carlmc25

Saha got to me as well, if he had passed the bloody ball sometimes then we'd have won

Yeah I agree, the rumour is he's going to Arsenal for £4m and at certain times on Saturday it looked the case. Pienaar was clean through with a simple pass and Saha just dawdled on the ball and ended up blasting it straight at an Arsenal defender. We should have won this match and I'm annoyed that we left a massive space down the right hand side of our defence for their equaliser when we were into added on time, we should have had every man back behind the ball. Even more annoying was the fact that Howard probably had it covered but we were unlucky again. We really need to start getting some wins now but it's nice to see that our season is definitely turning around, ever since we totally outplayed Liverpool (another top 4 team Romey - or will be top 4 anyway) but lost our performances have really gone up a level and we're now playing like the Everton team we know and love. We just need Jags and Arteta back and we could have another glorious season. An excellent league finish may now be getting slightly unrealistic (although I can still see top 8 or so) but I can't see any reason why we can't win a cup this year. The league was wide open this year, it's just a pity we had so many injuries and such poor form early on. Next year I think we can have a very good season, I still think we're a match for anyone when everyone is fit.

2-0 to Arsenal. I think the scoreline will flatter them though because I reckon we'll play well but just not create.

 

What a shocker, Romey predicts yet another Everton defeat, I've never known any Everton fan quite as pessimistic! Anyway, Arsenal aren't that great, force them to get the ball out to the flanks and close up the middle of the defence, they have no height and are virtually no threat from out wide. Chelsea totally nullified their threat using these tactics. Sit back, let them pass pretty circles but totally shut up shop down the middle, then hit them on the break and try and put them under pressure from set pieces. I think Arsenal are beatable, particularly at the moment without the likes of Fabregas and Van Persie.

 

IF we play well then we can get something from this, we don't need to fear them.

Top 5 for me has to be:

 

Big Nev - best keeper ever imo and also a legendary cult figure

Arteta - genius

Trevor Steven - one of my earliest favourite players, a truly brilliant winger

John Ebbrell - totally underrated player, much better than the totally overated Joe Parkinson imo, Ebbrell was my footballing hero when I was in school

Amokachi - I don't think any other Everton player has made me smile as much as Amo, he wasn't obviously that great a player but I loved him.

 

close mentions for Dave Watson, Peter Reid, Yobo, Lineker and Sharp.

We have been terrible this season and yet we're not too far behind the likes of City and Spurs etc, mainly because they're not very good. I don't think we can do any worse than we have, nearly all our best players have been out and the team set up has been wrong. Moyes seems to have fixed this recently and if we can get some players back and keep those we have fit, fit, then I think we'll easily be top 10 and with the likes of Arteta back we could get back into that top 6. Last year we were something like 8 points behind Villa with 8 games to go and we overtook them, we have a lot more time than that this time and I think we're a better team than virtually anyone in the league (Chelsea, Utd aside) when everyone is fit. I predict a good season with a decent league finish and a cup win. I fancy the Europa this year, we just need some players back and to keep the likes of Pienaar fit. If we have terrible injuries then we won't have a great season but it'll still be ok, you can't expect much more than that.

Regarding the Howard debate started with Romey and Dunc, I lean towards Romey's side of the argument but think it's not as clear cut as he states. Howard is a great close range shot stopper, possibly one of the best in the league, and he does get beaten from long range way too often and this season has been comanding his area very poorly. However I feel that people shoot from long range becasue they can't beat him a close range and the revolving line of defenders this season does not help him trying to arrange his defence. Howard is an average goalkeepr if we really look at it, he makes some great stops at close range but makes mistakes in other areas. I can name at least five goalkeepers better than him playing in the league at the moment. Cech, Friedel, Van Der Sar, Jaaskelianan, Riena, Given, Schwarzer are all current premier league goal keepers that i can think off the top of my head that are better than Howard. He is an above average goal keeper who, untill this year, previously played in front of a very solid defence. Last season he was one of the goal keepers who had to make the fewest saves, I believe Van der Sar was the only one above him, this is why he had so many clean sheets, because the defence stopped most attacks before they came to him. This year our defence has been shite leaving Howard to make more saves and he does make alot of mistakes. I like Howard but would definatly replace him given the chance, it's just that we always have much more pressing positions. Personally I like Kieren Westwood at Cov.

