Finn balor Posted July 11, 2019 Report Share Posted July 11, 2019 I think if brands would have been here earlier DCL would have had a season on loan somewhere to get game time. Look at Harry Kane went on loan to Norwich and didn’t do owt. Spurs were looking at getting rid then it just clicked for him. DCL has said himself up to the age of about 16-17 he was a midfielder and got moved upfront and you can tell that from the way he plays as he knows what a midfielder wants from a forward. I think with him in positions he either over thinks things or he lacks the composure to finish clinically. I like him as a player. He puts a shift in and plays the game with a smile on his face and lets not forget he is a baby. We sign a Kean or a Leao I’d be well happy with that as our forward line Bailey, nutmegwolf203 and barryj 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Palfy Posted July 11, 2019 Report Share Posted July 11, 2019 He probably will be our number one striker again this season the way our transfer window is going, which if I’m being honest doesn’t fill me with much confidence in his ability to score goals. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted July 12, 2019 Report Share Posted July 12, 2019 16 hours ago, Bailey said: Personally I dont see anything from him that suggests he will score enough goals to warrant him starting every game this season. He has many other virtues but he has to score more to stay in the team for the long term. He can only do that if he’s allowed to play though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpartyBlue Posted July 12, 2019 Report Share Posted July 12, 2019 23 hours ago, Palfy said: He probably will be our number one striker again this season the way our transfer window is going, which if I’m being honest doesn’t fill me with much confidence in his ability to score goals. If I read correctly we didn’t sign our first player last year until July 24th and the vast majority would say we had an excellent window. A lot of players were gone for major tournaments as well. Patience. Matt, StevO, markjazzbassist and 1 other 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Finn balor Posted July 12, 2019 Report Share Posted July 12, 2019 Good point sparty Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bailey Posted July 12, 2019 Report Share Posted July 12, 2019 13 hours ago, Matt said: He can only do that if he’s allowed to play though. He has had quite a lot of opportunity for a lad his age in the last 2 seasons. Aside from opportunity, I just dont think he is a very good finisher. His technique isnt good enough to score many from long range, he doesnt really beat a man and therefore his goals largely have to come from others putting them on a sixpence for him. Palfy 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted July 13, 2019 Report Share Posted July 13, 2019 8 hours ago, Bailey said: He has had quite a lot of opportunity for a lad his age in the last 2 seasons. Aside from opportunity, I just dont think he is a very good finisher. His technique isnt good enough to score many from long range, he doesnt really beat a man and therefore his goals largely have to come from others putting them on a sixpence for him. His only real run was towards the end of last season, and (as I’ve said before) the entire team seemed to improve at the same time he got regular game play. I’ll stop here before I go around in circles markjazzbassist and Shukes 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bailey Posted July 13, 2019 Report Share Posted July 13, 2019 12 hours ago, Matt said: His only real run was towards the end of last season, and (as I’ve said before) the entire team seemed to improve at the same time he got regular game play. I’ll stop here before I go around in circles I should probably do the same but I have shown before that he has had runs of games before. I dont deny that we did improve as a team but I disagree over who was the chicken or egg and whilst he has many other virtues as I have also said, he doesnt score enough goals himself. Do you disagree with the points I made in my original 2nd paragraph? Btw I would love to be wrong because if I am we have a real player on our hands! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted July 13, 2019 Report Share Posted July 13, 2019 1 hour ago, Bailey said: I should probably do the same but I have shown before that he has had runs of games before. I dont deny that we did improve as a team but I disagree over who was the chicken or egg and whilst he has many other virtues as I have also said, he doesnt score enough goals himself. Do you disagree with the points I made in my original 2nd paragraph? Btw I would love to be wrong because if I am we have a real player on our hands! Not at all. His finishing is poor, but his role is what’s important Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Finn balor Posted July 13, 2019 Report Share Posted July 13, 2019 He might be the surprise of the season next year. I’ve got faith in him. We get a striker he can compete with. The finishing will come, he brings people into play Matt, nutmegwolf203 and Shukes 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shukes Posted July 14, 2019 Report Share Posted July 14, 2019 Didn’t someone show that if he would have played a full season he would have got about 20 goals? Doesn’t seem that bad to be fair. Have we had anyone get 20 Prem goals ever? I know Lukaku got close, but can’t remember if the top of my head if he hit 20. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Btay Posted July 14, 2019 Report Share Posted July 14, 2019 1 hour ago, Shukes said: Didn’t someone show that if he would have played a full season he would have got about 20 goals? Doesn’t seem that bad to be fair. Have we had anyone get 20 Prem goals ever? I know Lukaku got close, but can’t remember if the top of my head if he hit 20. I kind of showed that his tally of goals + assists would be about 20. Thing is I don’t care who scores the goals - our front 4 could get 12 each or we could get lukaku back and have 1 player score 15-20 Matt, StevO, Shukes and 1 other 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shukes Posted July 14, 2019 Report Share Posted July 14, 2019 11 minutes ago, Btay said: I kind of showed that his tally of goals + assists would be about 20. Thing is I don’t care who scores the goals - our front 4 could get 12 each or we could get lukaku back and have 1 player score 15-20 I’m the same mate. Not bothered about