samtheguru Posted July 22, 2009 Report Share Posted July 22, 2009 (edited) There is 0 chance of Mark Hughes selling Onuoha or Richards....just to let you guys know. Edited July 22, 2009 by cityfan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lowensda Posted July 22, 2009 Report Share Posted July 22, 2009 There is 0 chance of Mark Hughes selling Onuoha or Richards....just to let you guys know. There is 0 chance of David Moyes selling Lescott without adding Richards or Onuha....just to let you know Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
efc-murph Posted July 22, 2009 Report Share Posted July 22, 2009 (edited) There is 0 chance of David Moyes selling Lescott without adding Richards or Onuha....just to let you know there is 0% chance of moyes selling Lescott for anything less than £30m Edited July 22, 2009 by efc-murph Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
12ubb3rduck Posted July 23, 2009 Report Share Posted July 23, 2009 I want us to get velso for defensive mid and cover for centre back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samtheguru Posted July 23, 2009 Report Share Posted July 23, 2009 (edited) There is 0 chance of David Moyes selling Lescott without adding Richards or Onuha....just to let you know there is 0% chance of moyes selling Lescott for anything less than £30m I wouldn't put any money on it if I were you guys. City will NOT pay anywhere near £30m. Richards and Onuoha will not be used as a makeweight, Hughes has already stated this. You will get £20-21m for him at the very most if he does go. I think you will find the key is down to Lescott, not Moyes, and how hard he pushes for the move. The more he pushes, the cheaper the price will be for him but some of the prices being thrown around on here are a bit ridiculous. I think you will find that a bid of £21m would make your team seriously, serioualy think, that is if our next bid of 18m is not accepted. In fact I wouldn't find it hard to believe that this deal is very advanced and simply waiting on you finding a replacement (without people knowing that you have £20m as a bargaining tool). Edited July 23, 2009 by cityfan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GMONEYone Posted July 23, 2009 Report Share Posted July 23, 2009 I wouldn't put any money on it if I were you guys. City will NOT pay anywhere near £30m. Richards and Onuoha will not be used as a makeweight, Hughes has already stated this. You will get £20-21m for him at the very most if he does go. I think you will find the key is down to Lescott, not Moyes, and how hard he pushes for the move. The more he pushes, the cheaper the price will be for him but some of the prices being thrown around on here are a bit ridiculous. I think you will find that a bid of £21m would make your team seriously, serioualy think, that is if our next bid of 18m is not accepted. In fact I wouldn't find it hard to believe that this deal is very advanced and simply waiting on you finding a replacement (without people knowing that you have £20m as a bargaining tool). Unfortunately i happen to agree with you mate, i dont think we will get either one as a part exchange although i would personally like either richards or onuoha. Anything above £20mill and I really dont think we would refuse it and also as much as Lescott is a legend I think 100k+ wages are too good to turn down for him. But i do trust in moyes to discover another gem of a cb for around £6mill I just hope he is allowed to spend all of the rest on strengthening the other positions we are weak in - ie Right back, Right wing One thing is for sure if you do get lescott he is one hell of a defender and also a lot better value for money than terry is! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lowensda Posted July 23, 2009 Report Share Posted July 23, 2009 I want us to get velso for defensive mid and cover for centre back. I 'd like that too but i cant see it happening!? he's available, for a touted price of around £12m, i think thats a snip and well worth it buut im not EFC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wirral Wizard Posted July 23, 2009 Report Share Posted July 23, 2009 Agree with you City Fan. I think Lescott will go and we will get £20 million. That money buys us 2-3 quality players, one to replace Joleon and something to bolster our lightweight midfield, which is good against most opposition but can't compete against the likes of Chelsea in that department with their physically imposing and athletic players. Arteta, Cahill, Osman and Pienaar struggle against that. The jury is out on Fellaini as far as I'm concerned but at least he does give us physical presence in the middle. Until we get a commanding presence in centre midfield we can't look at going 4-4-2, which I think is what we need to do to get anywhere near the top 4. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duncanmckenzieismagic Posted July 23, 2009 Report Share Posted July 23, 2009 Agree with you City Fan. I think Lescott will go and we will get £20 million. That money buys us 2-3 quality players, one to replace Joleon and something to bolster our lightweight midfield, which is good against most opposition but can't compete against the likes of Chelsea in that department with their physically imposing and athletic players. Arteta, Cahill, Osman and Pienaar struggle against that. The jury is out on Fellaini as far as I'm concerned but at least he does give us physical presence in the middle. Until we get a commanding presence in centre midfield we can't look at going 4-4-2, which I think is what we need to do to get anywhere near the top 4. I think you are being very optomistic in thinking Moyse would have £20M to spend. We would have to give Wolves 15% for a start. We would then be left with just Neville Hibbert Bines & Yobo in defence so we would need to get at least 2 CBs & a LB before we could even consider strengthening the midfield Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lowensda Posted July 23, 2009 Report Share Posted July 23, 2009 I think you are being very optomistic in thinking Moyse would have £20M to spend. We would have to give Wolves 15% for a start. We would then be left with just Neville Hibbert Bines & Yobo in defence so we would need to get at least 2 CBs & a LB before we could even consider strengthening the midfield Spot on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wirral Wizard Posted July 23, 2009 Report Share Posted July 23, 2009 Fair point about the need to bolster the defence. We'd still have £20 million to spend though as we obviously have some funds available without selling Lescott. Moyes could look to use Rodwell at centre half, alternatively could he agree a deal with City that would see Lescott go in the January window once Jagielka is back from injury...probably unlikely I guess as City want to spend money on their defence now. So two defenders and a strong midfield presence the priorities for me then if Lescott goes. £20 million should be enough to do that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeO Posted July 23, 2009 Report Share Posted July 23, 2009 Assuming he went for £20m Wolves would get £2.25m (15% of the profit made) if we're correct about the sell-on clause. Do we know what it is or are we just guessing btw ? Still the best part of £18m coming into the club. Don't know how much DM would be given but I'd take a bet he made sure he had a serious level of control after his contract negotiations last year. I know the club have a history of not passing money straight on to him but that was all under his previous contract. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duncanmckenzieismagic Posted July 23, 2009 Report Share Posted July 23, 2009 Fair point about the need to bolster the defence. We'd still have £20 million to spend though as we obviously have some funds available without selling Lescott. Moyes could look to use Rodwell at centre half, alternatively could he agree a deal with City that would see Lescott go in the January window once Jagielka is back from injury...probably unlikely I guess as City want to spend money on their defence now. So two defenders and a strong midfield presence the priorities for me then if Lescott goes. £20 million should be enough to do that. I think the problem is a bit more serious than that we already need at least 2 defenders now and thats before you take the possibility of Lescott going into account Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carlmc25 Posted July 23, 2009 Report Share Posted July 23, 2009 (edited) I wouldn't put any money on it if I were you guys. City will NOT pay anywhere near £30m. Richards and Onuoha will not be used as a makeweight, Hughes has already stated this. You will get £20-21m for him at the very most if he does go. I think you will find the key is down to Lescott, not Moyes, and how hard he pushes for the move. The more he pushes, the cheaper the price will be for him but some of the prices being thrown around on here are a bit ridiculous. I think you will find that a bid of £21m would make your team seriously, serioualy think, that is if our next bid of 18m is not accepted. In fact I wouldn't find it hard to believe that this deal is very advanced and simply waiting on you finding a replacement (without people knowing that you have £20m as a bargaining tool). Liverpool signed the inferior Johnson for £18m and he can only play at RB, Lescott is a fantastic CB and LB, he basically gives us cover in 2 positions meaning we'd have to replace 2 positions unless we somehow manage to find another CB who is also excellent at FB (how many of them do you know?). Moyes would have no reason to sell Lescott for £20m when he knows some of the fee will go to Wolves and he would need to replace him with two players, unless we get someone like Onouha then Moyes will tell Hughes to kiss it unless the offer is silly money. I think you underestimate Moyes both as a manager and his pride, also under Kenwright we have constantly got brilliant transfer deals - Barmby, Ball, Jeffers, McFadden, Rooney (imo anyway, he was never worth £20-30m). If Hughes wants LEscott then he's going to have to make Moyes