I give up, Evertonians really are never happy. I wouldn't swap Howard for anyone except possibly Reina and fluke master Given. Cech is a spent force, as is Schwarzer (Who was never very good anyway, except on crosses) and Friedel. Howard is an excellent keeper all round and a brilliant shot stopper. I honestly can't see how any Everton fans can complain about Howard but everyone has a right to an opinion, even if it is a terrible one.

Howard - I'd like to kiss him for that save. I'm critical of Howard but that save was fucking priceless, and you could tell how much it meant to him from the way he celebrated the save. That poor post.

I don't know how anyone can be critical of Howard, he's definitely in the top 3 or 4 keepers in the Premiership imo. He made an absolutely outstanding save from Crouch at 2-0 that kept us in the game, it was nearly as good as the save of the season that he made from Insua in the derby. He's our best keeper for years, since Big Nev imo. The only other keeper nearly as good was Martyn but he was terrible on crosses - he never came for them unless they were under his bar and when he did he invariably made a total hash of them.

 

Everton definitely look back, our defence at the moment is always going to look a bit dodgy. I thought Neill (goal aside) looked pretty good, Coleman was awesome, Hibbert was out of position and dodgy but Baines was once again pretty damn poor. He needs a kick up the backside at the minute, hopefully setting up the goal will get his confidence back as at the moment his delivery is poor and his defending very suspect.

 

Well played Everton, much more like it.

I thought Distin did little wrong, Yobo was at fault for both goals imo. I love Yobo but he hasn't been good enough this year, he needs to get his act together. What a difference Pienaar makes, finally with some creativity in our team we showed that we are a decent team. It's been very difficult without Arteta, Pienaar, Billy and even Osman in our team, no wonder we have struggled to score goals. Once again though, Liverpool were absolutely terrible yet we still let in two goals, says it all about our defending at present - it's the defence that is really letting us down this season. We played really well today and hopefully our season will kick off now, I still think we'll have a decent season and maybe win something, we just need Jags and Arteta back. Oh and what a save by Howard from that header, best save of the season in my opinion. Glad to see Cahill back where he belongs, playing off the front man. Fellaini isn't a bad passer of the ball and Cahill is far more dangerous going forward, finally Moyes seemed to get the right balance with those two.

Wake up and smell the coffee Moyse opted for 442 because he had no choice with Bily & Felli suspended and Goslings form being so poor it had nothing to do with fan pressure

As if, he played 442 due to our poor form and fan pressure calling him negative all the time. He probably thought, 'right, it's only Hull and everyone is moaning about me being negative so I'll play 442 and try and score a few goals, I can probably risk the formation in this match' and guess what, we lost. We could have played Gosling or Neill on the right wing. The fact is playing more players up front doesn't automatically make you a more attacking team, it doesn't automatically make a team more dangerous - what it does mean is that you have less players in midfield to win the ball and protect the defence. We've been rubbish for weeks even in a 451 due to the amount of injuries we have (not Moyes fault) and some players poor form but the fact is, at least in a 451 we are usually competitive and give someone a match, if we play 442 we're likely to be thrashed as our midfield is weak in a 4, it has been for the last 4/5 years which is why all Moyes success has been built on 451. If we had Gerrard and Mascherano I'd be happy with a 442, instead we have Rodwell (learning his trade) Cahill (totally useless in a 4) Heitinga (jury still out) or Fellaini (useless in a 5 never mind a 4) to play in there and they aren't up to it. Until Arteta and/or Pienaar are back fit we are going to struggle to win games and score goals, FACT. We need to accept it and stop moaning about performances and negative tactics, Moyes has no creative players fit so how the hell is he supposed to help us play attacking football? We need to get back to basics, defend and try and pinch a goal until our players return to fitness. It may not be pretty but I'd take grinding out results over losing any day. oh and Distin and Yobo just can't play together, we must have kept about one clean sheet this season, if Hull can put 3 past us I am genuinely scared about what Liverpool may do. We need to drop Distin and try maybe Heitinga with Yobo. Oh and how bad has Baines been this season, he needs a real kick up the backside, he's offered nothing going forward and been poor defensively. Can't wait for Arteta to be back, not least for his set-pieces (which some people used to have the audacity to moan about).

