SpartyBlue

3 minutes ago, Romey 1878 said:

 

Curious how the deal is structured. No reason to buy him in January over the summer if it’s the same price. 

3 minutes ago, Shukes said:

I guess he would be brought for the potential.

We can’t afford to buy top players, and if we had the money… can’t attract them as a club. So we need to be able to bring in players that have the potential to turn into top players.

What he said. We are not getting the finished product. The only way we are getting really high end talent at this point  is bringing it through the academy or taking a gamble before a true breakout.

24 minutes ago, London Blue said:

He is still developing his finishing, but he gets into the right areas, he makes very good runs, his ball control and passing are good. He is no good heading, but he is not a striker, as for defending I would say he tracks back well and tackles.

I think if you’re a winger you have to be good at crossing the ball and/or heading the ball if you’re not just banging in double digit goals. Gordon is doing none of those things at the moment and is also an inconsistent presser/defender. I think the desire is there but you only get so many games before we want to see some progress in those areas. Still time of course. 

25 minutes ago, Shukes said:

His biggest weakness is his tracking back. He tracks back for headlines sure.

But he does it in stages, he has a massive sprint off but in the same scenario ten minutes later, Literally stands there and watches. I think if he can improve this side of his game it automatically makes him ten percent a better player.

The thing I worry most about is that he’s just not physically up for it. He needs to keep improving his body. Towards the end of last season he wore down badly to the point he was played less. When asked to play striker he was pretty easily bullied out of the game. I think the desire is there but adding some muscle (and he should) would improve all aspects of his game. Richie wasn’t huge either but he’s strong enough to hold position and really make himself a handful to deal with.

20 minutes ago, Shukes said:

I would say around 25m 

He is a dangerous player and his finishing WILL improve.

Ability wise he is very much on par with Gray and McNeil. What he has over them is potential.

I’m about there as far as current value.

In regards to McNeil, important to remember he’s just 22. I think he has some attributes Gordon hasn’t shown and vice versa. 
 

4 minutes ago, London Blue said:

He will improve, the question is "How much?"

He willingness to run at players and his footballing brain is very advanced for a player his age, added to his ability to beat a player and technical ability mean his celling is high, maybe very high.

He has pace and decent technical ability. I’m not sure his footballing brain is as advanced as you suggest. His wastefulness often comes from making the wrong choices in the final moment. Given that he’s not particularly physical, doesn’t cross or defend that well, isn’t great in the air..he will have to really be clinical in the final 1/3 to be worth that price. 
 

Can he develop into that? Sure. But for every one who does there are 10 like  Gordon who never do. Consider that Richie is probably better than Gordon is now at every aspect of the game and he’s a 60m ish player. From a pure business standpoint I think it’s a no brainer deal for us. Of course, there are other factors.

9 minutes ago, London Blue said:

You have to factor in his potential, but what he is now £30 million, what he could become £60 - £70 million.

I think that shows you what a good deal it is. Chelsea is allegedly paying pretty close to the best case scenario price. He would need to develop quite a bit in many areas to be worth that sort of money.
 

Personally I think 30m is even a bit generous for what his game is right now. It’s always far more likely a player like Gordon never realizes his full potential. 

8 minutes ago, Shukes said:

I’m hoping we’re saying he is not for sale. Don’t get me wrong…. Come back with 70, then he is for sale!  
But as it stands I’m hoping we’re keeping him.

Out of curiosity what do you value Gordon at in a vacuum? Not potential, or factoring in that he’s English or that he came in through our academy. In terms of what he provides as a player right now, what do you believe he’s worth?

1 hour ago, Romey 1878 said:

Took his goal very well again tonight. 

Probably the best finisher we have at the moment.

32 minutes ago, Goodison Glory said:

Any number of reasons I guess.

But if we aren't going to target people who are in talks with better clubs the list is going to pretty short right now.

the reality is teams like Newcastle, West Ham etc are all better prospects than we are but yet we still compete for players. 
 

 

I would suggest Juventus is in a different class than those you mention on a couple of different levels

8 minutes ago, Goodison Glory said:

No Allan...even on the bench to come on and get some match fitness. Pleased to see some of the youngsters (providing we still get a result of course!)

Might mean he will play for Davies on the weekend. Or simply that if he played today he wouldn’t be available on the weekend due to not being fully fit.

6 minutes ago, Goodison Glory said:

Juventus have agreed a deal with Marseille to sign Arkadiusz Milik.

The deal is an initial loan costing £1.7m (€2m) plus a £6.7m (€8m) option to buy Poland striker.

Jesus...we should have been all over that for that price.

But why would he come here over Juventus?

2 minutes ago, dunlopp9987 said:

Christ I hope this doesn't come back to bite us. I understand he's been played out of position this season but he just doesn't look interested and I worry that his head's been turned. 

Plus that is....so much money to turn down.

