BoroBlue

Did you see the full game or just the highlights on evertontv? Just wondering what you or anyone else who has seen any of the reserve games recently makes of the young lads in and around the first team squad at the moment (Gueye, Vellios, Bexter, Barkley). Looking at there recent results they appear to be scoring goals for fun.

Its like penis envy, only I think they call it pitch envy.

http://thisisourcitymanchester.blogspot.com/2012/02/uniteds-childishness-proves-there-is.html sour grapes much?

What a complete tit you are Moyes, I wonder if Manalos thinks thank god I didn't sign on the dotted line when he sees that team sheet!

It says we are delaying the transfer to see if we can afford the 500k after the Jelavic transfer goes through, if only we could fine Saha 10 weeks wages for his p*ss poor performances this season that should about cover it!

completely agree with you about taking Shane back out of the limelight when the senior centrebacks return to fitness and getting him a loan to a championship club, but I for one will be fuming if Moyes drops him for Hibbert at centreback, what sort of a message does that send out to Shane and the other young players at the club, even if they play well the manager would rather play an average senior player out of position than give them a run in the first team

I will officially lose all faith in Moyes if he puts Hibbert at centreback instead of Shane. http://www.evertonfc.com/news/archive/2012/01/26/moyes-assesses-defensive-options

For Duffys progression and confidence do you think it is better if he is dropped when the senior centrebacks return to fitness while he is playing well, or do you think it is better to wait for his form to dip or for him to make a mistake then drop him?

Just checked the figures and the defence with Jags conceded 8 goals in the 10 and a half games before his injury, they have conceded 6 goals in the 3 and a half games since his injury. I think with Jags he is always going to make mistakes because he is the one willing to step out of position to put a challenge or an interception in, this is vital for breaking up opposition play and not inviting pressure on ourselves and I think is something we are missing at the moment and is exposing our defensive midfielders and fullbacks as you say. I also think this is the reason he seems to get criticised by fans so often and I think alot of it is unfair. I will agree that his distribution isn't superb and he opts to go long too often but I think that is largely to do with our midfield being very flat, there isn't a whole lot of options in front to pass to. I am not criticising the replacement centrebacks as I think they are doing a great job, particularly the young lad Duffy, but the team needs to adapt to life without Jags and try and plug that gap between defence on midfield because at the moment I think we are giving people far to much time on the ball in that dangerous area.

Personally I look forward to the day these players leave because I think the current crop of youngsters at the club have far more to offer than the old boys, but I agree we should be looking to do this sooner rather than later to give them exposure to first team football and let them bed in to the team. I also think we need to forget about the investment ever coming in as it doesn't look like happening anytime soon, and even if it does the fifa financial fair play rules mean we can't just go out and buy a new team anyway, the club needs to be breaking even, which means we need to put our faith in the youngsters at the club.

http://www.teamtalk.com/everton/7441698/Moyes-Everton-have-the-chance-to-be-mint Interesting read, couldn't agree more either. Its time to stop making excuses and waiting for a rich investor to throw us a lifeline, and start rebuilding the squad and making the best of what we have.

Would like to see: Howard Coleman Heitinga Duffy Baines Rodwell Felliani Barkley Baxter Vellios Gueye Not going to happen any time soon but would like to see how that team would get on

I refer you to my previous post

Don't get me wrong Tim Howard is a great goalkeeper, I am not saying we could easily replace him or improve on him without spending money, but the point I was trying to make was this: The club has no money, we can't afford to allow players to play out their careers here and eventually lose them for nothing when we could sell them early for a fee and replace them with that fee. Tim Howard is nearly 33 years old, right now he is in his peak and still young enough to command a reasonable fee, in 3 years time he will be nearly 36 and while his ability may not have declined due to his age his value certainly will have. Lets say we sell him in the Summer for £10million, the banks take half and we are left with 5mil to buy a new keeper. Lets say we sell him in 3 years for £2million, the banks take half and we are left with 1mil to buy a new keeper. Lets say we release him in 6years time when his top flight career comes to an end, we have no money to buy a replacement and the banks put pressure on us to sell another player. I know which one of these scenarios I would choose. I don't pretend to know what replacement goalkeepers are available, what age Howards ability will decline or what his value is in the current market but this is just an example to illustrate a point.