happy otherwise forget it. £30m is too high but I'd be surprised if we sold him for less than £24m unless players are included. Edited July 23, 2009 by carlmc25 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samtheguru Posted July 23, 2009 Report Share Posted July 23, 2009 Liverpool signed the inferior Johnson for £18m and he can only play at RB, Lescott is a fantastic CB and LB, he basically gives us cover in 2 positions meaning we'd have to replace 2 positions unless we somehow manage to find another CB who is also excellent at FB (how many of them do you know?). Moyes would have no reason to sell Lescott for £20m when he knows some of the fee will go to Wolves and he would need to replace him with two players, unless we get someone like Onouha then Moyes will tell Hughes to kiss it unless the offer is silly money. I think you underestimate Moyes both as a manager and his pride, also under Kenwright we have constantly got brilliant transfer deals - Barmby, Ball, Jeffers, McFadden, Rooney (imo anyway, he was never worth £20-30m). If Hughes wants LEscott then he's going to have to make Moyes happy otherwise forget it. £30m is too high but I'd be surprised if we sold him for less than £24m unless players are included. I fail to see how Johnson comes into this. The reason that price was so high was the result of a bidding war. £20m is already well over the odds for Lescott and I don't think any other clubs would match that right now. The fact that City will simply move on to another target (as several deals are already in the works) if this deal does not go through means that the value of this deal will not go any higher leaving Moyes/Everton at a point to explore their options to see what deals they can get and use this to their advantage. £20m is silly money for a defender and with Lescott angling towards a double-your-money move then this does not put Everton in a very strong bargaining position so I would not expect Moyes to be able to push the price up to what you say. But we have just lent you Jo for another season, I cannot see us letting this happen unless a lot of terms have already been agreed with the Lescott deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris1eng Posted July 23, 2009 Report Share Posted July 23, 2009 I fail to see how Johnson comes into this. The reason that price was so high was the result of a bidding war. £20m is already well over the odds for Lescott and I don't think any other clubs would match that right now. The fact that City will simply move on to another target (as several deals are already in the works) if this deal does not go through means that the value of this deal will not go any higher leaving Moyes/Everton at a point to explore their options to see what deals they can get and use this to their advantage. £20m is silly money for a defender and with Lescott angling towards a double-your-money move then this does not put Everton in a very strong bargaining position so I would not expect Moyes to be able to push the price up to what you say. But we have just lent you Jo for another season, I cannot see us letting this happen unless a lot of terms have already been agreed with the Lescott deal. Maybe, or maybe Jo kicked off andwanted to come back, afer all you do have loads of forwards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeO Posted July 23, 2009 Report Share Posted July 23, 2009 Valid viewpoint I guess, until I got to this.. ...with Lescott angling towards a double-your-money move... How do you know that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samtheguru Posted July 23, 2009 Report Share Posted July 23, 2009 Valid viewpoint I guess, until I got to this.. How do you know that? A bit of an assumption, but ultimately all footballers are mercenaries. Lescott has kept very quiet on the matter, similar to Terry. Possibly because he is using this as a bargaining tool to gain a better contract? How many years does he have left and what kind of money is he on out of curiosity? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian C Posted July 23, 2009 Report Share Posted July 23, 2009 A bit of an assumption, but ultimately all footballers are mercenaries. Lescott has kept very quiet on the matter, similar to Terry. Possibly because he is using this as a bargaining tool to gain a better contract? How many years does he have left and what kind of money is he on out of curiosity? 