foobiezw Posted February 2, 2013 Report Share Posted February 2, 2013 Partly ranting after the villa game so bear with me here. I think it's evident from the last few games the Heitinga isn't up to his lofty standards of the last few seasons. For most of the season, and in particular for the last few games, he's been guilty of some absolutely atrocious defending (and thats not even mentioning this evening). Question is, what's caused this ridiculous drop in form? Completely surprised he hasn't been benched a la Jelavic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete0 Posted February 2, 2013 Report Share Posted February 2, 2013 Rewatch the goals, he's not completely to blame. We've barely kept a clean sheet without him in the team, he's not the root of the problem. But hey ho, whatever scapes your goat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted February 2, 2013 Report Share Posted February 2, 2013 not sure how much he can be blamed today, he was asked to mark one of the biggest and strongest strikers in the EPL, who also has much more pace than him (not that that is hard). Why Moyes told him to mark Beneteke is a mystery pete0 and SimonButtle 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foobiezw Posted February 2, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 2, 2013 not sure how much he can be blamed today, he was asked to mark one of the biggest and strongest strikers in the EPL, who also has much more pace than him (not that that is hard). Why Moyes told him to mark Beneteke is a mystery I'll give you that one. Would've though Distin was the man to take on Beneteke. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted February 2, 2013 Report Share Posted February 2, 2013 I'll give you that one. Would've though Distin was the man to take on Beneteke. I know! Not tryin to say Johnny has been unlucky in recent weeks, hes been crap, but he really had no chance today. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foobiezw Posted February 2, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 2, 2013 Any thoughts on the cause of his downturn though? I've always kinda seen Heitinga as a ball playing centreback and would fit the expansive attacking passing game Everton has been trying to do (kinda like Vermaelen). Instead, these days I shit bricks every time the ball goes anywhere near him :S Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duncanmckenzieismagic Posted February 2, 2013 Report Share Posted February 2, 2013 Got to look at Moysie for that today , johnny has been shite all season and it was obvious Benteke was going to have a field day with him Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve_E Posted February 2, 2013 Report Share Posted February 2, 2013 Heitinga is the right central defender, Distin the left one. If Benteke plays in Heitinga's zone, then Heitinga's the one to mark him. You can't ask Distin to follow him all over the pitch! Rival strikers are targetting him (Carlton Cole kept playing in Heitinga's zone as well for example) and he keeps on giving them reason to do so. Too weak, too small, too slow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete0 Posted February 2, 2013 Report Share Posted February 2, 2013 Heitinga is the right central defender, Distin the left one. If Benteke plays in Heitinga's zone, then Heitinga's the one to mark him. You can't ask Distin to follow him all over the pitch! Rival strikers are targetting him (Carlton Cole kept playing in Heitinga's zone as well for example) and he keeps on giving them reason to do so. Too weak, too small, too slow. Man marking and have the centre-halfs switch sides. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve_E Posted February 2, 2013 Report Share Posted February 2, 2013 Man marking and have the centre-halfs switch sides. No one ever does that and with good reason. Your centre backs would need superhuman understanding to pull it off without getting in each other's way, keeping their line and leaving enormous gaps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete0 Posted February 2, 2013 Report Share Posted February 2, 2013 No one ever does that and with good reason. Your centre backs would need superhuman understanding to pull it off without getting in each other's way, keeping their line and leaving enormous gaps. Against an attacking side or 442 formation, but Villa only left the one man up top. It would have been easy to leave a man on him as there was no one else to worry about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zoo Posted February 2, 2013 Report Share Posted February 2, 2013 I think Heitinga had a decent game, he got out-paced for the first goal but that's probably because he shouldn't have been marking Benteke in the first place (Distin should). He's still a top player and I think people are looking for things to moan about because of his mistake against West Brom mid-week. pete0 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duncanmckenzieismagic Posted February 2, 2013 Report Share Posted February 2, 2013 I think Heitinga had a decent game, he got out-paced for the first goal but that's probably because he shouldn't have been marking Benteke in the first place (Distin should). He's still a top player and I think people are looking for things to moan about because of his mistake against West Brom mid-week. Its not just West Brom though, everytime he has started this season he has been disastarous. