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StevO

At Petes request, a poll.

At Petes request, are we better off without Gana?  

33 members have voted

  1. 1. Are we better off without Gana?

    • Yes
      5
    • No
      28


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It’s to early to say on the playing front, but because I was given no option but to make a yes or no decision now, I would have to say yes based on the fact he wanted to leave, and no one can convince me  that having players that have publicly said they want to leave is good for the dynamics of the team, so yes we are better off and if truth be known that was why he was allowed to leave. 

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2 hours ago, StevO said:

So from the other thread, Pete thinks “most” have changed their mind on Gana and now think similar to him. 

 

2 hours ago, Matt said:

Can you an option of “too early to tell”? Can’t do it on my phone. 

That would defeat the question in the poll, which is "are we better off" (present tense); what may or may not happen down the line is conjecture so inadmissible. Objection denied👨‍⚖️.

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6 minutes ago, MikeO said:

 

That would defeat the question in the poll, which is "are we better off" (present tense); what may or may not happen down the line is conjecture so inadmissible. Objection denied👨‍⚖️.

Then I can’t answer the question 

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On the pitch - No. But happy to have the money we had for him in context of age and yrs of contract remaining. Plus we paid peanuts for him and PSG aren't exactly a small or similar competing club as us.

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7 minutes ago, pete0 said:

Today Gomes held the midfield together when we were under the cosh. If we had Gana next to Gbamin no doubt we'd have given away more chances than we did today. 

Gbamin was Gana’s replacement so that’s an unlikely scenario. Gana would have done a better job than Gbamin today but that’s not to say that Gbamin won’t develop into a player of Gana’s quality.

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40 minutes ago, c1982 said:

Gbamin was Gana’s replacement so that’s an unlikely scenario. Gana would have done a better job than Gbamin today but that’s not to say that Gbamin won’t develop into a player of Gana’s quality.

Gbamin is the DM, Gomes moved into the CM role. Either way both offered more than just pressing. Gana isn't as comfortable in the ball as either or as solid positionally. All he would have added is the unpredictability of running round like a headless chicken and giving needless free kicks away. Today I was bored second half, which is a step up from fearing the big gaps Gana used to leave. 

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Just now, pete0 said:

Gbamin is the DM, Gomes moved into the CM role. Either way both offered more than just pressing. Gana isn't as comfortable in the ball as either or as solid positionally. All he would have added is the unpredictability of running round like a headless chicken and making me fear we're gonna concede whereas today I was more bored second half which is much better than fearing the big gaps Gana used to leave. 

Marco talks about Gbamin replacing Gana, Gana was the more defensive of the two last year. Gomes hasn’t moved into any role, he’s carried on with the same role he had last season. Nothing has changed in the set up. The only difference is Gbamin is not pressing from the front. 

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5 minutes ago, StevO said:

Marco talks about Gbamin replacing Gana, Gana was the more defensive of the two last year. Gomes hasn’t moved into any role, he’s carried on with the same role he had last season. Nothing has changed in the set up. The only difference is Gbamin is not pressing from the front. 

Gbamin is the one getting between the defenders to pick up the ball. That was Gomes' role last year, with Gana further forward. 

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Not better off, not worse. On basis of first two games we look to have picked up exactly where we finished last season, defensively solid, could do with being a bit more clinical up top. 

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5 hours ago, MikeO said:

 

That would defeat the question in the poll, which is "are we better off" (present tense); what may or may not happen down the line is conjecture so inadmissible. Objection denied👨‍⚖️.

But far too early to pose that question when we had only played one game at the time of asking, should have been asked midway through the season to get a fair assessment. 

But I can see why it wasn’t the Ganaretts may  have looked silly saying no when in 19 games time it might be an obvious yes.

So inconclusive or should it be yes because the result against Palace away last year was exactly the same as this year without him in the team, so therefore that is conclusive evidence we didn’t miss him, so go straight to jail and do not pass go. 

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8 minutes ago, Palfy said:

But far too early to pose that question when we had only played one game at the time of asking, should have been asked midway through the season to get a fair assessment. 

But I can see why it wasn’t the Ganaretts may  have looked silly saying no when in 19 games time it might be an obvious yes.

So inconclusive or should it be yes because the result against Palace away last year was exactly the same as this year without him in the team, so therefore that is conclusive evidence we didn’t miss him, so go straight to jail and do not pass go. 

Feel free to ask the question after 19 games, you might get a different result:).

Unless we follow the Brexit model where emerging evidence/opinion/knowledge is ignored and stick blindly to the initial uninformed outcome:otvwhistle:.

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1 minute ago, MikeO said:

Feel free to ask the question after 19 games, you might get a different result:).

Unless we follow the Brexit model where emerging evidence/opinion/knowledge is ignored and stick blindly to the initial uninformed outcome:otvwhistle:.

😂👍

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I think your asking the wrong question. 

We haven’t just lost Gana. We have made a few really good signings. If we had Gana, and all these signings, then we would be better off than we are now.

Do I think the new team and structure will be better? Yes I do. We have better options, we have more depth, and we have players that can only improve.

