StevO Posted September 4, 2008 Report Share Posted September 4, 2008 (edited) Having read that screed it seems to me that they are the words a a losing cynic. Yes we all know that the club led the way for years with the innovations incorporated into GP and we were proud to do so. The difference between now and then is the high powered media pressure that gets applied from all quarters to people in the hot seats. I'm certain Sir John Moores would never had allowed any of you that type of soap box. Unfortunately if you give some people an inch they will want to take a yard. The board had no need to offer anything conciliatory to anyone, what do they get for doing so yet more silly destructive snide comments from fans who say they care, Those of you taking this action are not the sole owners of the heart of Everton and never think you are. I have called many times for unity but when it gets to a point were people resort to hair splitting, character assassination and down right cussedness that they need to take a close look at themselves and realise that they are tilting at windmills and damaging, possibly permanently the future of our club and I find that hard to take. Jim - i respect your opinions, but the fact of the matter is that any shareholders of any company have the right to do exactly what has been done by the shareholders, not by the clubs fans, by the people who own the club. Moores would have had to give this sort of soap box. take a quick look at company law. a little info here http://moneyterms.co.uk/egm/ Edited September 4, 2008 by StevO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
linglong Posted September 5, 2008 Report Share Posted September 5, 2008 That is old ground Ling, the shareholders voted last night so its a pointless argument mate. Louis I apologise mate, yes your report was very biased, as Mike says it depends on your viewpoint, I should have said I would like to hear another version. That said even Grayson had the courtesy to thank the board for their frankness last night. If you lads are so certain that Kirkby will not get the go ahead why get so upset, just sit back and it won't happen. Our Blue ancestors had the courage to go and build outside the then city boundaries, I still have that spirit of adventure as do the majority of shareholders. Can you lot say at what stage you will get behind the board because if Kirkby is given the green light you'll have to All im wondering honestly is where evertons share of the cash will come from Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Louis Posted September 5, 2008 Report Share Posted September 5, 2008 can someone tell me how far kirkby is too the CBD of liverpool and Goodison park... It's 7 miles from Kirkby to Old Hall Street (which is what I would class as the CBD) and also whats the big drama about moving is it really far away? It's 4 miles from Goodison Park but it's to the outskirts of Merseyside and the site is relatively remote. Access to the site by 50,000 fans is difficult. One example is that the local rail link can only support 3,900 people per hour (that's 6 carriages every 15 minutes) or 7% of fans. is it that kirkby is a dump? Is that you Roger Philips? (local radio DJ said on air that "Kirkby is a dump" It's not a relevance really.. but it would factor in some fans decisions (not mine). or is it u want to stay at Goodison If Everton do locate I would prefer them to locate nearer the city centre i.e. the road network hub/public transport hub/near the CBD. I do support a Goodison redevelopment and a groundshare as well. i really dunno who to support in this one mainly cause most of you hear are decided and are biased It's going to stay that way too sadly, people have nailed their colours to the masses. I have defected from favouring Kirkby to opposing it until I did some further reading but it's up to people to make their own mind up. btw did they talk about the money and the summer of horror? No because it was off the agenda, shareholders are calling for non-stadium issues to be discussed at another EGM which is possibly likely to go ahead in October/November. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Everton_Worshiper Posted September 5, 2008 Report Share Posted September 5, 2008 It's 4 miles from Goodison Park but it's to the outskirts of Merseyside and the site is relatively remote. Access to the site by 50,000 fans is difficult. One example is that the local rail link can only support 3,900 people per hour (that's 6 carriages every 15 minutes) or 7% of fans. Louis, has there ever been a study to see what % of fans currently use the train services to travel to Goodison (or close enough to walk)? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carlmc25 Posted September 5, 2008 Report Share Posted September 5, 2008 Here's Howard Kendall's take on the ground move and the lack of respect for Kenwright - which I totally agree with. After hearing some of BK's comments the other night it sounds like he's pretty much ready to throw the towel in, no doubt due to all the sniping of some fans who keep taking digs every chance they get. I think Everton fans will only realise how good Kenwright is, once he's gone. Bill Kenwright should get more creditSep 5 2008 by Howard Kendall, Liverpool Echo FOOTBALL is no longer the game it used to be and the antics at a couple of clubs this week have proved that once again. Alan Curbishley felt compelled to resign on Wednesday after West Ham’s board had allegedly meddled in his transfer dealings, while Newcastle have – not for the first time – descended into mayhem. Throw on top of that the fact that nobody seems to be happy with what is happening across Stanley Park and it’s clear to see that new owners of football clubs are not all that they are cracked up to be. Yet, at Goodison Park, we have a chairman who loves Everton to his core – just as David Moores loves