Kenwright On Moyes

[Louis]

I've transcribed this from a Sky Sports report which aired today on Moyes reaching nine years at the club:

 

Bill Kenwright: "From the way he talked and from the way we talked certainly over 4-5 weeks, there was always a feeling that there was a kind of destiny that was drawing him to Everton. He has sort of admitted that and I think what has happened over the past nine years have proved that, that was the perfect scenario for David Moyes and I have to say Everton Football Club."

 

"It's not been an easy nine years, it's not been an easy nine years for a man who wants to win, for a club that wants to win but it's been a nine years where he has given everything to advance this football club to take it forward and that's what he has done. I think our track record in the last five years is an average of 7th position each season, that wasn't the case when he first arrived."

 

Kenwright on speculation linking Moyes to Man Utd:

 

"I know [about the speculation] because I read it too and I talk to him about the stories about Manchester United, one of, if not the biggest club in the world and if that day ever came he would have to make a decision but I also know how he committed to the cause of this football club, not just the next week, the next two weeks but what this club is all about, what this club needed means an awful lot to him."

[MikeO]

BK said on the news last night (talking about the new Superman musical on Broadway) that it's still possible to make "zillions" from a stage production.

 

Anyone on here have Rice/Lloyd-Webber delusions? I know we've got a fair few musicians but we need a lyricist and a storyline.

 

Get a success and we'll leave City and their paltry billions in the gutter .

[Louis]

Text - http://www.skysports...6807638,00.html

 

Video - http://www.skysports.com/video/inline/0,26691,16426_6806724,00.html

[Romey 1878]

United would be absolutely mad to hire Moyes.

[scouse]

Moyes and Kenwright = the mutual appreciation society

[Louis]

Why's that Mark?

[Hafnia]

Moyes at united? Hmmmm maybe they would get to see o'shea being brought on to score a vital goal when 1-0 down, or macheda being played on the wing...

 

Never mind moyes being allowed to walk away, we would happily allow our current board to get lost.

[Romey 1878]

Why's that Mark?

 

 

Because he's not good enough.

[Louis]

What is it about Moyes that makes you say that? Tactics? Substitutions ?

[SimonButtle]

Not interested in anything Kenwright has to say unless it contains the words 'Money Going Into Everton'

 

sad, but true

[Romey 1878]

What is it about Moyes that makes you say that? Tactics? Substitutions ?

 

 

Tactics, subs, more interested in not losing than actually winning, he has his favourite players who he sticks with no matter what, he's crap when it comes to big games, too negative... bla bla bla.

 

It sounds like I think he's absolute shite, which I don't, but he's just not good enough in any aspect, other than in the transfer market, to take charge of a top club.

[pehitt]

Tactics, subs, more interested in not losing than actually winning, he has his favourite players who he sticks with no matter what, he's crap when it comes to big games, too negative... bla bla bla.

 

It sounds like I think he's absolute shite, which I don't, but he's just not good enough in any aspect, other than in the transfer market, to take charge of a top club.

 

true. i think him going to united would turn into a hodgson situation!

[EFC-Paul]

Tactics, subs, more interested in not losing than actually winning, he has his favourite players who he sticks with no matter what, he's crap when it comes to big games, too negative... bla bla bla.

 

It sounds like I think he's absolute shite, which I don't, but he's just not good enough in any aspect, other than in the transfer market, to take charge of a top club.

 

I agree far to negative and simply doesn't have the tactical nous for European football etc, If he did go to a bigger club he would replicate what has happened so many times before to managers who either see the pound sign's or blind glory he would end up in the same situation as Allardyce, Hodgson etc

[Hafnia]

In all seriousness, look at why we have performed so poorly this season. Teams such as WBA, Stoke, reading, Blackpool can get points from us easily. The reason being they know what to do! The reason they know what to do is that they know what we are going to do. The reason they know what we are going to do is because moyes is predictable. The reason moyes is predictable is because he has no alternative tactics, 3-5-3, 4-3-3. Have we ever seen that? I would guess that Even dalglish has varied his formation more times than moyes in his short reign.

[duncanmckenzieismagic]

In all seriousness, look at why we have performed so poorly this season. Teams such as WBA, Stoke, reading, Blackpool can get points from us easily. The reason being they know what to do! The reason they know what to do is that they know what we are going to do. The reason they know what we are going to do is because moyes is predictable. The reason moyes is predictable is because he has no alternative tactics, 3-5-3, 4-3-3. Have we ever seen that? I would guess that Even dalglish has varied his formation more times than moyes in his short reign.

 

 

 

Probably the reason why Moyes is so predictable is because we havent got the squad to enable us to play 3-5-3 or 4-3-3

 

We have struggled all season to find one player who can play upfront let alone 3.

 

David Moyse is as aware of Evertons short comings as anybody but he is powerless to do anything about it with out the financial backing of the board.

 

Moyes has been voted the LMA Manager of the Year 3 times by his peers, and you would hope that they know what they are talking about, so clearly they dont think he is as inept as some of the people in here do

 

Moyes has done an incredible job with the resources he has got at his disposal but unfortunately I dont suppose some Evertonians will appreciate what he has done until he has gone and we are back to the bad old days of fighting relegation or worse

[duncanmckenzieismagic]

Tactics, subs, more interested in not losing than actually winning, he has his favourite players who he sticks with no matter what, he's crap when it comes to big games, too negative... bla bla bla.

 

It sounds like I think he's absolute shite, which I don't, but he's just not good enough in any aspect, other than in the transfer market, to take charge of a top club.

