Bailey

They are, way way out of proportion. His touch is perfectly fine unchallenged (as you would hope from a Premier League footballer!) but its when he is coming short, back to goal with a defender behind him that its really poor. He has enough good touches to know that he has the technical ability to control a football, he just needs to use his strength and position his body better to make sure he is able to control the ball and hold off the player at the same time. He is never going to be the most technically gifted player in the squad, it will always be one of his weaker points, but it will improve over time especially when he improves mentally/tactically. That is the funniest thing I have read today... Almost spat my drink out. If anything I think under hype players a lot of the time! You only have to look at this thread. I do get what your saying with Barkley/Lukaku but at the same time I dont agree. Both are important and I wouldnt disagree if you said Lukaku was more important to our season that Barkley was but that was Barkley's first full season of top flight football and he will improve bundles for the experience and when he starts to drop deeper he will have a much greater influence on the team, like he did in some of the games this season. A lot of people on here seem to think that all Lukaku does is score goals and he is a far better all round player than he is given credit for a lot of the time. His link up play is vastly underrated ans so is his movement and tactical awareness. Its not as good as other players in the squad but that too will improve with age but I still do think his move is price dependant.

Yeh the Celtic job has got Moyes name all over it. Would be perfect for him to try and restore his reputation and actually get some trophies to his name as well as European experience and Celtic also wont be able to attract another manager with a higher profile.

I really disagree about Lescott. Whenever I have seen him play recently he has stood out like a sore thumb on the ball with his passing and his control. Whats worse is he panics on the ball if challenged (albeit so does Jags on occasions). I think Distin has adapted brilliantly this season and his passing his pretty impressive actually because he looks forward more than Jags who is probably the one that still leaves me a bit jumpy. Although I do agree that we should be fine for now, although we will have 2 players to replace in the coming seasons so if the right young player is available it wouldnt be the worst idea to bring him in. Yeh with 4 comps next season, we definitely need at least one main striker and maybe another support striker wouldnt hurt either. I think we should be ok at RB. We have Coleman as our main starter and Browning will probably learn his trade in that position. We also have 3 left backs and I am sure Bainesy would easily be able to adapt to that side if it comes to it.

I guess its more of a case of whether we can get anyone else to contribute that much but for less money.

I dont think Gibson is that good defensively either. He loses the players he is meant to be marking far too easily.

I dont think Arteta was ever good enough to get in the Spanish team. You would barely have heard of him had he played in Spain.

He will go wherever the money is though and I doubt very much that we will compete with some of the other clubs that are likely to get involved.

I have seen quality from them both and I have seen shite from them both and I wouldnt really rate one above the other based on last season. The Deulo from the Christmas period was better than anything I have seen from McGeady but the end of season Deulo was worse than McGeady.

Looking at the squad we seem to be more or less covered at the back other than 1 left sided CB. Personally I wouldnt touch Lescott because he just isnt comfortable on the ball and that is important to us. He will still be on high wages too and I think we should be looking more to the future rather than another stop gap as we have done that with Alcaraz. I think Browning is predominantly a CB and whilst he plays RB too, I think his future will be through the middle. Im hoping Barry will sign on again because he has been great this year and we could do with that experience at the club. He is worth the wages IMO and whilst he will need to be replaced in a couple of years too we really do need bodies in this area of the field. As far as starters go I think you can only rely on Mirallas, Barkley and McCarthy leaving one central berth and one wide position that need to be filled. Barry will at least be able to play the majority of next season if he stays but both Pienaar and Osman will more than likley have their playing hours reduced. Colback or Milner would be a great signing for the middle of the park next to McCarthy at a relatively modest fee and Cleverly would be good back up for the wide left or central attacking position. Im sure there are also many more better foreign options but I dont know them. I do think that any of those players would turn out to be a great addition. I'd also add Ki from Swansea too if he is allowed to leave. I like Pable Hernandez for the attacking role and he may not be as difficult to attract as he would have been last season. You would also have Ledson in the wings too who is another I think would compliment McCarthy. As far as more attacking players go I dont know where we go. Hopefully Gerry will come back, he was a little disappointing in the end last season but there was a lot of promise there too. If so that gives us several wide options and we should be ok. Up front is a different story. Im confident in Kone stepping up providing he is fully fit from his injury and Naismith does his job up there too. We do need a 'star' striker and someone who can truly lead the line week in week out and whilst I would have Lukaku back at the right price I dont think it will happen and I dont know of anyone who could do that job at a better price.

