rowlo-efc Posted November 24, 2005 Report Share Posted November 24, 2005 After picking ourselves up from the abyss that is the foot of the table - getting 7 points from 9 against tough opposition, we then went and badly let ourselves down against the albion. Infact the albion game was by far the worst game so far this season (inc. Bucharest away!). They were not much better than the stuff I get to see on a Sunday down at my local park - the defending was nothing like the premier league standard that we have all grown to expect from our players. The more skillful players didn't turn on the magic and the battlers didn't battle. we were a disgrace and our effort levels were rock bottom.. but why? Why are the players not working hard enough - why did moyes not expect a defeat at all - why did he assume that we would win?! Is there a deep rooted problem amongst the players that even Moyes failed to spot? I just cant understand how a team can grind out results against Chelsea, Boro and top strugglers birmingham and then go to WBA and not only get beat, but get stuffed. We were so bad that we allowed every one of their strikers to score. I cant see what is wrong - we have a very good team now, probably the strongest since the 80's. Every player is receiving the right wages - and is getting parity compared with their peers - so there cant be much arguement there. Every player is getting their chance to shine - either through injuries or via merit. What is going wrong? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ooberman Posted November 24, 2005 Report Share Posted November 24, 2005 rowlo, to be honest i just think it's gonna be one of those seasons. it's interesting to note that when we finished 8th (having been in the top 4 all season), next year we finished 16th (or 17th?), then next season we finish 4th, maybe this season we're destined not to do well again!? to be honest, the reasons behind our failure to put a decent run together so far this season has been down to 3 factors in my opinion: - 1) Cahill isn't scoring. He's being played in the centre of midfield, and not being given as much scope to get in the box and finish as last season, due to us playing 2 strikers. 2) We've had injuries. Last year we didn't have any pretty much. And the new players we've brought in haven't had the chance to get fully fit, and people like VDM are being thrown in at the deep end somewhat in order to regain their match fitness 3) And perhaps most importantly........Moyes is tinkering. I think that he felt he HAD to change the formation from last year. People were going on about how we'll be found out (and that we were found out in the last third of last season) and for that reason he felt we couldn't play the same game as last year. I say, we move back to 4-5-1, play Martyn, Hibbert, Yobo, Kroldrup (!), Neville, VDM, Cahill, Arteta, Carsley, Davies, Beattie that will win us the 3 points against Newcastle on Sunday Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FairWooney Posted November 24, 2005 Report Share Posted November 24, 2005 you say he's been tinkering. but all the games we've won we've played 4-4-2. I've personally really like it when we've played 4-4-2 ------------Martyn-------------- Hibbert---Yobo---Weir----Neville ------------------------------------ Arteta---Davis---Cahill----VDM --------------------------------- --------Ferguson---Beattie------ With VDM making those nice switches of position that they did so well the other week. we tried 4-5-1 for several games and it simply isn't working now. I don't know why we are playing so badly but i'm really not looking forward to another sky game this weekend against tough opposition. Newcastle have picked themselves up a bit and if we play like we did against WBA we'll leak a record result. lets hope the boys have some self respect this week. I hate the way a designated player comes out on the offical site each week to appologise for the team, tell us how bad they feel and how they're gonna fight and work together to produce the fans a result the next week. Such bullshit i can' t listen too much longer. If they're gonna come out with that shite I wan't to see them actually produce it the next week. WBA wasn't just a bad performance it was a passionless performance by some quality players who looked like non league side. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Posted November 24, 2005 Report Share Posted November 24, 2005 It could be that we have several problems in the background, which we dont know or hear about. Our form started to decline at the turn of the year, some say at the sale of Tommy Grav, but i'm not sure if that was the cause, one by one the players of 12month ago have been replaced by new signings, it could be dressing room fallouts between the players, or again it could be that players have lost respect for the manager, ? its a difficult one. But i will give you my opinion. We have never had a settled team, injuries, suspensions, tiredness !!, having to play players out of position, all manner of upsets that doesnt allow for playing the best players, in their best positions. Who's fault. ? the Club as a whole must take the blame for that....I have never Known a club sign so many players who are not able to play after we sign them. ...examples....Pistone, Kroldrop, Beattie, Van Der Meyde, How did these players pass such strict medicals, which Everton are supposed to have.?? My answer......they didnt, but they were signed anyway. Sheer panic buys at the thought of losing them if they dont sign now, or they may not sign in the next window, and we have nobody else. If you look at the squad now i think its only Hibbo and Weir who are not DMs players, so he must hold his hands up and say, this is the team i wanted and i brought these players in. So what is wrong ?? the the team selection and formation, the tactics or players not good enough, team spirit non existent, yes all of them , and who is that down to.????????? But hey, thats only my opinion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rowlo-efc Posted November 24, 2005 Author Report Share Posted November 24, 2005 Not sure that Moyes is entirely to blame - I dont personally think that the players are pulling their weight. I dont think that they are being professional enough to simply step out onto the park and give it their all and its a disgrace. Moyes is however responsible for getting them going but can do little to change things once the ball has been kicked. If the players aren't up for it - then Moyes might as well have not bothered - then the fans might as well have not bothered. It is sad that I have to mention the fact that the players aren't up for it - they are professionals getting paid lots and lots of money but yet their effort is so minimal that in any normal day job, they would have been fired by now. Unfortunately football is different and moyes is going to have to be hard with his players in order to get them going again. If it were me in charge, I think that it would be time to start fining one or two of them to give out warnings to the others! