JoeQuince

Sounds like he's fighting tufan nail to come to Everton...

Sounds like he's fighting tufan nail to come to Everton...

Sounds like he's fighting tufan nail to come to Everton...

Sounds like he's fighting tufan nail to come to Everton...

We know nothing of the particulars of who offered what. Nor do we know what's in Witsel's head/heart. He's a professional making a career decision. We can't rush to judgment because of the rumblings of Twitter/the press (who now often act on rumours that originate on Twitter).

My wife is pretty much always working. On top of that, she's a funeral director. So, either she's engaging in some unspeakable acts with the sadly deceased StevO, or you're winding me up!
 
Also, I'm drunk. My favorite neighborhood bar is a Pokestop.

Hyperbole alert! Hyperbole alert!

Are you the Nigerian prince who fleeced my grandmother???

Are you the Nigerian prince who fleeced my grandmother???

"Start the 48-hour countdown clock! And, stay at the ready to reset it on my command!"

I think we will have this handled within... Oh, I don't know.... The next 48 hours?

I think we will have this handled within... Oh, I don't know.... The next 48 hours?

We were just talking about how rumours are almost never accurate, especially when it comes to specifics, and how we shouldn't get bent out of shape over them. You're responding to a rumour about a rumour and letting it feed into some larger narrative about how the club can't get anything done, yet we know no hard facts about anything surrounding the club's rumoured pursuit of Witsel. Try to just let the story unfold and see if anything happens. There's nothing to get excited or upset about just yet.
 
I understand frustrations about us not having done any business when we see all kinds of deals being made around us. But, we don't know anything factual about our targets. The club hasn't made any public statements about players. All we have are rumours, which are usually, for Everton, wide of the mark. And we historically haven't rushed into transfer dealings. Yet, something always tends to materialize. So, just take the rumours as rumours and nothing more. Wait for the business to be done. And, hopefully, the club makes good moves. We can assess whether or not they've made the right moves once the transfer window closes.

We were just talking about how rumours are almost never accurate, especially when it comes to specifics, and how we shouldn't get bent out of shape over them. You're responding to a rumour about a rumour and letting it feed into some larger narrative about how the club can't get anything done, yet we know no hard facts about anything surrounding the club's rumoured pursuit of Witsel. Try to just let the story unfold and see if anything happens. There's nothing to get excited or upset about just yet.
 
I understand frustrations about us not having done any business when we see all kinds of deals being made around us. But, we don't know anything factual about our targets. The club hasn't made any public statements about players. All we have are rumours, which are usually, for Everton, wide of the mark. And we historically haven't rushed into transfer dealings. Yet, something always tends to materialize. So, just take the rumours as rumours and nothing more. Wait for the business to be done. And, hopefully, the club makes good moves. We can assess whether or not they've made the right moves once the transfer window closes.

Believing it as fact is silly. Following the stories because they provide enjoyment and there's nothing else going on is fine. As long as you approach it with the idea that this is a possibility and not a certain truth, you'll be alright. Getting bent out of shape over rumors is crazy, whether those tumors are about players at the club or players potentially coming into the club.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the 1990s-2010s period more of an exception than it is the rule in our history? Weren't we one of the clubs that paid players and made record signings before the Premier League era? Didn't we have a reputation as a moneyed club? So, maybe the provincial notion about us really being a club of crafty penny pinchers who know how to punch above their weight on a shoestring budget has less depth than we think.  
There tends to be a correlation in this world between one's place and practices and an ideology that justifies, legitimates and rationalizes them as morally superior and just. Sure, maybe we've been convinced of our moral victories in a world gone crazy with cash, as at least we still haven't sold out. But, football is about winning and losing on the pitch. Those who manage the club need to please the fans. If they can't win on the pitch, they need to do whatever they can ideologically to make the fans continue to care about and even believe in the club. This takes the form of media campaigns that tell us how special this club is and how it's unlike those other clubs who lack the integrity (or class, understanding, belief in certain principles, etc) that we have. Thus, many of us can point to loving Everton for some reason or another that only makes sense in a field of other clubs that are unlike Everton in X/Y/Z ways. "Those clubs are soulless. They have no heart. They're plastic. Etc." But, whether or not these statements are accurate, they say more about US than they do about THEM. What I think we are dealing with and will be dealing with in this transition (from "plucky little Everton" to being a club with major expectations and money that allows us to compete in the contemporary game) is a change in culture and mindset and coming closer to what we've all trained ourselves to hate and made the butt of all of our inside jokes for years.
 
