Would you invest in E f C?

[StevO]

im not city fan, i like GP, id love it to be redeveloped.

 

but tonight when i watch city line up against munich in the champions league with silva and aguero in the city side, i for one will be very jealous.

 

enjoy it mate.

[FanchesterCity]

If you guys could 'invest' in Everton - but NOT as shareholders... but as bond holders, would that be an option for Everton?

 

For that that don't know... a 'bond' is basically a way of you lending the money to Everton, but they promise to pay it back (and with interest).

 

Example: You give them 1000, and they promise to give you back the 1000 in 10 years. BUT, they will also pay you 5% interest every year on that money.

 

This is something Arsenal did to help pay for the stadium (since they couldn't actually afford it) - but also part of why their prices are high and they need to make sure they can afford to pay it back in the future!)

 

The same principle applies as with a shareholding though.... if the business isn't performing well now, why should it after you've lent money to it... unless you believe that money will be invested wisely and turn the club around. You could spend it on players and aim for CL but that's a heck of a gamble, or you can invest it in ground improvements / new ground (arguably the more stable investment). - however, with a shareholding, you have a stake in the club, and a say in what goes on... with bonds, you just lend them the money.

 

Would Everton fans go for bonds? (easy to say "yes" but you might be pissed when you've not earned much interest over 10 years and the club squandered the money)

[Louis]

It's not an investment though, is it? You know you're never likely to get your money back.

 

Would I invest in Everton? No.

 

Would I be interested in owning a share of a company owning shares in Everton? That depends.

[FanchesterCity]

im not city fan, i like GP, id love it to be redeveloped.

 

but tonight when i watch city line up against munich in the champions league with silva and aguero in the city side, i for one will be very jealous.

 

enjoy it mate.

 

Cheers! nice gesture.

 

It's all new to us... very exciting, but a real lesson too. These teams really ARE steeped in European history and know how to do well.

Like Everton on Saturday (I think) - we'd take a draw.

I expect 2-0 to Munich but miracles happen!

[FanchesterCity]

It's not an investment though, is it? You know you're never likely to get your money back.

 

Would I invest in Everton? No.

 

Would I be interested in owning a share of a company owning shares in Everton? That depends.

 

I think with a bond it's a proper guarantee - not a gamble... the only 'variable' is what Everton would do with the money and if it would move the club forward.

It's safer than shares - since with shares, if the worst came to the worst, you'd be left with nothing.

 

However, if Everton went on to do a United and dominate for 20 years, you'd just get was promised in the original bond, with a shareholding, you COULD be well and truly in the money ;-)

 

Share = high risk, but you become part of Everton (good and bad!). You could make some money, or lose it all.

Bond = low risk, you help Everton out and get your money back + interest, but no say in the club (like now!)

 

I 'think' (but not certain) that they can issue the bonds on a specific premise - 'to pay off the debt' or 'build a new stadium' or just say "for whatever purpose we want!" <--- don't do it!

[storm]

I like the sound of the investing if it was utilised for a new stadium, which would in turn generate the income we need to really compete.

 

however if its just shares for i dunno, 30% of the club itself is a different matter. say if only 50million was generated.. great it pay's off the debt, buys a small portion of the club but then what about end of the next season.. we'd have everyone on our backs (not literally) "where's the money for the next player?" ... so i'd then either have to cough up more cash, or have my shares diluted (i guess?).

 

I think i'd only be happy investing if a huge sum was generated (and my cash not released until the required amount was confirmed), which would pay for a new stadium. Which would in turn generate the transfer funds for future seasons without the need to dig into our own pockets so much season after season after season (which is what would probably happen without a new stadium generating additional revenue).

[FanchesterCity]

The other thing of course is that IF people decided 'ok' let's go down the new stadium route, it's all to easy to look at a stadium like the Emirates and say "that's where WE need to be at" (in terms of prestige and size etc) - but that's just out of the question for most clubs. You're more likely to looking at something LIKE what City have - nice enough but no great 'sheiks' (sic).

 

A super duper stunning ground is asking to much. (I think) - just a modern, larger capacity, better views ground is all you'll get.

