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James Rodríguez


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5 hours ago, RuffRob said:

It would be nice to at least see him at his majestic best over a season - I am sure the crowd would make him feel so loved - which I think he would feed off. I would be great if he made a good go of it this season.

Benitez might have no other option other than to get a system that will accommodate him. there where plenty of world class player at Madrid he could use instead of James - no so here. 

Been thinking about that last point a lot. Well said. Rafa may not have liked him when he was surrounded by class at Madrid but he’d have to be a blind squirrel to not see the gulf in class between him and any of other midfield options. Here’s to hoping he stays so Goodison can give him the love he deserves. 

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16 hours ago, StevO said:

Played in the middle last night, in a 4231.  Wasn’t much of a game to be fair, but it’s still nice seeing him in an Everton shirt. 

Think that’s his best position for us. Liverpool away point in case - he is on another level for vision/ability when on the ball and we need him on it in those areas as much as possible. Allan & Doucoure behind him ( possible Gbamin ) provide the steel. Pace either side of him in Richy & Townsend.

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I’d like to think we will keep him at least for the final year of his contract. Purely based on the glimpses of quality he brings. It’s that one through ball or bit of magic that can unlock the top teams. 
 

Having watched his most recent performances though,you can see he’s clearly not fit. I don’t think it’s match fitness either he’s just not very mobile. Clearly his body is coming to the end of performing at elite level. 

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21 hours ago, MC11 said:

I’d like to think we will keep him at least for the final year of his contract. Purely based on the glimpses of quality he brings. It’s that one through ball or bit of magic that can unlock the top teams. 
 

Having watched his most recent performances though,you can see he’s clearly not fit. I don’t think it’s match fitness either he’s just not very mobile. Clearly his body is coming to the end of performing at elite level. 

Other way around for me.  We can't afford to carry him against the good teams.  But against teams who are sitting in a low block where we have the possession he might be able to pick the pass.

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21 minutes ago, chicagoblue said:

Other way around for me.  We can't afford to carry him against the good teams.  But against teams who are sitting in a low block where we have the possession he might be able to pick the pass.

Last season our worst games where against the team’s in the lower block, not all his fault that’s for sure but against the lesser team’s he struggled to raise his game. I see him as someone who has a personal fortune of 86 million dropped by his country and little heart to put the work in, just hope he doesn’t stay here for another season fleecing us for 140k a week. 

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On 28/07/2021 at 22:26, MC11 said:

I’d like to think we will keep him at least for the final year of his contract. Purely based on the glimpses of quality he brings. It’s that one through ball or bit of magic that can unlock the top teams. 
 

Having watched his most recent performances though,you can see he’s clearly not fit. I don’t think it’s match fitness either he’s just not very mobile. Clearly his body is coming to the end of performing at elite level. 

I agree with the first paragraph, disagree with the second. 

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11 hours ago, StevO said:


Did anyone who wants rid of him actually watch him play for us last season? He did played some unbelievable football. The only issue is he didn’t play more, so why have him play even less by letting him leave. We can’t buy another player who has that level of ability right now. We got him in a perfect storm, so make the most of it. He is the most talented player we have had in our team since Rooney was a teenager. 
If he leaves before I get to see him in the flesh at Goodison Park I’ll be absolutely gutted. 
We should be enjoying seeing such a talent in a blue shirt and enjoy it while we can.  

 

I know you are an ardent follower of him Steve and admire him quite a lot but I think you exaggerate just how good he is.  He looked good last season because he was surrounded by some less than average players, yeah he played a few good passes and scored a couple of goa!s, but tends to lose possession on a regular basis.

So nothing to go overboard about.  A decent player and I would like to see him stay, but he's nothing exceptional.

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33 minutes ago, Bill said:

I know you are an ardent follower of him Steve and admire him quite a lot but I think you exaggerate just how good he is.  He looked good last season because he was surrounded by some less than average players, yeah he played a few good passes and scored a couple of goa!s, but tends to lose possession on a regular basis.