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Posted February 2, 2013 Report Share Posted February 2, 2013 (edited) Ive never been a lover of Heitinga, i dont think he had an awful lot to his game tbh but what he did have he has lost. As already been mentioned and i would agree that Moyes has to be looked at for the selection, Jags is a much better defender so it would have been simple to move him over and play Neville full back. Would rather have had Duffy, Edited February 2, 2013 by Bill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zoo Posted February 2, 2013 Report Share Posted February 2, 2013 Would rather have had Duffy, I don't understand why everyone loves Duffy so much. He's nowhere near as good as Heitinga, Distin, Baines or Jagielka so I don't see why everyone makes a song and dance about him. He's a decent defender but there is no way I'd play him ahead of the ones we've already got. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duncanmckenzieismagic Posted February 2, 2013 Report Share Posted February 2, 2013 (edited) Ive never been a lover of Heitinga, i dont think he had an awful lot to his game tbh but what he did have he has lost. As already been mentioned and i would agree that Moyes has to be looked at for the selection, Jags is a much better defender so it would have been simple to move him over and play Neville full back. Would rather have had Duffy, This @Johnheitinga: Played worst game ever in the shirt of #Everton. Let teammates and fans down but they never let me down. Will work hard to come back strong At least he knows it and I hope he does get back to the player he was last season Edited February 2, 2013 by duncanmckenzieismagic Bailey and Peter H 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marcus jones Posted February 2, 2013 Report Share Posted February 2, 2013 I think he has lost some of the nastiness in him this season, by which I mean he can impose his will on the attacker and unsettle him. Maybe with his dip in form players will target him more. Benteke should have been smashed today (not literally), I don't think there is anything wrong with roughing up an opponent, like leaving a foot in etc......... letting him know who's boss that's all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zoo Posted February 2, 2013 Report Share Posted February 2, 2013 What I like about Heitinga is that he never runs away and hides. If he fucks up he at least holds his hands up and apologises, that's why I'm such a big fan of his. Matt and Peter H 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duncanmckenzieismagic Posted February 2, 2013 Report Share Posted February 2, 2013 What I like about Heitinga is that he never runs away and hides. If he fucks up he at least holds his hands up and apologises, that's why I'm such a big fan of his. Lol I would be more of a fan if he didnt fuck up so much in the first place! Hopefully its just a bad run of form and he will come good agaon but he is woeful at the moment Steve_E 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve_E Posted February 2, 2013 Report Share Posted February 2, 2013 Against an attacking side or 442 formation, but Villa only left the one man up top. It would have been easy to leave a man on him as there was no one else to worry about. I'm sorry, I know you're a fan of his, but if we can't afford to have one of our centre backs defend the opponent's striker than what's the fuckin point in playing him? That's pretty much his only job. We can't expect Distin to completely do Heitinga's job for him every time we play someone who's stronger or faster than Heitinga. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete0 Posted February 2, 2013 Report Share Posted February 2, 2013 I'm sorry, I know you're a fan of his, but if we can't afford to have one of our centre backs defend the opponent's striker than what's the fuckin point in playing him? That's pretty much his only job. We can't expect Distin to completely do Heitinga's job for him every time we play someone who's stronger or faster than Heitinga. Play to a defenders strengths, why we have more than 2. Heitinga is one of the only defenders I know of that has kept Drogba in his pocket. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve_E Posted February 2, 2013 Report Share Posted February 2, 2013 Play to a defenders strengths, why we have more than 2. Heitinga is one of the only defenders I know of that has kept Drogba in his pocket. How are we supposed to play to Heitinga's strenghts? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete0 Posted February 2, 2013 Report Share Posted February 2, 2013 How are we supposed to play to Heitinga's strenghts? By not fecking up in the first place would be a good start. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve_E Posted February 2, 2013 Report Share Posted February 2, 2013 By not fecking up in the first place would be a good start. Keep him glued to the bench then? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete0 Posted February 2, 2013 Report Share Posted February 2, 2013 Keep him glued to the bench then? I'm on about the rest of the team. If there's is a calamity of errors before his you can't lay the blame solely on him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Callum Jones Posted February 2, 2013 Report Share Posted February 2, 2013 Johnny Heitinga, where do I start eh! It’s got to the stage now where I’ve just had enough, I can’t tolerate the lad. His blag hardman perception, his ridiculous hashtags in his tweets, and most importantly, the constant mistakes on the pitch costing us points. Today was the tip of the iceberg, you could put him at fault for all 3 Villa goals. The first one, for a centre half to just be breezed past like that, it’s terrible. I understand Christian Benteke is a strong boy, but to get past Heitinga that easily, it’s just poor defending. The second, he just stands there and watches Agbonglahor nod it in. No challenge, Heitinga is the closest person to him. He just watched Agbonglahor nod it in. The cross could have pressured better but again, terrible defending from Heitinga. Then the third, not completely Heitinga’s fault but could have put a better challenge in. When a ball is inside the 6 yard