Ifs, buts and Maybes

[Hafnia]

1 hour ago, duncanmckenzieismagic said:

Think we all need to start coming to terms with the fact we are going down, this squad has no fight at all

Same again today, did ok first half but as soon as they scored the first goal we all knew  with 100% certainty it was game over, zero reaction 

I’m actually rethinking my love of the game…..   it’s not what it used to be - yeah I may not say this as passionately if we were doing well but the game is fucked.

Generally footballers now have zero passion for the game, it’s all about money, the people who run the game, the media….. it’s money.  Gambling companies, money washing.

I loved Everton players of bygone times - the only reminder of that is the way I feel about Anthony Gordon.  Such a pity that this kid realised his dream and has to play with a bunch of cowards. 

I’m prepared to be relegated and you know what….. I’ve had no shit off Liverpool fans (ones who are real football fans)…. I think they probably look at our players and think “you bunch of twats”. 
 

You get what you deserve if you accept shite for long enough.  The apathy that has been flooding our club for years has bit us on the arse at last. 

[Btay]

3 hours ago, duncanmckenzieismagic said:

Think we all need to start coming to terms with the fact we are going down, this squad has no fight at all

Same again today, did ok first half but as soon as they scored the first goal we all knew  with 100% certainty it was game over, zero reaction 

If we do that we can’t blame the players for having no fight. Fans can make the difference in these moments.

We can’t forget or forgive the players who packed up tools though and there’s been a few the last weeks.

[c1982]

4 hours ago, duncanmckenzieismagic said:

Think we all need to start coming to terms with the fact we are going down, this squad has no fight at all

Same again today, did ok first half but as soon as they scored the first goal we all knew  with 100% certainty it was game over, zero reaction 

Sadly, I’m numb to whatever shit is coming our way. I’ve just accepted, if Mina’s not playing, we’ll probably lose. I’ve started drinking wine at half-time to nurse me through!

[Bailey]

I don't think its a lack of passion, I just think a lot of the players are scared and confused. 

I didn't see anyone hiding as such, I just saw players scared to take a risk. In the last 3 or 4 games the ball has gone into midfield then straight back to a CB when there were forward passes on. The passing is so slow because they want 2 or 3 touches. Lots of the passes are underhit because they are scared to ping something into someone.

We need players to shake off that anxiety and trust their ability to go out and play football.

[Wiggytop]

10 hours ago, Bailey said:

I don't think its a lack of passion, I just think a lot of the players are scared and confused. 

I didn't see anyone hiding as such, I just saw players scared to take a risk. In the last 3 or 4 games the ball has gone into midfield then straight back to a CB when there were forward passes on. The passing is so slow because they want 2 or 3 touches. Lots of the passes are underhit because they are scared to ping something into someone.

We need players to shake off that anxiety and trust their ability to go out and play football.

This is spot on, rabbits in headlights at times yesterday. 

[FairWooney]

I only listened via EvertonTV as I had a long drive home but that's exactly what they were saying early on.  The players were playing with a lack of confidence and a fear of making a mistake, I think this feeling would have been compounded by the Spurs match where we were torn apart so easily which would have been a real blow to whatever confidence they did have following decent performances against Leeds and Man City.

The Newcastle game won't make things any easier, they are a team that are beatable but in great form and in complete contrast to us are full of confidence.

With our lack of goals the players are obviously worried that an error that leaves to a goal not only gives an angry crowd but also leaves the team desperately trying to create a goal when they appear incapable of doing so at the moment.

Lampard and the coaches not only need to try to give them a bit of confidence to play their game and believe in themselves but also to work on alternative methods of creating a goal!  Even if it's getting players in the box for some route 1 filth at the end of the game.

[Romey 1878]

Right, I've dusted myself off, pulled my big boy pants up and I'm back on the 'we're surviving' train.

That starts with us winning on Thursday.

What am I doing to myself?  

[Bailey]

I still can't actually contemplate us going down. 

Sunday was as close as I have been but I just refuse to accept that it is possible.

[dunlopp9987]

The reason I see us going down is just the lack of leaders on this team. I'm just baffled when I watch us give up a goal and roll over and die (with the exception of the City game where we could've grabbed a point.)

Ya know speaking of the City game, I'm wondering if the VAR debacle just completely took the wind out of our sails. We've looked more or less like zombies since then.

Palace earning a draw against City yesterday, I don't see us beating them in either the cup or the league. 

Until this team can show me they can win back to back games, or even god forbid pick up fucking points in back to back games (hasn't been done since beginning of October), I have to assume we're going down.

[Bailey]

4 hours ago, dunlopp9987 said:

The reason I see us going down is just the lack of leaders on this team. I'm just baffled when I watch us give up a goal and roll over and die (with the exception of the City game where we could've grabbed a point.)

Ya know speaking of the City game, I'm wondering if the VAR debacle just completely took the wind out of our sails. We've looked more or less like zombies since then.

Palace earning a draw against City yesterday, I don't see us beating them in either the cup or the league. 