Liverpool – and does everything that he possibly can to improve things, giving his total support to the manager. He doesn’t make phoney comments. Everything Bill says comes from the heart yet with the vast majority of supporters, he gets no credit at all, not even in a week when he has just sanctioned another record breaking transfer. Of course, the issue of going to Kirkby is a thorny one but I think most sensible people would agree after Wednesday night’s EGM that we have got to move away now; leaving Goodison is clearly the only possibility. Getting a successful team together, though, is just as important and I don’t think David Moyes would mind me saying he is backed by one of the game’s most loyal and understanding chairmen. I was never keen on having a fan in charge, as they tend to let their hearts rule their heads. Could you imagine some of the decisions that would be made on Monday morning if a section of the Gwladys Street ran the club? Supporters tend to make knee-jerk reactions but Bill has been pragmatic and found the happy medium between expectation and realisation – which is more than can be said for thepeople in charge of some of Everton’s Premier League rivals. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy the blue Posted September 5, 2008 Report Share Posted September 5, 2008 Jim - i respect your opinions, but the fact of the matter is that any shareholders of any company have the right to do exactly what has been done by the shareholders, not by the clubs fans, by the people who own the club. Moores would have had to give this sort of soap box. take a quick look at company law. a little info here http://moneyterms.co.uk/egm/ Steve it is a joy to argue sensibly which we do mate. My comments about Moores were meant to highlight the difference in approach to what we have now, partly because Billy is not a rich man he needs as many fans behind him as he can get. Having said that, if Moyes walks to Newcastle, which I don't think will happen, just watch the shit hit the fan then and I know which direction it will be going in mate. We should all be applauding Kenwright for the commitment he shows Moyes even though he/we can't afford it. As I said earlier hopefull this new guy will repair some of the damage Wyness has done and get some financial streams unblocked Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Everton_Worshiper Posted September 5, 2008 Report Share Posted September 5, 2008 Could you imagine some of the decisions that would be made on Monday morning if a section of the Gwladys Street ran the club? Supporters tend to make knee-jerk reactions but Bill has been pragmatic and found the happy medium between expectation and realisation – which is more than can be said for thepeople in charge of some of Everton’s Premier League rivals. Last 2 paragraphs sum it up nicely. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy the blue Posted September 5, 2008 Report Share Posted September 5, 2008 Here's Howard Kendall's take on the ground move and the lack of respect for Kenwright - which I totally agree with. After hearing some of BK's comments the other night it sounds like he's pretty much ready to throw the towel in, no doubt due to all the sniping of some fans who keep taking digs every chance they get. I think Everton fans will only realise how good Kenwright is, once he's gone. Bill Kenwright should get more creditSep 5 2008 by Howard Kendall, Liverpool Echo FOOTBALL is no longer the game it used to be and the antics at a couple of clubs this week have proved that once again. Alan Curbishley felt compelled to resign on Wednesday after West Ham’s board had allegedly meddled in his transfer dealings, while Newcastle have – not for the first time – descended into mayhem. Throw on top of that the fact that nobody seems to be happy with what is happening across Stanley Park and it’s clear to see that new owners of football clubs are not all that they are cracked up to be. Yet, at Goodison Park, we have a chairman who loves Everton to his core – just as David Moores loves Liverpool – and does everything that he possibly can to improve things, giving his total support to the manager. He doesn’t make phoney comments. Everything Bill says comes from the heart yet with the vast majority of supporters, he gets no credit at all, not even in a week when he has just sanctioned another record breaking transfer. Of course, the issue of going to Kirkby is a thorny one but I think most sensible people would agree after Wednesday night’s EGM that we have got to move away now; leaving Goodison is clearly the only possibility. Getting a successful team together, though, is just as important and I don’t think David Moyes would mind me saying he is backed by one of the game’s most loyal and understanding chairmen. I was never keen on having a fan in charge, as they tend to let their hearts rule their heads. Could you imagine some of the decisions that would be made on Monday morning if a section of the Gwladys Street ran the club? Supporters tend to make knee-jerk reactions but Bill has been pragmatic and found the happy medium between expectation and realisation – which is more than can be said for thepeople in charge of some of Everton’s Premier League rivals. Well said mate Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Louis Posted September 5, 2008 Report Share Posted September 5, 2008 Louis, has there ever been a study to see what % of fans currently use the train services to travel to Goodison (or close enough to walk)? 1993 - Merseytravel did a Stadia Access study 1996 - JMP did one 2007 - evertonfc.com online survey and results were forwarded to Knowsley Council http://www.knowsley.gov.uk/resources/22507..._1TAVolume3.pdf Page 49 Kendall is entitled to his opinion, no disrespect to him but he's not an expert in the relevent fields (architect, civil engineer etc.), I fear he has simply read what was in the Echo and made his judgement on that). As I said with the EGM, someone is typing up minutes so people will be able to read what really happened and in what context. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Everton_Worshiper Posted September 5, 2008 Report Share Posted September 5, 2008 In the document it states in 2003 that 12% of the fans that were questioned used the train to get to Goodison. In the Kirkby environment if the max capacity from Goodison is going to the game, 12% represents approx 4,800 fans. If the local rail link can only sustain 3,900 fans per hour then the shotrfall is not as bad as is being made out. Granted I do not know all the facts nor am I a transportation infrastructure specialist but I still believe figures like the train capacity of Kirkby are being purposely degraded to add to the argument against Kirkby. Anyway, I am always interested to read more and more information from both sides of the argument... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chicagoblue Posted September 5, 2008 Report Share Posted September 5, 2008 In the document it states in 2003 that 12% of the fans that were questioned used the train to get to Goodison. In the Kirkby environment if the max capacity from Goodison is going to the game, 12% represents approx 4,800 fans. If the local rail link can only sustain 3,900 fans per hour then the shotrfall is not as bad as is being made out. Granted I do not know all the facts nor am I a transportation infrastructure specialist but I still believe figures like the train capacity of Kirkby are being purposely degraded to add to the argument against Kirkby. Anyway, I am always interested to read more and more information from both sides of the argument... I can only imagine that the main issue with the train's lack of capacity is that currently a huge number of fans are able to walk to the ground. In a move to Kirkby a good number of those fans will be added to those already taking the train. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Louis Posted September 5, 2008 Report Share Posted September 5, 2008 Everton Worshipper, I don't think your taking into account that that it's 1,000 people less per hour (that's 20% less) with a stadium capacity 10,000 seats larger which is pushing more people onto buses and park and ride sites which the club are paying for. Chicagoblue, At present there are 744 season ticket holders who are within a 40 minute walking distance from the Kirkby stadium according to the report. (page 166). The report also says 4% of fans walk to Goodison Park (4% of Goodison Park capacity is 1622, 4% of this seasons average home attendance is 1461) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevO Posted September 6, 2008 Report Share Posted September 6, 2008 Steve it is a joy to argue sensibly which we do mate. My comments about Moores were meant to highlight the difference in approach to what we have now, partly because Billy is not a rich man he needs as many fans behind him as he can get. Having said that, if Moyes walks to Newcastle, which I don't think will happen, just watch the shit hit the fan then and I know which direction it will be going in mate. We should all be applauding Kenwright for the commitment he shows Moyes even though he/we can't afford it. As I said earlier hopefull this new guy will repair some of the damage Wyness has done and get some financial streams unblocked i agree jim, i do enjoy our debates. a lot of people on here like to get personal and insulting. i do hold respect of BK as an evertonian, but to me a lot of things just dont add up. if only the moores family were still backing everton. i have faith in Elstone, hopefully he will sort things out. id like them to at least break the exclusivity agreement. id like to see them have a public debate with LCC personally, put LCC on the spot and ask them out right if they want to keep us in liverpool what are they going to do for us. i know Joe Anderson will break his neck for the club if he gets in Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy the blue Posted September 6, 2008 Report Share Posted September 6, 2008 i agree jim, i do enjoy our debates. a lot of people on here like to get personal and insulting.i do hold respect of BK as an evertonian, but to me a lot of things just dont add up. if only the moores family were still backing everton. i have faith in Elstone, hopefully he will sort things out. id like them to at least break the exclusivity agreement. id like to see them have a public debate with LCC personally, put LCC on the spot and ask them out right if they want to keep us in liverpool what are they going to do for us. i know Joe Anderson will break his neck for the club if he gets in TBH Steve even the Moores family aren't rich enough now, that is how sad things are mate <_< One comment of mine meant in humourous fashion was greeted with abuse this morning, when people resort to abuse it is simply a display of a low IQ mate demeaning themselves and the forum Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevO Posted September 6, 2008 Report Share Posted September 6, 2008 i know, i dont agree with the personal stuff. ive called a few people names myself as sometimes we all go off on one. but its not really needed. i heard a rumour bill gates his buying efc as a birthday present for one of his sons we'll be fine then Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy the blue Posted September 6, 2008 Report Share Posted September 6, 2008 i know, i dont agree with the personal stuff. ive called a few people names myself as sometimes we all go off on one. but its not really needed. i heard a rumour bill gates his buying efc as a birthday present for one of his sons we'll be fine then What another Bill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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