US Men's National Team Thread 2016

[Sibdane]

One for our American friends or people who follow the MLS close enough.

 

I've tuned in a few times to watch Colorado to check up on Tim Howard and how he's doing and I must admit Marlon Hairston has caught my eye, 22 year old who plays right wing and is an absolute live wire.

 

Have I just caught him at the right moments or is he regarded as a player with some potential?

He's from my home state(Mississippi), so I've been rooting for him. Hasn't done much up until recently though -- hoping he continues his excellent form.

[Btay]

Yeah. Yedlin was fantastic at RB for Sunderland last year though, Big Sam said he improved all year and really grew to own that spot. He's back at Spurs now. We'll see what happens with him.

 

Yeah he is small, but he's fast as hell, kinda like baines but faster, uses his speed to make up for his size. Baines has better positioning.

Yeah I'm well aware of Yedlin, I more meant this fella for Colorado is playing RW but says he is RB.

Yedlin reminds me more of colemans game. Lots of pace but lacks a bit of natural technique, Baines is a "proper" footballer.

 

Good to see some decent young Americans coming through, if you ever catch a Colorado game keep an eye out for him on the wing!

[Keith B]

Lynden Gooch, a USA U20 squad member, started for Sunderland today. Reviews seem to say that he worked hard, but it doesn't sound like he did much. I saw the first half the match, but didn't know he was starting so I didn't really pay close attention and I was drinking beer at the bar with a couple of friends.

[markjazzbassist]

Yeah I saw that too. Moyes spoke highly of him so I'm guessing he's a workhorse kinda guy.

[Keith B]

Yeah I saw that too. Moyes spoke highly of him so I'm guessing he's a workhorse kinda guy.

 

He wasn't on my radar and I try to pay close attention to our youth guys that might be coming into the senior team. Can only think it is good news for US Soccer. Many more like this please, US Soccer.

[markjazzbassist]

Yeah I'd never heard of him either.

[markjazzbassist]

Expecting a win this afternoon. There are many iterations but I think Trinidad should win too and we'll both advance. Bradley out with suspension from yellows.

 

Guzan

Yedlin Cameron Gonzo Fabian

Bedoya Nagbe beckerman pulisic

Wood altidore

Edited September 2, 2016 by markjazzbassist

[markjazzbassist]

here's the lineup for today's match

 

Guzan

Yedlin Cameron Besler Acosta

Beckerman Bedoya

Zusi Wood Fabian

Altidore

 

Very happy with that lineup, should be a win.

[markjazzbassist]

18 year old Christian Pulisic just scored his first Champions League goal for Borussia Dortmund. Very telling that Tuchel picks him to start for most of their CL matches. He's already great, but he could be next level if this keeps up.

[Sibdane]

18 year old Christian Pulisic just scored his first Champions League goal for Borussia Dortmund. Very telling that Tuchel picks him to start for most of their CL matches. He's already great, but he could be next level if this keeps up.

 

Got an assist on the first goal too. He's already a very good player.

[aaron]

one of the highest rated youngsters in European football at the moment, he's got a big future ahead of him. He's at a great club for young players already but from what I've heard he could take the next step to the A star teams.

[Sibdane]

one of the highest rated youngsters in European football at the moment, he's got a big future ahead of him. He's at a great club for young players already but from what I've heard he could take the next step to the A star teams.

 

Not that they're an A-star team, but I keep hearing rumors that Liverpool is interested. I would be crushed if he ever went there.

[markjazzbassist]

 

Not that they're an A-star team, but I keep hearing rumors that Liverpool is interested. I would be crushed if he ever went there.

 

he said he's not interested in going there (thank God). it's a step down from Dortmund as well honestly, they barely play CL (every couple of years) compared to every year for Dortmund. Signed through 2020 now so i think once that contract is close to up we will see offers if he continues to play at a high level or improve.

 

it's about time we have a real "potential worldie" from the US, i'm excited.

[aaron]

 

Not that they're an A-star team, but I keep hearing rumors that Liverpool is interested. I would be crushed if he ever went there.

don't get me wrong Dortmund are great but what I mean is your Real Madrid's / Barcelona / Bayern teams, Dortmund is only a short step down from those, a bit like your Juventus, Atletico and PSG. The brides maids if you will.