We should keep hold of at any cost: Rodwell, Barkley, Felliani, Baines We should sell for the right price: Jags, Heitinga, Osman, Hibbert, Coleman, Howard We should look to sell for whatever we can get to raise funds (transfer fees and reduced wage bill) to rebuild: Distin, Saha, Cahill, Bilyaletdinov, Anichebe, Mucha, Yobo, Neville We should be looking to bed in to the first team: Gueye, Duffy, Baxter, Vellios, McAleny, Garbutt We will be losing at the end of the season (or earlier) McFadden, Drenthe, Straqualursi, Donovan, Hanneman We should be looking to bring in: Cheap, young, hungry players who are good enough to do a job now and with the potential to improve the team. We should not be looking to bring in: Loans (they eat up what little funds we have, develop players for other teams while hampering our own players development, and are very short sighted), players approaching there twilight years (there is no re-sale value, again very short sighted). The way I see it we are at a cross roads now, either Moyes decides to sell to raise funds to rebuild a squad that can maybe once again challenge for europe or even higher, or he continues to try and tread water and keeps faith with his old players who have served him well in the past and we eventually and inevitably sink to the bottom of the league or further.

Ravel Morrison anyone? Out of contract in the summer and doesn't look like signing another one, reportedly available for around 300k (the fee UTD would expect to get at tribunal), several parties interested, could we be one of them? Often referred to as potentially one of the greatest talents of his generation but has been in abit of bother with the police, described as "a supremely gifted talent: a skilful, creative midfielder capable of scoring and making goals" on the club website. He can play in wide positions, in the centre of the park, or just behind the main striker.

I'm getting a bit sick and tired of hearing our lack of finances being used as an excuse for poor performances this season. We may not have the money other clubs around us, but how many clubs have had players of the calibre of rooney, rodwell and barkley come through their youth academies in the last 10 years, how many other clubs have enjoyed the stability of management we have over the last 10 years. The players at the club and the manager are far better than the performances of this season suggest and I think Moyes and the players need to stop making excuses and realise the poor performances are down to there own poor performances, not the financial situation at the club. As abit of a side note both Arsenal and Newcastle have had net transfer spends over the last 5 years in minus figures (ours is about £1 million), both have been forced to lose players they didn't want to as have we, and both have rebuilt their squads and are improving this year, we are not.

Thats the point I was trying to make really, the formation we play isn't the problem, its the rigidity with which we play it. Using Barcelona as an example again you could argue that they play 4-5-1 or 4-3-3, or you could write it as 4-1-4-1, 4-4-1-1, 4-1-2-1-2 or even 4-2-3-1. The fact is they don't really stick to any one formation they change through the match with defensive players playing more disciplined roles, and attacking players given the freedom to play.

Thats how Barcelona play, they call it the fake number 9 role and it is occupied by Lionel Messi, who apparently is not a bad little player, but it doesn't really work when you have a striker who drops deep and no-one willing to run beyond him. Only saw the highlights on MOTD and looked like a decent performance. Would like to see Gueye and Drenthe on the wings again switching over to keep defenders on there toes, looks like a potent weapon.

Good to see the young lads Neville, Saha, Cahill and Hibbert given a chance ahead of Rodwell, Vellios, Barkley and Coleman. Rant over COYB, it is good to see Gueye given a chance though.

Do you think Moyes is getting the best out of the current team? Do you think Moyes has been tactically sound so far this season? Do you think Moyes has made the most of his limited resources in recent season?

