as a bad debt then I might have some respect for him, but he won’t do that because he’s here for the money not the love of the club. 

And by the way Shukes did you vote Brexit ? 

But it’s not a new loan Palfy, we already had a loan. We were paying over the odds interest and Moshiri brought that down by giving us better terms. That’s smart business.

I voted remain. I’m a small business man and it made no sense to me to leave.

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16 minutes ago, Shukes said:

But it’s not a new loan Palfy, we already had a loan. We were paying over the odds interest and Moshiri brought that down by giving us better terms. That’s smart business.

I voted remain. I’m a small business man and it made no sense to me to leave.

Remain fair play mate you have got some redeeming features 😉

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Hey guys you seem worried about the "loans". These are actually investments recorded as loans. That's because Moshiri owns about 70% of the shares. Making investment benefit all the shareholders. That means if he want to get his money back he can't without splitting them with other shareholders. By recording these investment as a loan, Moshiri keeps a hand on his money so he can pull them out when he decides without owning a cent to other shareholders. Meanwhile the club is not paying any interests whatsoever, and is not making any repayments just yet. There's no end date as well. Seems fair to me. Was he a sole owner of Everton these loans would have been proper investments.

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20 minutes ago, Shukes said:

But it’s not a new loan Palfy, we already had a loan. We were paying over the odds interest and Moshiri brought that down by giving us better terms. That’s smart business.

I voted remain. I’m a small business man and it made no sense to me to leave.

Right now we are getting some where he did give us an interest free loan the loan is getting bigger than the loan it paid off but there is no interest so that is good, but do not forget on top of that he had about 150 million in receipts from sales yet we still have massive debt and bunch of over paid shit players that we can’t give away. 

Brands was brought in primarily to clean up the shit he created, but the devastation Moshiri as created is that bad that Brands is struggling to get rid of the players brought in, and the ones that have left have gone for a lot less than we paid for them, and the ones out on loan we are substituting their wages because the clubs that are prepared to take them can’t and don’t pay anywhere near what we give them. 

I standby that we are financially worse off since he joined, and footballing wise the same we are poorer since he joined and thrown 300 million on players and about 40 on managers and DoF, for that sort of money to have been spent you wouldn’t be wrong in expecting to be challenging to top 5 instead of being closer to the bottom 5. 

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5 minutes ago, Haiku said:

Hey guys you seem worried about the "loans". These are actually investments recorded as loans. That's because Moshiri owns about 70% of the shares. Making investment benefit all the shareholders. That means if he want to get his money back he can't without splitting them with other shareholders. By recording these investment as a loan, Moshiri keeps a hand on his money so he can pull them out when he decides without owning a cent to other shareholders. Meanwhile the club is not paying any interests whatsoever, and is not making any repayments just yet. There's no end date as well. Seems fair to me. Was he a sole owner of Everton these loans would have been proper investments.

They are down as loans so the debt is the clubs he can call those loans in anytime of his choosing, the money we owe him is bigger than what we owed the banks and on top of that we have spent the money that we received in sales, so it would be more than fair to say we are financially in a worse position than when he joined. 

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46 minutes ago, Palfy said:

They are down as loans so the debt is the clubs he can call those loans in anytime of his choosing, the money we owe him is bigger than what we owed the banks and on top of that we have spent the money that we received in sales, so it would be more than fair to say we are financially in a worse position than when he joined. 

He can't. The money are already spent on assets. The club can generate those money through sales, but that would get us into bancruptcy and falling off the premier league with Moshiri losing a lot more money he invested through buying the major stake of shares and the huge money club generates as a PL participant.

Your arguments are saying that Newcastle is the club with best financial stability and people living in a trailer are in better financial position, because they don't have a mortgage.

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14 minutes ago, Haiku said:

He can't. The money are already spent on assets. The club can generate those money through sales, but that would get us into bancruptcy and falling off the premier league with Moshiri losing a lot more money he invested through buying the major stake of shares and the huge money club generates as a PL participant.

Your arguments are saying that Newcastle is the club with best financial status and people living in a trailer are in a better financial position, because they don't have a mortgage.

Of course I’m not what I’m saying is if you go out and buy 300 million pounds worth of players that are now potentially worth less than 50-60% of that value now has to put you financially in a worse position than you were in before you bought them, regardless of were the money come from. 

Working on your scenario of mortgage it’s the same principle you go out and buy a house for 200,000 you get a mortgage for 180,000 then the property market crashes and your house which is your asset falls to a 120,000 you then become on paper financially worse off, if you wish to sell you become worse off in the pocket because you have no asset yet a 60,000 debt. 