 

Yeah I've heard plenty of times him being linked to Liverpool, but tbf I think its just lazy journalism, the Klopp link.

 

Mark, at least he isn't another "Adu"!

Edited March 9, 2017 by aaron

[markjazzbassist]

don't get me wrong Dortmund are great but what I mean is your Real Madrid's / Barcelona / Bayern teams, Dortmund is only a short step down from those, a bit like your Juventus, Atletico and PSG. The brides maids if you will.

 

Yeah I've heard plenty of times him being linked to Liverpool, but tbf I think its just lazy journalism, the Klopp link.

 

Mark, at least he isn't another "Adu"!

 

also for me (not for Tonks, we've had many back and forths on this) that he's not a Landon Donovan. Played in MLS forever with a couple europe stints. When it comes to football I'll admit i'm a Europhile. Gladly admit that. I just feel Pulisic playing at the top level in one of the top leagues makes his stature as an american more respectable and acceptable to non americans. If he was tearing MLS up i don't think anyone would care.

[Sibdane]

I definitely prefer European football, but in order to improve the national team MLS (and the US youth setup) needs to grow and improve. Domestic football is the key to making the USA better, so I definitely try to support MLS when I can. Not saying it will happen, but I'd love to see the MLS as a top league one day.

 

Pulisic is an exception to the rule. Most US national teamers won't have the opportunity to be trained by the Dortmunds, Barcelonas, et al, so improving the game at home is critical.

[aaron]

Americas problem is Football isn't the major sport is it, its come on leaps and bounds over the years, but as far as im aware American Football, Basketball and Baseball are well above football in terms of youth playing it? Be interesting to get an inside look to how American youth view football. Growing up it was always the thought of "yeah but imagine how good you'd be against americans if you had a kick about over there"

[markjazzbassist]

Americas problem is Football isn't the major sport is it, its come on leaps and bounds over the years, but as far as im aware American Football, Basketball and Baseball are well above football in terms of youth playing it? Be interesting to get an inside look to how American youth view football. Growing up it was always the thought of "yeah but imagine how good you'd be against americans if you had a kick about over there"

 

you're right as far as television goes. but it's growing rapidly in that sense. More and more watch european football and MLS.

 

but most kids in the suburbs play soccer as kids. i did up till high school. it's just what you do during the fall season (you're too young for american football). i think the issue is the coaching. It's father's (mine did) coaching who don't know anything about the sport so it's most hustle/bustle hard working types who have little in terms of technique. by the time they are making "travel teams" which are like youth u-12 and up that play at a higher level and more competitively they might get the correct coaching (though i doubt it's that great). High school coaches are mostly gym teachers that want an extra 8-10k side job so they coach a sport (ie don't know much about it). The college game is so messed up, unlimited subs, crazy travel, little practice time to work on the small things so unless you have good technique it's not gonna get worked on. There is no minor leagues here, technically the colleges are. It's a terrible system. There are now academies at the MLS clubs but i don't think they are big at all and it's probably super difficult to get in them (unlike England which has droves of academies and non-league teams).

 

So in the end you have non-technical players who can work their ass off (see michael bradley, geoff cameron types) and try their hardest, but their basic skills are unpolished. That's why americans aren't bought unless they have left america and plied their trade in Europe/mexico/South America for a few years. Even then there is skepticism.

 

 

to your point of an english in america, Dom Dwyer was a reject from the Norwich Academy and is a world beater for Sporting Kansas City (ok not worldie but a top striker in the league). That says it all really.

Edited March 9, 2017 by markjazzbassist

[aaron]

 

you're right as far as television goes. but it's growing rapidly in that sense. More and more watch european football and MLS.