I'm confused, should we be forgetting history or not? On the one hand Moyes is immune to criticism based on his past achievements but on the other we need to forget history and the clubs past achievments and base our expectations on the current situation. I completely agree with you on the second point but not the first Is Moyes getting the best out of the current crop of players? No I don't think so Is Moyes getting the most out the resources available to him? No, as the manager he needs to be making tough decisions, what areas can we afford to sell in order to raise funds and what areas need to be strengthened with the limited funds available. Do I think Moyes should be given time to get things right? Yes, there is no denying what a great job he has done in the past and you don't lose that over night Do I think the fans have a right to criticise? Yes, simply put our results and performances have been poor as have Moyes tactics, On paper I would put us behind the top 6 teams in the league but above the rest so we are underperforming at the minute. If results and performances don't pick up by the end of the season will I still be behind Moyes? I'm not so sure

I know what you mean and perhaps I have worded it wrong, what I meant was more that we have 2 centre mids who play a more disciplined role. Felliani and Rodwell both have the athleticism and the brain to be able to provide cover to the defence and each other while getting forward when appropriate. I agree with you that 2 midfield anchors leaves 1 player wasted but I do think a midfield anchor plays better when they have a deep-lying player next to them who can make themselves available to recieve the ball from the more defensive minded players and give it to the more attacking players. Xavi is a great example of this type of player. Arteta did this job for us and I think that has been something we have missed this year and Arsenal have benefited from. Unfortunately we do not have that type of player anymore, but what we do have is 2 players in Rodwell and Felliani who have the athleticism to play box-to-box, the footballing brain to know when to stay back and when to get forward, the defensive ability to be able to cover the backline including 2 attacking full backs, and the technical ability to be able to control the game and bring others in to play. This is why I think we should play both in defensive/central midfield roles and I think as the partnership develops it could be a formidable one.

While I agree with you about Hibberts form I do not think he should be first choice at rightback as he is very limited as a footballer. As back-up and as a squad player I think he is great, a model profesional who is solid and reliable definsively, but this isn't enough to be first choice in a team who are looking to progress. I am not saying Coleman is the better rightback at the moment but he has the potential to be, and I think he offers far more going forward although he is not as solid at the back, but what do they say about attack being the best form of defence, the opposition can afford to be alot more adventurous if we have a player who offers nothing going forward. The pace and directness of Coleman would mean the opposition would have to be more cautious coming forward so not to get hit on the break. It would also afford whoever is playing right mid more space as the opposition would not be able to double up on them and would have to watch out for overlapping runs. Its just a theory but basically what I am saying is I think a more attacking fullback could actually make us more defensively solid as a unit aswell as offering more going forward. This is because we would not be inviting pressure on ourselves down that side and would give them something to think about aswell.

I really don't understand all the calls for us to play 2 upfront. We have no strikers of the required quality at the moment so why do people feel picking 2 of them is going to help anything? Most the top teams play with one striker these days the difference is they have players around them who can create and play off the striker. I think our problem is our midfield 5 is completely flat, all players are expected to be involved in both defensive and attacking phases of play and it just doesn't work. We are so easy to defend against because we are so flat, teams can afford just to soak up the pressure and hit us on the break, yesterday we had 70% possesion and still were unable to create anything. It seems to me players are unwilling to move into space and play in the hole as this would mean leaving an opposition player unmarked, it is such a negative way to play and is why we always end up playing hoofball, because there is no-one linking midfield/defence and attack. If we play with a back 4 with Baines and Coleman at fullback and Rodwell and Felliani playing as defensive central midfielders this gives us a solid back 6 capable of controlling the game at the back as well as joining attack when appropriate. One up front with the ability to hold the ball and bring others into play, I like Vellios for this as I feel he has all the attributes and ability needed and is only going to get better. That gives us 3 players who can afford to play with abit of freedom to create chances, and play in the hole between the oppositions defence and midfield. I am not saying these players should have no defensive responsibilities at all, but not when we have the ball. What really impresses me about Barcelona aside from there obvious technical abilities is what they do when they don't have the ball, they defend from the from the front and don't give the opposition a moments peace. How many times do you see there attacking players in and around there own box, but that doesn't mean they don't contribute defensively.