So nothing to go overboard about.  A decent player and I would like to see him stay, but he's nothing exceptional.

I’m an admirer of him because he is that exceptional a talent. If you saw him play last season and didn’t see someone with a level of creativity that we’ve not had for a long time then maybe your eye test is due 😂

To hear anyone think he isn’t an exceptional footballer is mind blowing to me. We must like different things. 
 

He looked good last season when he had Digne, Richarlison and DCL on form. When we started to miss these players his impact decreased. A player who can pick a pass like he can will shine when he has runners. 
Im hoping Benitez has seen this and that’s why he went straight in for wingers to give him those runners. 

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1 hour ago, Bill said:

Don't think Benitez thinks a lot of him, i think he might be on his way, shame really but lack of fight and effort will not do it for Benitez. 

Keeps picking him. Not sure where this idea of lack of fight or effort comes from. He isn’t going to be tracking back all the time, we don’t need to be playing with ten men behind the ball. 

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9 minutes ago, StevO said:

Keeps picking him. Not sure where this idea of lack of fight or effort comes from. He isn’t going to be tracking back all the time, we don’t need to be playing with ten men behind the ball. 

Keeps picking him? In preseason? All of our first team players get a run-out to work on their fitness etc.. 

You can call it a lack of effort or just focusing on one end of the pitch but it has the same effect. Offensively he’s our most creative player by a wide margin and distributes the ball well. On the other side of the coin, he does give the ball away too easily at times (and in our own half) and he provides almost no effort defensively. His normal procedure is to wave a leg and hope it disrupts you. If it doesn’t then he’s over it. It’s a tough puzzle for Rafa if he stays as his ability with the ball when we are in attack is much needed given our struggles to break teams down but he’s an absolute liability defensively and fragile to boot. 

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42 minutes ago, pete0 said:

Surely they would have questioned Benetiz on James and what he wants to do with him. No way he gets the job if he hasn't sold them how he's gonna get the best out of our best player. 

Fuck off that James, and get me Townsend and Gray. Agent Rafa

We’ll be seeing the same people who want rid of James moaning about our lack of creativity a few months after he’s sold. At least the new lads work hard though. 

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Whether this is true one can only speculate, but the story circulating is that Benitez has already told him to go he’s not in his plans, and Seville are looking likely to go for him Madrid said they had no interest to take him back.  

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Overall he's our best player, hands down.

The one thing he isn't though is a runner and the team are required to work harder to accommodate for that, which effects the overall balance of the team. I can see why Rafa might want to rid him, although I don't think the rumours are true.  I'd really like to see how he operates behind the striker in a 4231.

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57 minutes ago, Aidan said:

Overall he's our best player, hands down.

The one thing he isn't though is a runner and the team are required to work harder to accommodate for that, which effects the overall balance of the team. I can see why Rafa might want to rid him, although I don't think the rumours are true.  I'd really like to see how he operates behind the striker in a 4231.

I’m not sure if I agree he’s our best player overall. We need the creativity for sure but he’s our worst defensive player every time he’s on the pitch, by a mile. Plus he’s fragile so the odds of getting 30+ games from him are minuscule. I think a guy like Richie is better once you consider his overall game and you can make a case for a couple others. Important for us for sure but his deficiencies, like his left foot , stand out 

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8 minutes ago, SpartyBlue said:

I’m not sure if I agree he’s our best player overall. We need the creativity for sure but he’s our worst defensive player every time he’s on the pitch, by a mile. Plus he’s fragile so the odds of getting 30+ games from him are minuscule. I think a guy like Richie is better once you consider his overall game and you can make a case for a couple others. Important for us for sure but his deficiencies, like his left foot , stand out 

I feel he is the only player capable of having a good enough season to get us into Europe (capable as in if he stays fit) although I do understand your point on his fragility. If he could play 38 games a season he probably wouldn't be here would he?