 

but most kids in the suburbs play soccer as kids. i did up till high school. it's just what you do during the fall season (you're too young for american football). i think the issue is the coaching. It's father's (mine did) coaching who don't know anything about the sport so it's most hustle/bustle hard working types who have little in terms of technique. by the time they are making "travel teams" which are like youth u-12 and up that play at a higher level and more competitively they might get the correct coaching (though i doubt it's that great). High school coaches are mostly gym teachers that want an extra 8-10k side job so they coach a sport (ie don't know much about it). The college game is so messed up, unlimited subs, crazy travel, little practice time to work on the small things so unless you have good technique it's not gonna get worked on. There is no minor leagues here, technically the colleges are. It's a terrible system. There are now academies at the MLS clubs but i don't think they are big at all and it's probably super difficult to get in them (unlike England which has droves of academies and non-league teams).

 

So in the end you have non-technical players who can work their ass off (see michael bradley, geoff cameron types) and try their hardest, but their basic skills are unpolished. That's why americans aren't bought unless they have left america and plied their trade in Europe/mexico/South America for a few years. Even then there is skepticism.

 

 

to your point of an english in america, Dom Dwyer was a reject from the Norwich Academy and is a world beater for Sporting Kansas City (ok not worldie but a top striker in the league). That says it all really.

Cheers! good insight that. Is there anything being done about youth coaches? Minor leagues? That's the big up roar over here about "Grass Roots" not being invested in enough, seems like America could follow suit and put money into it to try and mold better home grown players.

 

What is the US equivalent of the FA? they a bunch of suits who have no experience in the game? or are they former players?

 

Never even heard of Dom Dwyer I'm sure I read somewhere LA Galaxy years ago offered Ant & Dec (tv presentors, national treasures) playing contracts!

Edited March 9, 2017 by aaron

[Sibdane]

Americas problem is Football isn't the major sport is it, its come on leaps and bounds over the years, but as far as im aware American Football, Basketball and Baseball are well above football in terms of youth playing it? Be interesting to get an inside look to how American youth view football. Growing up it was always the thought of "yeah but imagine how good you'd be against americans if you had a kick about over there"

 

That's very true. I think more and more youth are heading towards football. Baseball has dropped a lot in popularity over the years, and it's no secret that exceptional height plays a major part in Basketball. American Football is probably the main rival to soccer in terms of recruiting youth, but with the recent concussion findings I think its popularity will start to decrease (among parents). Football actually has a pretty good youth movement over here, but the culture doesn't really encourage kids to continue playing. That is changing in larger cities. I use to live in Seattle, and football is HUGE there. You'll see that in the metropolitan areas -- particularly ones with MLS teams.

 

The part in bold: I remember a Dutch foreign exchange student coming over to our school and he used to play pick-up with us. He was superior by far to the rest of us, but he always said that back home he was the worst of his group!

[Sibdane]

 

you're right as far as television goes. but it's growing rapidly in that sense. More and more watch european football and MLS.

 

but most kids in the suburbs play soccer as kids. i did up till high school. it's just what you do during the fall season (you're too young for american football). i think the issue is the coaching. It's father's (mine did) coaching who don't know anything about the sport so it's most hustle/bustle hard working types who have little in terms of technique. by the time they are making "travel teams" which are like youth u-12 and up that play at a higher level and more competitively they might get the correct coaching (though i doubt it's that great). High school coaches are mostly gym teachers that want an extra 8-10k side job so they coach a sport (ie don't know much about it). The college game is so messed up, unlimited subs, crazy travel, little practice time to work on the small things so unless you have good technique it's not gonna get worked on. There is no minor leagues here, technically the colleges are. It's a terrible system. There are now academies at the MLS clubs but i don't think they are big at all and it's probably super difficult to get in them (unlike England which has droves of academies and non-league teams).

 

So in the end you have non-technical players who can work their ass off (see michael bradley, geoff cameron types) and try their hardest, but their basic skills are unpolished. That's why americans aren't bought unless they have left america and plied their trade in Europe/mexico/South America for a few years. Even then there is skepticism.

 

 

to your point of an english in america, Dom Dwyer was a reject from the Norwich Academy and is a world beater for Sporting Kansas City (ok not worldie but a top striker in the league). That says it all really.

 

Nail on head.

[markjazzbassist]

Cheers! good insight that. Is there anything being done about youth coaches? Minor leagues? That's the big up roar over here about "Grass Roots" not being invested in enough, seems like America could follow suit and put money into it to try and mold better home grown players.