We have eight full internationals on the pitch, plus Rodwell and Baines (who've both played under 21's) and Distin.

How can this happen?

442, that's how it can happen. Everton fans never learn, finally they pressure Moyes into playing it and guess what, we can't defend to save our lives. We just don't have good enough players in midield (without Arteta - and even possibly with Arteta) to play 442. We don't have the right balance, we don't have the class and players with authority. Rodwell is a little boy lost in midfield, Cahill is useless in a 442 (I know he's been useless all season but he's been out of position) and with only 4 in midfield our already shaky defence is even more isolated and nervy.

 

We cannot play 442, there is no point having two quality strikers up front if you can't get the ball to them. We have only one creative player - Pienaar - who is half fit, so we are always going to struggle to score goals no matter who we play. Due to relative inability to score we need to keep it tight and try and fluke a goal from somewhere, even a set piece. We need to concentrate on defending and keeping clean sheets. Moyes tried to be positive but we just don't have the players, Moyes already knew it but pandered to the moaning of the fans who think having more players up front suddenly makes you a better team when in reality it just gives us even less of the ball.

Of the knee injuries Neville, Piennar & Anichebe got thier injuries as a result of bad tackles sustained during competritive games so they cant be put down to anything in training

 

Jags just landed awkwardly and Arteta got his stoods caught in the turf as he turned. Yak was just unlucky

 

Thier is no conspiracy and to look for a scapegoat like Steve Round is absurd

 

If the injuries were all niggling strains etc then maybe you could look at the training

 

But as somebody else pointed out Vaughn want even at the club when he got injured, Yobo was a head injury picked up in a game, Yak is bound to pick up some niggling injuries after being out for so long so that only leaves Baines, Osman & Bily's injuries and given the amount of games they are being asked to play its hardly surprising that we pick up one or two knocks

Vaughan and VDM are irrelevant as they are obviously just injury prone, but as you said - Arteta, Jags AND Yakubu all picked up 'freak' injuries within the space of roughly 12 months since Round has been coach, how many 'freak' serious injuries did we have when Irvine was in charge? we must have had more injuries in the last 15 months than the previous 4 or so years under Irvine's training regimes and none can really be blamed on the new boots and metatarsals. Injuries like Anichebes are unavoidable, some of the others seemed to be picked up far too easily. As you think, it may be coincidence but you can't blame me for seeing a pattern emerging and looking for possible answers.

What utter rubish!

 

If Steve Round had tackled Anichebe, Piennar, Neville etc in training then yes it would be his fault

 

Our injury crisis has got nothing to do with Steve Round or anything the players are doing in training its just plain bad luck

freak accidents seem to be occurring with alarming regularity, maybe if our players knees (whatever) were stronger they wouldn't be so prone to freak injuries when they jump for a header. It's just a thought and maybe it is purely bad luck, but questions should be asked imo. Liverpool had a lot of injuries when Phil Boersma was in charge of training, I doubt he went around actually injuring players himself. Sometimes the training can be to blame.

