SpartyBlue

11 hours ago, StevO said:

Love this level of absurdity as much as I find it comforting.  

What do you find absurd? Brighton don’t think he’s good enough to be getting 30+ games for them as their primary striker as he has for the last 3 seasons. Their manager has suggested as much. He won’t be getting that game time here either in normal circumstances. 

12 minutes ago, c1982 said:

Yep and none of that has anything to do with work-rate which is the only point I picked up on in the first place.

Yes it does. His work-rate was poor playing up top. His work-rate in games down the stretch last year suffered because he was physically worn down. I do think in general it’s a good quality of his, as we saw today, but that doesn’t change the reality that he’s been inconsistent there.

19 minutes ago, dunlopp9987 said:

Been quietly impressed with him so far. He hasn't stood out as a superstar by any means, but he also hasn't stood out period. Usually that wouldn't be cause for praise, but for a 20 year old fullback in his first season in the PL, he's looked solid. 

Excited to see him progress

He’s been caught out now and then but you’d expect that at his age and experience. Some good aggressive defending  and a willingness to get forward. Of Patterson and Myko I think Patterson has the higher ceiling.

3 minutes ago, c1982 said:

That’s what happens when you don’t have the depth in the squad to play players in their correct positions. Gordon is not, and will never be, a suitable striker in this system.

That’s why I mentioned his playing out of position…

I don’t think it’s really the system, he’s just not got the physicality or the skill set to play that position at this point. Richarlison could because he was a good hold up player, good in the air, and could hold his own physically. None of that is Gordon’s game yet.

Just now, Matt said:

It matters massively. Financially, morale, showing progress, attracting better players because they they see positive progress and not 2 successive relegation battles with fans on their backs. 

It matters a little bit but you’re overstating it I think. A player is going to come here because he believes in the project, his opportunity, money. I doubt it matters if we finish at 45 points or 50. Financially it isn’t a big impact moving a couple spots unless it’s into Europe. Of course I want us to do as well as possible but the main thing is to develop our young core and to stay up, hopefully with some room to spare. The risk this season is that with a lot of changes and youth coming into the team we get dragged into another relegation scrap. If we can get through this season I think we will be fine in that regard going forward. 

3 minutes ago, c1982 said:

I’m not talking about what position he’s been played - having watched him last season and the difficult begging to this; where all of a sudden he’s not just some local lad who’s made it and now a £60m wonderkid, the one thing that can not be questioned is the lad’s work rate.

The first couple games playing up top his work rate was not particularly good. He didn’t press well, hold it up well or contest aerials duels well. 
 

Towards the end of last year he was clearly wearing down. I don’t question his desire but I do question whether he can physically sustain the effort we saw today. 

8 minutes ago, Matt said:

No, it's a misunderstanding of what survival means. Last season was survival, that is not acceptable again. 10-14 is mid-table and shows significant progress to with and safety with 1 game left. 

Again, it’s just how you’re defining it. My point is that I don’t particularly care where we finish this year as long as we stay up since we are unlikely to challenge for anything. It’s about the longterm project and finishing 13th over 15th matters little. As long as we stay up we should be much better the following year. At that point I will want to see some real progress.

4 minutes ago, Matt said:

This season is about transition, not survival. Mid table is a reasonable finish, and a point away isn't to be be dismissed. 

That said, he does need a win soon because tides will change very quickly. 

I think this is a bit of semantics. We stay up, we progress the young players. Whether we finish 10th or 14th doesn’t matter a whole lot towards our eventual goals. 

20 minutes ago, Shukes said:

I don’t think he is trying to achieve anything other than pick up a few points.

He is trying to get through until Dom is back, Godfrey is back, Maupay is available, Onana is up to speed, another forward comes in. 
 

We’ve also got a few others on the table.  Get through this period while picking up a few points, then I’ll judge him when he has his team.

Doucoure as well. This season is just about survival and progressing the young players. At that point we should be in a much better spot to push on. No bad away points this season, that’s for sure.

3 minutes ago, c1982 said:

Really?!?! I really don’t understand this comment.

I’d say his work rate is his best quality and something he needs to learn how to ‘manage’ as he burns himself out due to being on full throttle from the off.

End product is my biggest criticism.

Certainly the first couple games he’s been poor up top. Has looked disinterested but maybe that’s just playing out of position. Was much more of a pest defensively today, still not great in the air or with his hold up play but did seemed to have more desire there as well. He’s gonna need to be able to physically show this same performance every game. Big test Tuesday, away again, with a short turnaround.

