Ifs, buts and Maybes

[Romey 1878]

1 hour ago, Hafnia said:

Yes I agree but Leeds were effectively below us when you look at the odds of relegation. We would have had 3 games on them with one point behind so from a psychological perspective if limits the variables and puts more pressure on the Burnley game. 
 

if we take care of Burnley and Watford and average a point per match we will be ok. 

And they still will be if we do what we need to do.

Leeds or whoever above picking up points isn't going to relegate us, what the sides below us do and what we do will.

All I'm saying is, if you're going to stress and worry about things then make sure they're the things that actually matter!

We just need to finish outside the relegation places this season. It'll be shit to finish 17th (or anywhere we end up finishing in terms of survival) but it will allow us to reset for the next season, where I hope (and think) we will be much better.

[dunlopp9987]

4 minutes ago, Romey 1878 said:

And they still will be if we do what we need to do.

Leeds or whoever above picking up points isn't going to relegate us, what the sides below us do and what we do will.

All I'm saying is, if you're going to stress and worry about things then make sure they're the things that actually matter!

We just need to finish outside the relegation places this season. It'll be shit to finish 17th (or anywhere we end up finishing in terms of survival) but it will allow us to reset for the next season, where I hope (and think) we will be much better.

Who knows, we could even pull a Leicester next season!

[Romey 1878]

8 minutes ago, dunlopp9987 said:

Who knows, we could even pull a Leicester next season!

I won't stick my neck out and say that  but I do think that if we get the right signings that Lampard wants, get rid of the shite that he doesn't, and sell big in the right way then we'll be more likely to be fighting for a European place than in another relegation fight next season.

Like I've said before, he's not someone I ever thought of to be our manager, and I do think he's made some mistakes so far, but I can't help but be impressed with him.

[Cornish Steve]

4 hours ago, dunlopp9987 said:

I just so wish Burnley and Watford were at home. Their supporters are going to make it that much more challenging, and our road mentality is just shit.

Would not surprise me in the least if we lost both games, unfortunately.

The games I most worry about are the next three without Allan. 

[duncanmckenzieismagic]

Whilst I agree we need to be more concerned about the teams below us than above us it would have been nice to keep as many teams involved as possible. I think that’s gone now though anyway. I would expect it’s now down to three out of the current bottom four which means we have no room for error and that makes me extremely nervous 

[Romey 1878]

16 minutes ago, Cornish Steve said:

The games I most worry about are the next three without Allan. 

One of them is the cup game. So I’m not really bothered about that one. 

[dunlopp9987]

23 minutes ago, Cornish Steve said:

The games I most worry about are the next three without Allan. 

One of which is Burnley away

[StevO]

I don’t think we even need to beat Watford and Burnley, we just can’t afford to lose those games. 
Better them most weekends and we’ll be fine. 
 

Wont be easy though. 

[Hafnia]

“If” we play a midfield 3 then Gomes may be the option. 
 

is an option to try Gordon in there?  

[Romey 1878]

30 minutes ago, Hafnia said:

“If” we play a midfield 3 then Gomes may be the option. 
 

is an option to try Gordon in there?  

He played more centrally against Newcastle and I think he struggled to get involved in the game. Maybe more of a role for him when he's older I'd say, but if needs must he wouldn't let anyone down.

[duncanmckenzieismagic]

5 hours ago, StevO said:

I don’t think we even need to beat Watford and Burnley, we just can’t afford to lose those games. 
Better them most weekends and we’ll be fine. 
 

Wont be easy though. 

Have you looked at our fixture list ?

[StevO]

8 hours ago, duncanmckenzieismagic said:

Have you looked at our fixture list ?

Yes I have. 

[Hafnia]

lets see how the players respond to Lampards interviews yesterday.  It was a gamble for lampard to do that but he was quite transparent in what he said "I've buttered them up and tried to boost the confidence - its clearly not worked"

 

I've not seen an Everton manager so incensed in an interview - saying the word "bollocks" - referring to Gomes I believe - it was jogging back.  Essentially the supposed approach in a relegation battle is to not throw the players under the bus - but I think it has got to the stage where Lampard cant bite his tongue any more and he is letting these fraudsters know "this is on you - don't look at me".

