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robin.jones

Long Balls Are A Waste

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Very Impressed with our win tonight but we still insist on lobing the ball out of defence or midfield and hoping Vic and Aj can get on the end of it. I think this is a sympton of having our ball plaers (spud + Os) on the wings and so when nev or cars get it they try and lob it up fron.t Hopefully with Manny in the middle we have someone who takes his time under pressure not to just hoof it.

 

a few other points.

 

Spud is the bets playmaker in the prem.

Ossie seems to have added some purpose to his game and seems to have more an end product.

Big Vic although full or running and energy does not have the confidence/skill to hold the ball up

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Bobbyj ... "Big Vic although full or running and energy does not have the confidence/skill to hold the ball up"

 

...

 

Give the lad a break, I know he's made a few appearances as a sub but last night was only his 9th start for the team and he got battered all through the Game, elbows in the neck and knees in the back just like he did on saturday, and he's only 18years old or something. Ive said on another thread somewhere that he needs to work on his stamina cos he was knackered by half time, but he will get better, and by the time Vaughan comes back from injury he might be our leading Goalscorer.

He's a big strong lad and I think he has the strength to hold the ball up, but just needs time to work it up to the premier level, which i think will come with the experience of more games.

Thought he ran himself ragged last night, as they all did.

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His first touch is a bit heavy but the guy is only 18 and will improve over time.

 

I think he is a real handful - defenders hate playing against him. When he has the ball at feet in the penalty area - you aren't going to get the ball off him! He is sooo strong!

 

He looks to have a bit of a hard side too. He is not frightened by anyone. He absolutely battered that Boulha-asomething guy from Chelsea last season.

 

Man. I love our team!

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Long balls are not always a waste to be honest. Its good to mix it up a bit, as well as long balls we are more than capable of playing through the midfeild if need be.

 

Getting somehing from Spurs away is no walk in the park to be honest - Especially, when they have 3 strikers on the pitch.

 

Having Nellive and Carsley in the middle mean it really broke up Spurs offensive play, the starting objective I would have thought.

 

In the end, allthough Spurs had the majority of the possesion last night, we didn't allow them to do anything with it. Even as the 'defending' team (as Jol put it), we ended up with more (and better) chances on goal than a fancied Spurs side.

 

So

- pick up a 3-1 victory at a London club fancied for a top 4 place,

- Played 4-4-2 away to a decent team,

- Still limited their goal scoring chances,

- made plenty of goal scoring chances ourselves,

 

Difficult to have a go at the teams tactics last night if you as me. There will be probably plenty of chance to do that through the season. So a little perplexed reading this sort of thing this morning.

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Very Impressed with our win tonight but we still insist on lobing the ball out of defence or midfield and hoping Vic and Aj can get on the end of it. I think this is a sympton of having our ball plaers (spud + Os) on the wings and so when nev or cars get it they try and lob it up fron.t Hopefully with Manny in the middle we have someone who takes his time under pressure not to just hoof it.

 

a few other points.

 

Spud is the bets playmaker in the prem.

Ossie seems to have added some purpose to his game and seems to have more an end product.

Big Vic although full or running and energy does not have the confidence/skill to hold the ball up

 

Osman always has been a good player but only when he plays behind the strikers.

Victor will get better and better give him time, he's progressed alot since the westbrom game when he came off the bench.

When Manny comes we will play alot more along the floor IMO.

Neville + Cars both played good yesterday but they do hit to many long balls, if they could keep the ball a bit more it would help, we need a Zokora type player he was class yesterday, I think Manny will be our Zokora if he signs...

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2 points: What I should have said about Vic was last night he gave the ball away alot and also gave away alot of freekicks whera as Aj holds the ball well and passes it off. I think we need another stiker to play with AJ and use Vic sparingly. I agree he is a nightmare to play but he needs to think more about his game and play a bit more cleverly.

 

2nd point. I agree the played we'll and created alot of chances I just think we will play even better when manny replaces either cars or nev in the middle. I also think jagielka needs to be given a go at centre back while baines is out. I think stubbs should not be first chice as he gets shown up for pace far too often.