Until this team can show me they can win back to back games, or even god forbid pick up fucking points in back to back games (hasn't been done since beginning of October), I have to assume we're going down.

In some ways, I would almost like us to go 1 down to Newcastle and then come back and beat them. 

I feel like the players need to know they can do it because at the moment its like they are scared to concede the first goal because they doubt they will get one back. 

[Cornish Steve]

Current status: 38 points

Brentford (H): 3 points
Burnley (A): 3 points
Leeds (H): 3 points (actual: 3 points)
Newcastle (H): 3 points
Palace (H): 3 points
Watford (A): 3 points

Leicester (H): 1 point
Southampton (A): 1 point (actual: 0 points)
Wolves (H): 1 point (actual: 0 points)

Arsenal (A): 0 points
Chelsea (H): 0 points
Leicester (A): 0 points
Liverpool (A): 0 points
Man City (H): 0 points (actual: 0 points)
Man United (H): 0 points
Spurs (A): 0 points (actual: 0 points)
West Ham (A): 0 points

[Shukes]

9 hours ago, Romey 1878 said:

Right, I've dusted myself off, pulled my big boy pants up and I'm back on the 'we're surviving' train.

That starts with us winning on Thursday.

What am I doing to myself?  

I’m there with you mate! 
All these doom bringers don’t have a clue….. 8th is still possible! 
Ok Champions league is probably gone for this season…. But the rest!

[Shukes]

7 hours ago, Bailey said:

I still can't actually contemplate us going down. 

Sunday was as close as I have been but I just refuse to accept that it is possible.

If we show this in the ground, then the players will feel it and be galvanised. We can drag us back up.

Lets get on the pitch with them and make them feel that we’re in it together.

[MikeO]

7 hours ago, Bailey said:

I still can't actually contemplate us going down. 

Not surprising, any Evertonian with experience of relegation is well into their seventies....and we've only spent four seasons out of the top flight since the league began; that's 119 seasons, Villa second most with 108.

Spurs, Man City, Man United and Chelsea have all been relegated in my lifetime, and Liverpool were second division when I was born; of the current "big" clubs only Arsenal have been around longer than us.

I want to say it's unthinkable, but it's not. That said if the worst comes to the worst it won't make me, along with probably 99.9% of the fanbase, any less passionate about the club. What will be will be, COYB

[Shukes]

Some good places to visit in the championship MikeO! Already planning my away days haha.

[Palfy]

13 minutes ago, MikeO said:

Not surprising, any Evertonian with experience of relegation is well into their seventies....and we've only spent four seasons out of the top flight since the league began; that's 119 seasons, Villa second most with 108.

Spurs, Man City, Man United and Chelsea have all been relegated in my lifetime, and Liverpool were second division when I was born; of the current "big" clubs only Arsenal have been around longer than us.

I want to say it's unthinkable, but it's not. That said if the worst comes to the worst it won't make me, along with probably 99.9% of the fanbase, any less passionate about the club. What will be will be, COYB

I would be more disappointed if there was a 0.1% who stopped supporting the team if they went down than the team actually going down, true supporters except the blows no matter how devastating and heart breaking they are. Any way less of this negativity we will prevail whether we stay up or go down because we are Everton, and we are strong, honest, and passionate, we are REAL. 

[dunlopp9987]

1 hour ago, Shukes said:

If we show this in the ground, then the players will feel it and be galvanised. We can drag us back up.

Lets get on the pitch with them and make them feel that we’re in it together.

See but this type of galvanizing and 100% full-throttle support was what I expected and what we needed against Wolves. We needed it to be like the Leeds game, where the Goodison roar was almost omnipresent throughout the game.

That energy just wasn't there on Sunday. I'm hopeful the Goodison faithful can repeat their performance from the Leeds game and not the Wolves one

[Romey 1878]

Just now, dunlopp9987 said:

See but this type of galvanizing and 100% full-throttle support was what I expected and what we needed against Wolves. We needed it to be like the Leeds game, where the Goodison roar was almost omnipresent throughout the game.

That energy just wasn't there on Sunday. I'm hopeful the Goodison faithful can repeat their performance from the Leeds game and not the Wolves one

I feel like the line-up put paid to that. It was a sucker punch to say the least and made people very nervous before a ball had even been kicked. 

[dunlopp9987]

16 minutes ago, Romey 1878 said:

I feel like the line-up put paid to that. It was a sucker punch to say the least and made people very nervous before a ball had even been kicked. 

Sure but if we really are going to get out of this, the Goodison crowd needs to be vocally behind the team from minute 1 to 90, no matter the lineup.

Seeing as we likely won't pick up any points on the road going forward, it needs to be a fucking madhouse at Goodison. And it was anything but that on Sunday

[Romey 1878]

42 minutes ago, dunlopp9987 said:

Sure but if we really are going to get out of this, the Goodison crowd needs to be vocally behind the team from minute 1 to 90, no matter the lineup.

Seeing as we likely won't pick up any points on the road going forward, it needs to be a fucking madhouse at Goodison. And it was anything but that on Sunday

Their player constantly going down injured for the first 10 minutes didn’t help either. Stopped the teams flow and stopped the crowd from getting going as well. Any time the crowd started singing it seemed like they’d stop the game.

