Bailey

Crazy!

I really dont see him being a £25m player. He would need to find a lot of final ball quality rather than just the pace he has shown so far.

On 08/08/2023 at 20:55, Hafnia said:

Chelsea forums weren’t particularly positive about Salah. Around the same as as Daka when he managed to tighten up his game to go with pace. 

Maybe so but not performing for a team fighting relegation is very different from a team trying to win the league!

Salah under Klopp is very different to a Salah under Mourinho as well fwiw. Im not sure a Daka under Rodgers is worse than a  Daka under Dyche?

9 hours ago, Palfy said:

Baileys fault he voted leave

He didn't! 

Everton 1 - 1 Fulham

Doucoure

Leicester forums aren't particularly positive about him!

14 hours ago, Romey 1878 said:

Does anyone?

Well we keep buying shite, so maybe scouts need to pay attention as I could save them some time and money!

5 hours ago, Romey 1878 said:

Player doesn't quite perform in his first season in the Premier League... that's never happened before.

We were after him before he went to Leicester so we obviously saw something in him and still think it's there to be unlocked.

I'd rather him than Iheanacho because I think he's got more attributes to his game if he can reach the potential we see in him.

This is now his 3rd season at Leicester.

3 hours ago, StevO said:

Scored quite regularly for a bench player. 
 

 

I think there is also the counter argument to this in that sometimes bench players can have more impressive stats because of the situation they end up playing in.

My view is that you just need to look at the individual player and if there is a reason he isn't scoring goals or getting on the end of chances and why that reason is, more than a record they have. To contradict myself slightly, it is a bit of a red flag that he played in an attacking, creative team and didn't do a massive amount when he had his chances. Despite having a fair few starts, he rarely played 90 minutes, which is also a strange one.

Rodgers seemed to have him behind Vardy but ahead of Iheanacho in the pecking order and the RedBull teams are generally very smart when it comes to recruitment themselves.

I haven't looked at him as a player very closely, but as I said before he has just never stood out to me when I have watched Leicester and he has been on the pitch.

Lets not forget that this pre-season is the first time Dyche has been able to see him up close and regularly.

He has to adapt to a very different style of football than he was playing last season and he has come back late due to the World Cup.

I am sure they will assess him and if they think he is good enough he will start, and probably get a better wage package on top of that. It isn't like we have any outstanding defensive talent standing in the way of his progression!

He has never really caught my eye! 

I think that like VAR, whatever they use needs to be transparent. Let the fans see it on the big screen every time the clock stops. 

If they don't, you can bet your arse it will just be Fergie time all over again where the biggest clubs seemingly get more time to get back in games.

8 hours ago, c1982 said:

I expect this name will pop up as the deadline draws closer (on-loan).

Weirdly enough, I thought of him when I heard he was on his way back from injury.

I can see it from say January onwards when he is ready or maybe on a loan contract that keeps the cost to us really low unless he plays but I just doubt it would happen.

Im amazed he has scored so many as sometimes his technique is dreadful. 

I watched him for Leeds today playing as the central striker. Whilst I didn't think he looked as sharp as he should at this stage of the season, his ability to play in tight spaces and pick a pass with the correct weight is impressive for such a young player.

11 hours ago, Palfy said:

Coady played 5 games under the Dyche the first 4 then the final game keeping 3 clean sheets and conceding 4 goals. 
Keane played 10 games keeping 2 clean sheets and conceding 20 goals. 
In the first 4 games that Dyche took control of Coady played they kept 2 clean sheets and conceded 4 goals. 
The next 4 games Keane played kept 1 clean sheet and conceded 9 goals. I rest my case that dropping Coady for Keane and trying to recreate the Bournemouth factor didn’t work. 

The final game was a back 5 so I think that is a bit different. 

Of those Coady games you mentioned, 3 were at home. Of those Keane games you mentioned, 3 were away. The 1 home game Keane played, we kept a clean sheet. 

Swing it however you like but Tarkowski and Coady played in our easier spell of games under Lampard and fucked it up. Yes we got an amazing result against Arsenal at home but then it was back to reality being beaten by two against Villa and Liverpool.

We leaked goals all season and whilst that improved under Dyche, it wasn't a problem that we ever solved regardless of who played at the back but we did take more risks going forward. You only have to look at the Buendia goal at home to Villa to see why that was considered a bit of a problem and why Coady has generally always been considered a better defender in a back 5. Like it or not Coady is far easier to expose than Keane (oohh errr). 

16 hours ago, Palfy said:

The dropping of Coady for Keane opened the floodgates of goals being conceded, I’m not trying to make a comparison between them as individuals but as a pair there was more understanding with Tarkowski and Coady than Tarkowski and Keane.  

Hmmmm... The 2 goals conceded against Leicester, 3 goals conceded against Bournemouth and 4 goals conceded against Brighton suggest the floodgates had opened before Keane came into the side!

3 hours ago, Cornish Steve said:

Things change over time, don't they? I would still agree with much of what I wrote, though. Where our boat was holed was DC-L being out for most of the season and Maupay proving to be poor. Our defence was not an issue: remember when we had the best defence stats in the league? Our midfield was strong and remains so. We have England's #1 in goal. McNeil turned out to be an excellent acquisition. In many ways, our story is similar now to what it was then. With the wisdom of hindsight, though, we now know that proven depth in attack is not only a priority but an absolute necessity.

