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markjazzbassist

Watford (Home) Saturday August 17th

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First home game a win is the only result we should accept.  Gonna be tough in the midfield with Morgan out and Delph/Gomes working to get healthy.  If they aren’t fit it will be Davies I imagine, Marco loves the 433.  Here’s what I think we will see

 

                      Pickford

coleman keane Mina digne

  Gomes/Delph/Davies   Gbamin

    Richarlison gylfi    Bernard

                           DCL

                

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Id like Gylfi next to Gomes with Gbamin in between. We need Gylfi on the ball more - he was definitely rusty against palace when he’s involved it’s generally quality.

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                  Gbamin

               Gomes  Gylfi

Richarlison            Bernard

                      DCL

that for me please. 

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11 hours ago, Btay said:

Id like Gylfi next to Gomes with Gbamin in between. We need Gylfi on the ball more - he was definitely rusty against palace when he’s involved it’s generally quality.

I agree with this. Not a massive fan of what I have seen from Siggy deeper, at least defensively, but he is undoubtedly a quality player and the more he is on the ball the better. Looking at the Palace game Siggy had 37 touches in the 72ish minutes he was on the pitch. Gomes had 42 in about 40 minutes. 

The problem is that we aren't Man City and we don't have 60%+ possession every game (albeit we did against Palace) and therefore we don't necessarily always have the luxury of doing that with someone who isn't exactly mobile.

Weirdly just looking at the pitch map for the average position and Siggy was further forward than DCL. Problem number 1 right there. DCL should be the one stretching the game and Siggy should be finding the spaces between the lines.

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1 minute ago, Bailey said:

I agree with this. Not a massive fan of what I have seen from Siggy deeper, at least defensively, but he is undoubtedly a quality player and the more he is on the ball the better. Looking at the Palace game Siggy had 37 touches in the 72ish minutes he was on the pitch. Gomes had 42 in about 40 minutes. 

The problem is that we aren't Man City and we don't have 60%+ possession every game (albeit we did against Palace) and therefore we don't necessarily always have the luxury of doing that with someone who isn't exactly mobile.

Weirdly just looking at the pitch map for the average position and Siggy was further forward than DCL. Problem number 1 right there. DCL should be the one stretching the game and Siggy should be finding the spaces between the lines.

Gylfi doesn’t need to be a good tackler to defend though. His best attribute after his shooting (weekend aside) is his work rate. If he is a little further back he’ll guide people into those who can tackle just by pestering them or force people to reconsider their options and play it back. 

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4 hours ago, Matt said:

Gylfi doesn’t need to be a good tackler to defend though. His best attribute after his shooting (weekend aside) is his work rate. If he is a little further back he’ll guide people into those who can tackle just by pestering them or force people to reconsider their options and play it back. 

I agree, again look at City they have De Bruyne and the Silva's doing the same thing but it's more his mobility and then his attitude to defending. The latter I think is fine albeit he will get it wrong (ie wrong side of the man, diving in, not tracking a man) but if he is beaten he is completely out of the game. Gomes is similar too and therefore you need a bloody good DM to sort out the problems. If that's Schneiderlin then you have 3 statues. Then again, it was those 3 at the weekend and they did a very good job in stopping Palace do pretty much anything in the game. When you play a better side thats when you will see the problem more. Gbamin at least looks more mobile, as is Delph.

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1 hour ago, Bailey said:

I agree, again look at City they have De Bruyne and the Silva's doing the same thing but it's more his mobility and then his attitude to defending. The latter I think is fine albeit he will get it wrong (ie wrong side of the man, diving in, not tracking a man) but if he is beaten he is completely out of the game. Gomes is similar too and therefore you need a bloody good DM to sort out the problems. If that's Schneiderlin then you have 3 statues. Then again, it was those 3 at the weekend and they did a very good job in stopping Palace do pretty much anything in the game. When you play a better side thats when you will see the problem more. Gbamin at least looks more mobile, as is Delph.

I really don’t get the mobility criticism. He’s not quick off the mark but he reads play well so would be in position. He’s also not slow!

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1 hour ago, Matt said:

I really don’t get the mobility criticism. He’s not quick off the mark but he reads play well so would be in position. He’s also not slow!

In his position you need a quick brain and quick feet, he has both.

He had a poor game against Palace, but hi was consistently one of our best players last season.