 

What is the US equivalent of the FA? they a bunch of suits who have no experience in the game? or are they former players?

 

Never even heard of Dom Dwyer I'm sure I read somewhere LA Galaxy years ago offered Ant & Dec (tv presentors, national treasures) playing contracts!

 

Yeah when Juergen Klinssman took over he did an overhaul of all the youth programs and everything and hopefully in a few years we'll see the result of that. No minor leagues, the college system works for all the other sports (except football) so they're not going to change it. MLS doesn't want a lower league (they are greedy and don't want competition) and already worked to get rid of the NASL (New York Cosmos) which is now defunct.

 

Yeah it's just called US Soccer and same thing as the FA. Ran by Sunil Gulati some guy who probably never played. They're making strides to make it better by just getting tournaments here (Copa America Centenario, and now every Copa America will be here with South America and ConCacaf joining for it), WC coverage, MLS coverage, and marketing the sport so people are exposed to it. Once there is enough demand for better coaching and stuff I think they will follow suit, but until that happens who knows.

 

A lot of the former players are taking over MLS teams and trying to change it that way. Instead of making them money makers they're trying to make them actual clubs with youth academies and homegrown prospects and such.

 

One of the things going for us (well pre-trump) is massive latin american immigrants. They all love football and have played it and grew up with it, so they dominate the youth teams in cities and there is a lot of talent there. Needs to be better mined in my opinion.

 

Here's Dom Dwyer, article talks about can english football players who didn't make it start flooding MLS. I hope they do, would love championship and lower players over here, make the overall level of the league better. MLS is like this, 4 players on each team could play Premier league or Bundesliga, etc. 2/3 could play championship, dutch /belgian/etc league, the other 5 and bench would be in non-league england or pub league players. The overall quality isn't great. They need to improve salaries to get foreign players to want to play here so the whole team is like at least dutch league equivalent, and then if you add the superstars you're getting somewhere.

 

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2017/jan/23/dom-dwyer-usa-kansas-city-usa-football-team

[aaron]

 

Yeah when Juergen Klinssman took over he did an overhaul of all the youth programs and everything and hopefully in a few years we'll see the result of that. No minor leagues, the college system works for all the other sports (except football) so they're not going to change it. MLS doesn't want a lower league (they are greedy and don't want competition) and already worked to get rid of the NASL (New York Cosmos) which is now defunct.

 

Yeah it's just called US Soccer and same thing as the FA. Ran by Sunil Gulati some guy who probably never played. They're making strides to make it better by just getting tournaments here (Copa America Centenario, and now every Copa America will be here with South America and ConCacaf joining for it), WC coverage, MLS coverage, and marketing the sport so people are exposed to it. Once there is enough demand for better coaching and stuff I think they will follow suit, but until that happens who knows.

 

A lot of the former players are taking over MLS teams and trying to change it that way. Instead of making them money makers they're trying to make them actual clubs with youth academies and homegrown prospects and such.

 

One of the things going for us (well pre-trump) is massive latin american immigrants. They all love football and have played it and grew up with it, so they dominate the youth teams in cities and there is a lot of talent there. Needs to be better mined in my opinion.

 

Here's Dom Dwyer, article talks about can english football players who didn't make it start flooding MLS. I hope they do, would love championship and lower players over here, make the overall level of the league better. MLS is like this, 4 players on each team could play Premier league or Bundesliga, etc. 2/3 could play championship, dutch /belgian/etc league, the other 5 and bench would be in non-league england or pub league players. The overall quality isn't great. They need to improve salaries to get foreign players to want to play here so the whole team is like at least dutch league equivalent, and then if you add the superstars you're getting somewhere.

 

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2017/jan/23/dom-dwyer-usa-kansas-city-usa-football-team

what's the deal with the draft? same as NFL, last place gets first pick?

 

Cheers for the education on it, quite an interesting subject and its a great insight. Also THANK YOU for not saying soccer, not even once!

[Sibdane]

what's the deal with the draft? same as NFL, last place gets first pick?