 

 

If you decide to stay at Goodison... 'doing it up' and expanding it usually costs an arm and a leg - and often disproportionately expensive - a bit like keeping your old car going! it starts getting out of hand.

 

The way things are in the sport today - the current fan base is NOT enough. You can't keep expecting the 40,000 regulars to keep paying for everything - they can't afford it, and it's simply not right. So you have get your revenue from other sources.

 

You're getting more or less the same 'standard' TV money as most other clubs, but mega bucks stuff is coming from CL. It's a BIG ask to get into CL, especially year in year out.

 

You can attract more fans - either with some tweaking of the ticket prices (e.g. 10% less cost to get 15% more fans) - but I suspect the prices are finely tuned already

 

You can attract more fans with 'better' performances and sexier football

 

You can attract more media / sponsorship AND fans with marquee signings - which is risky. It can work, but it can go horribly wrong too.

 

You can give up all reasonably hope of becoming a top side, and settle for mid table stalwarts - reducing your costs etc - but that might see gates down too.

 

You can invest in a new stadium which is less risky than a bunch of marquee signings, and doesn't depreciate as quickly either, and start 'afresh'. The new stadium generally attracts more fans than loses, brings in more sponsorship (because MOST sponsors want to be associated with success (perceived), newness, good facilities, families etc) - more corporate boxes (not a fan of them, BUT needs must - if you want their money!)

 

There MUST be lots of latent Everton support up and down the country (let alone Merseyside). All those new kids growing up now are making choices about who to support... it's been United for years, and a fair few for Chelsea - City are grabbing a few now, and Everton probably need to be doing the same. Call them 'plastics', call them 'fashion followers' etc etc but they ARE the future of clubs. Some will always follow Everton - of course they will, cos their dad supports them, or because their mate supports Liverpool, and they want to be different etc... but most kids are being marketed at and 'captured' by the big clubs. If you don't join 'em - You'll dwindle. And NO club is too big for that to happen to.

 

That's what I reckon anyway!

 

The Kings Dock could have been spectacular location - but it's gone now - but I'm sure other chances will come.

If / when you get a new stadium, I am certain it'll attract new interest, new investors, new fans and new players. It's just a shame your council 'seems' to favour Liverpool (or Liverpool are a bit sharper than you guys on the commercial front? - no offence!)

[MikeO]

The other thing of course is that IF people decided 'ok' let's go down the new stadium route, it's all to easy to look at a stadium like the Emirates and say "that's where WE need to be at" (in terms of prestige and size etc) - but that's just out of the question for most clubs.

Had a long conversation with some Arsenal season ticket holders last month (airport delay) and they hate the Emirates....it's a common feeling apparently, dreadful atmosphere; and didn't a couple of players who moved on recently say something similar.

[Lowensda]

Had a long conversation with some Arsenal season ticket holders last month (airport delay) and they hate the Emirates....it's a common feeling apparently, dreadful atmosphere; and didn't a couple of players who moved on recently say something similar.

 

Personally, and this is only my opinion; If we were to magically find the right buyer who was looking to help fund and build a stadium, I really really don't want a generic concrete shelter with flashing lights like the Reebok and the sorts.

 

I'd much prefer a more traditional style new build, with modern mods and functionality. But has the characteristics of an older style. I'll try and find an example....

[FanchesterCity]

Good luck with THAT!!! :-)

 

I can't think of any that cut the mustard to be honest. Emirates is impressive - but only a visual spectacle (and even then it's not THAT amazing).

 

Even of the grounds that have been extended, United's a bit of a mess outside and I don't really think there's any 'vibe' of tradition about it. Craven Cottage is possibly the best for that.

 

St. James' Park always impresses me though - and that's fairly ugly - but I have a soft spot for Newcastle. If I had to pick an away ground that wasn't modern, it would be there.

 

City is pretty generic, reasonably nice touch on the 'winding stairs' outside, but that's about it.

Stadium of Light isn't bad - but more of the same

Bolton - tricky, you either love it or hate it - it's pretty modern looking / slightly futuristic.

Anfield - well, humm have to be careful how I phrase this. It DOES have some amazing history but - it's a real anticlimax

 

Stadiums are stadiums by and large - it's very hard to make a load of cheap concrete and plastic seats that impressive!