2 minutes ago, Shukes said:

Gordon. Showing why we’re happy to turn down 60m. May have not had everything come off for him today, but he lead by example.

My biggest criticism is his work rate, but I thought he stepped that up today.

If he did as well every match as he did today I would start to believe he could be worth that. Hopefully we see that desire if he stays. 

19 minutes ago, RPG said:

It was. The drive and energy on that run reminded me of a previous Everton Number 8 but I won't burden Onana by mentioning his name just yet.

He had a couple of those. Exciting to see. That was a subtle ball in to give Gray an opportunity. Great to have guys that can turn and run into that space. I dunno that we will get Kudus but he also looks excellent at that. There is a video asking if you should even press him.

2 minutes ago, RPG said:

He is certainly adapting well. In his debut the first thing he did when he received the ball was to try to let it run across his body to turn defence into attack. He lost possession and we conceded. Today, he did the same move but knew he had less time, protected the ball and the move worked. He has loads of energy and is a real box to box midfielder. Once he gets full match fitness and fully adapted to the Premier League we will have a real player on our hands. I would love to see Gueye tidying up behind him though.

He also did it once and gave up possession. It’ll just take time. Most of his first thoughts seemed to be to play it backwards and he wasn’t quite as available as you’d like in that role for me. As noted though, very early and overall he was solid given circumstances with a couple moments that stand out.

6 minutes ago, Bailey said:

As I have just said in the other thread, I thought that was a good game from him in the circumstances. You can see him growing into a box-to-box type role.

Yeah he has some moments for sure. Was it him that played that clever little ball that gave the chance Gray fumbled?

Very safe today, which is understandable. Just gonna take time to build league experience and confidence. The 2-3 times he decided to be positive you could see the potential. 

Easily Gordon. Perhaps the prospect of a big money move was motivating but in any case he was good today. Particularly liked the energy he showed defensively.

19 minutes ago, Bailey said:

That made me laugh... someone buy Rondon!? 

There has to be a Turkish team somewhere. Better than paying any wages at all to a player who won’t start even when we have no other options.

1 minute ago, Bailey said:

I might be in a minority but I thought McNeil offered more than Rondon in the Forest game so it doesn't surprise me. Plus I think Rondon can have more of an impact in a short burst, say 20-30 minutes if we need a goal.

Interesting to see how Onana gets on with his first league start in a game where the opposition press really well.

From what i’ve seen listed elsewhere positionally it’ll be Gordon up top but maybe that’s incorrect. I just think if Rondon isn’t starting in this circumstance then you might as well sell him for whatever we could get.

 Agree on Onana but I’m happy he will get to take his lumps. 

Just now, MikeO said:

I’m curious if the Maupay move makes Frank think Rondon’s head isn’t in it. Or perhaps he’s off, if possible. 

37 minutes ago, StevO said:

We are miles behind Brighton, sadly. Not even close. 

Worth noting that when they say they have outgrown him they are almost surely talking about as a primary striker. He isn’t being brought to Everton for that so it’s not really a reflection of where either team is.

15 minutes ago, Romey 1878 said:

 

This would be a shame. Hard for us to attract players of this talent level at the moment. Might have taken some time but I think this would be a coup. I suppose, at worst, we’d have a bit of a leg up if he’s available in future windows.

15 minutes ago, Shukes said:

Why are people saying he can’t finish? 
Is he known for having a low shot to goal ratio or something?

I wonder how he compares to Richarlison?

Honestly don’t watch him much, but when ever he plays against us…. He looks good. 
 

But then everyone looks good against us. Fucking Messi would look a top player against us.

Agree, Messi would probably look pretty good against us.

1 hour ago, Gwlad all over said:

Levy must be havin' a laff.

Doubtful given this means they will make less money on the deal.

14 minutes ago, chicagoblue said:

Oh I get that, and wholeheartedly approve. As long as that is the idea here then great. But we’re are desperate for first team goals and I don’t see this lad being anywhere near double figures out the blocks. 

Well he’s a midfielder. Shouldn’t expect double figure goals from any midfielder really. 
 

Like Onana he looks to have some tantalizing upside. I’ll be disappointed if we can’t get this one through.

4 minutes ago, London Blue said:

He is still developing, but the potential is there to see.

 

 

Short video :). For sure he has potential but for his position it’s always going to be end product, particularly if you don’t excel at other aspects of the game. 

He may develop into a very good, even a great player but he’d have to for us to turn down such a huge price. It also might take years for that to happen. Years I’m not sure we have. 

I’d be much more inclined to hold and see how he develops if we were a comfortably mid table or better side right now.