The soul of the club, or of any club (if there is one), has never been the players (at least not since this became a game that you didn't have to work a side job to survive in). Their job is to go out and compete as professionals and bring home a win (or a performance worthy of winning). The soul is in the people who give their days, weeks, months and years to caring about the club and its fortunes as if their own personal happiness depended upon it. The soul is in the people who go to the games (if they are so lucky), wake up early or go to bed late to watch from afar, participate in a community of other supporters, and who support the club through thick and thin as if they have a familial connection to it.
 
Sure, money has changed the nature of how clubs and players operate. But, it's really always been about the fans and the community. And, this is something that (for all their failings) I think Everton have recognized and done a solid job with. As long as the club remembers that it is ultimately about delivering something the fans can be proud of, then it will still have its "soul."
 
That said, I'm not convinced Witsel is worth what we are apparently going to pay for his services. Though, I admittedly know very little of him as a player beyond his work history and appearances in international matches, where he's looked decent but not world class.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the 1990s-2010s period more of an exception than it is the rule in our history? Weren't we one of the clubs that paid players and made record signings before the Premier League era? Didn't we have a reputation as a moneyed club? So, maybe the provincial notion about us really being a club of crafty penny pinchers who know how to punch above their weight on a shoestring budget has less depth than we think.  
There tends to be a correlation in this world between one's place and practices and an ideology that justifies, legitimates and rationalizes them as morally superior and just. Sure, maybe we've been convinced of our moral victories in a world gone crazy with cash, as at least we still haven't sold out. But, football is about winning and losing on the pitch. Those who manage the club need to please the fans. If they can't win on the pitch, they need to do whatever they can ideologically to make the fans continue to care about and even believe in the club. This takes the form of media campaigns that tell us how special this club is and how it's unlike those other clubs who lack the integrity (or class, understanding, belief in certain principles, etc) that we have. Thus, many of us can point to loving Everton for some reason or another that only makes sense in a field of other clubs that are unlike Everton in X/Y/Z ways. "Those clubs are soulless. They have no heart. They're plastic. Etc." But, whether or not these statements are accurate, they say more about US than they do about THEM. What I think we are dealing with and will be dealing with in this transition (from "plucky little Everton" to being a club with major expectations and money that allows us to compete in the contemporary game) is a change in culture and mindset and coming closer to what we've all trained ourselves to hate and made the butt of all of our inside jokes for years.
 
The soul of the club, or of any club (if there is one), has never been the players (at least not since this became a game that you didn't have to work a side job to survive in). Their job is to go out and compete as professionals and bring home a win (or a performance worthy of winning). The soul is in the people who give their days, weeks, months and years to caring about the club and its fortunes as if their own personal happiness depended upon it. The soul is in the people who go to the games (if they are so lucky), wake up early or go to bed late to watch from afar, participate in a community of other supporters, and who support the club through thick and thin as if they have a familial connection to it.
 
Sure, money has changed the nature of how clubs and players operate. But, it's really always been about the fans and the community. And, this is something that (for all their failings) I think Everton have recognized and done a solid job with. As long as the club remembers that it is ultimately about delivering something the fans can be proud of, then it will still have its "soul."
 
That said, I'm not convinced Witsel is worth what we are apparently going to pay for his services. Though, I admittedly know very little of him as a player beyond his work history and appearances in international matches, where he's looked decent but not world class.

I came along to Everton in the '00s, when ESPN started showing PL matches in the US. So, this is also all I've ever known. I feel the exact same way as you. It's all very exciting and highly upsetting at the same time, witnessing the changes that the club is undergoing and considering what this means for our week-in-week-out support (and our identity as Evertonians). But, I think it's important that we try to understand why this is so upsetting within a broader context. Then we can cope with it positively and move forward rather than get angry and reactionary.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the 1990s-2010s period more of an exception than it is the rule in our history? Weren't we one of the clubs that paid players and made record signings before the Premier League era? Didn't we have a reputation as a moneyed club? So, maybe the provincial notion about us really being a club of crafty penny pinchers who know how to punch above their weight on a shoestring budget has less depth than we think.  
There tends to be a correlation in this world between one's place and practices and an ideology that justifies, legitimates and rationalizes them as morally superior and just. Sure, maybe we've been convinced of our moral victories in a world gone crazy with cash, as at least we still haven't sold out. But, football is about winning and losing on the pitch. Those who manage the club need to please the fans. If they can't win on the pitch, they need to do whatever they can ideologically to make the fans continue to care about and even believe in the club. This takes the form of media campaigns that tell us how special this club is and how it's unlike those other clubs who lack the integrity (or class, understanding, belief in certain principles, etc) that we have. Thus, many of us can point to loving Everton for some reason or another that only makes sense in a field of other clubs that are unlike Everton in X/Y/Z ways. "Those clubs are soulless. They have no heart. They're plastic. Etc." But, whether or not these statements are accurate, they say more about US than they do about THEM. What I think we are dealing with and will be dealing with in this transition (from "plucky little Everton" to being a club with major expectations and money that allows us to compete in the contemporary game) is a change in culture and mindset and coming closer to what we've all trained ourselves to hate and made the butt of all of our inside jokes for years.
 