I think Spurs are supposedly playing a load of fringe players. I'm not bothered if we go out as it may be for the best, although I do think we have a big enough squad to cope this year. We have a lot of injuries at the moment but those players will return in the not too distant future. At the moment we'll struggle to beat anyone and I mean anyone, we have virtually nil creativity so we'd struggle to break down Blackpool never mind Spurs, that being said Everton - under Moyes - nearly always give 100% and I expect no different tonight. We'll give Spurs a game and with a bit of luck and the odd lucky set-piece we could win. No one could ask for any more than that with our current injuries, any team would struggle missing nearly all of their best players.

Genuine enquiry guys, so please no flak, but does anyone have the slightest idea as to why, season after season, we are suffering so much with injuries? I know all teams have injuries to key players at some stage, but we seem to be plagued with them. Is it something to do with the fitness or training methods? I for one, have no idea, but some of the more knowledgeable amongst you may have some theories at least.

I don't know if it's bad luck or something more sinister but since Steve Round has come in our injury problems have been unbelievable (plus our defending of basic set pieces this season is inept). When we had Irvine we seemed to have little problem with injuries but last season and this it's getting silly.

I agree that Neville aids the back four better than Jack does, but I think this whole lineup change depends on the team and style were playing. Jack is better at going forward and being offensive when needed, yet he can still be a holding midfielder. Jack can score goals where Neville is a far shot for that. Neville is the veteran with experience though. It will be interesting to see how Moyes handles this situation in big games. I love that were debtating this because this means we finally have depth for the first time in a few seasons

Arteta, Pienaar and Cahill will provide/score the goals - Rodwell/Neville will be there to provide defensive cover as their primary function, Rodwell still can't cut it so he'll be dropped unless he improves as Neville does that job much better.

Ah right, I see, Kenwright and Moyes come as a set? So in order to keep Moyes as manager we need to have Kenwright. Wasn't aware of that clause. That's a bit like the old George Michael and Andrew Ridgley partnership, one with obvious talent and one in the limelight for no apparent reason.

 

I was kind of hoping without that then maybe we could keep Moyes and have someone like Lerner backing him (who has put about £85 net transfer funding behind MON)

 

Not that he doesn't sound like he knows he hasn't got the financial backing he needs when asked:

 

Q: "Ultimately you spent less than £5m net, bringing in Fellaini and selling Andy Johnson. How much would it have taken to ‘have a real go’?"

 

A: We’ve had 4th, 5th, 6th and 7th-place finishes in my six seasons and got close to being able to establish ourselves alongside the Big Four. I think £30m-£40m would have given us a realistic chance. But a lot of clubs are spending now, Man City, Villa, Tottenham, Newcastle . . . so we might have needed £30m just to stay fifth. And it could take four years of spending £30m to bridge that gap with the Big Four.

 

source: http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/sport/football/premier_league/everton/article5299415.ece

(in fact read the Answer to the question: How much longer can you have the energy to keep pushing Everton forward while the club is scrimping and saving?

 

Would you still like to see a manager like Moyes partnered with a chairman unable to fund him in the way that Lerner has supported MON (who has made some questionable signings admittedly). When in the words from the man himself supports what I have always thought "That if we were given that extra injection of money when we were challenging top 4, we could have made that breakthrough to the level where our revenue would possibly increase by a further £20m a season with champs league"

I'm still awaiting the proof that Lerner wanted to buy us? Actually I'm not really as there isn't any, only rumour and gossip.

I think Jo is hit and miss, I don't particularly rate him and would rather play Anichebe who I still think could come good if he can get some consistency, fitness and a run of games.

I agree with jamie. Neville is a great presense but not a starter when were healthy. Felli could take the place of one of them. I havent quite figured out where Billy will fit best. He serves up dirty balls from the wings, but could see him scoring goals in the middle. I think Cahill is looking forward to Mikel coming back the most.

I disagree about Neville. Rodwell may be more assured on the ball but he gives nothing like the protection to the back 4 and the general involvement in the game that Neville does, Rodwell goes missing in virtually every game whereas Neville was superb last season. Rodwell still has a lot to prove for me, he has the ability and potential and that may be good enough for the future but it's not enough for the here and now, he needs to contribute more otherwise I'd drop him as soon as Neville is fit.