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12 minutes ago, Aidan said:

I feel he is the only player capable of having a good enough season to get us into Europe (capable as in if he stays fit) although I do understand your point on his fragility. If he could play 38 games a season he probably wouldn't be here would he?

True enough. Or if he had the energy to contribute defensively. He’s basically a Ferrari with mechanical issues. If you’re uber wealthy you might not be bothered but for most everyone else IT’S STILL A FERRARI!

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25 minutes ago, Romey 1878 said:

We don't deserve nice things when there are complaints that our creative outlet is our worst defensive player.

I think you have to always take the full picture. Even for someone whose job is at the other end he does cost us some with the nonexistent defensive effort. If you like I’ll also include giving the ball away in our own half trying to be tricky when it’s not called for. This all sounds like I hate him as a player, I don’t and I’d take him again in a heartbeat, but I get why he couldn’t get on the field for Real Madrid. 

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Last season Holgate was getting slaughtered for  ambling about and not looking bothered ....... Mention the same about James and there's uproar in defence of him.  Haven't seen him make one tackle all the time he's been here, he trots toward the attacker and waves his foot at him and that's it. He never chases back and if Richie was to do that he would get slaughtered as well.

You can't have a separate rule for James when he is as bad as others.

 

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3 minutes ago, SpartyBlue said:

I think you have to always take the full picture. Even for someone whose job is at the other end he does cost us some with the nonexistent defensive effort. If you like I’ll also include giving the ball away in our own half trying to be tricky when it’s not called for. This all sounds like I hate him as a player, I don’t and I’d take him again in a heartbeat, but I get why he couldn’t get on the field for Real Madrid. 

You're just ruining my Friday night now, Sparty, stop it :lol:.

1 minute ago, Bill said:

Last season Holgate was getting slaughtered for  ambling about and not looking bothered ....... Mention the same about James and there's uproar in defence of him.  Haven't seen him make one tackle all the time he's been here, he trots toward the attacker and waves his foot at him and that's it. Never chases back and if Richie was to do that  he would be slaughtered as well.

Can't have a separate rule for James when he is as bad as others.

 

This isn't a James thing, this is a let our attacking players attack thing. I was the same with Deulofeu when our fans complained that he didn't race back to the edge of his own penalty area to defend with the other 10 players we already had there. I didn't give a shiny shite because his job was at the other end of the pitch.

If we can't afford to have one player with his main job being to make things happen and let him off with doing as much defensively, then that speaks volumes about how shit our actual defensive players are or maybe how low opinions of them are. 

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6 minutes ago, SpartyBlue said:

I think you have to always take the full picture. Even for someone whose job is at the other end he does cost us some with the nonexistent defensive effort. If you like I’ll also include giving the ball away in our own half trying to be tricky when it’s not called for. This all sounds like I hate him as a player, I don’t and I’d take him again in a heartbeat, but I get why he couldn’t get on the field for Real Madrid. 

First three seasons at Real he played 111 games and scored 36 goals, final season not so much (unsure why) so I think saying he couldn't get on the pitch is a bit of a stretch.

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We are not good enough to carry passengers, if he doesn't pull his weight this season I can see Rafa sending him home, ambling about and giving the ball away won't cut it with Rafa.

 

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9 minutes ago, Bill said:

Last season Holgate was getting slaughtered for  ambling about and not looking bothered ....... Mention the same about James and there's uproar in defence of him.  Haven't seen him make one tackle all the time he's been here, he trots toward the attacker and waves his foot at him and that's it. Never chases back and if Richie was to do that  he would be slaughtered as well.

Can't have a separate rule for James when he is as bad as others.

How much defending did Jimmy Greaves do? Not what the man's there for.

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Well if Benitez has told him he’s not in his plans and he’s as good as some say, selling him for 30-40 million should be very easy and if that was to happen I’d say FairPlay to him and take the money, because regardless of his pros and cons him and Benitez aren’t going to get on. 

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11 minutes ago, MikeO said:

First three seasons at Real he played 111 games and scored 36 goals, final season not so much (unsure why) so I think saying he couldn't get on the pitch is a bit of a stretch.