Having DCL on for 70 minutes and managing to change him for Kean was great to see, and gives us our fabled plan B.

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2 hours ago, pete0 said:

Today Gomes held the midfield together when we were under the cosh. If we had Gana next to Gbamin no doubt we'd have given away more chances than we did today. 

Don’t spoil it please.

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1 minute ago, Shukes said:

I think your asking the wrong question. 

We haven’t just lost Gana. We have made a few really good signings. If we had Gana, and all these signings, then we would be better off than we are now.

Do I think the new team and structure will be better? Yes I do. We have better options, we have more depth, and we have players that can only improve.

Having DCL on for 70 minutes and managing to change him for Kean was great to see, and gives us our fabled plan B.

Yeah and just imagine if we reversed the DCL Kean comment we may have got a couple more goals. 

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15 minutes ago, MikeO said:

Feel free to ask the question after 19 games, you might get a different result:).

Unless we follow the Brexit model where emerging evidence/opinion/knowledge is ignored and stick blindly to the initial uninformed outcome:otvwhistle:.

Isn’t that what we’ve been doing with the Ps for the last twelve months haha?

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Just now, Palfy said:

Yeah and just imagine if we reversed the DCL Kean comment we may have got a couple more goals. 

I think the manager played it perfect mate.

They were set up to defend DCL and we changed it around. If they were set up to defend Kean it may have been a completely different game for him.

Marco got us 3 points and a clean sheet. 

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1 hour ago, pete0 said:

Gbamin is the one getting between the defenders to pick up the ball. That was Gomes' role last year, with Gana further forward. 

You still do not understand the idea of a player defending from the front. 

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6 minutes ago, Shukes said:

Isn’t that what we’ve been doing with the Ps for the last twelve months haha?

Only 12 Gana had been pissing me off for 24 but mercifully the bad days are now over, and I will be able to watch a game without worrying about what is next fuck up is going to be 😉

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1 minute ago, Palfy said:

Only 12 Gana had been pissing me off for 24 but mercifully the bad days are now over, and I will be able to watch a game without worrying about what is next fuck up is going to be 😉

Don’t worry mate.... like Brexit, we’ll keep doing the poll again until people give up and just agree with you to shut you up 😉

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18 minutes ago, StevO said:

You still do not understand the idea of a player defending from the front. 

You mean like Gylfi and DCL? 

Gana runs head first regardless and leaves us exposed. Your yet to name another player at cm who does... 

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41 minutes ago, pete0 said:

You mean like Gylfi and DCL? 

Gana runs head first regardless and leaves us exposed. Your yet to name another player at cm who does... 

I won’t name another because I disagree it’s headless and believe it’s tactical. But you think a player can only be a defensive midfielder if they sit behind the other midfielders. Our last few managers, and PSG, understand though. 

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8 minutes ago, StevO said:

I won’t name another because I disagree it’s headless and believe it’s tactical. But you think a player can only be a defensive midfielder if they sit behind the other midfielders. Our last few managers, and PSG, understand though. 

I'm asking to name another team that do it. If it's tactics surely you can find one team that does it. 

Walsh was a stats idiot, he wanted Gana over Kante and just got lucky at Leicester that Villa bought him (note: Gana played a massive part in them going down and are the only team that come close to clear chances through the middle like we had with Gana). Alladyce inherited a team with very little energy and did look to replace him. Silva didn't want him, and was happy for him to go, pending a replacement. 

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1 hour ago, pete0 said:

I'm asking to name another team that do it. If it's tactics surely you can find one team that does it. 

Walsh was a stats idiot, he wanted Gana over Kante and just got lucky at Leicester that Villa bought him (note: Gana played a massive part in them going down and are the only team that come close to clear chances through the middle like we had with Gana). Alladyce inherited a team with very little energy and did look to replace him. Silva didn't want him, and was happy for him to go, pending a replacement. 

I don’t watch enough other teams to know their tactics to know what their midfielders do. But just because someone else doesn’t do it doesn’t make it bad. What I do know is that all of our managers he played for, the sports media and PSG all agree with me on this. 

Silva didn’t want him? 😂

Alardyce tried to replace him? I missed that. 

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16 minutes ago, StevO said:

I don’t watch enough other teams to know their tactics to know what their midfielders do. But just because someone else doesn’t do it doesn’t make it bad. What I do know is that all of our managers he played for, the sports media and PSG all agree with me on this. 

Silva didn’t want him? 😂

Alardyce tried to replace him? I missed that. 

The media used to bum Joe Hart, you know that lad who's now in his prime yet found himself as third choice at Burnley last year. As for PSG he's not got on the pitch for them yet, although even Stoke's finest double double barrel Jean-Eric Choupo-Moting gets game time for them so there's hope for Gana yet. 

There's 100s of teams. You watch at least 19 others a year for I assume 20 years plus. You'd think another in that time would have done it or copied if it was a good tactic. 

Must have a very short memory. 

15 minutes ago, StevO said:

Update. Currently 88% of voters think we are not better off without Gana. 

Would help if you framed the question and thread name better. Looks more a popularity contest as there was definitely more than 3 happy to see him go as the team will be more balanced. 