It doesn’t matter how you dress it up you are financially in a worse position. 

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4 hours ago, StevO said:

The more I’ve had that conversation the more I think I would love it. 

I want Everton to be horrible and hated. 

We are already horrible, you want us to be hated as well?

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Players aren’t in the accounts as regular assets, but their transfer costs are spread across the length of their first contract. So a £50m player with a four year contract will be amortised at £12.5m per year for four years. So if you sell them after four years they are technically a profit. 

Just putting that in if it helps. 

Also, selling players doesn’t come straight in either. It comes in based on the payment plan as almost no one pays up front in full. So sales of people like Lukaku will be spread over maybe three or four years accounts. Stones is probably a single payment as City are happy to pay in full. 

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39 minutes ago, plaidharper said:

Puel gone. That is probably Sarri gone. Didn’t see them leaving before Silva. 

It’s a results industry there paid massive money to get results, big game Tuesday if we lose that after Cardiff got smashed 5-1 at home to Watford he must surly get the push. 

Something is afoot to much speculation going on especially with the bookies and there not usually wrong. 

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3 hours ago, Makis said:

We are already horrible, you want us to be hated as well?

We aren’t horrible, shit yeah, but not horrible. Of course I want us to be hated, did you not grow up hating Man Utd because they won everything and were aggressive on the pitch? I know I did. Then Chelsea were the same. 

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1 minute ago, StevO said:

We aren’t horrible, shit yeah, but not horrible. Of course I want us to be hated, did you not grow up hating Man Utd because they won everything and were aggressive on the pitch? I know I did. Then Chelsea were the same. 

Yes and Liverpool when Souness was there kicking the shit out of us. 

We are now looked upon by other clubs as a good chance to get 3 points. 

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19 minutes ago, Palfy said:

Yes and Liverpool when Souness was there kicking the shit out of us. 

We are now looked upon by other clubs as a good chance to get 3 points. 

Exactly!! And dirty Leeds! I’d love us to be hated and feared. 

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34 minutes ago, StevO said:

Players aren’t in the accounts as regular assets, but their transfer costs are spread across the length of their first contract. So a £50m player with a four year contract will be amortised at £12.5m per year for four years. So if you sell them after four years they are technically a profit. 

Just putting that in if it helps

Also, selling players doesn’t come straight in either. It comes in based on the payment plan as almost no one pays up front in full. So sales of people like Lukaku will be spread over maybe three or four years accounts. Stones is probably a single payment as City are happy to pay in full. 

Well no, as you said further down your post it depends on the payment plan whether it's a single payment or spread in installments over 2-3-4 years, but once you bought that player it doesn't matter when you sell him, you owe the money accordingly to the payment plan even when the player is no longer at your club. I think we still owe money to Ajax for Klaassen.

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16 minutes ago, StevO said:

And dirty Leeds!

Too much that, if we became like Revie's Leeds I'd struggle to support us; but then I'm old enough to remember them unlike your good self.

Take your point though.

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6 minutes ago, MikeO said:

Too much that, if we became like Revie's Leeds I'd struggle to support us; but then I'm old enough to remember them unlike your good self.

Take your point though.

Billy Bremner probably the horribles player I’ve ever seen a nasty dangerous piece of work more a thug than a footballer, and Norman Hunter would cut you in half with a wild tackle than let you pass him. 

We don’t want people like that in the game anymore. 

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2 hours ago, StevO said:

Players aren’t in the accounts as regular assets, but their transfer costs are spread across the length of their first contract. So a £50m player with a four year contract will be amortised at £12.5m per year for four years. So if you sell them after four years they are technically a profit. 

Just putting that in if it helps. 

Also, selling players doesn’t come straight in either. It comes in based on the payment plan as almost no one pays up front in full. So sales of people like Lukaku will be spread over maybe three or four years accounts. Stones is probably a single payment as City are happy to pay in full. 

 

1 hour ago, Haiku said:

Well no, as you said further down your post it depends on the payment plan whether it's a single payment or spread in installments over 2-3-4 years, but once you bought that player it doesn't matter when you sell him, you owe the money accordingly to the payment plan even when the player is no longer at your club. I think we still owe money to Ajax for Klaassen.

From memory you can choose whether to declare the full amount in the accounts or spread it.

Think it was highlighted in the past when we put Fellaini's fee as just the first installment but had used the full fee we would eventually get for whatever player we sold that year to balance the books. 

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