 

Be under no illusions - this bunch led by the likes of Digne resisted Rafas defend at all costs philosophy and churned out complete and utter tripe.   Now they have a manager who invites them to show some bottle and get on the front foot - but no, they pass backwards like cowards, even in a game which was a free hit to get some freedom to express themselves and they showed what they are.

 

By churning out that performance - watford and burnley will be clinging to the hope they can escape.  They will be full of optimism.  

[Cornish Steve]

Gomes is a real problem, I think. It's not that he's a bad player, but he's meant for the European leagues and not the Premier League. His almost casual nature flows to the rest of the team, and the levels of energy and urgency just drop. Yes, I am being a little unfair - at the start of the move that led to our goal at Newcastle, he's the player on the left battling for the ball before it goes to the middle and is won by Coleman - but it's more a matter of style and mentality than anything else.

Once again, it reveals the importance of midfield: everything hinges on that - which must be why Lampard made late moves for van de Beek and Alli. For the next two games, we need a replacement for Allan who's just as determined and uncompromising. Maybe it's van de Beek or maybe it's not. Can Gordon translate his attitude to that role? For sure, it's not Gomes.

[Bill]

Did we get rid of Davies. ??

[Hafnia]

9 minutes ago, Bill said:

Did we get rid of Davies. ??

he's out for the season

[Hafnia]

25 minutes ago, Cornish Steve said:

Gomes is a real problem, I think. It's not that he's a bad player, but he's meant for the European leagues and not the Premier League. His almost casual nature flows to the rest of the team, and the levels of energy and urgency just drop. Yes, I am being a little unfair - at the start of the move that led to our goal at Newcastle, he's the player on the left battling for the ball before it goes to the middle and is won by Coleman - but it's more a matter of style and mentality than anything else.

Once again, it reveals the importance of midfield: everything hinges on that - which must be why Lampard made late moves for van de Beek and Alli. For the next two games, we need a replacement for Allan who's just as determined and uncompromising. Maybe it's van de Beek or maybe it's not. Can Gordon translate his attitude to that role? For sure, it's not Gomes.

talent wise he's exceptionally good.  He was bought by Barcelona - you don't get an expensive transfer like that without ability.

I've seen him play his best football for us coming back from injury or when completely unfit.  Its in his head or heart, whichever organ it is that makes him  not bother.

 

[Bailey]

I am not looking forward to playing Burnley in particular. You can see them soaking up our inept attacking play and then hitting us on the counter.

I feel like an early goal for us is going to be so important.

[duncanmckenzieismagic]

8 hours ago, Bailey said:

I am not looking forward to playing Burnley in particular. You can see them soaking up our inept attacking play and then hitting us on the counter.

I feel like an early goal for us is going to be so important.

Me neither, pretty sure we will be in the bottom 3 after this game

[AlbanyNYToffee]

2 hours ago, RPG said:

West Ham away first. It would be so Everton to win at West Ham and then get thrashed at Burnley. And I'd probably take that right now if it was offered.

3 points from 2 away games in 4 days. Need everyone be reminded of our away form this season. Absolutely we'd take that. Hell I'd take 2 points. 

[Hafnia]

2 hours ago, RPG said:

West Ham away first. It would be so Everton to win at West Ham and then get thrashed at Burnley. And I'd probably take that right now if it was offered.

no chance, if we get beat by burnley its a 6 pointer, i would take a point both games now

[Palfy]

5 hours ago, Hafnia said:

no chance, if we get beat by burnley its a 6 pointer, i would take a point both games now

I’m not even going to try and contemplate what losing to Burnley would mean to our survival at this moment in time, a win would be boss a draw would be more than acceptable. 

[Bailey]

11 hours ago, RPG said:

West Ham away first. It would be so Everton to win at West Ham and then get thrashed at Burnley. And I'd probably take that right now if it was offered.

This season it would be so Everton to lose both!

[Btay]

On 21/03/2022 at 23:54, Hafnia said:

talent wise he's exceptionally good.  He was bought by Barcelona - you don't get an expensive transfer like that without ability.

I've seen him play his best football for us coming back from injury or when completely unfit.  Its in his head or heart, whichever organ it is that makes him  not bother.