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I thought a new season, the player whom I shall not name gone we may have a whole different more exciting debate .......how wrong was I? Any way the forum can delete any post with g word in it? 😂

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1 hour ago, pete0 said:

Would help if you framed the question and thread name better. Looks more a popularity contest as there was definitely more than 3 happy to see him go as the team will be more balanced. 

Then as I asked in the other thread, who?

the rest of your post, we will never agree. I have seen other teams for at least 90 minutes per season, not enough where I could tell you how they play or tactical patterns in their play. The high pressing hasn’t been massive over the last 20 years, but I’ve been watching football a fair bit longer than that, so I don’t know many others who have played in that style. 

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10 minutes ago, StevO said:

Then as I asked in the other thread, who?

the rest of your post, we will never agree. I have seen other teams for at least 90 minutes per season, not enough where I could tell you how they play or tactical patterns in their play. The high pressing hasn’t been massive over the last 20 years, but I’ve been watching football a fair bit longer than that, so I don’t know many others who have played in that style. 

Unsure but there was definitely more than three of us. Gana thread is very short after his move, and I'll be damned if you expect me to search the multiple random threads that all the after talk is in. 

That's a lot of football to not be able to name one. Closest I can think is Kante who has moved from DM to CM this year but he's smarter in his positioning and closing down. He wasn't solely a defender from the front, he gave more going forward connecting the defence with attack and got 4x as many goals and assists to Gana 8 to 2 respectively. (Kante's biggest flaw was his sloppy forward passes but that was to be expected given it was a new responsibility). Going through the league there wasn't many CMs with the minutes Gana had and so little contribution offensively. Defensively I've never seen a team give such good chances away through the middle than the Everton Gana, and Villa Gana teams (at the time I thought Sanchez was a joke but after seeing Gana turn Schneiderlin into a pasty I can see I noticed the wrong man when watching Villa's demise).

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I am with matt on this  may as well ask if we are better off without Joe Mercer  yes I know he is dead and buried now  but he used to platy for us as did gana

 

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3 hours ago, barryj said:

I thought a new season, the player whom I shall not name gone we may have a whole different more exciting debate .......how wrong was I? Any way the forum can delete any post with g word in it? 😂

Gomes🤷‍♂️

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2 hours ago, pete0 said:

Unsure but there was definitely more than three of us. Gana thread is very short after his move, and I'll be damned if you expect me to search the multiple random threads that all the after talk is in. 

Seve was very critical of Gana and posted very good arguments to back up his position. 

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16 hours ago, pete0 said:

Gbamin is the one getting between the defenders to pick up the ball. That was Gomes' role last year, with Gana further forward. 

Yesterday that was still, most definitely Gomes' role, and not Gbamin's. Gomes could've had a cup of tea with Keane and Mina.

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5 hours ago, Palfy said:

You could have gone to Specsavers and you would have seen it’s not interesting. 

I know that, just read your last comment! It’s like watching David Brent look in a mirror when you two speak!

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40 minutes ago, Shukes said:

I know that, just read your last comment! It’s like watching David Brent look in a mirror when you two speak!

I know I look in the mirror sometimes and I think my work is done here, I’m like Jesus really and I’m spreading the word on how poor Gana is. 

I’m not just confined to TT I’m bigger than that I might live in Reading but I know the worlds a bigger place Bracknell Woking Slough even Newbury isn’t that far away, and it’s my job to educate the world about poor footballers, that’s why I see my life as modern Jesus, I probably had a better start than him he was a back street carpenter odd job man really, I’ve climbed the ranks of top management I know how to make people listen and take everything I say on board not many could do what I do probably not even Jesus. 

Is that David Brent enough for you Shukes ( Aka Jesus )

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Personally I think we are about the same, but to be honest it's far too early to assess right now. Have to say, this fence I'm sitting on is nice and comfy.

 

 

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How is this question even being asked yet? On paper it would indicate no but only time will tell, pointless even asking this now. Should be asked midway through / end of the season.

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On 18/08/2019 at 13:08, Palfy said:

We beat Watford at home yesterday without Gona and drew 2-2 last season with Gona, surly more evidence so early on that we don’t miss him. 

Or the draw with Palace means there’s no change? 🤦‍♂️

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8 minutes ago, barryj said:

Or the draw with Palace means there’s no change? 🤦‍♂️

I did highlight that draw some posts back which again proves we didn’t miss him, because we never lost and the result was the same he wasn’t missed. 

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18 minutes ago, Palfy said:

I did highlight that draw some posts back which again proves we didn’t miss him, because we never lost and the result was the same he wasn’t missed. 

Only a simpleton would suggest corresponding results one season after the next were proof of the impact of a single player.

And I'd never suggest you were a simpleton Palf.....maybe.

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On 19/08/2019 at 16:18, aaron said:

How is this question even being asked yet? On paper it would indicate no but only time will tell, pointless even asking this now. Should be asked midway through / end of the season.

It's taken its inspiration from the Brexit referendum, we all have to vote with absolutely no clue as to how things will pan out. As such nobody will be allowed to change their minds when they observe the reality of his performances for PSG and there will be no second vote under any circumstances.

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