I thought Distin had his best game, he was really solid imo. As for Gosling, considering he's a youngster with little experience playing in an unfamiliar position I thought he did well. They targeted the right hand side because both Gosling and Hibbert were out of position, very little got past Gosling from memory, the only problem was he liked to go forward a lot which did leave some holes defensively. I thought he did well and he should get some credit considering he is not meant to be a right back. Jo was a total waste of space, as was Yakubu. Baines has been one of the biggest disappointments so far this season for me, again last night his general passing was abysmal, in the first half he played about 7 easy passes in a row straight to the opposition. His attacking play is virtually non existent and he isn't the world's greatest defender, he needs to up his game but unfortunately he has no competition now Lescott has moved on. A gritty performance last night, horrendous conditions, the squad was stretched to breaking point yet guess what - we win again. You can rely on Moyes' Everton teams to do the business, they very rarely let us down. We just need to keep going until Arteta is back.

I'll admit that I was wrong .

me too, I was adamant we should sell him in the summer as he was a waste of space, he has been excellent this year and looks a different, fitter, stronger player.

I thought Heitinga had an absolute nightmare, I had my doubts when we signed him as Van Bronckhurst used to play for the Dutch defence and he couldn't defend for toffee. He reminded me of Gravesen, without the talent and class on the ball. He constantly dives in, charges at people and commits himself and he looked slow and isn't particularly big, I'm worried if he's supposed to be the answer in defence. Our defence looks a bit shaky, we need Jags organisation and brick wall attitude alongside Yobo's pace and aerial ability, Distin has been ok so far but doesn't look overly brilliant alongside Yobo - who was our best defender today by some distance. I actually thought Osman did ok today, he did more defensively than Heitinga and showed good feet on occasions. Saha and Howard excellent and Cahill unlucky not to score a couple, everyone else pretty poor, how we miss Arteta's set pieces as Baines isn't in the same league. Once we have Arteta back we'll be a lot better. How Fellaini didn't score that header I'll never know. Lucky win but it's still 3 points.

Without being analytical to the point of using google we are running a sell to buy business. The major saleable assets we have now are ones that would form part of a first team of a title contending team. Taking two or three steps forward without taking one back is what we need. If we had strength in depth we would have had champions league football. We have been hindered by our weak right hand side and inabilty to cover injuries. By the way as an fyi, we were on the decline in 89 as we had sold our title winning players of 85 to the likes of rangers, marseille etc as they had european cup aspirations. 20 years, 24 years whatever. Nil satis nisi optimum looks a nice bit of latin, it's what it means that we need to remember.

Man Utd have sold Beckham, Ronaldo, Ince, Van Nistelrooy etc. No one player is bigger than the club, would you rather we had Rooney and were playing in the Championship? We all want more money, we all know that with a little more investment we could potentially be serious challengers for the top 2 or 3 but we don't all want just any old millionaire taking over the club as some of them don't actually put any of their money into the club they just put the club further into debt and then leave them high and dry when they walk away. Peter Johnson was a rich man, what did he do for Everton? I believe that Kenwright is waiting for the right investor and at the moment, with the ground the way it is etc it may just be that the right investor is not interested in us. We're moving forward every season, I for one am happy with that.

Beat me to it. Eloquently written, highlights many of the points that have driven me insane. Expect it to be removed from the feed at some stage if one of his points are true!

Portsmouth, Notts County, QPR and Southampton? not exactly clubs I'm hoping to emulate, maybe Kenwright is waiting for the 'right' buyer rather than just anyone who apparently has some cash (look at Pompey post Gaydamak era).

I think it's not the case of who spent how much - it's a case of how much did they need to spend to strengthen their squad adequately.

 

 

Man u NO - Sold Ronaldo and lost Tevez, bought in Valencia, Owen, Obertan and already have a massive squad - 52 players per position at least with Hargreaves coming back.