 

This mentality is half our problem though. These clubs don’t sell players that are good enough for them - we need to stop taking the excess off the teams we (were) trying to reach the level of and go after the players they replace them with ( before they reach that level ).

[Hafnia]

Just now, Btay said:

This mentality is half our problem though. These clubs don’t sell players that are good enough for them - we need to stop taking the excess off the teams we (were) trying to reach the level of and go after the players they replace them with ( before they reach that level ).

Pienaar, arteta, Howard, Neville are exceptions to that rule.  
 

the difference is whether they have the right character. We bought tosun gylfi and Keane and they have arguably been two of the worst signings in recent years

[Btay]

6 minutes ago, Hafnia said:

Pienaar, arteta, Howard, Neville are exceptions to that rule.  
 

the difference is whether they have the right character. We bought tosun gylfi and Keane and they have arguably been two of the worst signings in recent years

See what your saying but I don’t think we have been remotely proactive enough with scouting.

[StevO]

Out of curiosity @Hafnia why did you think the bollocks comment was towards Gomes? Personally I thought it was aimed at the whole team but interested in why you thought it was aimed at him. 

[Hafnia]

1 hour ago, StevO said:

Out of curiosity @Hafnia why did you think the bollocks comment was towards Gomes? Personally I thought it was aimed at the whole team but interested in why you thought it was aimed at him. 

 

I said the bollocks comment was aimed at the players

I also said allowing opponents to stroll in the box was Gomes - "I guess". although I am sure there were others who did it with less consequence.

Gomes was dropped/sick after his Southampton performance and I imagine that if lampard can find a suitable replacement he will be sick again.

 

On 20/03/2022 at 18:04, Hafnia said:

 

gloves are off and he’s spot on.  The bollocks he refers to is him basically calling the players gutless cowards…. Referred to allowing opponents to stroll in the box, Gomes I guess. 

He’s had enough of this shower.   Let’s hope we manage to stay up, I think he is going to have some fun with a big red pen going through players names.

he’s right about tactics…. The first 15 showed that the set up was good enough, what wasn’t good enough is the players ability to concentrate and apply themselves for any longer than that. 

 

 

[badaids]

Gomes has been terrible since he came back from injury, but it hasn’t always been like that.

When he arrived on loan he was amazing - I remember loads of games when his ability to retain and carry the ball with 2 or 3 thugs beating on him was incredible. He didn’t play like Fellaini, but his effect on the ball was the same. For a while, Spurs were going to rob us off him.

Whats happened to Gomes - apart from injuries - is that he’s been ground down, like so many other players have. To the point where it looks like he probably dreads even pulling on a shirt. It’s a symptom of the wider sickness at the club, and it’s the thing that really needs sorting out.

As for the thread title - we ain’t getting 40 points. We might 35 or 37 and it should hopefully be enough.

[Hafnia]

24 minutes ago, badaids said:

Gomes has been terrible since he came back from injury, but it hasn’t always been like that.

When he arrived on loan he was amazing - I remember loads of games when his ability to retain and carry the ball with 2 or 3 thugs beating on him was incredible. He didn’t play like Fellaini, but his effect on the ball was the same. For a while, Spurs were going to rob us off him.

Whats happened to Gomes - apart from injuries - is that he’s been ground down, like so many other players have. To the point where it looks like he probably dreads even pulling on a shirt. It’s a symptom of the wider sickness at the club, and it’s the thing that really needs sorting out.

As for the thread title - we ain’t getting 40 points. We might 35 or 37 and it should hopefully be enough.

I was an absolute Gomes fan when he first arrived, he looked immense in his first game against Man United and in many other games in the load period he was sensational.  The truth is that even in his loan period he had really bad dips - like night and day difference.  I was all for buying him but I was very cautious and I think I referred to him as bit of a Ross Barkley.... loads of talent but seriously inconsistent.

The injury from Son was not a career changer, it was a clean injury and his recovery was quite swift.  He came back and despite no match fitness looked very very good... yet when he got match fitness he became crap again.

In many ways he is like Dele Alli... if you can get the fire burning inside him and get him psychologically up for it he can play.... but he cant.

Imagine if he had Jordan Hendersons mentality?