chris1eng Posted August 8, 2009 Report Share Posted August 8, 2009 I'd like to thank the allied service personal for putting their life's on the line for us, for the young men and women of many countries going through what they are going through we all should be very thankful. I know not everyone is a Christian but please repeat these words 'Lord, hold our troops in your loving hands. Protect them as they protect us. Bless them and their families for the selfless acts they perform for us in our time of need. Amen.' Not much i ask of you Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian C Posted August 8, 2009 Report Share Posted August 8, 2009 I'd like to thank the allied service personal for putting their life's on the line for us, for the young men and women of many countries going through what they are going through we all should be very thankful. I know not everyone is a Christian but please repeat these words 'Lord, hold our troops in your loving hands. Protect them as they protect us. Bless them and their families for the selfless acts they perform for us in our time of need. Amen.' Not much i ask of you "Personnel" Atheist, against both wars, but support all western troops wherever they are sent. Keep your head down boys, you've got family and friends who want you home. On a sidenote, a shout out to all European servicemen and women on EUFOR and UNFOR missions peace-keeping around the world in dangerous places like the Lebanon, Sudan, Kosovo and South Ossetia. Brave, brave souls. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris1eng Posted August 8, 2009 Author Report Share Posted August 8, 2009 "Personnel" Atheist, against both wars, but support all western troops wherever they are sent. Keep your head down boys, you've got family and friends who want you home. On a sidenote, a shout out to all European servicemen and women on EUFOR and UNFOR missions peace-keeping around the world in dangerous places like the Lebanon, Sudan, Kosovo and South Ossetia. Brave, brave souls. Atheist or not, support the wars or not, the guys and girls need support, and they thank you for it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
holystove Posted August 9, 2009 Report Share Posted August 9, 2009 Atheist, against both wars, but support all western troops wherever they are sent. Keep your head down boys, you've got family and friends who want you home. On a sidenote, a shout out to all European servicemen and women on EUFOR and UNFOR missions peace-keeping around the world in dangerous places like the Lebanon, Sudan, Kosovo and South Ossetia. Brave, brave souls. I second that. Get home safe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainFerguson10 Posted August 9, 2009 Report Share Posted August 9, 2009 They shouldn't be out there anyway, if our government feels so strongly about invading other countries when they can't even look after it's own, they should send their own children and family to fight. The wars are based on nothing but greed, our soldiers are ill prepared and ill equipped and really can't understand the cause they have been sent for. I pray for peace for those innocent members caught up in any conflict, but those (including our soldiers) who commit crimes like needless murder or rape, deserves the harshest of justice! Which goes for Bush/Blair/Pinochet etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian C Posted August 9, 2009 Report Share Posted August 9, 2009 They shouldn't be out there anyway, if our government feels so strongly about invading other countries when they can't even look after it's own, they should send their own children and family to fight. The wars are based on nothing but greed, our soldiers are ill prepared and ill equipped and really can't understand the cause they have been sent for. I pray for peace for those innocent members caught up in any conflict, but those (including our soldiers) who commit crimes like needless murder or rape, deserves the harshest of justice! Which goes for Bush/Blair/Pinochet etc. Crock of crap. The soldiers out there are some of the best trained soldiers on the planet. The reason it seems they're ill-equipped is that technology is constantly advancing, IED's are getting more and more advanced and are becoming as strong as dedicated tank mines. Iraq and Afghanistan may be less stable places than they were 6-8 years ago but they are infinitely more free. Having said that, I disagree with the West flexing it's muscles for petty reasons like revenge. Bad form to bring politics into this thread, mate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DangerMouse Posted August 9, 2009 Report Share Posted August 9, 2009 They shouldn't be out there anyway, if our government feels so strongly about invading other countries when they can't even look after it's own, they should send their own children and family to fight. The wars are based on nothing but greed, our soldiers are ill prepared and ill equipped and really can't understand the cause they have been sent for. I pray for peace for those innocent members caught up in any conflict, but those (including our soldiers) who commit crimes like needless murder or rape, deserves the harshest of justice! Which goes for Bush/Blair/Pinochet etc. Explaine how these wars are based on greed....... do you not mean protecting "our" interests...............either directly or not......... dont fall into the trap that its all about literally nicking their oil..... Solidiers are not ill prepered... people ie the media will have you belive they are for their own political reasons but look into things a little before you follow blindly what they say....... Our soldiers are heros and should be treated as such.......... is it not ignorent to just believe they are out there lining someone elses pockets........ You should be lucky that you live in a society that sees rape murder & theft a serious crime.......... in a free society thats what its like....... go to these innocent countries and watch them stone a woman to death for admiring another man... watch them execute children for stealing....... your lucky that you can post your views in this free country.... see how far that will get you in China or North Korea...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainFerguson10 Posted August 9, 2009 Report Share Posted August 9, 2009 Crock of crap. The soldiers out there are some of the best trained soldiers on the planet. Having said that, I disagree with the West flexing it's muscles for petty reasons like revenge. Bad form to bring politics into this thread, mate. That is factually incorrect Britain boasts the best trained soldiers, go and check it up. I rarely get involved in politics as it causes too much emotion and radical views (check the quote below), but I agree the West should never tell others about moral values. http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/politics/article6684326.ece Explaine how these wars are based on greed....... do you not mean protecting "our" interests...............either directly or not......... dont fall into the trap that its all about literally nicking their oil..... You should be lucky that you live in a society that sees rape murder & theft a serious crime.......... in a free society thats what its like....... go to these innocent countries and watch them stone a woman to death for admiring another man... watch them execute children for stealing....... your lucky that you can post your views in this free country.... see how far that will get you in China or North Korea...... Oh dear, seems like you are the one who is naive and deceived by nationalism. The Iraq and Afgan wars are a direct result of western greed: http://www.bloggingstocks.com/2009/07/05/the-iraq-war-was-fought-for-oil-now-we-have-none-of-it/ It's truly sad that quite a few people like yourself are sucked into the 'us vs them' syndrome, when you truly have no idea about the other side of the coin. Yes our soldiers are brave, but we got involved in a war which broke Geneva laws in 2002, which came to haunt us in 2005. So you saying we went to war to protect our interests is bollocks! And by your comments it seems your having a poke at Islam? I see children executing children around Liverpool suburbs, men raping women and getting away with it because they have a high position like police chiefs or Judges, etc all in Britain so that point of yours is totally baseless! What they do in there lands is entirely up to them as it works for them, it is none of our business. If we go there then we obey the laws of the land, and likewise for them here. As for being free over here to say what we want, think Robin Cook, Dr David Kelly, Sir Trevor Philips, David Davies and countless others will disagree with you. Back to topic, I know squaddies who are proud to be British but are pissed off how they were treated in combat and then to come home to virtually no benefits from the government. That's the reality, I couldn't care less about nationalism only the truth concerns me. Anyway as I feel this will develop into a post war, I will not reply again on this thread but you get my gist. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian C Posted August 9, 2009 Report Share Posted August 9, 2009 Everybody has the right to freedom of religion. However, when that right impedes the right of someone to live free of unjust persecution and death then it's ridiculous for us to say that they're allowed to do that in their countries. I disagreed with the Iraq and Afghan wars because of how they were handled and who led them and for what reasons. But everything you have just come out with is complete and utter trash. We have a moral OBLIGATION to prevent unjust persecution around the world. However, all intervention needs to be done with the support of the United Nations. Radical and conservative Christianity is just as bad as Islam, except in the West the radicals are kept at bay by our secular laws. This is not the case in the Middle East. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DangerMouse Posted August 9, 2009 Report Share Posted August 9, 2009 That is factually incorrect Britain boasts the best trained soldiers, go and check it up. I rarely get involved in politics as it causes too much emotion and radical views (check the quote below), but I agree the West should never tell others about moral values. http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/politics/article6684326.ece Oh dear, seems like you are the one who is naive and deceived by nationalism. The Iraq and Afgan wars are a direct result of western greed: http://www.bloggingstocks.com/2009/07/05/the-iraq-war-was-fought-for-oil-now-we-have-none-of-it/It's truly sad that quite a few people like yourself are sucked into the 'us vs them' syndrome, when you truly have no idea about the other side of the coin. Yes our soldiers are brave, but we got involved in a war which broke Geneva laws in 2002, which came to haunt us in 2005. So you saying we went to war to protect our interests is bollocks! And by your comments it seems your having a poke at Islam? I see children executing children around Liverpool suburbs, men raping women and getting away with it because they have a high position like