Didn’t Zadane dislike him. 

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3 minutes ago, Bill said:

See the opening sentence in my previous post.

I'm very happy to carry a "passenger" who's got magic in their boots (not being player specific, just in general), we have nine other outfield players who can do the hard yards. Not going into names but there have been countless luxury players in the game over the years, why can't we have one?

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4 minutes ago, MikeO said:

I'm very happy to carry a "passenger" who's got magic in their boots (not being player specific, just in general), we have nine other outfield players who can do the hard yards. Not going into names but there have been countless luxury players in the game over the years, why can't we have one?

As far as I'm concerned, he's (or any attacking player for that matter) only a passenger if he's not creating.

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11 minutes ago, MikeO said:

How much defending did Jimmy Greaves do? Not what the man's there for.

Mike with respect mate for people of our age the game as changed since we were watching Greavesie, I wish it bloody hadn’t but the reality is it has, not losing is more focused on than winning for a majority of teams.  

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47 minutes ago, Romey 1878 said:

You're just ruining my Friday night now, Sparty, stop it :lol:.

This isn't a James thing, this is a let our attacking players attack thing. I was the same with Deulofeu when our fans complained that he didn't race back to the edge of his own penalty area to defend with the other 10 players we already had there. I didn't give a shiny shite because his job was at the other end of the pitch.

If we can't afford to have one player with his main job being to make things happen and let him off with doing as much defensively, then that speaks volumes about how shit our actual defensive players are or maybe how low opinions of them are. 

I think it’s always gonna be iffy when you have a one dimensional player. That dimension better be very very good. The issue for me with James is he isn’t a striker or even the sort of winger who spends all his time at the top of the pitch. A lot of the time when he’s lazy with the ball or giving no effort to hinder an opponent it’s in our own half and it’s really hurting us. Gerry would try his tricks and not really get back but it was generally in the attacking third where it didn’t really punish us. This is a tangent but I’d have liked to have him on the squad for us last season down the right. 

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57 minutes ago, Bill said:

Last season Holgate was getting slaughtered for  ambling about and not looking bothered ....... Mention the same about James and there's uproar in defence of him.  Haven't seen him make one tackle all the time he's been here, he trots toward the attacker and waves his foot at him and that's it. He never chases back and if Richie was to do that he would get slaughtered as well.

You can't have a separate rule for James when he is as bad as others.

 

I think this is why Richie is probably our best player. He’s not the finished article but he’s productive offensively and actually quite responsible defensively. He’s always working hard. 

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I just dont think he can play RW against any half decent team thats going to attack us. If its against a team that will sit back and we have 60/70% possession its not so bad but he isnt going to track his full back.

Play him as the 10, he doesnt need to tackle or throw himself about. If we are set up tactically at all we will have plans and traps set and he just needs to influence those by cutting passing lanes or marking a deep lying CM. Allan/Doucoure/Gbamin/Davies are all industries players who can do the hard yards behind him. James can pick the ball up 30 yards out and make something special happen.

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1 hour ago, Bill said:

Last season Holgate was getting slaughtered for  ambling about and not looking bothered ....... Mention the same about James and there's uproar in defence of him.  Haven't seen him make one tackle all the time he's been here, he trots toward the attacker and waves his foot at him and that's it. He never chases back and if Richie was to do that he would get slaughtered as well.

You can't have a separate rule for James when he is as bad as others.

 

Comparing defensive effort of a centre half and a number 10? Makes sense. 
Jesus Christ!

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1 hour ago, Romey 1878 said:

As far as I'm concerned, he's (or any attacking player for that matter) only a passenger if he's not creating.

Absolutely! Why don’t we get on the defenders cases for not scoring enough goals? 
As long as James is creating enough chances that’s what he’s on the pitch for. 

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1 hour ago, MikeO said:

I'm very happy to carry a "passenger" who's got magic in their boots (not being player specific, just in general), we have nine other outfield players who can do the hard yards. Not going into names but there have been countless luxury players in the game over the years, why can't we have one?