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2 hours ago, Matt said:

I really don’t get the mobility criticism. He’s not quick off the mark but he reads play well so would be in position. He’s also not slow!

I understand in relation to when he was played on the wing. Generally the technical/silky players shy away from the physical stuff - Gylfi gets in and scraps which is why I’d have no issue him deeper. I think with Gbamin between him and Gomes we could really lock up the centre and allow the wingers to stay a bit further up. For all DCL’s lack of goals - he can look after the and bring others into it - Kean looks the same but more so with the ball to feet. 

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2 hours ago, Matt said:

I really don’t get the mobility criticism. He’s not quick off the mark but he reads play well so would be in position. He’s also not slow!

You see it with Gomes quite a lot. Someone like Gana is hard to get past because even you are half way past him he still has the mobility to get back at you. 

If you get past Gomes and more so Siggy you are through and attacking the heart of the defence.

Then you need to add in the prospect of both attacking and defending counter attacks. When I said previously he will be fine if we control the ball that's because he will be predominantly be playing in their half in controlled possession where he isn't running the length of the pitch or exposed on his own where an opposition player can just take it round him. It happens too, seen it when he plays for us on the odd occasion deeper and for Iceland.

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13 hours ago, Matt said:

I really don’t get the mobility criticism. He’s not quick off the mark but he reads play well so would be in position. He’s also not slow!

One of the greatest defenders of all time, Paulo Maldini is quoted as saying "If I have to make the tackle, I have already made the mistake". He made a career at the top of the game for sniffing out chances and stopping moves before they happened, reading the game and being one step ahead. 

Sergio Busquets, arguably one of the best holding midfielders of the decade isn't the fastest but constantly gets himself in the right place at the right time to protect the back four. Being a good defensive player isn't about running fast and last ditch tackles as by doing so there has obviously been an issue that's allowed players to run in behind. 

I'd take tortoises all day at Everton if they could be in the right place at the right time. Speed doesn't come into it for me.

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1 hour ago, Zoo 2.0 said:

One of the greatest defenders of all time, Paulo Maldini is quoted as saying "If I have to make the tackle, I have already made the mistake". He made a career at the top of the game for sniffing out chances and stopping moves before they happened, reading the game and being one step ahead. 

Sergio Busquets, arguably one of the best holding midfielders of the decade isn't the fastest but constantly gets himself in the right place at the right time to protect the back four. Being a good defensive player isn't about running fast and last ditch tackles as by doing so there has obviously been an issue that's allowed players to run in behind. 

I'd take tortoises all day at Everton if they could be in the right place at the right time. Speed doesn't come into it for me.

I had Barry in mind to be honest :lol: 

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5 hours ago, Zoo 2.0 said:

One of the greatest defenders of all time, Paulo Maldini is quoted as saying "If I have to make the tackle, I have already made the mistake". He made a career at the top of the game for sniffing out chances and stopping moves before they happened, reading the game and being one step ahead. 

Sergio Busquets, arguably one of the best holding midfielders of the decade isn't the fastest but constantly gets himself in the right place at the right time to protect the back four. Being a good defensive player isn't about running fast and last ditch tackles as by doing so there has obviously been an issue that's allowed players to run in behind. 

I'd take tortoises all day at Everton if they could be in the right place at the right time. Speed doesn't come into it for me.

There is a massive amount of difference between the quality of players you have mentioned, not to mention different leagues and different positions. You can deal with a lack of pace at CB especially in Italy, you can deal with a lack of pace when playing as a DM especially when the team you play for sees a lot of the ball. You try and play Pirlo or Busquets box to box or Maldini in a high press, average possession team and then see how good they look. They won't suddenly become crap players but they will show their physical limitations far more regularly.

On the whole though I would agree with you. I would rather have smart players over quick or strong ones but if you want to see the best from those smart players you need to build a team around them that will cover for their limitations. That is the only reason I can think of as to why Siggurdson isn't a central midfielder. 

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You need your workers and battlers and you also need your cultured play makers, and you very rarely find players now who possess it all, I would say the last player we had who had everything in his armoury was Arteta.

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Gomes a doubt aswell. Marco said that it’s JPG and Morgan competing for the one position so if Gomes isn’t fit with Delph does that mean a change of formation or does gilfi drop into Gomes position? 