Our defence was an issue, a bloody big one, and we were just lucky that we weren't conceding as many goals as we should have given the chances we conceded.

Then, shock horror, teams started putting them away. There is only so long you can get away with outperforming the underlying data. 

3 hours ago, RPG said:

Somebody obviously thought he had enough ability and/or potential to put  him on 70k a week. I agree that apart from one short purple patch he has neither demonstrated enough ability to earn that wage nor lived up to his supposed potential. I think the main reason for that is between his ears. He seems to come across now as thinking he is far better than he is and I believe most of that is caused by giving him too much money, too soon, and it has badly affected his attitude.

To some extent I think his atttitude got him to where he is. That arrogance and aggression is what got him to this point but the bubble burst.

4 minutes ago, StevO said:

He is quick, he is strong and he’s 6 foot tall. As Matt said, physically fine. Doesn’t make him a stand out player, but he never said he was. 

He is no quicker than Keane, albeit he is more agile. 6ft still makes him our shortest CB and below average for the league. He isn't strong for the league either IMO. 

He is below PL average in most of those categories, maybe with speed and agility being average. 

6 hours ago, c1982 said:

For the data lovers…

 

Just as an FYI that appears to be over the course of their careers, albeit I have tried to use other sources to work out how these minutes have been calculated and it doesn't add up.

Also Sulemana's xG and xGA for his time at Southampton and Rennes (league only) totals around a combined 10xG/xA. I have no idea where the other 28.9 xG/xA have come from unless they have been assessing his time at FC Nordsjaelland in the Danish first tier! It is possible as whilst he was there he contributed a combined 22 goals and assists.

It seems slightly suspect for a so called analyst!

4 hours ago, RPG said:

I wouldn't argue too much with that. His main problems seems to be between his ears.

I would. He isn't quick, he isn't strong, he looks about 5ft 6 against proper defenders and he doesn't have a Tim Cahill style leap. His passing is shit. He doesn't read the game well enough.

There is nothing about him that marks him out to be a Premier League footballer. It's ludicrous that we are paying him as much as we are for someone who has effectively come through the academy.

Dobbin's strength's very clearly lie on the counter attack and getting in behind and it isn't easy to get that too often in the Premier League.

The best sides give you space but are getting better and better at stopping the counter. As it happens though, he would get lots of opportunity against Fulham as they play a high line don't press the ball like the best teams. The way we have played has suited him because when he is on the pitch, you see Maupay drop into the hole and he is the one stretching the play and it has worked. I don't expect that to work as the quality of the games increases because they just don't pan out the same way.

The one time when that space shut down for him (second half v Bolton) he lost the ball repeatedly. That half he played with the young lads and he had played longer than everyone else, but it showcased that he might struggle in and around a compact defence.

I also don't really see him as a genuine wide player as he has very little quality with his delivery at this stage of his career. I think he is a player that needs a foil and he can't have a lot of defensive duties if he is going to be playing on the shoulder of the defence.

There is a long way to go for him, however that role playing off the shoulder of the back line alongside a recognised striker is one that really suits him and if Dyche has that game plan in his sights, then he has to stay for the time being.

1 hour ago, Hafnia said:

Making it sound like gray is a rounded player.  See gray have a good game 1 in 5, the amount of times gray has allowed defenders to get past him and fail to pass the ball to a better placed man is a joke. 
 

Sulemana has bags of potential, I watched the highlights of the 2-2 game against Liverpool, he tore them a new one.  Many of their fans wanted him signed up. 

I said he was more rounded. Gray has all the ability in the world but his tactical and mental attributes let him down massively. 

I have seen those highlights and basically what you see is a quick player against a slow back line pressing high and a crap keeper. The keeper should save his first goal. Even Armstrong was able to score a goal on the counter using his pace with a tidy finish. 

That game was a perfect storm for him and made him look far better than he is. Gnonto is a far more talented footballer. 

6 minutes ago, Matt said:

Looking at that clip, I'd beg to differ. 

It was a lovely turn, but yeh its not the greatest defending you will ever see! 

1 minute ago, RPG said:

Sounds like Gray!

He has that about him but Gray is more rounded in the rest of his play and technique.

33 minutes ago, c1982 said:

Have you seen enough of him to make a statement like that? We’ve clearly been scouting him for a long time, hence the interest in January. Young lad thrown into a relegation battle in a new country… oh and the manager who signed him gets sacked days later. Not the easiest of conditions to shine in.

I watched a lot of videos of him (what is available anyway) and his sides games before he signed for Southampton and then a bit when he was playing for Southampton. I have seen a fair bit of Gnonto. So, yes its certainly on the premature side, but I rate Gnonto very highly and there is nothing about Sulemana that makes me think he is anywhere near that level. He looks to be a bit of a speed merchant with a lot of questions about his end product and attitude.

23 minutes ago, London Blue said:

Shop window?

I'm not sure that is really a thing any more with all of the footage and scouting networks? Most teams leave players they don't want behind these days.