 

I've been lucky enough to go to the Benabeu and Camp Nou (but never to a game) and I have to say both were a bit of a dump outside, but inside - breaktaking - got chills just imagining what it's like at a derby.

 

Oh and driven past the Allianz Arena - Munich. That's (from places I've been) the most 'distinctive'.

 

 

Let me know if you think of a modern (uk) ground with much character! - I'm racking my brains and can't think of one.

[MikeO]

Anfield - well, humm have to be careful how I phrase this. It DOES have some amazing history but - it's a real anticlimax

Of course it has an amazing history....up until 1892 anyway.

[FanchesterCity]

At Arsenal, the moved from a ground quite like Goodison... possibly (no shouting) a bit classier... that had a really nice 'feel' to it - like a well preserved old ground. To a spanking stunning stadium.

 

The fans complained a LOT about the lack of character, and ended up getting Arsenal to add some stuff to the ground - like the Arsenal logo in the seats (I think), and far more extras around the ground as 'heritage'. Oh,,,, and the CLOCK!... the 'clock end' to remind 'em of Highbury.

 

I'm afraid that's just part of the price you pay I think. You just can't take the character with you - just a few token items and that's your lot.

 

Perhaps that's just the issue - you will NEVER replace Goodison, and the fatal mistake is hoping to. When you move to a new stadium, it's like remarrying - you just can't ask the missus to be as dirty as the last one ;-)

 

If you could build a new ground on the same site - that's the only way I think you can get a great compromise and still feel 'it's the same pitch' but that's totally not viable without compulsory purchase orders on the housing and school etc etc and would still cost more! And you've have the council moaning about traffic. They can't do much about you already being there, but they CAN put obstacles in your way if you build a new structure - although in my opinion, it would benefit the area.

[FanchesterCity]

Of course it has an amazing history....up until 1892 anyway.

 

erm... don't forget Billy Graham preached there once too! - credit where credit is due!

[FairWooney]

The new Spurs stadium design looks pretty decent, certainly inside anyway where the design is supposed to really keep everyone close to the pitch.

 

Fanchester I've not made it to Nou Camp yet (hopefully next year) but agree about Bernabau, really feels like your walking out into an ancient colusseum when you walk out into the stands. Amazing views despite the heights and the closeness to the ground for all 90,000+ fans holding all that astounding atmosphere is in phenomenal.

[marcopaulo]

At Arsenal, the moved from a ground quite like Goodison... possibly (no shouting) a bit classier... that had a really nice 'feel' to it - like a well preserved old ground. To a spanking stunning stadium.

 

The fans complained a LOT about the lack of character, and ended up getting Arsenal to add some stuff to the ground - like the Arsenal logo in the seats (I think), and far more extras around the ground as 'heritage'. Oh,,,, and the CLOCK!... the 'clock end' to remind 'em of Highbury.

 

I'm afraid that's just part of the price you pay I think. You just can't take the character with you - just a few token items and that's your lot.

 

Perhaps that's just the issue - you will NEVER replace Goodison, and the fatal mistake is hoping to. When you move to a new stadium, it's like remarrying - you just can't ask the missus to be as dirty as the last one ;-)

 

If you could build a new ground on the same site - that's the only way I think you can get a great compromise and still feel 'it's the same pitch' but that's totally not viable without compulsory purchase orders on the housing and school etc etc and would still cost more! And you've have the council moaning about traffic. They can't do much about you already being there, but they CAN put obstacles in your way if you build a new structure - although in my opinion, it would benefit the area.

 

don't marry her then..she ain't gonna get any dirtier after marriage so if she isn't happy with a plastic bag on the head she never will be..move on(off topic i know i just wanted to say...)

[StevO]

I agree you can't take the character with you. But if a stadium is rebuilt, say a new stand every couple of years a lot of it could stay as the match day routine can be continued, meet in similar places have the same pint in the same pub, sit in the same sort of area. I know after all four sides it is different, but not as different as moving completely.

[pete0]

B'burn plans http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/17610789

Seems a little unrealistic that there's enough B'burn fans for this. It's a good idea though, United were successful with it. Be surprised if we don't see an Everton scheme in the near future.