johny

they bought the club for £187m 3 1/2 years ago, they now value it at over £400m, despite adding little true value to it. they can go and sit on a big stick.

they havent put "loads of money" into Liverpool at all. The season they took over they borrowed money to buy the club and then borrowed a further £60m for cash flow. Both these loans were secured against the club, and it's the second loan that provided the transfer money the season we signed Torres, Babel, and Mascherano. Every season since then we've made a net profit on transfers. They haven't put a single cent of their own money into the club for players. The only money they are personally liable for is the £140 of equity RBS insisted they provide as part of a previous refinace deal. This money is also borrowed, albeit against personal guarantees. This was then loaned to Kop Holdings through a second holding company, Kop Caymen. The club, whilst they own it, carry the burden of repaying this loan also.

thanks to whoever deleted the link. In other news, seems we probably will be getting a 9 point deduction if the RBS have to step in. Suppose it all rests on the outcome of this court case on Tuesday. Looking forward to seeing the back of them 2 cnuts however it comes about. Not remotely bothered about the nationality of the new owners, Henry being a yank doesn't put him in the same boat as Hicks. I mean, I'm the same nationality as Peter Sutcliffe but I've not murdered nearly as many prostitutes as he has Ask me again in 12 months though how I feel about it all though...

he is the expert of financially ruining clubs after all. just noticed where thats from as well!! do us a favour and take the link down?

I don't know a single Liverpool fan who wouldn't happily drive the 9 points to Lancaster Gate personally if it meant RBS calling in their loans. This is much more important than a handful of points! Interesting point though, the loan is secured against Kop Holdings, whose sole asset is LFC, rather than directly against the club itself. This may mean that a point deduction is not applicable, one for the lawyers to sort out. If I could be arsed to find the link for this I would... By all accounts the Red Sox are as well a run team as any in baseball, have had success and have built a tallented young squad since this fella has owned them. I would be cautiously optimistic if I hadn't heard it all before. Not holding my breath to be honest. See yous on the 17th! Can't wait. (sarcastic smiley)

definately past his best now, keeping his place in our defence at the moment simply on skyrtl's lack of form. having watched him in action week after week with my own eyes I can confidently say that at his peak between 04 and 08 he was nowhere near overrated, him and Hyypia were phenominal. Whether its body or mind thats slipping now, or both, the interceptions aren't sticking, the crosses are getting past, and he's increasingly being caught out. Still gives his all and still has the ability to put in the massive perfomances but they are increasingly rare these days. Not sure exactly why Capello wants him, probably for his big game experience, but I know he spent a lot of time trying to talk him out of retirement when he 1st became manager so he obviously rates him.

haven't been on the internet as much in the last 8 months or so since I changed jobs. Got to actually do some work for a living now. you would pull your hair out (as a red) if you believed any of the bullsh*t that gets spread around merseyside about our players / managers down the years, before the internet it used to be the bluenose taxi drivers, now its every tom, dick and harry with a phone or keyboard. you can always tell whats bollocks though by the fact that everyone repeats word for word the exact same text message / email, each claiming they got it off their own "source". for what its worth, my mums hairdresser's pet python told me tim cahill beats his mum up for threatening to go to the daily star and tell them he left the planet venus in shame after getting a 103 year old male prostitute pregnant. pass it on

Oliver Kay in today's Times: Scandal-mongering of internet gossips a shameful practice Oliver Kay, Football Correspondent You have probably heard the rumour. Shocking, isn’t it? Shocking that so many people are happy to lap up a series of malevolent lies about one of England’s leading footballers and to spread them like wildfire in the belief — and, far worse, the hope — that they must be true. It seems that the English public is more than happy to believe anything about footballers these days. Perhaps that is the consequence of the John Terry affair, in which the kind of improbable scandal dreamt up by the scriptwriters of Footballers’ Wives turned out to be true, but the most sickening thing about this latest sadistic rumour about another player is the unbelievable number of people on internet message boards writing things such as: "Please let this be true! LOL!" Please let this be true? Please let this decent man see his family life ripped apart because he happens to be a footballer playing for a club other than your own? Is that how far we have sunk? As a football-loving nation, have we actually reached the stage where we hate footballers? Not every footballer is a walking, talking egotist with regard only for himself, his libido and his bank balance. That breed represents a very small minority. The player at the centre of this rumour is renowned as a family man — or at least he was until some loser with a vivid imagination and nothing better to do with his time decided to dream up a scenario, post it on a message board and wait for it to spread like wildfire across the internet. The internet has become a dangerous place for those in the public eye, particularly those in football. Rumours — Player A is gay, Player B is having an affair with Player C’s wife, Player D is a cocaine addict, Manager A was caught in bed with the chairman’s daughter — are peddled gleefully and without restriction. This latest rumour could even be found yesterday morning on the message board of a rival club’s official website. It has been removed. Next time you hear that the newspapers are intent on undermining England’s players in a World Cup year, though, cast your mind back to the scandal-mongering of the internet gossips and pub bores over the past week or so. Certain newspapers do very well out of publishing unpleasant truths about the private lives of footballers, stating that they are doing so in the "public interest", whatever that might be. What they do not do is make up or spread malicious gossip of the type presented as truth on the internet. If they did, they would be closed down. As for the player in question, he has no choice but to ignore the rumours and hope they go away. A World Cup is looming. England expects. And what a hypocrisy that is becoming.