 

Oh and please don't get all moody cause I am knocking parts of the perfomance this is an opinion I am entitled too.

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Will agree with you about Stubbs, Jags is too good a player to warm the bench but he has to wait his turn.

2 wins out of two, so i wont be disappointed if he plays an unchanged team for the Reading Game. :)

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I just think the long ball games doesn't help our stikers AJ only got to about 1 in 10 of the long balls and vic even less. If we want to sue that as an option then we should be looking at a target man for AJ to play off and although Beattie wasn't the answer someone ni that mould would be.

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Nikola Zigic would have been the perfect striker to go with Johnson if anyone has seen him play, he's bigger than crouch, scores goals with feet and head. just the way we mix long and short balls he would win every ball because of how big he is.

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the long ball to AJ, i doubt is for him to win it in the air, more for him to run onto it, over the defenders head.

Vic is doing a good job, if another stiker comes in or when vaughan is fit i doubt he will be a starter.

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Agree that we play it too much but the long ball game ain't going to go away. Blame Graham Taylor, who had huge success with the tactic with Watford from 1977-87, working on the theory that if you pumped the ball into the opponents area enough times you'd score a few. Worked for them and it still works to an extent, everyone does it....I was amazed to see how often Manure did it at Goodison last season, playing balls for Shrek to chase down. Not pretty to watch but it's part of the game now sadly.

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Zigic is an unknown to most of us I guess. In terms of when vaughn comes back I see vaughn as slightly better than big vic and although they are good for the odd start and sub appearance I think moyes knows we need a ready made first team player. If he thought we only needed cover why is he bidding 10 mil for yakuba, He is not goign to break the transfer record for a bench player.

 

Anyway my point is we shouldn't be playing long ball at all and should be looking at a goal scorer to come in who is quick so we can play teams on the break with balls into the channels. How many times last night did AJ get a cross into the box from the wing we need a better finsher in the box to convert them

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After the Wigan game a post of mine questioned "why we played the long ball so much" and that we should keep it on the floor Etc.

What did I get in response? "we won be happy" "the long ball game is a good tactic" "Wigan are no pushovers" "Its one of Moyes' tactics" Etc Etc.

 

Now I find a thread about "long balls being a waste" AND many replies supporting this theory, I despair!

 

My point a few days ago was that we were playing WIGAN at home, and shouldnt need to resort to long balls.

Spurs away I would expect some long balls.

I fail to understand why some would defend long balls at home to Wigan and have a go at the long ball tactic Away at Spurs.

 

 

 

The mind boggles!!

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Sorry if this is a recreation of another thread I just see so many times when we get possession in midfield or defence and only certain players look to launch it up front where as players like ossie lescott and arteta take a touch and look up before just hoofing it. When we didn't just hoof it we looked like we could threaten them.

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it's only really neville, hibbert, carsley, and stubbs who look for the long ball all the time, if we get manny, when everyone is fit three of those players probably won't be in the team. i could'nt understand why jagelka did'nt start last night and hibbert did, was he not fully fit or something?

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i think jags looked very good when he came on, he took the ball down on a few occasions n got it on the floor. which considering arteta was the only other 1 doing that, was pretty relieving to see

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i could'nt understand why jagelka did'nt start last night and hibbert did, was he not fully fit or something?

 

DM likes to keep faith in a winning team, evidenced by starting this year with last seasons team which is fair enough I think. Once Jags gets in though I think he'll stay....

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After the Wigan game a post of mine questioned "why we played the long ball so much" and that we should keep it on the floor Etc.

What did I get in response? "we won be happy" "the long ball game is a good tactic" "Wigan are no pushovers" "Its one of Moyes' tactics" Etc Etc.

 

Now I find a thread about "long balls being a waste" AND many replies supporting this theory, I despair!

 

My point a few days ago was that we were playing WIGAN at home, and shouldnt need to resort to long balls.