The soul of the club, or of any club (if there is one), has never been the players (at least not since this became a game that you didn't have to work a side job to survive in). Their job is to go out and compete as professionals and bring home a win (or a performance worthy of winning). The soul is in the people who give their days, weeks, months and years to caring about the club and its fortunes as if their own personal happiness depended upon it. The soul is in the people who go to the games (if they are so lucky), wake up early or go to bed late to watch from afar, participate in a community of other supporters, and who support the club through thick and thin as if they have a familial connection to it.
 
Sure, money has changed the nature of how clubs and players operate. But, it's really always been about the fans and the community. And, this is something that (for all their failings) I think Everton have recognized and done a solid job with. As long as the club remembers that it is ultimately about delivering something the fans can be proud of, then it will still have its "soul."
 
That said, I'm not convinced Witsel is worth what we are apparently going to pay for his services. Though, I admittedly know very little of him as a player beyond his work history and appearances in international matches, where he's looked decent but not world class.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the 1990s-2010s period more of an exception than it is the rule in our history? Weren't we one of the clubs that paid players and made record signings before the Premier League era? Didn't we have a reputation as a moneyed club? So, maybe the provincial notion about us really being a club of crafty penny pinchers who know how to punch above their weight on a shoestring budget has less depth than we think.  
There tends to be a correlation in this world between one's place and practices and an ideology that justifies, legitimates and rationalizes them as morally superior and just. Sure, maybe we've been convinced of our moral victories in a world gone crazy with cash, as at least we still haven't sold out. But, football is about winning and losing on the pitch. Those who manage the club need to please the fans. If they can't win on the pitch, they need to do whatever they can ideologically to make the fans continue to care about and even believe in the club. This takes the form of media campaigns that tell us how special this club is and how it's unlike those other clubs who lack the integrity (or class, understanding, belief in certain principles, etc) that we have. Thus, many of us can point to loving Everton for some reason or another that only makes sense in a field of other clubs that are unlike Everton in X/Y/Z ways. "Those clubs are soulless. They have no heart. They're plastic. Etc." But, whether or not these statements are accurate, they say more about US than they do about THEM. What I think we are dealing with and will be dealing with in this transition (from "plucky little Everton" to being a club with major expectations and money that allows us to compete in the contemporary game) is a change in culture and mindset and coming closer to what we've all trained ourselves to hate and made the butt of all of our inside jokes for years.
 
The soul of the club, or of any club (if there is one), has never been the players (at least not since this became a game that you didn't have to work a side job to survive in). Their job is to go out and compete as professionals and bring home a win (or a performance worthy of winning). The soul is in the people who give their days, weeks, months and years to caring about the club and its fortunes as if their own personal happiness depended upon it. The soul is in the people who go to the games (if they are so lucky), wake up early or go to bed late to watch from afar, participate in a community of other supporters, and who support the club through thick and thin as if they have a familial connection to it.
 
Sure, money has changed the nature of how clubs and players operate. But, it's really always been about the fans and the community. And, this is something that (for all their failings) I think Everton have recognized and done a solid job with. As long as the club remembers that it is ultimately about delivering something the fans can be proud of, then it will still have its "soul."
 