So one minute the Derby game in your opinion is a massive game for local supporters and then the next it is not and the United game is more of an attraction very contradicting! stop making things up, where have i suddenly decided the derby game isn't a massive game? the point i was making, which you seem to have conveniently ignored was that the united game was a bigger attraction than the derby to the type of fans you have flooded the game in the last 15 years or so, the type who spend all game taking photos on their mobiles, texting their mates, waving like bellends at the cameras every time the ball goes out for a throw or a corner, moan when people stand up when were attacking, come up to you outside the ground asking "which one is the kop?", dressing up like a kid at a birthday party with face paint and jester style hats, and expecting to be entertained by the "famous atmosphere" and failing to realise that they have to be a part of that atmosphere in the first place. <<That is the type of person i'm refering to. i encapsulated it under the title "sky generation fans" for ease of typing. i'm sure you will have seen the same change yourself at goodison in the type of fans you go the game nowadays? you only have to look at the average gates at anfield down the years to see the difference, since i started going we used to get around 33,000ish and it was the same for years, you could get a ticket on the day of the game, even pay on the gate in the corner of the kop, during the mid 90s it started to increase, and by the end of the 90's we were getting over 40,000, now all of a sudden its exploded, sold out pretty much every game on the day of the sale, 58,000 on the seasie waiting list. where did all these people crawl out from all of a sudden? i gave up my seasie in 98 as the aways were to tempting to go on, and were killing me financially and i thought it would be easier to just buy tickets game for game. within 2 years i'd put myself on the waiting list as it was getting harder and harder to get tickets, i'm still waiting now, and some lads have been on it as long as 15 years, and just a few seasons before they were on it they were walking up to the ground and paying in. I really cant see Liverpool supporters taking the Derby games on par with playing Bolton and WestHam i mean come on your not doing yourself and the so called real supporters you know so well any favours by coming out with complete bollocks like that. i didnt come out with complete bollocks like that though did i? why are you throwing bolton in with west ham? i said everton, spurs, villa, and west ham, and the point which you seem to have missed is that these games ARE big games, its just that certain liverpool fans dont treat them as big games becasue they believe all the hype about the "big4". You can not tell me you have a full collective of other Liverpool supporters on the subject so you would not know its simply your and maybe a few of your mates opinions its not fact simple. why would i tell you that? i'm telling you what i SEE and HEAR week in, week out at anfield. why would i need to question every liverpool fan in the country to come to the conclusion that SOME of them are shit fans who care more about the kudos of supporting a certain team than the team itself or the city they represent? i can see it for myself, and unfortunatly it is a fact. and it is much, much more than just mine and a few mates opinions. its also the opinion of pretty much every evertonian i have ever spoken to that liverpool have a load of glory hunting pricks following us, you are pretty much the exception in that respect (that have made their opionions clear to me that is). to be honest i think you just took offence to the "too many wools" comment in my first post and have been trying to justify your own support for everton ever since. its certainly how its coming across anyway.

who's the ref? fine, sure thing.

plank! ouch! come on play nice sweetheart. fisrt of all, it says wirral as my location. i was posting under the assumption that this is clearly visable to everyone on this board? i havent labeled myself as anything! and second of all, on the subject of contrary, in your first reply to me you said "but i dont see where a geographical link to Merseyside would make you more of a fan of any club and carry less passion for which ever club it is you support" and then in your second reply you denied talking about "how much of a fan you are" but what i really dont understend is why you think you know more about the nature of our support than me? the question was asked why some liverpool fans say everton isnt a big game. the fact is that a lot of liverpool fans dont see it as a derby and treat it like any other game. the united game is the only other that sells using the same pre-req rules as the derby (2 pre-determined fixtures registered against a fan card), and every year united sells out twice as fast. this season the derby eventually went to any fancard holder with any 08-09 game registered against it and there were still tickets on sale that evening! sad fact of the modern game but too many sky generation fans believe the media hype over the mythical "big-four" and see games against the likes of everton, spurs, west ham, and villa as average run of the mill games comparable to bolton or reading. whether you like it or not, and clearly you dont, the lads at the match you see and hear with this type of attitude never have a local accent. this quote bollocks is beyond me but i think bluebri put it much more eloquently than i can on page 4 of this thread. so you either think you know our fans better than me, or think i'm lying about it?

sorry mistaken identity!