                      Gilfi     JCP  

charly.              Bernard        Iwobi

                           Kean

or is it 

              Gilfi         JPG      Bernard

              Charly       Kean    Iwobi 

fucking wellbeck could start tommorow aswell. 🤯

 

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Well, since Morgan will be banned for a game, competition isn’t really the word :lol: 

wasn’t Welbeck reported to have a long term ankle injury just the other day?!

i do like the second lineup though 

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3 minutes ago, Sibdane said:

Not going to lie, I feel a sense of rivalry with them too after the last couple of years. They've moved up in my "book" of teams I don't like.

I'm sure we are becoming a big rival to them. But then again between the hammer and the nail,.only the nail sees it as a rivalry.

 

Channeling my inner Ted Lasso and saying we win by a field goal, 4-1. Siggy, Richy, Siggy, Kean and Gerry for them. 

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6 minutes ago, markjazzbassist said:

I want a win COYB first game I’ll be able to watch I’m so excited

Lucky git. I’m stuck in the office again tomorrow but with any luck not working this Sunday 

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13 minutes ago, Ghoat said:

I'm sure we are becoming a big rival to them. But then again between the hammer and the nail,.only the nail sees it as a rivalry.

 

Channeling my inner Ted Lasso and saying we win by a field goal, 4-1. Siggy, Richy, Siggy, Kean and Gerry for them. 

First time I've heard that. I'm saving it.

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8 hours ago, Finn balor said:

Gomes a doubt aswell. Marco said that it’s JPG and Morgan competing for the one position so if Gomes isn’t fit with Delph does that mean a change of formation or does gilfi drop into Gomes position? 

                      Gilfi     JCP  

charly.              Bernard        Iwobi

                           Kean

or is it 

              Gilfi         JPG      Bernard

              Charly       Kean    Iwobi 

fucking wellbeck could start tommorow aswell. 🤯

 

I'd expect Davies and JPG to sit. Siggy might play as a 3 as well but I expect it will play in his normal position. 

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21 minutes ago, Bailey said:

I'd expect Davies and JPG to sit. Siggy might play as a 3 as well but I expect it will play in his normal position. 

My thoughts exactly. It will be Davies, Gbamin, and Gylfi, unless Gomes is fit, which I highly doubt.

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Pickford 

Coleman Keane Mina Digne 

Gbamin 

Richarlison Davies Gomes Iwobi 

DCL

If we're looking at blooding Gbamin in I'd pack the midfield to help give him more options and minimise the risk of him getting caught out. If he looks comfortable then bring Kean on second half to switch it up a gear. 

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7 hours ago, pete0 said:

Pickford 

Coleman Keane Mina Digne 

Gbamin 

Richarlison Davies Gomes Iwobi 

DCL

If we're looking at blooding Gbamin in I'd pack the midfield to help give him more options and minimise the risk of him getting caught out. If he looks comfortable then bring Kean on second half to switch it up a gear. 

I wouldn’t mind seeing that starting line up especially Iwobi and Kean I can’t wait to see what impact they have on the team.

 I really hope Kean gets at least 30 minutes today so we can properly evaluate his readiness for this league. 

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18 hours ago, Sibdane said:

Not going to lie, I feel a sense of rivalry with them too after the last couple of years. They've moved up in my "book" of teams I don't like.

I wouldn't call it a rivalry as such as for that to happen both teams need to give a shit, I think Watford are far more obsessed with us than we are of them. Even when they were building up to the FA Cup Final last summer when we weren't even involved they had to start crying to the BBC presenters about how we cheated our way past them in '84. Add into the mix that they bizarrely stole Z-Cars to walk out to, despite playing in yellow and the embarrassing inflatable balloons that they brought all the way from London I think it's clear to see the mentality of the fanbase. 

I think it's a bit of bitterness to be honest, one whisper of interest about their manager and he was off and took Richarlison with him. Their local derby is Luton Town, so understandably need to fill the gap with someone to hate while the two teams are seperated. 

Edit: Just got to the ground, flag on every seat which is going to look class for when the teams come out. Not sure why but the Upper Bullens is the only section without them.

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6 minutes ago, Zoo 2.0 said:

bizarrely stole Z-Cars to walk out to, despite playing in yellow an

Is z cars colour related? All I know is it was a TV show and a few of the cast attended a game. 

As for the rivalry I guess it would be similar to us with Lescott but a bit less intense. 

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