Yeh I would agree with that. Shown glimpses of potential but he is very inconsistent.

You show me any strikers goals highlights and they will mostly be running through on goal in some form or another. I dont disagree with the comments about him being better when the game is in front of him but Martinez isnt trying to change how Lukaku plays, he is trying to make him better at dealing with tight defences where there is not much space and where he will spend more time with his back to goal because no matter where he goes, if he wants to be at a top club he will have to learn how to deal with it.

I am just catching up with thread and I have dragged few a couple of old posts so ignore me if they have been answered elsewhere (I ,may have skipped a page here or there!) First of all this is shite. Yes Martinez prefers to dominate possession but you simply cant just play the ball for him to run on to in probably 50% of game you play in the league. Against the teams that sit deep there simply isnt that option. I think Rom played as a target man in possibly 2 games, one against West Brom and the other against Utd, other than that he wasnt used as an out ball (other than goal kicks) and it was the tactical set up of the other team which forced him to play with his back to goal and come short where he is certainly at his worst. Unless you force the opposition into a mistake or turn the ball over when they are on the counter you're not going to be able to bring him into the game like you want him too. We played to his strengths as much as the opposition allowed us to not just because Martinez wanted him to do this or that. You also wont find many top strikers across the world who dont initiate a move with their back to goal at some point because its that aspect of dragging a CB out of position that then creates space for him or a team mate to attack. I think he wants to be as good as he can. He may look a little laid back but he has the desire to win, just look at the goal he scored on debut. Not exactly the act of a man who just wants to pick up a cheque. Thats crap Haf. Anyone who compared him to Drogba is a fecking tool to start with. If you cant see that Lukaku has far more ability than Jones then you're in the wrong game! I dont think there will be an awful lot of difference in price between Bony and Lukaku. They paid £12mil only last season and he has scored 16 goals. Swansea will be desperate to keep him, he has time on his contract and Swansea are in a good position financially. You are looking between £20-25mil if you ask me and even at £17mil thats a lot of money for a guy with only one Prem season under his belt. I expect him to kick on again next year too, but its not a given. Its interesting you say less financial risk with Batshuayi because at £10mil and completely unproven at this level that is actually quite high risk. He might go on to be a great player and I cant comment because I havent seen enough of him but £18-20mil who has proven himself roughly as a 1 in 2 striker is less risk if you ask me. I do think though that the worth of Lukaku's signature is all about the price. He is an excellent young striker and he could lead the line for years to come and he will get the job done for 60-75% of the games we play and its likely that the better of opposition we face the better he will be (more space and likely to be able to go forward with the ball rather than back to goal. On the other hand its those 25-30% of games that decide whether you are top 4 or on the fringe just like those tricky Palace, Soton, Villa games and if we are paying £20mil I would like to be able to see a player who can adapt to all of those challenges. It would be ok if we were a Utd or Chelsea and we could afford to have 3 or 4 top class striker we could play horses for courses but we arent and £20mil is a shit load of money to us. We do have Kone/Naismith for those types of games mind you so we do have options but they arent in Lukaku's class. He would be worth £20mil to a lot of clubs but as much as I admire the guy, I dont think he is worth £20mil to us.

I just dont think he has the pace to fit into the Martinez way and be good enough to rely upon to challenge the top 4. Duffy actually has decent feet from what I remember so Im not sure that aspect of his play will be much of a problem.

I actually prefer it that we cant just go out and spend £20-30mil on players, pay them extortionate wages just so they can piss their pants when they dont get wished happy birthday! I just wish we had enough money to buy one or two £6-10mil players every summer without having to sell. I get greater enjoyment in finding the next big player rather than just buying him when he is in his prime.

He was frustrating in the 2nd half of the season because before his injury he started to really show the improvement we had hoped from him, but he is young and that happens. I think its more of a mental thing with him tbh because he has the ability and whilst he is one footed, its amazing how many times he can beat a man with the same trick on that right hand side! I was getting the feeling that before he got injured he was just starting to realise what it means to play for a club regularly who need 3 points week in week out. He was working hard, in attack and defence, and he was creating chances for himself and others. When he came back it was almost a bit like he had gone back to think he was the next Barca pretty boy and he didnt have to work as hard at the game, maybe going back home for treatment wasnt the best thing for him in the end. If he wants to be a real player then he has the ability to do it, but Im not sure he wants it enough just yet.

