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Palfy

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The lockdown in Wuhan, the Chinese city where the global coronavirus outbreak began, will be partially lifted on 8 April, officials say.

Travel restrictions in the rest of Hubei province, where Wuhan is located, will be lifted from midnight on Tuesday - for residents who are healthy.

A single new case of the virus was reported in Wuhan on Tuesday following almost a week of no reported new cases at all.

 

A light at the end of the tunnel.  ??

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3 hours ago, Bill said:

The lockdown in Wuhan, the Chinese city where the global coronavirus outbreak began, will be partially lifted on 8 April, officials say.

Travel restrictions in the rest of Hubei province, where Wuhan is located, will be lifted from midnight on Tuesday - for residents who are healthy.

A single new case of the virus was reported in Wuhan on Tuesday following almost a week of no reported new cases at all.

 

A light at the end of the tunnel.  ??

They did have a complete lockdown early which has obviously worked, what everyone will be watching for is when they relax restrictions is if they start getting a second spike, if not that would prove that going in to full lockdown works, and that Italy and Spain with much smaller populations have had more deaths because they left it to late. 

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1 hour ago, Tonsta said:

You actually believe what the chinese say, was it a whistle blower, only way you get the truth from them. 

 

16 minutes ago, holystove said:

I agree, those Chinese numbers are very suspect. Whistleblower reports speakof 40.000+ deaths.  We'll never know.

Not entirely sure how China would gain by fabricating numbers.

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7 hours ago, MikeO said:

 

Not entirely sure how China would gain by fabricating numbers.

I'm surprised by your comment.  Creating the illusion that your response is the best one to a crisis is page one in the authoritarian playbook.   

1) They want to keep Chinese people convinced there is no reason to question the leadership, that everything is under control.  That the communist regime is the only regime that had a good handle on the crisis.  Just look at all those capitalist countries with their thousands of deaths...

2) They want to project to the rest of the world how superior their model of government is.  They want countries to look at China as the leader of the world, and the first 'superpower' countries should look to for help and guidance.

It is easy to say in hindsight, but it's becoming clear China mishandled this crisis from the beginning.  This could be their Chernobyl, but as it is China we'll never know for sure how much they knew, when they knew it, and what they could (should) have done.

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7 hours ago, holystove said:

I'm surprised by your comment.  Creating the illusion that your response is the best one to a crisis is page one in the authoritarian playbook.   

1) They want to keep Chinese people convinced there is no reason to question the leadership, that everything is under control.  That the communist regime is the only regime that had a good handle on the crisis.  Just look at all those capitalist countries with their thousands of deaths...

2) They want to project to the rest of the world how superior their model of government is.  They want countries to look at China as the leader of the world, and the first 'superpower' countries should look to for help and guidance.

It is easy to say in hindsight, but it's becoming clear China mishandled this crisis from the beginning.  This could be their Chernobyl, but as it is China we'll never know for sure how much they knew, when they knew it, and what they could (should) have done.

If that was the case why aren’t we hearing these stories from the people of China, being leaked to journalists through the internet or by another medium. 
China has become a lot more transparent in the last 20 years it’s had to be to become a trading super power, I agree that they still let’s say keep there cards very close to there chests, but I don’t see how they can hide the number of deaths you are talking about from there own citizens which in turn wouldn’t be leaked to the west. 
That’s my view but I could easily be wrong, and the fact that we are not hearing this in the wider media I don’t feel I am. 

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59 minutes ago, Palfy said:

If that was the case why aren’t we hearing these stories from the people of China, being leaked to journalists through the internet or by another medium. 
China has become a lot more transparent in the last 20 years it’s had to be to become a trading super power, I agree that they still let’s say keep there cards very close to there chests, but I don’t see how they can hide the number of deaths you are talking about from there own citizens which in turn wouldn’t be leaked to the west. 
That’s my view but I could easily be wrong, and the fact that we are not hearing this in the wider media I don’t feel I am. 

Become a lot more transparent?! We only really get to see what they want us to see, to give this impression they are becoming more transparent. The cover up of the doctor who died from the virus is the latest evidence 

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10 minutes ago, Matt said:

The cover up of the doctor who died from the virus is the latest evidence 

In away that echoes what I’m saying if they struggle to hide the death of one doctor without it being proven and leaked to the west, how are they possible hiding the fact that they’ve had 40,000 plus deaths and saying they’ve only had 3,000 plus. 
I just can’t see what they would gain by trying to do so.

If they have and are that’s a strange one for me. 

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33 minutes ago, Palfy said:

In away that echoes what I’m saying if they struggle to hide the death of one doctor without it being proven and leaked to the west, how are they possible hiding the fact that they’ve had 40,000 plus deaths and saying they’ve only had 3,000 plus. 
I just can’t see what they would gain by trying to do so.

If they have and are that’s a strange one for me. 

 I believe at that point they had had 500+ deaths already, but even then it was still “leaked” if I remember correctly 

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3 hours ago, Palfy said:

If that was the case why aren’t we hearing these stories from the people of China, being leaked to journalists through the internet or by another medium. 
China has become a lot more transparent in the last 20 years it’s had to be to become a trading super power, I agree that they still let’s say keep there cards very close to there chests, but I don’t see how they can hide the number of deaths you are talking about from there own citizens which in turn wouldn’t be leaked to the west. 
That’s my view but I could easily be wrong, and the fact that we are not hearing this in the wider media I don’t feel I am. 

here's one source https://www.nationalreview.com/news/wuhan-residents-dismiss-official-coronavirus-death-toll-the-incinerators-have-been-working-around-the-clock/

here's how they covered up at the start https://www.ft.com/content/fa83463a-4737-11ea-aeb3-955839e06441

China is anything but transparant. With new technology it's becoming even worse, as their control over the population (including leakers) increases.  Look up the 'social credit system' they're implementing, scary stuff.