individual stats, just how Everton do. 100 goals shared by 100 players is still more than 50 goals shared between 2. Btay 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Palfy Posted July 14, 2019 Report Share Posted July 14, 2019 1 hour ago, Shukes said: Didn’t someone show that if he would have played a full season he would have got about 20 goals? Doesn’t seem that bad to be fair. Have we had anyone get 20 Prem goals ever? I know Lukaku got close, but can’t remember if the top of my head if he hit 20. That’s the problem with people posting stats all reality goes out the window, as with Matts he only had a real run at the end of the season. He played in 35 games last season 19 starts and 16 as a sub and scored 6 goals, how you equate that to if he played a full season he would have scored 20 goals I haven’t a clue that would have taken him 3 seasons roughly, and how Matt thinks that nearly half a season is just the end of the season again I don’t know . He has had plenty of opportunity to stake his claim in the team as a striker but hasn’t taken it his finishing is not good enough, his attempts on target are not good enough, his attempts of target are not good enough. He does have good attributes he’s getting stronger and hard to knock off the ball and he has a lot of pace, so try him in a different position possibly out wide or give him a shot in Gylfi’s position you never Know and Gylfi has no competition for his spot, but he’s no striker. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shukes Posted July 14, 2019 Report Share Posted July 14, 2019 Simple mate, people use a goals per minute ratio, and equate to that. If that person carries on the same consistency..... rest is a matter of mathematics. I see how and why, but don’t necessarily agree. Take for instance the expected goals farce. It’s just not how football works. And the expected goals per game showed that to be true. DCL should only be played up front though. Playing him in another position will be going backwards. If a player plays well on a position, you don’t move him somewhere else. Matt 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shukes Posted July 14, 2019 Report Share Posted July 14, 2019 And Matt was taking about a consistent run, not total matches. 19 starts through a season isn’t playing a whole half of a season continuously. You just woke up Palf? Matt 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted July 14, 2019 Report Share Posted July 14, 2019 7 minutes ago, Palfy said: That’s the problem with people posting stats all reality goes out the window, as with Matts he only had a real run at the end of the season. He played in 35 games last season 19 starts and 16 as a sub and scored 6 goals, how you equate that to if he played a full season he would have scored 20 goals I haven’t a clue that would have taken him 3 seasons roughly, and how Matt thinks that nearly half a season is just the end of the season again I don’t know . He has had plenty of opportunity to stake his claim in the team as a striker but hasn’t taken it his finishing is not good enough, his attempts on target are not good enough, his attempts of target are not good enough. He does have good attributes he’s getting stronger and hard to knock off the ball and he has a lot of pace, so try him in a different position possibly out wide or give him a shot in Gylfi’s position you never Know and Gylfi has no competition for his spot, but he’s no striker. Because Matt recognises that DCL only started regularly from Feb is the last 3rd of the season. All the other appearances were here and there which gives no chance for consistency. It’s not that complicated really. The other factor for the end of the season improvement was also Digne and Bernard getting an understanding. Shukes 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Palfy Posted July 14, 2019 Report Share Posted July 14, 2019 7 minutes ago, Shukes said: And Matt was taking about a consistent run, not total matches. 19 starts through a season isn’t playing a whole half of a season continuously. You just woke up Palf? He had a consistent run it wasn’t just 5 or 6 games at the end of the season, how many is just the end of the season for fuck 14 ,15 or 12 seems like it’s any figure to suit your argument that he didn’t have a fair run, and you didn’t answer the 20 goals a season bollocks, come on mate stop inventing numbers. Tell me when it’s your birthday ( that’s if you know because it involves figures) and I’ll buy you a calculator Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Palfy Posted July 14, 2019 Report Share Posted July 14, 2019 19 minutes ago, Matt said: Because Matt recognises that DCL only started regularly from Feb is the last 3rd of the season. All the other appearances were here and there which gives no chance for consistency. It’s not that complicated really. The other factor for the end of the season improvement was also Digne and Bernard getting an understanding. So is a third only the end of the season for me the end of the season would be 5 or 6 games, that’s when most people would be saying we are near the end of the season, I’ve never heard or seen anyone use that terminology when there is still 14 games to go until you posted it. I don’t want to dwell on that point just trying to add a bit of balance and perspective to what constitutes near the end of the season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shukes Posted July 14, 2019 Report Share Posted July 14, 2019 10 minutes ago, Palfy said: He had a consistent run it wasn’t just 5 or 6 games at the end of the season, how many is just the end of the season for fuck 14 ,15 or 12 seems like it’s any figure to suit your argument that he didn’t have a fair run, and you didn’t answer the 20 goals a season bollocks, come on mate stop inventing numbers. Tell me when it’s your birthday ( that’s if you know because it involves figures) and I’ll buy you a calculator First, read it mate. I said ... someone put it up.... I was pretty clear about that. Couldn’t be any clearer. Haha he even posted right after my post.... or you just reading posts in isolation? You got some fetish about trying to prove me wrong haven’t you x come on you can say it, we’re all big boys here xx Secondly. Yes I did answer it... again, very clearly. I even said that I didn’t necessarily agree with it, but I could easily see why people use those stats. Again.... couldn’t be any clearer. Also made my point very clear.... yawn.... it’s about the team and not the individual stats that count. I’m an Everton fan before any single player. You awake enough to understand now mate? Or should I call back after your morning coffee when your brain starts to work? Joking and sarcasm aside though. This argument has come up for numerous players over the years. Games here and there with no consistency isn’t a way to judge a player. When DCL did have a decent run... at the end of the season.... he played well and that corresponded with the team going on a good run of results. Now as Bailey has said, that may or may not be due to DCL, but facts are facts... he was playing, and we did go on a run. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimmytheJimster Posted July 14, 2019 Report Share Posted July 14, 2019 What we as a club are missing is a player that can score a goal out of nothing, and change a draw into a win. If DCL can do that then great, he'll save us a load of money. I personally would like to give him a full season as are main striker to see if he can do it, but I wouldn't be happy going into the new season with just one striker because we have no one else good enough. Palfy and Shukes 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Palfy Posted July 14, 2019 Report Share Posted July 14, 2019 53 minutes ago, Shukes said: When DCL did have a decent run... at the end of the season.... You can be a right bitch at times That’s my biggest issue you and others keep saying end of season as if he had a better shot at it he would have been better. I’m saying and standing by that his run started way before the end of the season, do your homework and look at when his continuous run started, then get back to me with what you discover and we’ll see I was right all along ( that’s my Brian Clough take on it ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Palfy Posted July 14, 2019 Report Share Posted July 14, 2019 5 minutes ago, JimmytheJimster said: What we as a club are missing is a player that can score a goal out of nothing, and change a draw into a win. If DCL can do that then great, he'll save us a load of money. I personally would like to give him a full season as are main striker to see if he can do it, but I wouldn't be happy going into the new season with just one striker because we have no one else good enough. I think Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimmytheJimster Posted July 14, 2019 Report Share Posted July 14, 2019 We ain't going to get a proven striker without champions league football, so do we take a risk on DCL or risk spending millions on an unproven striker for it not to work? Matt 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevO Posted July 14, 2019 Report Share Posted July 14, 2019 8 minutes ago, JimmytheJimster said: We ain't going to get a proven striker without champions league football, so do we take a risk on DCL or risk spending millions on an unproven striker for it not to work? Take a risk on Kean, if it doesn’t work out you’d still get most of the money back. I’d be more than happy having him and DCL switching, if one of them is scoring they keep their place. Could also give us a chance to play two up front in some games. DownUnderToff and Btay 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shukes Posted July 14, 2019 Report Share Posted July 14, 2019 36 minutes ago, Palfy said: You can be a right bitch at times That’s my biggest issue you and others keep saying end of season as if he had a better shot at it he would have been better. I’m saying and standing by that his run started way before the end of the season, do your homework and look at when his continuous run started, then get back to me with what you discover and we’ll see I was right all along ( that’s my Brian Clough take on it ) No I get you 100%. My point is that during this run, he did well and the team did well. Before that he wasn’t getting a run of games, and the team weren’t doing well at all. Would you rather we had a striker that could knock 49 goals a season, but the team did shit? I much prefer to have goals shared and the team climbing the league. Matt 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted July 14, 2019 Report Share Posted July 14, 2019 1 hour ago, Palfy said: So is a third only the end of the season for me the end of the season would be 5 or 6 games, that’s when most people would be saying we are near the end of the season, I’ve never heard or seen anyone use that terminology when there is still 14 games to go until you posted it. I don’t want to dwell on that point just trying to add a bit of balance and perspective to what constitutes near the end of the season. I mentioned from February because that’s when the team and results started improving. You’re the one talking about end of the season I deliberately mentioned the timeline as I did, as it also coincided with DCL starting consistently, meaning Richarlison wasnt being played out of position and there was also the link up of Digne and Bernard. I’m not suggesting DCL saved the season all by himself, just that he was a big factor. His finishing is still not the best, but it will improve as will his confidence. Only if he is given a prolonged run though. We saw the same with Bernard too; took a while for him to get used to things, being used as a sub very often to get up to speed before he eventually nailed down his position. Player development takes time and can only develop on the pitch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimmytheJimster Posted July 14, 2019 Report Share Posted July 14, 2019 14 minutes ago, StevO said: Take a risk on Kean, if it doesn’t work out you’d still get most of the money back. I’d be more than happy having him and DCL switching, if one of them is scoring they keep their place. Could also give us a chance to play two up front in some games. Yeah I'd go with something like that, it would give us a plan B and we wouldn't be so predictable. I also wouldn't mind getting Costa if the price was right (10-15 mill) at least he'd gives us that aggression and could teach DCL a thing or two. Palfy 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Palfy Posted July 14, 2019 Report Share Posted July 14, 2019 On 13/07/2019 at 08:11, Matt said: His only real run was towards the end of last season, Excuse me? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted July 14, 2019 Report Share Posted July 14, 2019 21 minutes ago, Palfy said: Excuse me? You’re excused. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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