 

Arsenal NO - Sold Adebuyor and Toure - bought in Vermaelen and have an outragous number of youngsters coming through

 

Chelsea NO - big squad already, borught in zhirkov - £18m

 

Liverpool NO - lost alonso - brought in Johnson and Aquilaini to add to an already decent sized squad.

 

 

 

Everton: Struggled through last season having to play the same players with little rest. Injuries meant threadbare squad relied on youngsters with little or no premier league expreience sitting on the bench. Lost Valente, Castillo, Jacobsen and Lescott as senior players. Brought in: Billy, Heitinga, Distin and under the realisation that we are still threadbare Lucas Neill.

 

Yes we have strengthened in quality a little maybe, the damning fact remains is that our nearest rivals such as Villa and Spurs have strengthened what were already stronger squads than us.

 

If we are to continue to look to improve we need to get strength in depth. We are always 2 injuries away from a disaster - our first 11 is great, how often do the first 11 stay fit?

 

I applaud those who continue to look at the glass being half full - I wish I could. Fact is history has a way of repeating itself at this club. The only thing that keeps it positive is the work that Moyes and the boys do. We are being let down at a higher level.

 

Burning question: "How much is Everton up for sale for?"

This quite frankly is rubbish. Liverpool finished in the top 4, have a huge worldwide fanbase and only had a net spend of about 5 million and they only have one decent recognised striker - Torres. If he gets injured they're in big trouble. They have virtually no depth anywhere, they have a brilliant first eleven but a rubbish squad, hence why they most likely won't win the league again. United have definitely weakened however you look at it, Villa didn't spend much and lost their best player etc.

 

You mention about selling Rodwell in the future, we all hope this won't happen but if it's for the good of the club (like Lescott and Rooney) then what is the problem? Selling Lescott and Rooney has not weakened our club, it isn't making us go backwards, it's giving us the finances to help Moyes take us that next step into the top 4 and has had substantial benefits for the club already. I genuinely believe (for the first time in a long time) that we would win something this season. We have an excellent squad, easily our best in the last 20 years which has cover in every position on the pitch, we can now cope with cup runs and still achieve a high finish in the league. Finishing in the top 6 is going to be difficult this year, I think we can do it (even top 4) but at the same time I wouldn't be overly devastated if we finished 7th and won the Europa Cup. I think this year is going to be a great year for Everton fans, we've done some great transfer business and performances and results are now picking up, once Arteta is back we'll explode and start winning virtually every match. We have a very good team, as long as Moyes gets the right balance. I don't understand why Everton fans are so pessimistic, we don't have Mike Walker or Walter Smith anymore, we have one of the world's best managers and some fantastic players.

We have Rodwell in our side, we don't need to look any further than him (but he is the only one left tbh).

I thought Rodwell was totally anonymous at the weekend against a very limited Fulham side. He's got to do a lot better than that before he can be seen as the answer in our midfield. We had two defensive midfielders in front of our back four and we still looked dodgy at the back. Distin lost some headers he was easily favourite to win as well, the second goal he should have won the ball in the air and then awful defending from Baines (who has started the season quite slowly imo) who should never have shown Duff onto his favoured left foot and directly in on goal, basic stuff really. We need to compete again, the second half we didn't look interested until we went 2-1 down.

No backlash as it's a fact! The only thing stopping Arteta and Jags going is that Citeh are well stocked in those areas, but money talks and especially for a chairman who is seemingly intend on keeping us a selling club. Doesn't matter Moyes says know, as Hughes put it, clubs will speak to Billy directly as they know he is keen for the cash.

I don't agree that it's a fact at all. Selling Jagielka for anything in excess of £20m would have to be excellent business but selling Arteta would make absolutely no sense as we'd have to pay a fortune to replace him. The only way I can see us selling Arteta would be for a fee in excess of £35m+, certainly £30m+ as he is the most important player in our team and getting a replacement of his quality will be very difficult and risky. Most players in our team are replaceable, Arteta isn't.