Gwlad Posted August 16, 2009 Report Share Posted August 16, 2009 It's been a horrible shock to lose like that on the opening game but it is the first game. Seems Lescott's forgotten the opportunity DM gave him and if he doesn't want to wear our shirt let him go. Let's hope the rumours are true that we are going to get a couple of new faces before the deadline and get Arteta, Jags and Yak fit saspo - competition for places will wake the players up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iggy Posted August 17, 2009 Report Share Posted August 17, 2009 2 tickets to the game - £70.00 Petrol - £50.00 Hotel for 1 night £60.00 Meals/Drinks for 2 £? Team performance - Useless Worst team performance since the relegation battle days, I pray to god that it was a one off and that the chequebook comes out sharpish! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nogs Posted August 17, 2009 Report Share Posted August 17, 2009 Hmmm well that was a rather brutal dose of reality to quench all my pre-season optimism! Thing is, even though the final scoreline shocked me, I wasn't that surprised we got turned over in the end - that's now five losses out of eight season openers under Moyes. And I don't know about anyone else, but to me it always seems to be defensively that we get caught out early season - the thing that stands out for me about the Liege game at Goodison last year was how vulnerable we looked to their pace out wide, and in particular how dodgy Lescott looked against their right mid (Dalmat?). Surely there's got to be something going wrong in the preparation for this to keep happening - the second and third goals on Saturday were criminal (and pretty much made the finals core obsolete), simple balls into the box and we looked like we hadn't done a set-peice defensive drill for months. Solutions? If this was a one-off then yeah, perhaps we could blame the Lescott situation for disrupting the back four. As it is, I think its a perennial problem and i think a big problem is, without Jags, we lack a natural leader at the back. Yobo has always been too quiet, and I don't think Lescott's natural game is as a commander either. The second and third goals would never have been scored with a) proper communication and someone like Jags sensing the danger and having the courage to leave his man to clear up someone else's mess (although I admit an on-form Lescott can usually be relied on to do that). So never mind what happens with lescott for now, i'm more interested in getting in someone with a voice and a pair of balls to pull what was a ragged mess of a back four on Saturday into line - Steven Taylor seems to fit the bill perfectly. As John Terry proves, sometimes as a centre back its not all about natural ability, its about having a big gob and a big heart. The other thing that pissed me off on Saturday was the tactics - 4-5-1 at home AGAIN! I know this has served Moyes well in the past, but that was when we didn't have the same quality in the squad that we have now and when we had forwards like Bent and Johnson who would run the channels all day to bring the midfielders into the game up field. If we have any real pretence to being contenders for the top four, we've GOTTA set out to beat teams like Arsenal at home, not packing midfield and hoping to snatch it with a Cahill or Fellaini header. And it also means playing to a out strikers' strengths - Jo was useless on Saturday, but fair play to him, he is NOT a lone striker, his game is neither running the channels nor playing with his back to goal holding up play, he needs the ball at his feet in and around the box running at goal. And I'd say the same for Saha and for Yakubu, so ffs start playing them in tandem. I guarantee using combinations of those three as a front two will get us more goals than relying on Cahill and Fellaini - they were only our top scorers last year coz we had no strikers fit! Phew, feel better for that - just hope we can pull something out the hat against the Czech lot now and get our season up and running Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DangerMouse Posted August 17, 2009 Report Share Posted August 17, 2009 Hmmm well that was a rather brutal dose of reality to quench all my pre-season optimism! Thing is, even though the final scoreline shocked me, I wasn't that surprised we got turned over in the end - that's now five losses out of eight season openers under Moyes. And I don't know about anyone else, but to me it always seems to be defensively that we get caught out early season - the thing that stands out for me about the Liege game at Goodison last year was how vulnerable we looked to their pace out wide, and in particular how dodgy Lescott looked against their right mid (Dalmat?). Surely there's got to be something going wrong in the preparation for this to keep happening - the second and third goals on Saturday were criminal (and pretty much made the finals core obsolete), simple balls into the box and we looked like we hadn't done a set-peice defensive drill for months. Solutions? If this was a one-off then yeah, perhaps we could blame the Lescott situation for disrupting the back four. As it is, I think its a perennial problem and i think a big problem is, without Jags, we lack a natural leader at the back. Yobo has always been too quiet, and I don't think Lescott's natural game is as a commander either. The second and third goals would never have been scored with a) proper communication and someone like Jags sensing the danger and having the courage to leave his man to clear up someone else's mess (although I admit an on-form Lescott can usually be relied on to do that). So never mind what happens with lescott for now, i'm more interested in getting in someone with a voice and a pair of balls to pull what was a ragged mess of a back four on Saturday into line - Steven Taylor seems to fit the bill perfectly. As John Terry proves, sometimes as a centre back its not all about natural ability, its about having a big gob and a big heart. The other thing that pissed me off on Saturday was the tactics - 4-5-1 at home AGAIN! I know this has served Moyes well in the past, but that was when we didn't have the same quality in the squad that we have now and when we had forwards like Bent and Johnson who would run the channels all day to bring the midfielders into the game up field. If we have any real pretence to being contenders for the top four, we've GOTTA set out to beat teams