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36 minutes ago, holystove said:

here's one source https://www.nationalreview.com/news/wuhan-residents-dismiss-official-coronavirus-death-toll-the-incinerators-have-been-working-around-the-clock/

here's how they covered up at the start https://www.ft.com/content/fa83463a-4737-11ea-aeb3-955839e06441

China is anything but transparant. With new technology it's becoming even worse, as their control over the population (including leakers) increases.  Look up the 'social credit system' they're implementing, scary stuff.

the national review is a barely credible far right publication, i am very surprised you are using them.  it's american far right which is about as anti-China as it gets, i'm not at all surprised they would have an article like that.

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58 minutes ago, holystove said:

here's one source https://www.nationalreview.com/news/wuhan-residents-dismiss-official-coronavirus-death-toll-the-incinerators-have-been-working-around-the-clock/

here's how they covered up at the start https://www.ft.com/content/fa83463a-4737-11ea-aeb3-955839e06441

China is anything but transparant. With new technology it's becoming even worse, as their control over the population (including leakers) increases.  Look up the 'social credit system' they're implementing, scary stuff.

On our live government update today they were using what’s happening in China as a comparison to what’s happening here, I don’t want this to sound like I’m full of praise for China for all they do or say because I’m not, but surely the British government with all the secret services at there fingertips wouldn’t be publicly publishing the figures on Coronavirus in China if they didn’t think they were genuine, just a thought.

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12 minutes ago, Palfy said:

On our live government update today they were using what’s happening in China as a comparison to what’s happening here, I don’t want this to sound like I’m full of praise for China for all they do or say because I’m not, but surely the British government with all the secret services at there fingertips wouldn’t be publicly publishing the figures on Coronavirus in China if they didn’t think they were genuine, just a thought.

This government relies far too heavily on China for investment (as the tories don't believe in public spending other than their own fat expenses) so they're not in a good position to argue otherwise with the Chinese. 

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11 hours ago, markjazzbassist said:

the national review is a barely credible far right publication, i am very surprised you are using them.  it's american far right which is about as anti-China as it gets, i'm not at all surprised they would have an article like that.

Did not know that about the national review.   There's other publications reporting the same though.  Point is, China's numbers are very unlikely.  Very poor hygiene, a cover up to start the epidemic, millions cooped together and still only 3000 deaths... Add to that China has lied about everything and anything negative happening within its borders in the past.   If you go by the numbers there's another country that is even more impressive than China, North Korea with 0 deaths.

To answer Palfy's point, just because their numbers might not be correct, doesn't mean you can't learn something from what you do know for certain about their approach.

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14 hours ago, markjazzbassist said:

the national review is a barely credible far right publication, i am very surprised you are using them.  it's american far right which is about as anti-China as it gets, i'm not at all surprised they would have an article like that.

Media bias has them as right biased but mostly factual, which is entirely possible unless you view conservatism as a mental illness.

https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/national-review/

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1 hour ago, Chach said:

Media bias has them as right biased but mostly factual, which is entirely possible unless you view conservatism as a mental illness.

https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/national-review/

If you look at credible sources on that site (Like NPR)  you will see them only listed in the “very high” setting.  National review is 2 below that.  Not something I would trust especially on a China hit piece,  but to each their own.

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19 hours ago, markjazzbassist said:

If you look at credible sources on that site (Like NPR)  you will see them only listed in the “very high” setting.  National review is 2 below that.  Not something I would trust especially on a China hit piece,  but to each their own.

Thing is mate I would believe a right biased US news publication before anything the Chinese government was telling us, remember they currently have a couple of million Uighur Muslims in concentration camps for "re-education" 

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5 hours ago, Chach said:

Thing is mate I would believe a right biased US news publication before anything the Chinese government was telling us, remember they currently have a couple of million Uighur Muslims in concentration camps for "re-education" 

the country you live in had people in similar conditions on Manus Island (might still have them there).  USA has people in Guantanamo in cuba with no trial and torturing them daily.  we still take australia and usa info as credible.  no country is perfect (i'm not saying any of those actions are excuseable, they are not).  

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3 hours ago, Chach said:

Update, two days WFH and have to admit I'm being much more productive so far, although not enjoying the video meetings at all.

Harvard studies have shown working from home actually increases worker productivity.  I have been petitioning my work (before this crisis) to allow full work from home (i work remote 2 days a week usually) as a way for everyone to be more productive and have better work/life balance.  i'm hoping with this crisis and everyone working from home now they will see the benefits. Thankfully we aren't doing video meetings, just audio, i can understand how video meetings would be awful.  have you seen the tweet going round about the lady who goes to the bathroom during the video meeting not realizing everyone is watching her?  

 

https://www.inc.com/scott-mautz/new-harvard-research-says-its-time-to-let-employees-work-from-anywhere-the-productivity-gains-alone-are-impressive.html 

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