Yeh I thought Garbutt was very good going forward, albeit he had a poor 15 min spell in the second half before finishing well. He was far better playing behind Ince than he was with Redmond, probably as he had more space to play in and because Ince is the more intelligent footballer. Defensively he was a bit naive, got caught 1 vs 1 a couple of times but he did also make some good covering challenges as the LCB Moore was a bit all over the place positionally at times. Very promising display though, we have an embarrassment of riches at LB! Of the rest, Keane looked very solid all game. Calm, collected, good positional play and whilst he wasnt really pressured today he had to try and manage Moore a lot as well and I think he could have a big future. Ward-Prowse was surprisingly distinctly average, first time I have seen him and whilst he brings energy and a certain degree of technical ability he doesnt bring enough to the table IMO. Chalobah has a bit more about him but again I dont see him playing in a top 10 prem club week in week out based on that display. Lingaard was frustrating, found space but failed to deliver and Ings looked like a Championship striker. Ince impressed me though, started poorly but he has a touch of class about him and didnt rely on pace like Redmond. Their RB was shocking and when Ince played on that side for 20-30 mins we ran riot and whilst Redmond played well and scored 2 (the last was going wide and will probably go to Berinho) he didnt have the same effect on the team and it was more of an individual performance. Ince also worked hard defensively which I didnt expect.

Yeh he is a very solid player. Im not keen on him outwide because he just drops his head and whips a ball in but through the centre he looks up, can control the game and plays with intelligence.

I reckon that if he does come here then he will start the season in that wider role and then move more centrally as his confidence picks up. A lot of the time that inside left position ends up as more of a second striker in attack and I can see him doing his best work in the spaces that would open up to him.

Looks like both teams have a few injury concerns as well which could add a little extra uncertainty into the mix. I can see us being more on the front foot for this game as we wont want to let them play the ball into Lambert to near our own goal.I dont think they have bundles of pace in the attack positions given the players who are out and with Stones, Coleman and Baines in the back four we should be ok. I would go with the 3 in the central midfield positions as we will need the passing options as Saints will press high and if we can escape that initial press we should be able to get at their back four with the pace and power we have up front.

Yeh tough game this one, especially as we are getting short at the back. This will probably be the toughest game to get motivated for given last weekend and the prospect of City in the horizon.

Not as instrumental as others though. He has been important and his set piece ability and leadership has been influential but he hasnt been their catalyst, at least not in the games I have seen of him. If you read my post back, you will see that I have also said recently, not throughout his career, mainly because I cant remember too many games from more than two or three seasons ago. I couldnt give a fuck if he has been given MOTM awards because they are heavily skewed by goals and towards popular players. He scores some great goals, I dont deny that, but how much of an impact on the game did he have before that? From previous posts I know that you seem to purely rate players on their goals and assists so in that respect I guess it explains why you put Gerrard in that bracket. I dont think its primarily an English thing with Nikica from what I have read, its more of his appreciation of technical players as opposed to the traditional all action British style footballer. Thats why I said in my original post that if we comparing Gerrards abilities purely to the English game then you wouldnt see too many disagree that he has been one of the most influential players under those conditions. However if you took him abroad to the Spanish or Italian leagues, his skillset would be far less valuable and I dont know whether he would even be rated as one of the 10 best midfielders in that league. Its probably one of the main reasons, barely any big European teams have ever come sniffing for the likes of Gerrard/Rooney/Lampard because technically they arent the type of players that you would expect to thrive in those type of leagues, at least not to the level they do over here.

I dont believe a lot of the comments in that Daily Mail article. Moyes wouldnt stand for that sort of crap for starters, he certainly didnt here and I dont for one second think he has gone soft since joining Utd. I can imagine a few players werent as happy with Moyes' regime as they were with Fergusons and not brining in more of his own players probably didnt help in that regard. The truth is, Moyes was picked because he was Fergie's mate and not for footballing reasons. Moyes hadnt earnt his chance at Utd and the players knew it.

Another one which is interesting as it shows his performance against us in whatever year it was. I dont like taking too much from videos because they can make someone look better or worse than they are but you can clearly see he is good on the ball, has quick feet, is good at finding space, sees first time passes and links play well. Looking at the first video, he looks perfectly suited to play from the left hand side instead of Osman/Pienaar.

Video of his early days (abeit a fairly shit video!)

He could be a very useful player and I would back Martinez to get him back to the player that he promised to be when he came on the scene. Put it this way, I would bet good money that if we signed him this summer for £4mil, he would be easily worth double that the summer after (assuming he stays fit).