The crowd can’t do it all, mate. The players need to do their bit as well. 

[Zoo 2.0]

Whereas I have been critical of the fanbase in the past, you can't expect people to create an electric atmosphere for a group of players that don't look interested, don't put a shift in and don't create any spark whatsoever for 90 minutes.

It's a bit like being asked to stand next to some dog shite on the pavement, and to sing and chant for the binmen to come and clean it up for an hour. The fans should be up for the game yes, but when you're averaging a single shot on goal a game and providing minimal huff and puff it's to be expected that the crowd are completely dejected.

[Bailey]

29 minutes ago, Zoo 2.0 said:

Whereas I have been critical of the fanbase in the past, you can't expect people to create an electric atmosphere for a group of players that don't look interested, don't put a shift in and don't create any spark whatsoever for 90 minutes.

It's a bit like being asked to stand next to some dog shite on the pavement, and to sing and chant for the binmen to come and clean it up for an hour. The fans should be up for the game yes, but when you're averaging a single shot on goal a game and providing minimal huff and puff it's to be expected that the crowd are completely dejected.

Yeh I imagine if we showed any spark whatsoever the crowd would have roared like they did against Leeds.

[Cornish Steve]

I'm still of the opinion that we'll survive, pulling out all the stops as the season nears its end. The reason for my optimism is that we don't just have a manager but a focused and extensive management team. That will make the difference in the end.

[dunlopp9987]

43 minutes ago, RPG said:

I sure hope so. I am more hopeful than confident but I'll still be shouting for the lads on Thursday night. Alarm set for 3-30 am Friday morning here in Malaysia to get up for the 3-45am kick off.

I think we need to be ready for a final game of the season nail biter.

Friend of mine is a gooner and seems to think we'll be able to beat them on the last day. But if they're fighting for 4th, I doubt it

[Matt]

Not sure where this optimism is coming from. When I agreed back in November/December that were in real trouble my 1 big if was if the squads confidence could be lifted. This hasn't happened. I still believe the skillset of the squad is a top 6 squad but their heads are completely lost and I've seen nothing at all to show any signs of positive change. If anything, they seem to get more and more dejected with each game. I hate to say it but we need to be playing for 1 point and if that means all 11 players in our own box for the rest of the season so be it. Then at least hope for a break we can snatch a win from. It is that dire a situation. 

[Palfy]

1 hour ago, Matt said:

Not sure where this optimism is coming from. When I agreed back in November/December that were in real trouble my 1 big if was if the squads confidence could be lifted. This hasn't happened. I still believe the skillset of the squad is a top 6 squad but their heads are completely lost and I've seen nothing at all to show any signs of positive change. If anything, they seem to get more and more dejected with each game. I hate to say it but we need to be playing for 1 point and if that means all 11 players in out own box for the rest of the season so be it. Then at least hope for a break we can snatch a win from. It is that dire a situation. 

I agree mate this is about survival and not trying to look pretty, when you’re in a battle you need fighters and we have to except it will look ugly but the result is more important than the style of play. 

[Shukes]

Guys… I’m usually the one saying there is no real concern. 
But I’m in agreance here. We’re in a fight! And a big fight. It’s time for our players to stand up and do whatever it takes now.

[Cornish Steve]

I can understand the criticism of the current team, but I'm not sure it's justified. Let's not forget the individual who got us into this mess: Rafael Benitez. He's the reason we're in a relegation fight. He's the reason the players lost confidence. He's the reason we had no strategy. When someone digs such a huge hole, it's never going to be easy climbing out of it.

[Hafnia]

3 hours ago, Cornish Steve said:

I can understand the criticism of the current team, but I'm not sure it's justified. Let's not forget the individual who got us into this mess: Rafael Benitez. He's the reason we're in a relegation fight. He's the reason the players lost confidence. He's the reason we had no strategy. When someone digs such a huge hole, it's never going to be easy climbing out of it.

Steve…. The club was in a shit state before he came.

Carlo got out of dodge.  The group of players are disgusting, Rafa wasn’t great but this squad of players and their cowardice has got many managers sacked.  They down tools when things don’t go their way. 

 

[dunlopp9987]

4 hours ago, Cornish Steve said:

I can understand the criticism of the current team, but I'm not sure it's justified. Let's not forget the individual who got us into this mess: Rafael Benitez. He's the reason we're in a relegation fight. He's the reason the players lost confidence. He's the reason we had no strategy. When someone digs such a huge hole, it's never going to be easy climbing out of it.

Absolutely, Rafa's appointment was a mistake and he plays a large part in why we are where we are.

But to say "the individual who got us into this mess"?? Certainly not, friend. He plays a part in it, but he wasn't out on the pitch. He also wasn't even around as we've taken 3 out of the last 18 points available.

I'm sure there is something to be said for Rafa's time having a negative impact on the player's confidence, but as @Hafniamentioned, this group of players was pretty shit before Rafa. And even after Rafa, we've seen they're still pretty shit.