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Posted November 24, 2005 Report Share Posted November 24, 2005 HEARD A BIT OF NEWS ... from someone who's well in at the club. Apparently Kenwright had done the deal with Bellamys agent and all was finalised for bells to sign, when he showed up at the club Moyes requested a private chat with Bellend before he signed and off they went to his office. 30 mins later Bellamy storms out the office SAYS HE'S NOT SIGNING and buggers off. God knows what went on in there, but it WAS A done deal, which fell apart rather quickly with DMs intervention. Beattie has also been sent home from training ground with drink related problems, (Allegedly). It might be old news but its the first i've heard of it. any body heard any rumours. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil Posted November 24, 2005 Report Share Posted November 24, 2005 i cant c the bellamy deal being true he doesnt strike me as moyes type of player besides glad it did fall through if it is true as he is 2 mouthy as for beatie it wouldnt surprise me purely because he hasnt looked fit once this season Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuffRob Posted November 24, 2005 Report Share Posted November 24, 2005 I must admit not suprised if the Bellamey rumour was true. But better to find out there was a clash of personnalities before money had changed hand to be honest. We all know about Bellamey's baggage, maybe Moyes pushed him a little in his 'interview' I think our poor form is purly down to bringing in so many player in one go, and the ineveratable tinkering that goes with having so many new player. The facts are we do have a good young manager who is now building a team for not just this season but the future and we now have better player at the club than we did when he joined. This could be a difficult season becasue of the above and the pressures that come with that. OK they are above us in the table, but team like Newcastle and Liverpool, have also done a fair bit of re-building (for a lot more money may I add) aren't doing that clever either yet. I think things will come good an hopefully WBA we a glitch, and the 3 previouse perfomanaces are nearer the mark of the team we have. Up front is light, Moyes is well aware of this fact, and something WILL be done in January. But I am more than happy to go through a little pain, if at the end of the day over the next 4-5 year we estabilsh ourselves as a top 6 side with regular European football and some decent cup run. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevO Posted November 25, 2005 Report Share Posted November 25, 2005 well said there Rob - its the long game were playing, we simply cnt afford quick success, even abramovic's money took 2 years! but i'll take this cloud if there is silver to follow Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pat Posted November 25, 2005 Report Share Posted November 25, 2005 off topic but on topic inr egards to the whole kit & kaboodle....Pat belives the main prob with Marcus Bent ( besides finshing) is that he is "HEAD FEURKED". I think he knows his days are numbred & it's got him. Think about it..the lad's had 26 clubs @ stilla young age..& all this talk of a move has fuked him. Uno we ask for loyalty...should not they? tuff 1 isnt it...then we say it's business..but if they leave they aint loyal? sum 1 shld ahve sat marcus down & set him str8. Maybe they have?. He looks to me to be a man whose lost the cause & not by his own doing. Sure he aint the best player in the world..& i poss would have taken the cple mill being touted for him..However, I belive Marcus has beem left hanging & the Manager is to blame. Also belive Marcus is a chip that Moyers wont hesitate to cash for further quality @ any time & Marcus knows this 2. ias just perhaps another pice of the puzzle that seems to be our fractured spirit of l8? Any coincidence?...think about it..thats 1 players story ( perhaps)..you only need a few others to be off with something, new players in..etc etc etc...& the whole thing starts going array..again sound familiar? Marcus ahs been slated for not trying of late..of course which is unacceptbale to us supporters. however unacceptbale consider this...You go to work..you no youre going to be laid of or sacked...do you bust your Ass for the company about to let yopu go...or do you do the natural thing of taking it easy eith a fuk you attitude?. Again better man managemnet perhaps would have avoided such a scenario in this instance..& who knows maybe in others. Not saying Moyes out...no way//just saying diplomacy could be improvved on...Alan stubbs was a further diplomatic, man magement disaster... anybody? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest fozzie22 Posted November 25, 2005 Report Share Posted November 25, 2005 The simple truth is that the whole club is run by a bunch of fools,as Pat said the Stubbs fiasco was typical of the way Everton are run,as are the horrudous number of injured players brought in. This now is DMs team and he has to take the blame,no more hiding behind excuses he bought the players so the buck stops with him. I can only see loan players coming in the transfer window,i just dont see where the money would come from,even though the squad is as threadbare as a tramps underpants. The recent injury crisis proved that the squad is niwhere near strong enough to compete once we lose a couple of players. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nyem Posted November 29, 2005 Report Share Posted November 29, 2005 -i don see we will finish higher than mid table.....im afraid we will fight relegation this season... - our problem is our squad are not stronger than last season..DM don get his men he need on last transfer period.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevO Posted November 29, 2005 Report Share Posted November 29, 2005 i think january can make or break moyes as our manger, if we have won a few more games by then, and upto say 12th then he get the players he needs/wants could be rosey. if were still in the mire and we cant sign anyone then could be nighy night ill tell you one thing, its gunna be an interesting xmas Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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