police chiefs or Judges, etc all in Britain so that point of yours is totally baseless! What they do in there lands is entirely up to them as it works for them, it is none of our business. If we go there then we obey the laws of the land, and likewise for them here. As for being free over here to say what we want, think Robin Cook, Dr David Kelly, Sir Trevor Philips, David Davies and countless others will disagree with you. Back to topic, I know squaddies who are proud to be British but are pissed off how they were treated in combat and then to come home to virtually no benefits from the government. That's the reality, I couldn't care less about nationalism only the truth concerns me. Anyway as I feel this will develop into a post war, I will not reply again on this thread but you get my gist. naive and deceved by nationalism???? I would ask you to look in to the true facts of the whole war and its wider consequences..... not just what you read in western newspapers or the propogander you get from the east..... you will find its you that is ignorent and believes exactly what you are told... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris1eng Posted August 10, 2009 Author Report Share Posted August 10, 2009 (edited) They shouldn't be out there anyway, if our government feels so strongly about invading other countries when they can't even look after it's own, they should send their own children and family to fight. The wars are based on nothing but greed, our soldiers are ill prepared and ill equipped and really can't understand the cause they have been sent for. I pray for peace for those innocent members caught up in any conflict, but those (including our soldiers) who commit crimes like needless murder or rape, deserves the harshest of justice! Which goes for Bush/Blair/Pinochet etc. Utter left wing crap mate, it's people like you would have let Hitler walk striaght in. Mentioning rape and Brit troops in the same sentence is disgusting, I mourn each loss the allies suffer and wish them a quick safe return, but only after the job is complete. What is there to have in Afganistan to justify calling our reason there greed? We are there to crush the terrorist, plain and simple. Pinochet? Where did that come from? Hitler and Stalin, plus many more were a lot worse. Edited August 10, 2009 by Chris the Blue Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Churinga2 Posted August 10, 2009 Report Share Posted August 10, 2009 naive and deceved by nationalism???? I would ask you to look in to the true facts of the whole war and its wider consequences..... not just what you read in western newspapers or the propogander you get from the east..... you will find its you that is ignorent and believes exactly what you are told... Why don't you tell us about it, the whole war and the wider consequences, and how this war is protecting our (or your) interests. Andwhat are those interests? Please educate us, the ignorant, in all your wisdom. Because all I see is hundreds of thousands dead people, for dubious reasons Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Churinga2 Posted August 10, 2009 Report Share Posted August 10, 2009 Utter left wing crap mate, it's people like you would have let Hitler walk striaght in. biggest bullshit i've heard o this forum What is there to have in Afganistan to justify calling our reason there greed? he's probably reffering to the Irak war We are there to crush the terrorist, plain and simple. i wish it was that plain and simple Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian C Posted August 10, 2009 Report Share Posted August 10, 2009 Utter left wing crap mate, it's people like you would have let Hitler walk striaght in. Mentioning rape and Brit troops in the same sentence is disgusting, I mourn each loss the allies suffer and wish them a quick safe return, but only after the job is complete. What is there to have in Afganistan to justify calling our reason there greed? We are there to crush the terrorist, plain and simple. Pinochet? Where did that come from? Hitler and Stalin, plus many more were a lot worse. *cough* Chamberlain was a conservative Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamiemaher85 Posted August 10, 2009 Report Share Posted August 10, 2009 Play nice lads. War, Religion and Politics are a very dangerous subject to bring up on a board. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeO Posted August 10, 2009 Report Share Posted August 10, 2009 Play nice lads. War, Religion and Politics are a very dangerous subject to bring up on a board. Indeed they are, so I shall be brief... ...I mourn each loss the allies suffer... But not the infinitely larger number of civilian deaths? Roughly 100,000 in Iraq and 10,000 in Afghanistan. But you couldn't mourn them could you because they're never reported so you don't know when they happen? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Churinga2 Posted August 10, 2009 Report Share Posted August 10, 2009 Indeed they are, so I shall be brief... But not the infinitely larger number of civilian deaths? Roughly 100,000 in Iraq and 10,000 in Afghanistan. But you couldn't mourn them could you because they're never reported so you don't know when they happen? That's a minimum, estimates are up to half a million in iraq only. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeO Posted August 10, 2009 Report Share Posted August 10, 2009 That's a minimum, estimates are up to half a million in iraq only. I was deliberately conservative (small "c") to avoid being accused of exaggeration. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris1eng Posted August 10, 2009 Author Report Share Posted August 10, 2009 (edited) *cough* Chamberlain was a conservative Never said he wasn't But you couldn't mourn them could you because they're never reported so you don't know when they happen? Ex military myself and still have a load of mates in, so i do get feedback. Fair enough I don't here about all the civvie deaths, but how many are killed by the allies on purpose? Not many, if any at all. I started this topic to pay tribute to the allied service men and women but there's always someone ready to jump up and down on them. That comment wasn't directed at you MikeO, maybe Iraq was a bad idea, but Afganistan isn't. That's my opinion, even if i didn't agree i would still support the troops out there. Look guys, if i've offended anyone with this post then i'm sorry, if my remarks i've made since caused offence, then i'm also sorry Edited August 13, 2009 by StevO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamiemaher85 Posted August 10, 2009 Report Share Posted August 10, 2009 It's a tricky subject and one that people have strong views that they most likely wont change. I wouldn't be too worried. As I said before its one subject area that can cause alot of trouble. I wouldn't take anything personally. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris1eng Posted August 10, 2009 Author Report Share Posted August 10, 2009 It's a tricky subject and one that people have strong views that they most likely wont change. I wouldn't be too worried. As I said before its one subject area that can cause alot of trouble. I wouldn't take anything personally. I know mate, cheers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
holystove Posted August 10, 2009 Report Share Posted August 10, 2009 Well I am glad that "get behind the troops" doesn't mean that you can't criticize the decision to send them over there, the reasons to keep them there or what they're doing there. I wouldn't say that prayer you suggested and I disagree with the fact that the soldiers putting their lives on the line for -me- (same goes for the ridiculous notion that we're fighting them over there so we don't have to fight them over here) , however I think it's a given that everyone wants the troops to be safe. In my case, even regardless of the side they're fighting for. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainFerguson10 Posted August 11, 2009 Report Share Posted August 11, 2009 Look guys, if i've offended anyone with this post then i'm sorry, if my remarks i've made since caused offence, then i'm also sorry Apology accepted! I also apologise for seemingly starting all of this off, it's an emotional subject which inevitably will stir deep-rooted feelings, a bit like supporting Everton! Anyway I'm glad to see (apart from one bellend) all of us can at the end of the day discuss this in an adult fashion, we all want the best for our respective people and having patience and respect for other peoples religions, countries and thinking is the greatest first step to a better co-existence! Well I am glad that "get behind the troops" doesn't mean that you can't criticize the decision to send them over there, the reasons to keep them there or what they're doing there. I wouldn't say that prayer you suggested and I disagree with the fact that the soldiers putting their lives on the line for -me- (same goes for the ridiculous notion that we're fighting them over there so we don't have to fight them over here) , however I think it's a given that everyone wants the troops to be safe. In my case, even regardless of the side they're fighting for. Beautifully written and heart felt intention, so I'm compelled to agree! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevO Posted August 13, 2009 Report Share Posted August 13, 2009 (edited) Play nice lads. War, Religion and Politics are a very dangerous subject to bring up on a board. very dangerous to bring up anywhere! the 3 subjects banned over a pint amongst me and my real world mates. chris - with your religious views, i didnt have you down as military. prejudice i know. i just dont put the two togeteher if that makes sense. hope thats not taken offensively. Edited August 13, 2009 by StevO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris1eng Posted August 13, 2009 Author Report Share Posted August 13, 2009 (edited) very dangerous to bring up anywhere! the 3 subjects banned over a pint amongst me and my real world mates. chris - with your religious views, i didnt have you down as military. prejudice i know. i just dont put the two togeteher if that makes sense. hope thats not taken offensively. To be fair when i was in the military i wasn't a Christian, being honest you will find a lot of 'religious' people, in the forces. I love my God and my country. Don't believe it's dangerous at all to bring this subject up as it effects us all, there has been alot of anti feelings to this post, not sure if this is due to the war or the religious side of it, but Brit troops are fighting and being killed and our support should be to them and their families, and of course to the innocent people of Afganistan and Iraq that are being effected by this conflict, don't care about the terrorists being killed. This war has been brought to our shores, 7/7, and to the shores of other countries. It's not only innocent Afgans and Iragis being killed, this should be remembered. SteveO, no offense taken mate, not in the slightest. Appreciate all views. Edited August 13, 2009 by Chris the Blue Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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