3 years left at least, @ 30-40k IIRC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samtheguru Posted July 23, 2009 Report Share Posted July 23, 2009 3 years left at least, @ 30-40k IIRC. It is very likely then that we would/have offered him a double-your-money deal then. Honestly, would anyone here not want a double-your-money deal? Also, that is quite low for a player of his standard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carlmc25 Posted July 23, 2009 Report Share Posted July 23, 2009 I fail to see how Johnson comes into this. The reason that price was so high was the result of a bidding war. £20m is already well over the odds for Lescott and I don't think any other clubs would match that right now. The fact that City will simply move on to another target (as several deals are already in the works) if this deal does not go through means that the value of this deal will not go any higher leaving Moyes/Everton at a point to explore their options to see what deals they can get and use this to their advantage. £20m is silly money for a defender and with Lescott angling towards a double-your-money move then this does not put Everton in a very strong bargaining position so I would not expect Moyes to be able to push the price up to what you say. But we have just lent you Jo for another season, I cannot see us letting this happen unless a lot of terms have already been agreed with the Lescott deal. Johnson comes into it as a comparative sale, we don't HAVE to sell Lescott, so unless you match our valuation then it's going to be tough. Lescott is one of the best centre backs in the country and also one of the best left backs, by that reasoning I don't see how a valuation of £20m is inflated? He would give you cover for 2 positions and would be the best defender in your team in both. The fact is we know how much money you have, everyone knows your defence is weak and you are desperate to strengthen, we all know Hughes is out of a job if you don't start well so Hughes isn't going to be too concerned whether he spends £20m or £24m, I think the only worry as far as Hughes is concerned is giving Moyes too much money to make us even stronger as you're already playing catch up. To say Lescott is angling for a move is just pie in the sky rubbish at this moment in time and as I said, Moyes won't give a toss what Lescott wants - he only sells players if he wants to, bottom line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris1eng Posted July 23, 2009 Report Share Posted July 23, 2009 Johnson comes into it as a comparative sale, we don't HAVE to sell Lescott, so unless you match our valuation then it's going to be tough. Lescott is one of the best centre backs in the country and also one of the best left backs, by that reasoning I don't see how a valuation of £20m is inflated? He would give you cover for 2 positions and would be the best defender in your team in both. The fact is we know how much money you have, everyone knows your defence is weak and you are desperate to strengthen, we all know Hughes is out of a job if you don't start well so Hughes isn't going to be too concerned whether he spends £20m or £24m, I think the only worry as far as Hughes is concerned is giving Moyes too much money to make us even stronger as you're already playing catch up. To say Lescott is angling for a move is just pie in the sky rubbish at this moment in time and as I said, Moyes won't give a toss what Lescott wants - he only sells players if he wants to, bottom line. Hear hear or is it here here. Who knows, but well said Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Posted July 23, 2009 Report Share Posted July 23, 2009 Carl has just explained how Johnson comes into it, he is a one position player costing £18m whereas Lescott is a two position player, equally as good at full back if not better. We would have to replace Lescott with Two players. We are quite happy to keep Jolean so if you want to move on by all means do so, its no loss to us. On the subject of Jo, dont kid yourself that there is any hidden meaning in the loan deal, MH knows nobody will buy him for the stupid fee he paid and he's never going to get back the money he paid for him, he also knows that with Adebayor, Robinho, Santa Cruz, Tevez, and Bellamy, he's not even going to get a game, so the loan deal takes the pressure off him with us paying his wages. Edit .... i'm slow on the typing so i'm a bit late with this post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian C Posted July 23, 2009 Report Share Posted July 23, 2009 It is very likely then that we would/have offered him a double-your-money deal then. Honestly, would anyone here not want a double-your-money deal? Also, that is quite low for a player of his standard. Depends. Does double-your-money matter when you're already making nearly £2m a year? Joleon is in a squad of friends and mates with a terrific manager and a never say die attitude. Personally I wouldn't give that up to join a dressing room full of superstar egos and a knob-end manager. It's not like Lescott will ever need to work for money outside football for the rest of his life anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samtheguru Posted July 23, 2009 Report Share Posted July 23, 2009 Johnson comes into it as a comparative sale, we don't HAVE to sell Lescott, so unless you match our valuation then it's going to be tough. Lescott is one of the best centre backs in the country and also one of the best left backs, by that reasoning I don't see how a valuation of £20m is inflated? He would give you cover for 2 positions and would be the best defender in your team in both. The fact is we know how much money you have, everyone knows your defence is weak and you are desperate to strengthen, we all know