 

Cheers for the education on it, quite an interesting subject and its a great insight. Also THANK YOU for not saying soccer, not even once! [emoji38]

Yep, last-placed team in the previous season gets first pick, and teams can also trade picks for money/players/allocation order.

[aaron]

Yep, last-placed team in the previous season gets first pick, and teams can also trade picks for money/players/allocation order.

what's the level of quality for the players in the draft? I'd google all this but I'd rather get a fan view of it all.

 

Tonka, Mark, any other Americans we have, who do you support? Is it a MLS team first then Everton or Everton then an MLS team? or just Everton?

[markjazzbassist]

what's the level of quality for the players in the draft? I'd google all this but I'd rather get a fan view of it all.

 

Tonka, Mark, any other Americans we have, who do you support? Is it a MLS team first then Everton or Everton then an MLS team? or just Everton?

 

Great questions. The draft is all the top college players, so i'd say the first round is quality players who will become starters. After that it's a crapshoot, either bench/role players or maybe you find a diamond in the rough.

 

I don't follow MLS at all, when i lived in LA for 2 years i followed the Galaxy a little bit but only watched 1 match. The closest team to me now is Columbus Crew and they are 2 hours drive away.

 

I just follow Everton. I fell in love with football in 2006 World Cup. Shortly after Howard went to Everton and he was one of the only americans in league so I started watching them (i also watched and followed dempsey at Fulham). Fell in love with Everton and the club (not so with Fulham) and the rest is history.

 

I follow some americans who play abroad (pulisic, fabian johnson with borussia monchengladbach, bobby wood with hamburg, Brooks with Hertha Berlin) and I have a couple teams in the other leagues i like (Sevilla and Celta in Spain because i'm a huge Bielsa fan [bielsa disciples as coaches], Marseille in France[biesla coached there]). I also follow the results in some other leagues casually like English Championship, SPL, and the top leagues (EPL, Liga, Ligue 1, Serie A, Bundesliga).

Edited March 10, 2017 by markjazzbassist

[Romey 1878]

Question for the American's. Do you think the system for football, in terms of having academies and the way transfers work, is a better way of doing things or do you think drafts and trading are better?

I must admit I find the American system a bit mad. Not so much the draft but the way trading works (if it works the same as in baseball where the club just tells a player they're going to another club and that's that).

[aaron]

I do hope the MLS carries on improving, as an outsider it does seem to have slowed down a little, maybe China with its money has for a short period of time taken over as it can influence players to move there for now with its mega money.

[markjazzbassist]

Question for the American's. Do you think the system for football, in terms of having academies and the way transfers work, is a better way of doing things or do you think drafts and trading are better?

 

I must admit I find the American system a bit mad. Not so much the draft but the way trading works (it works the same as in baseball where the club just tells a player they're going to another club and that's that).

 

i much prefer the european system of transfers, academies, minor leagues and promotion relegation. the be honest once i figured it all out it's what made me respect european football so much, the system is fantastic. i dislike the american system greatly.

[Sibdane]

Question for the American's. Do you think the system for football, in terms of having academies and the way transfers work, is a better way of doing things or do you think drafts and trading are better?

 

I must admit I find the American system a bit mad. Not so much the draft but the way trading works (if it works the same as in baseball where the club just tells a player they're going to another club and that's that).

 

It's crazy, but it also adds a bit of parity to the league, which has it's pros and cons. Each team has a salary cap in MLS, and it's to keep teams from folding, which makes sense given the current football climate here. However, it restricts how many high-value players can come in. Trading does kind of suck for the players, because they really don't have a choice on where they end up. Recently, Dax McCarty was traded from NYRB to Chicago Fire like a day after his wedding day. No one told him he was being traded until after it happened. MLS just recently allowed free agency and there's still ridiculous restrictions on that (like I think you have to have played in MLS for 8 years and be over a certain age).

 

In an ideal world, I would love to see the more-free market version of transfers like there is in Europe. No restrictions on transfers, free agents, etc. I do like how the salary cap helps with parity, but like I said above it restricts the amount of high-value talent you can bring to the squad. I also think trading is okay as long as the player has a say in it.

 

...And I much prefer the academy system. College players don't really get to play the higher competition that's needed to improve, and they don't play enough games.