Spurs away I would expect some long balls.

I fail to understand why some would defend long balls at home to Wigan and have a go at the long ball tactic Away at Spurs.

 

 

Wasn't it a long ball out of defence that sent Geoff Hurst away for "that"goal in the 66 world

cup final?....Plus numerous other things have been won with a"long"ball forward!!

Every team plays them now and again.....LIVE WITH IT!!

 

Sure at the moment with tiny AJ and Anichebe who at the moment isn't handling them that

well,it's not really working out that well,BUT!.....I guess you might be the first to moan when

Stubbs or Neville try to take full control of the ball and and do some wonderfull skill with it

before making a killer pass..........only to lose the ball under pressure and concede a goal!

Next thing you know the forums full of "just fuc%ing blast the ball forward.....stop playing

about with it".

 

Untill the whole team is ready to play the ball out every time,the long ball will continue!

As said it's not really working out too well at the moment......but hey!were winning.

 

Question!.....What if we bought a forward who was excellent at holding the ball,laying off

and flicking on!!....AND we came up against a team who it was obvious couldn't really handle

the "long ball".......What do we do?...NOT play the long ball because it's not nice to look at?

try and go through midfield because it's the way football should be played?

 

Come on!....Some times the long ball works......Just ask Geoff Hurst!

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After the Wigan game a post of mine questioned "why we played the long ball so much" and that we should keep it on the floor Etc.

What did I get in response? "we won be happy" "the long ball game is a good tactic" "Wigan are no pushovers" "Its one of Moyes' tactics" Etc Etc.

 

Now I find a thread about "long balls being a waste" AND many replies supporting this theory, I despair!

 

My point a few days ago was that we were playing WIGAN at home, and shouldnt need to resort to long balls.

Spurs away I would expect some long balls.

I fail to understand why some would defend long balls at home to Wigan and have a go at the long ball tactic Away at Spurs.

Wasn't it a long ball out of defence that sent Geoff Hurst away for "that"goal in the 66 world

cup final?....Plus numerous other things have been won with a"long"ball forward!!

Every team plays them now and again.....LIVE WITH IT!!

 

Sure at the moment with tiny AJ and Anichebe who at the moment isn't handling them that

well,it's not really working out that well,BUT!.....I guess you might be the first to moan when

Stubbs or Neville try to take full control of the ball and and do some wonderfull skill with it

before making a killer pass..........only to lose the ball under pressure and concede a goal!

Next thing you know the forums full of "just fuc%ing blast the ball forward.....stop playing

about with it".

 

Untill the whole team is ready to play the ball out every time,the long ball will continue!

As said it's not really working out too well at the moment......but hey!were winning.

 

Question!.....What if we bought a forward who was excellent at holding the ball,laying off

and flicking on!!....AND we came up against a team who it was obvious couldn't really handle

the "long ball".......What do we do?...NOT play the long ball because it's not nice to look at?

try and go through midfield because it's the way football should be played?

 

Come on!....Some times the long ball works......Just ask Geoff Hurst!

 

My comment of "Spurs away I would expect some long balls" suggests that I am not totally against the long ball tactic. Ofcourse they have a place and are a good tactic v some teams or in the last 5 or so minutes when chasing the game. My problem was that we used it too much at Home v Wigan, and I cant understand why that was overlooked yet v Spurs people are complaining about our long ball tactic. :rolleyes:

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Pat    2

I wont complain as watz left of my Brain has a tiny "Unsy & co, Whenever Dunc was ON horrible Wimbledon like" flashback area that arises whenver this topic is raised.

 

Whilst we are no way the perfect Footballing team, with much work 2 go -> We are better than we we was a cple of campaign's ago. :)

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Mr Bilic your talking absolute Tosh. What I actually said was if we need to have the long ball option n our side we need to replace beattie with a better version who can win headers and hold the ball up Vic and AJ cannot play that system and would bebetter with balls into feet or balls downt the channels I would hope moyes buys a stiker who is a bit of both wouild love us to have got ashton.

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