Bailey

Just to make it clear I'm not anti Koeman at all, I think we will get there but we need to see more and we need to see it soon. I'm pretty sure he is thinking the same thing. I just don't agree with some of these bullshit excuses. Using the same argument to support one manager and slate another. I don't even think Koeman would agree with such nonsense excuses himself!

Yep the relegated Norwich that we lost to this season, when they made 11 changes. Yep that's them.

For example Leicester and West Ham were ahead of us last season and ahead of Koeman last season so it is still relevant and thats why I raised the point. I'm not sure of the position but they were only 3 points above relegation so I doubt they would be that high on confidence! If Adkins was still there it would have been a far easier game but Pochettino came in and within a week or 10 days, no summer, he turned them into a high energy, high pressure team.

Fixtures are largely irrelevant because we are only 3 games past half way so it won't make a difference. As for the WC only Williams and Lukaku got any real game time, maybe Coleman? Not having that either. Pretty much every single one of those players you mentioned played no part of our season. Naismith went because the offer was far too good and truth is Martinez made him look like that price when in reality he is nowhere near it. It's not like he has done anything at Norwich. I don't get why people take the press conferences to heart. I would expect any manager to protect their squad. If you have a problem with a performance that should never be aired to the media, it should be between the manager and the player (s). I would rather have Martinez's bullshit about Barkley being the best player in the world than Koeman having a dig in front of the cameras. The press conference should just be a BS exercise so that you can get back to the players to tell them what you really think. Either way that's irrelevant now. I do think he is short of what he ideally wants but if he needed to ship the whole squad out and get a new one in, he probably isn't a very good coach and he probably wasnt the right man for the job. He clearly needs time, I don't dispute that, but we also need to see progress.

You don't know what Koeman was or wasn't told and managers don't get what they want a lot of the time. Do you think Martinez would have got McGeady if he could have brought in someone of real quality? That Moyes stuff is rubbish, we won something like 6 on the bounce in the second half of that first season, are you still crediting Moyes then? Why isn't Moyes carrying on from where Allardyce left off at Sunderland, or Ferguson at Utd for that matter if he is that good a coach? Plus Unsworth did a pretty good job at giving the squad an identity in the weak he had the team, you know, the same shambles of a team and they were that incompetent that they managed 3 goals and a clean sheet. The same Norwich that beat us in the cup this year. Like I have said plenty of times I am not expecting us to turn into world beaters after 6 months but I would have expected to see progress and at least some hope but I don't see any of it.

We should have been spanked by City as well but they couldn't finish.

You beat me too it. Considering how bad we were at the end of Martinez reign if Koeman doesn't beat last year's total by 12-15 points I think it would be a big disappointment.

Even if we were able to finish 7th with the same or less points than last season? I doubt it could happen but points gained should be the most important thing. Positions fluctuate year by year, hence why Moyes got us 4th and Martinez earnt our highest ever points total and finished 5th.

But at this stage last season we were roughly in the same position. Are you saying that the squad Martinez was able to get into that position 12 months ago is that much worse now? If so, please elaborate.

Yeh and they also have players like Fellaini, Jones, Rojo etc that are in their starting 11 which I wouldn't put in ours. Same with Depay. I'm not saying we have as many genuine first teamers as they do but when you look across the league we have roughly as many as the teams around us, and/or the teams that were above us last season. Fwiw the effect isn't just for top teams. Remember when we played Soton the week after Pochettino was in charge. They were superb and so much more organised and deserved 3 points.

Jury is out on Besic. Davies has more qualities in my opinion. As for Bolasie, I actually think he was the worse. First couple of games were decent but after that his second touch seemed to be giving the ball away. He always seems to have an assist in him but at the same time he has a cert goal wasted in him too. I would go Gerry, Mirallas, Valencia, Bolasie and then Lennon.

Klopp may or may not have had better players at his dosposal but that is irrelevant because they all started playing into his system. Like I said you could see it, almost from day one, how his team were going to play. Some players may have been better than others but they were in a system. We know we can do it because they did it under Martinez and some under Moyes. In terms of the squad options you mention, if you look at most teams they will have the same problem, it's only because it's Everton that you know who you would get rid of. I could go through Utd's squad, City's and Arsenals etc and identify similar if not more waste.

Good footballer but he is a moaning twat. Loves to dish it out and the cries like a bitch when someone touches him. Hate players like that.

In fairness City is his biggest task so I would expect it to take more than a season, albeit people (inlcudong me) probably got a little carried away given how well he started.

This is the problem for me. You want to see what we are trying to achieve even if we ultimately don't achieve it. I don't like using this example but Klopp do came in across the park and whilst it didn't always work, you could see what he was trying to do. Players took time to adapt, he probably had to adapt his philosophy a little to cope with English conditions but you could see what he wanted to do. You could see the same when both Moyes and Martinez came here too. I thought I could see the adaption against Spurs in week 1 but I haven't seen that since. We had glimpses against Arsenal and Liverpool but that was largely to run and tackle everything before lumping it towards Rom. I get that he will want to bring in players that can suit his style better but I have no idea if the players we have suit the style he actually wants to play because I don't know what that is.

Especially as both sides play in a similar fashion.

At the moment we don't play through he middle enough to get a decent number 10 involved. Probably a bit of a chicken and egg situation mind you.

I still don't know what he wants to do with the squad either. I'm surprised Gerry didn't start to be honest. I also don't remember hearing that he was injured?

It sounded like our usual game in that we lacked quality. We played in a similar way against them in the league but on that day we scored they didn't,although overall they were the best team. This time we sounded the more dominant but they did us. I still don't get the 5 at the back. 4 at the back did well against Soton and we are playing against a team who counter attack and don't dominate possession. We should have been playing with width and runners from midfield to pull them around and break them down. I don't know what the shot count was but it sounded as though Robles had more to do than Schmeichel.

Ross off for Kone. Leaving Davies and Barry on. Apparently Kone has gone wide, Mirallas central? All a bit odd.

2-1 Leicester. Must again.

One all. Typical Everton!

Gerry sets up Rom. 1 nil! Get in!

Although I think Robles has had more to do than Shmeichel.

Sounds like its all huff and puff without any quality. In fact it sounds like the Soton game but with us being less exposed.