like Arsenal at home, not packing midfield and hoping to snatch it with a Cahill or Fellaini header. And it also means playing to a out strikers' strengths - Jo was useless on Saturday, but fair play to him, he is NOT a lone striker, his game is neither running the channels nor playing with his back to goal holding up play, he needs the ball at his feet in and around the box running at goal. And I'd say the same for Saha and for Yakubu, so ffs start playing them in tandem. I guarantee using combinations of those three as a front two will get us more goals than relying on Cahill and Fellaini - they were only our top scorers last year coz we had no strikers fit! Phew, feel better for that - just hope we can pull something out the hat against the Czech lot now and get our season up and running Agree with most of that.... EVERYONE looked out of place... Lescott didnt really make to many mistakes but did catch him doing ALOT of moaning..... Are organisation was poor as it is at the begining of most campaigns (WHY????) and I dont think we matched Arsenals fitness levels either.... The 4-5-1 thing though..... can be attacking if set up correctly and we can play some good stuff going forward sometimes so I dont see it as being much of a problem......... The only problems with it are Osman & Hibbert.... Where the fuck was OSMAN when Hibbert lost the ball.... Im not blaming Osman for the goal just giving an example you can watch of the way he just runs forward & leaves Hibbo to get on with it..... Hibbet is a good defender...... without help though he gets found out...... Just look at the difference when Baines has the ball..... two or three options all the time...... Hibbo has one..... LUMP IT.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adpom Posted August 17, 2009 Report Share Posted August 17, 2009 The reason hibbit has no opions is because his attacking is awful, not ONCE did his cross get past the first man, in the whole game. So players don't bother giving him an options as he only lose it anyway, like he does every game. The lad should spend 40 hours a week on crossing to try an improve his game, his defending isn't bad, but his attacking is pitaful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DangerMouse Posted August 17, 2009 Report Share Posted August 17, 2009 The reason hibbit has no opions is because his attacking is awful, not ONCE did his cross get past the first man, in the whole game. So players don't bother giving him an options as he only lose it anyway, like he does every game. The lad should spend 40 hours a week on crossing to try an improve his game, his defending isn't bad, but his attacking is pitaful. Im not having that..... Id kick your arse if you were playing in my team saying that.... Maybe he loses it because of that......... Im not saying his attacking is brilliant or at all any good but give the lad some options...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nogs Posted August 17, 2009 Report Share Posted August 17, 2009 Agree with most of that.... EVERYONE looked out of place... Lescott didnt really make to many mistakes but did catch him doing ALOT of moaning..... Are organisation was poor as it is at the begining of most campaigns (WHY????) and I dont think we matched Arsenals fitness levels either.... The 4-5-1 thing though..... can be attacking if set up correctly and we can play some good stuff going forward sometimes so I dont see it as being much of a problem......... The only problems with it are Osman & Hibbert.... Where the fuck was OSMAN when Hibbert lost the ball.... Im not blaming Osman for the goal just giving an example you can watch of the way he just runs forward & leaves Hibbo to get on with it..... Hibbet is a good defender...... without help though he gets found out...... Just look at the difference when Baines has the ball..... two or three options all the time...... Hibbo has one..... LUMP IT.... I totally agree we're weak down the right but let's be honest, Osman is one of many players we've got who are naturally suited to playing down the middle who is being asked to do a job out wide - Arteta has had to do the same for most of his Everton career. And our lack of wide players is another reason why i don't like 4-5-1 - it works best when your wide players can quickly get forward to make it 4-3-3, we have Pienaar capable of doing it on one side but Osman lacks the pace. In any case, after Saturday surely it would be worth putting Neville back in at right back to give us some leadership at the back and seeing how we go with two up front - I'd even be tempted to start Rodwell instead of Fellaini so we have some composure in the middle, and giving Gosling a go on the right just coz Ossie looks so bang out of form Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chicagoblue Posted August 17, 2009 Report Share Posted August 17, 2009 (edited) In any case, after Saturday surely it would be worth putting Neville back in at right back to give us some leadership at the back and seeing how we go with two up front - I'd even be tempted to start Rodwell instead of Fellaini so we have some composure in the middle, and giving Gosling a go on the right just coz Ossie looks so bang out of form I just don't think Gosling has the ability, at least not yet, to really make us better on the right. However, I do think we'll see some changes for the Europa game just because this performance was so pitiful. Edited August 17, 2009 by chicagoblue Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carlmc25 Posted August 17, 2009 Report Share Posted August 17, 2009 We were terrible but at least we should be able to guarantee a reaction in the next match so it may not be all doom and gloom. At the end of the day it doesn't really matter if you lose 1-0 or 6-1, fair enough it was embarrassing but I think it was just one of those days, some of the goals were just criminal and you have to wonder whether it is the LEscott effect undermining the team. I'm sure we'll bounce back. We need to get Cahill further forward, Fellaini just isn't mobile enough - I can't wait until Arteta is back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimCahill17 Posted August 19, 2009 Report Share Posted August 19, 2009 Their are 37 games left, plus Europe, this was one bad result, let's pick ourselves up and get on with it like only we can!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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