That said, I'm not convinced Witsel is worth what we are apparently going to pay for his services. Though, I admittedly know very little of him as a player beyond his work history and appearances in international matches, where he's looked decent but not world class.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the 1990s-2010s period more of an exception than it is the rule in our history? Weren't we one of the clubs that paid players and made record signings before the Premier League era? Didn't we have a reputation as a moneyed club? So, maybe the provincial notion about us really being a club of crafty penny pinchers who know how to punch above their weight on a shoestring budget has less depth than we think.  
There tends to be a correlation in this world between one's place and practices and an ideology that justifies, legitimates and rationalizes them as morally superior and just. Sure, maybe we've been convinced of our moral victories in a world gone crazy with cash, as at least we still haven't sold out. But, football is about winning and losing on the pitch. Those who manage the club need to please the fans. If they can't win on the pitch, they need to do whatever they can ideologically to make the fans continue to care about and even believe in the club. This takes the form of media campaigns that tell us how special this club is and how it's unlike those other clubs who lack the integrity (or class, understanding, belief in certain principles, etc) that we have. Thus, many of us can point to loving Everton for some reason or another that only makes sense in a field of other clubs that are unlike Everton in X/Y/Z ways. "Those clubs are soulless. They have no heart. They're plastic. Etc." But, whether or not these statements are accurate, they say more about US than they do about THEM. What I think we are dealing with and will be dealing with in this transition (from "plucky little Everton" to being a club with major expectations and money that allows us to compete in the contemporary game) is a change in culture and mindset and coming closer to what we've all trained ourselves to hate and made the butt of all of our inside jokes for years.
 
The soul of the club, or of any club (if there is one), has never been the players (at least not since this became a game that you didn't have to work a side job to survive in). Their job is to go out and compete as professionals and bring home a win (or a performance worthy of winning). The soul is in the people who give their days, weeks, months and years to caring about the club and its fortunes as if their own personal happiness depended upon it. The soul is in the people who go to the games (if they are so lucky), wake up early or go to bed late to watch from afar, participate in a community of other supporters, and who support the club through thick and thin as if they have a familial connection to it.
 
Sure, money has changed the nature of how clubs and players operate. But, it's really always been about the fans and the community. And, this is something that (for all their failings) I think Everton have recognized and done a solid job with. As long as the club remembers that it is ultimately about delivering something the fans can be proud of, then it will still have its "soul."
 
That said, I'm not convinced Witsel is worth what we are apparently going to pay for his services. Though, I admittedly know very little of him as a player beyond his work history and appearances in international matches, where he's looked decent but not world class.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the 1990s-2010s period more of an exception than it is the rule in our history? Weren't we one of the clubs that paid players and made record signings before the Premier League era? Didn't we have a reputation as a moneyed club? So, maybe the provincial notion about us really being a club of crafty penny pinchers who know how to punch above their weight on a shoestring budget has less depth than we think.  
There tends to be a correlation in this world between one's place and practices and an ideology that justifies, legitimates and rationalizes them as morally superior and just. Sure, maybe we've been convinced of our moral victories in a world gone crazy with cash, as at least we still haven't sold out. But, football is about winning and losing on the pitch. Those who manage the club need to please the fans. If they can't win on the pitch, they need to do whatever they can ideologically to make the fans continue to care about and even believe in the club. This takes the form of media campaigns that tell us how special this club is and how it's unlike those other clubs who lack the integrity (or class, understanding, belief in certain principles, etc) that we have. Thus, many of us can point to loving Everton for some reason or another that only makes sense in a field of other clubs that are unlike Everton in X/Y/Z ways. "Those clubs are soulless. They have no heart. They're plastic. Etc." But, whether or not these statements are accurate, they say more about US than they do about THEM. What I think we are dealing with and will be dealing with in this transition (from "plucky little Everton" to being a club with major expectations and money that allows us to compete in the contemporary game) is a change in culture and mindset and coming closer to what we've all trained ourselves to hate and made the butt of all of our inside jokes for years.
 
The soul of the club, or of any club (if there is one), has never been the players (at least not since this became a game that you didn't have to work a side job to survive in). Their job is to go out and compete as professionals and bring home a win (or a performance worthy of winning). The soul is in the people who give their days, weeks, months and years to caring about the club and its fortunes as if their own personal happiness depended upon it. The soul is in the people who go to the games (if they are so lucky), wake up early or go to bed late to watch from afar, participate in a community of other supporters, and who support the club through thick and thin as if they have a familial connection to it.
 
Sure, money has changed the nature of how clubs and players operate. But, it's really always been about the fans and the community. And, this is something that (for all their failings) I think Everton have recognized and done a solid job with. As long as the club remembers that it is ultimately about delivering something the fans can be proud of, then it will still have its "soul."
 
That said, I'm not convinced Witsel is worth what we are apparently going to pay for his services. Though, I admittedly know very little of him as a player beyond his work history and appearances in international matches, where he's looked decent but not world class.

I'm cool with us signing him and all, but I don't want him anywhere near the ball when it comes time for a penalty kick.

I'm cool with us signing him and all, but I don't want him anywhere near the ball when it comes time for a penalty kick.

I'm not a religious man, but I'm praying you bring Truth.