i know what point you are making, that Liverpool fans can be contrary too, but thats pretty pointless as it doesn't change the truth in what i said in any way. and if efctaxi can point out where it is I've said that I am just as passionate as a local fan then maybe he would also have a point. But he wont be able to unfortunatly.

you see you are doing it agiain. i'm talking specifically about the derby and you come back with some gerneralised sentimental waffle about having everton in your veins. i know perfectly well how passionate some oot fans can be and despite what the majority of everton fans i know say, i know you have a fair sized oot following too, fucks sake im from the wirral, this isnt some "only scousers should get tickets" rant you may be comparing it to, its just the simple fact that a local derby will always mean more to locals. i'm not arguing about this i've seen it enough times with my own eyes in real life enough times to give a shit what someone types on a message board, its just that you dont seem to be able to grasp the point i was making. its funny how contrary you lot can be sometimes, theres plenty of blues out there who would swear blind you lot dont exist, that every match going blue lives on or just off county road and the fact is the people who talk the most sence about football, the most realistic, cynical, tinted glasses well and truly off, type of people tend to be regular match goers. so dont hate the player, hate the game, its not my fault its true.

dont talk shite. its nothing to do with how much of a fan you are, its the fact you've been brought up in an environment of multi-generational red and/or blue families, a local derby will always mean more to locals because its a part of the fabric of where they live and permiates into most aspects of their everyday lives. and every good blue i know, and by that i mean match going blues, the derby means as much to them as it does to us, losing it hurts no matter where you are in the league, its fuck all to do with points and positions compared to local and personal pride and i guess the fact you dont see that probably proves my point.

its 2 separate things 1. too many wools follow us and have no geographical link to merseyside, therefore everton are just another team to them 2. pretending the derby means nothing is a sly way of winding them up, i.e. we only care about the BIG teams. every local match going red i know counts the derby as the biggest games of the season, nothing, not even united, feels quite like a derby. the horrible nervous feeling you have days beforehand, derby belly. derbys are fucking horrible, spiteful things. they dominate your life for pretty much the whole week and you cant enjoy them till the final whistle, even at 2 or 3 up you're still bricking it with 5 minutes left.

in the first half maybe... over the 90 minutes we created 4 or 5 clear cut chances, should have been enough to win the game but Kuyt, Torres and Gerrard all fluffed their lines at the last second. gerrard missing an unmarked header, 8 yards out, dead center of goal summed it up for me really.

for what its worth i thought we were unlucky today completely controlled the game, mascherano, alonso and gerrard were completely dominant and at times, especially 2nd half, it was men against boys in the middle of the park. we were stronger, faster and more determined and our pressing was spot on, forcing so many errors from everton. at the back we were excellent, the one corner aside, and Skertl in particular was immense. whilst evertons defence was good, and our attacks pretty sterile, we still carved out enough good chances to put at least 2 away. if everton play that poorly at goodison i think we will beat them quite easily. our best form all season has been away from home and our record at goodison is fantastic. Fellani coming back will give them more grit in the middle but Torres will be that bit more fitter and sharper.

banks have invoked a 6 month grace period to pay back the loan, which was always on the cards.

Our selling arrangments just been announced on the offical site so I imagine Everton will now have been notified of their allocation.

you'll almost certainly get the lower rd end. arsenal had it 2 years ago, last seasons ties all had returns from the away fans so as far as i can hazily remember they only brought between 2-4000 each but you lot will get the full 6,400. cannot fucking wait and whoever said liverpool fans will be nervous about this...if jumping round the pub cheering like we'd won the thing counts as nervous then I guess we're guilty

really shocked to see him in the daily mirror today. still smilng though he'll leave a hole that won't be filled, proper gent.

i remember about 10 years ago or more, Dennis Wise catching the ball when playing for chelsea, and getting sent off. Just stuck his hands up and caught it for no reason. Straight away he realised what he'd done and was gutted but the ref had no choice.

you're both right. Taylor is a gobshite of the highest degree. Cringe everytime i see the smug cunts face on tv spouting the usual bollocks, but he has a point - the relationship has deteriorated badly over the last 7 or 8 seasons. Anyone who goes the match would tell you the same. From blue scarfs on the Shankly gates to young lads waving round copies of the Sun and squashing their faces, predending to be crushed, while old fellas just stand by without comment. sad, but thats the way its now become.

the problem i have is that you only seem to see what you want to see, and conveniently forget the nailed on penalty we were denied in the 1st half for handball and the fact they scored their second about 15 seconds later. swings and roundabouts and every liverpool fan i know (in real life now, not internet land) talk openly about gerrard diving, general concensus is no one really gives a shit, that includes me. used to watch united and arsenal always talking in the refs ear, trying to influence him and while the rest of the country seemed to be up in arms over it all i thought was "wish we did that", now we do, good. theres fuck all wrong with players talking to the referee, and if their daft enough to fall for it than thats theirs and everyone elses bad luck. i'd honestly be more bothered about what neville's been up to while all this was going on, if I was you.