You ask why we can’t have a luxury player? Read this thread. 
 

I wonder if there are Barca forums where they complain about Messi not putting enough tackles in. 🤔

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53 minutes ago, SpartyBlue said:

I think it’s always gonna be iffy when you have a one dimensional player. That dimension better be very very good. The issue for me with James is he isn’t a striker or even the sort of winger who spends all his time at the top of the pitch. A lot of the time when he’s lazy with the ball or giving no effort to hinder an opponent it’s in our own half and it’s really hurting us. Gerry would try his tricks and not really get back but it was generally in the attacking third where it didn’t really punish us. This is a tangent but I’d have liked to have him on the squad for us last season down the right. 

Out of curiosity, how many goals did we concede from James losing possession and trying tricks in his own half?

Ive seen every minute he’s played in an Everton shirt and this has just not been an issue. 

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54 minutes ago, SpartyBlue said:

I think this is why Richie is probably our best player. He’s not the finished article but he’s productive offensively and actually quite responsible defensively. He’s always working hard. 

If Richarlison was as good offensively as James, with his work rate, he would be up there with Ronaldo and Hazard. But he’s not. I love Richarlison, he’s very effective but he doesn’t have that magic. 

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27 minutes ago, StevO said:

Out of curiosity, how many goals did we concede from James losing possession and trying tricks in his own half?

Ive seen every minute he’s played in an Everton shirt and this has just not been an issue. 

Possibly none but we have seen teams concentrate more men and attacks on his side of the field and take advantage of the the fact he won’t track back to help his RB out, and goals have been conceded in those scenarios, it doesn’t take long for other managers to work out a team’s weakness and exploit it, he did do some decent stuff but he has had no consistency to his game bar not helping out with any form of defence he was very consistent in that approach, I honestly don’t think there’s a team in this league who would take him, I could be wrong and Villa or Wolves may give him a go. I remember many years ago when I was a regular at home games the supporters would turn on players that didn’t work for every ball available, now some seem to be advocating it, strange how times change.  

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I get the comments about James being our best player and that he should just focus on attacking but if Man City, Liverpool, Utd, Chelsea cannot afford to have someone shirking their defensive responsibilities then how can we?

The other point is that when James cant be bothered to chip in, the other side have an overload. It could be wide, it could be in midfield. If they have an overload, it is easier for them to keep the ball. If they have more of the ball, it reduces James' impact as an attacking footballer and exposes his defensive ability. It also means he is more likely to be on the ball in his own half rather than where he can do real damage. 

If we want to get the most out of James, we needs to have lots of the ball and to be able to pin them in their half and sustain regular attacks. If we can do that then start him every game. If we cant, then I think he has to be viewed as an option rather than the first name on the teamsheet.

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19 minutes ago, Btay said:

I think it’s as much poor managerial tactics as much as it’s his perceived lack of effort. Remember McGeady when he said he couldn’t believe how every team’s fullbacks were rapid.. the game has evolved that your wide players have to be athletic unless you are going to dominate the ball. 

James does enough for me to play 10 and to contribute to a defensive shape. He doesn’t have to make a single tackle, intercept or anything all game but if he pushes the play to where we tactically want it or closes down the space, passing lane or man he’s been told to then that’s enough.

Completely agree with that. My only complaint about his defensive work is when the RB is missing and he must contribute then. Otherwise I'm happy for him to sit and link up play.

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Mad thing is the fans who don't want him were happy with Sigurdsson behind the striker chasing shadows and barely making an interception.

A lot seems to be about his effort levels. He's competitive, he wants to win and he gets stuck in. 

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Good morning everybody,  see this thread is still the busiest,  never seen Steve so busy in such a short spell ......  5 posts one after the other quoting 5 different posts.  😀

I'm leaving this thread now because we all have our different views about James and I don't think anybody will change them.  I just hope that if he plays this season he has a good season and doesn't disappoint us.

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