It has to be that we aren’t sure we can bring in someone this window on such limited time. That or the deal is structured in a way where we wouldn’t have that much money available this window.
 

In a raw sense I don’t think Gordon is worth half of 60m right now. English, potential etc.. but for what he provides now..def not.

It’s actually quite a statement from the club given how much this would do to put our finances right.

1 hour ago, StevO said:

I wouldn’t take him back on loan. Don’t think it looks particularly good for us as a club if we did. 

From a business perspective it would be a very good move. Perception, not so much. Also, if we are bringing in a replacement I imagine we’d want to play them. 

39 minutes ago, Hafnia said:

Just wanna put it into perspective…. If we had £60m to spend and never had Gordon….. who would be happy if we spent £60m on AG instead of getting broja, Gallagher and another one or two? 

60m is an insane price for Gordon even if some add-ons won’t be met. It’s possible he will be worth that one day but I think the odds are against. You’ve gotta be banging in 10+ every year from the wing to be worth that and/or be a wizard crossing the ball.  We haven’t seen anything to this point to suggest he has that. It could develop but not many get to that level. 

2 hours ago, Romey 1878 said:

I repeat, they had fuck all lined up for Richarlison going with even longer to prepare. I don't have confidence they've got anything lined up this time either.

We were never getting a like for like replacement for Richarlison. In the same way we didn’t for Lukaku. The idea is you use the money to improve your team in a variety of other positions and overall you get better. Whether that happens remains to be seen but we shouldn’t be upset we didn’t sign a 60m winger as that wouldn’t have been best for the team even if it was possible.

2 hours ago, Shukes said:

Again… I know it’s probably just clips of Ajax second string, but this guy seems to have that low centre of balance and is strong. Must be technically good as you don’t often watch a highlights video with a player doing pirouette’s on four different clips.

My biggest worry is that he feels right, and someone might come in last second now we’ve found him.

Agreed. The agility is noticeable and Doesn’t have anything to do with the level he’s playing against.

3 hours ago, StevO said:

The level always matters. But hopefully he’s good enough. 
A lot of the clips doing the rounds are not for Ajax’s first team, but it’s clear he’s got a lot of potential. 

Not with isolated skills. For instance the confidence and technical ability in taking that volley off the bounce for his goal vs PSV  is impressive in any league. 

15 minutes ago, Goodison Glory said:

Wow! I just hope this does t fall apart. Let's not be Everton and have this drag on. Get it fully completed this weekend.

we aren't allowed nice things so it would t surprise me if one of the sky big 6 tried to swoop in at the last minute.

Man Utd have been sniffing around Ajax all summer surprised they haven't been offered him.

Good work by the team if we can get this one done. 

Given his injury and his lack of game time at higher levels he might be too far away from their lineup at the moment. He will want more minutes  and they will want to see more from him. Let’s be honest, if he progresses they might just be able to buy him in 2-3 years 

43 minutes ago, Aidan said:

Actually looks like a beast on YouTube. Can't help but be excited to see him play.

Definitely a few wow moments in there. Some of those the level doesn’t matter, just good skills. 

6 minutes ago, Romey 1878 said:

I know nothing about him but noticed someone saying he's constantly injured. How true is that?

Dunno on the injuries but he seems to have moved up to the first tier in the Netherlands during the season and had a lot of off the bench appearances. Not too surprising for a 21 year old making the jump. We aren’t in a position to get the finished article so this is what it looks like if we want to try to find a real star. Gambling on a young talent before they really break out.

22 minutes ago, Matt said:

1 will be staying up I'm sure, then everything else will be higher finish and appearances I'd imagine. So if they go down, £25m plus say £5m for apps isn't that ridiculous in this day and age. 

Yea. Gordon’s would probably be based around appearances and he might not get that many in the league this year if he made the move.

2 minutes ago, Hafnia said:

Forest really are spinning the wheel aren’t they? 

If they end up going down it’s going to be quite the mess there. Gambling that they can integrate everyone enough for it it work.

11 minutes ago, Matt said:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/62594961

£25m plus £17m add ons. Not quite as ridiculous as it seems. 

Makes me wonder if Chelsea's bid is structured that way which is why we dismissed it so quickly. 

Depends on the add-ons. Would make sense for Chelsea with a player as unproven as Gordon. Obviously we would prefer more guaranteed.

28 minutes ago, Matt said:

Only watched first season of that. Was ok but I'm a massive fan of Gaimans work especially American Gods, so I was always going to be critical. For Good Omens, once I saw who was playing Crowley and Aziraphale I just got too excited, and they were brilliant. 

I enjoyed American Gods though I didn’t finish it so maybe that tells you something. I’d love them to give the Sandman/Good Omens treatment to Neverwhere which was his first work that I read. I know that one had an odd history as it was a poorly done series before it was a book.