box the keeper should be coming and claiming it, not just standing there and watching the ball like Howard did. Tim Howard is another one I’m losing patience with but that’s another story. By the way, I’ve not seen any highlights that’s all from the view from my seat. It’s not just today though, there’s numerous times he’s cost us points this season. Wigan away, one of the worst performances I’ve seen, he was always as bad as today. He was at fault for their second goal, making us drop points. Norwich at home, last minute, just stands and watches Bassong nod it in. There again with that goal, there’s a shout that Howard should have come and claimed that one, but still there was no challenge from Heitinga. Then on Wednesday night against West Brom, he didn’t cost us any points but he certainly put us under pressure. Cruising at 2-0, a grim bit of defending on the line. 2-1, game on again and putting the side under pressure. The only decent thing he’s done this year, that winner at Bolton. When in all honesty, he shouldn’t have been on the pitch it was a negative substitution that got him on the field. I think what annoys me most about Heitinga is, when he plays our best centre back gets shoved to right back. Phil Jagielka isn’t a right back, he’s a very good centre half though. He showed his class today, when he went centre back after Heitinga went off. It’s not right that the best centre back in the club gets shoved to right back. The whole clapping the fans thing as well, see if I thought he meant it, it would be a good thing. When Tim Cahill used to clap the fans, he meant it. He never talked up moves to other clubs like Heitinga has in the past. How he won player of the year last year is absolutely baffling, the guy has had about 10 good games in the entire time he’s been at the club. He only won it because some of our fans our fooled by the whole “proud to be blue” image. He’s not proud to play for Everton, to him it’s just a job. I’m telling you all, don’t be fooled by his outrageous twitter hashtags. Now, booing him off today. I’m of the view, I pay my money for a season ticket at the start of the season, so if I want to boo someone I’ll boo them. He needed to know that we weren’t happy with his performance, booing him shows him that. The boos weren't just directed at him though they was directed at bringing Mirallas off. So, where do we go from here? If he is starting centre half at Old Trafford next week, they’ll stick 6 up us. Get Neville back in at right back and Jagielka back to centre half with Distin. If we’re going to get 4th spot, we have to start playing our best players in their best positions. Heitinga isn’t part of our best 11, and never has been. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mirallas Posted February 2, 2013 Report Share Posted February 2, 2013 What alternative does Everton really have? Both right backs can't play and at CB you got Jags and Distin. Baines is the undisputed left back and Oviedo isn't nearly good enough on right back. John Stones I suppose is brought in to replace Distin somewhere soon and then there's Duffy... it just looks like a sparse defense. EFC haven't got the money (here we go again) to invest in a worthy, proven defender such as Shawcross. But they do have Heitinga. We know Johnny has potential, although he's shit at this very moment. But at least they have him. Is this a good situation to get rid of him? I'd think it over a few times before doing so... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shukes Posted February 2, 2013 Report Share Posted February 2, 2013 guys seruously! I have watched the goals several times now and cannot understand how even the die hard Heits fans can try to defend him after that. First goal. no matter if its your best side, no matter how strong you are. you should not let a player just jog past you so easily....let alone when you are last man. Second goal. How many times do we have to say it, "white men cant jump" but you can at least attempt it. It was his man, he was standing right underneath the ball, and what did he do? yep you got it, he stayed on the ground. Third goal. Well worked and quality goal, you cant argue with those. and before anyone ways Distin held him onside....you can only comment if you know football. The far full back watches across the line, every other defender should watch the near line full back ( the one trying to close down the ball ) and should stay in line with him. He made a howler the other night and i think Moysey probably thought it best to give him an immediate run to try to boost his confidence. it backfired. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zoo Posted February 2, 2013 Report Share Posted February 2, 2013 It’s got to the stage now where I’ve just had enough, I can’t tolerate the lad. His blag hardman perception, his ridiculous hashtags in his tweets, and most importantly, the constant mistakes on the pitch costing us points. Yeah, lets sell him because he hashtags on Twitter - what a pathetic comment. The rest of that post was bollocks too, he was at fault for the first goal and thats being harsh because it was Moyes' fault for making him mark Benteke when it should have been Jagielka (as I and others have said in different threads). Heitinga is a top-class defender and always has been. Heitinga seems to be the new Naismith, everyone jumping on the 'hate bandwagon' because of one mistake. pete0 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shukes Posted February 2, 2013 Report Share Posted February 2, 2013 i just dont know what to say! One mistake? this is a professional footballer that he himself knows what s happened in just the last two matches, let alone the season. why cant the fans see it? im lost here! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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