Hughes is out of a job if you don't start well so Hughes isn't going to be too concerned whether he spends £20m or £24m, I think the only worry as far as Hughes is concerned is giving Moyes too much money to make us even stronger as you're already playing catch up. To say Lescott is angling for a move is just pie in the sky rubbish at this moment in time and as I said, Moyes won't give a toss what Lescott wants - he only sells players if he wants to, bottom line. City will not be taken for a ride when it comes to the price. If you really believe what you say and that you won't take £20m then there will be no deal and Lescott will remain an Everton player. Simples. Time will tell. £20m is inflated due to the fact that there don't seem to be many other clubs jumping at the opportunity to sign him at that price. In my opinion it is absolute top price. Without causing offence, teams are always bias about their own players. Arsenal fans were giving valuations of Adebayor much higher than the £22m we played, as were Villa fans with Barry. Most people seem to think their team's players are double their real value just because they are their own team's players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carlmc25 Posted July 23, 2009 Report Share Posted July 23, 2009 Carl has just explained how Johnson comes into it, he is a one position player costing £18m whereas Lescott is a two position player, equally as good at full back if not better. We would have to replace Lescott with Two players. We are quite happy to keep Jolean so if you want to move on by all means do so, its no loss to us. On the subject of Jo, dont kid yourself that there is any hidden meaning in the loan deal, MH knows nobody will buy him for the stupid fee he paid and he's never going to get back the money he paid for him, he also knows that with Adebayor, Robinho, Santa Cruz, Tevez, and Bellamy, he's not even going to get a game, so the loan deal takes the pressure off him with us paying his wages. Edit .... i'm slow on the typing so i'm a bit late with this post. exactly. Some Everton fans just need to remember what Moyes has done for us, he's a proud man and he wants Everton to get to the top, he's not just going to roll over to City unless the offer is too good to refuse or unless there is something in it for him. He's one of the best managers in Europe, the best manager we have had in years and he deserves our trust and respect. Quite frankly I find it a little insulting that we have a City fan on here telling us what Moyes and Everton will do, we don't have a small club mentality, we've been building for years and the upward curve will continue as long as Moyes runs the ship. If you want Lescott then prepare to pay for him, otherwise forget it and go and buy someone inferior and we'll keep our best players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Everton_Worshiper Posted July 23, 2009 Report Share Posted July 23, 2009 It is very likely then that we would/have offered him a double-your-money deal then. Honestly, would anyone here not want a double-your-money deal? Also, that is quite low for a player of his standard. I like how Citeh's fans have changed their attitude since Thai Bride and now the Arabs have pumped money into the club, suddenly £40k a week is quite low...I am sure if you had a financial profile of centre backs wages in the premiership, £40k is average if not above average. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samtheguru Posted July 23, 2009 Report Share Posted July 23, 2009 exactly. Some Everton fans just need to remember what Moyes has done for us, he's a proud man and he wants Everton to get to the top, he's not just going to roll over to City unless the offer is too good to refuse or unless there is something in it for him. Isn't that what I was saying when I said Moyes will be exploring all options right now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samtheguru Posted July 23, 2009 Report Share Posted July 23, 2009 I like how Citeh's fans have changed their attitude since Thai Bride and now the Arabs have pumped money into the club, suddenly £40k a week is quite low...I am sure if you had a financial profile of centre backs wages in the premiership, £40k is average if not above average. Geeze, what I am saying is when you are on 40k a week and your fellow internationals are on over double that wouldn't you feel inferior and be tempted to double your money? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian C Posted July 23, 2009 Report Share Posted July 23, 2009 Geeze, what I am saying is when you are on 40k a week and your fellow internationals are on over double that wouldn't you feel inferior and be tempted to double your money? I think you underestimate Joleon. Maybe in 2-3 years he may be tempted to join City or whoever the new flavour of the month are by that time for a big 5-year contract packet, but I personally don't think he'll go unless he feels so strongly that he pulls a Rooney. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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