 

 

 

I dont think that is a fair shout at all

 

Man Utd at home 3-3

The Shite at home 2-0

Spurs away 1-1

Chelsea away 1-1

City away 2-1

Spurs home 2-1

The Shite away 2-2

Chelsea home 1-1

Chelsea away 1-1 won on pens

Newcastle away 2-1

 

 

The only blemish against the top sides is Arsenal havae beat us 2-1 home and away, so hes not done that badly in big games

[Romey 1878]

I dont think that is a fair shout at all

 

Man Utd at home 3-3

The Shite at home 2-0

Spurs away 1-1

Chelsea away 1-1

City away 2-1

Spurs home 2-1

The Shite away 2-2

Chelsea home 1-1

Chelsea away 1-1 won on pens

Newcastle away 2-1

 

 

The only blemish against the top sides is Arsenal havae beat us 2-1 home and away, so hes not done that badly in big games

 

 

Maybe you're right, Dunc, but until recently his record against the big boys and in games that really matter he has been shocking. Plus, I'll never forget the FA Cup Final, Bucharest, Fiorentina away. There are probably more but they are the ones that stand out in my memory.

 

I stand by that he's not good enough for a top job, and if he ever gets a top job he'll be shown up for what he really is - simply a decent manager and nothing more, which is good enough for us and where we currently stand but not for a club like Manchester United where winning is the be all and end all.

[Hafnia]

Probably the reason why Moyes is so predictable is because we havent got the squad to enable us to play 3-5-3 or 4-3-3

 

We have struggled all season to find one player who can play upfront let alone 3.

 

David Moyse is as aware of Evertons short comings as anybody but he is powerless to do anything about it with out the financial backing of the board.

 

Moyes has been voted the LMA Manager of the Year 3 times by his peers, and you would hope that they know what they are talking about, so clearly they dont think he is as inept as some of the people in here do

 

Moyes has done an incredible job with the resources he has got at his disposal but unfortunately I dont suppose some Evertonians will appreciate what he has done until he has gone and we are back to the bad old days of fighting relegation or worse

 

3-5-2 = heitinga, jags, distin,

 

Coleman, arteta, rodwell, fellaini,baines

 

Becks, Saha

 

Similar for 4-3-3

 

 

His lma awards are mainly due to his shoe string operation, which is fair enough, but not in recognition of winning anything.

 

Top and bottom of it is that moyes is about near to as good as we can get, and that is the state of the club. Moyes on reflection as a manager is similar to rooney as a player. Not amillion miles off being perfect but suffers from flaws and inconsistencies that means he will never be classed as one of the best despite the most promising of starts.

[Bailey]

I dont think that is a fair shout at all

 

Man Utd at home 3-3

The Shite at home 2-0

Spurs away 1-1

Chelsea away 1-1

City away 2-1

Spurs home 2-1

The Shite away 2-2

Chelsea home 1-1

Chelsea away 1-1 won on pens

Newcastle away 2-1

 

 

The only blemish against the top sides is Arsenal havae beat us 2-1 home and away, so hes not done that badly in big games

 

They are all decent results but we havent beaten teams when we need to, or even looked like beating them at times. As Romey says look at the Cup Final (and the semi considering we played a Utd reserve team), our European games, the LC Semi against Chelsea etc. These were BIG games that would really impact on our future as a club and we have more or less bottled every one of them opportunities. Its more gutting when you then see teams like Birmingham go out and there and make a real fist of it and get teh silverware.

 

I also think Hafnia is right as well. Although Moyes tinkers (which doesnt help imo) he very rarely change adapt our formation and even when we play with 2 strikers, one of them still 9/10 drops back into an advanced midfield role to become a 4-5-1. He frequentley swaps players around but its a straight swap and it seems to hinder our shape.

 

I also think you are wrong about the 'cant find one striker let alone 3' comment. Its millions time harder for a striker to play up front on his own, than it is to have 3 of them up there. I remember when we played against Arsnenal at Goodison we went with 3 strikers at the end (saha, yak, becks?) and it worked pretty well and we could have scored a couple. Im not saying we should start like that, but when we need the points, it surely has to be a better option than doing a straight swap with 20+ mins to go.

 

Moyes has a lot to learn before he can even be considered for a top job in my eyes.

[duncanmckenzieismagic]

They are all decent results but we havent beaten teams when we need to, or even looked like beating them at times. As Romey says look at the Cup Final (and the semi considering we played a Utd reserve team), our European games, the LC Semi against Chelsea etc. These were BIG games that would really impact on our future as a club and we have more or less bottled every one of them opportunities. Its more gutting when you then see teams like Birmingham go out and there and make a real fist of it and get teh silverware.

 

I also think Hafnia is right as well. Although Moyes tinkers (which doesnt help imo) he very rarely change adapt our formation and even when we play with 2 strikers, one of them still 9/10 drops back into an advanced midfield role to become a 4-5-1. He frequentley swaps players around but its a straight swap and it seems to hinder our shape.

 

I also think you are wrong about the 'cant find one striker let alone 3' comment. Its millions time harder for a striker to play up front on his own, than it is to have 3 of them up there. I remember when we played against Arsnenal at Goodison we went with 3 strikers at the end (saha, yak, becks?) and it worked pretty well and we could have scored a couple. Im not saying we should start like that, but when we need the points, it surely has to be a better option than doing a straight swap with 20+ mins to go.

 

Moyes has a lot to learn before he can even be considered for a top job in my eyes.

 

 

Lol Well there an awful lot og knowledgeable people within the game who would disagree and I think I will side with them on this one

 

Suppose we will have to agree to disagree about our forwards as well because I still cant see where you could pick 3 decent forwards from our lot

[Hafnia]

Lol Well there an awful lot og knowledgeable people within the game who would disagree and I think I will side with them on this one

 

Suppose we will have to agree to disagree about our forwards as well because I still cant see where you could pick 3 decent forwards from our lot

 

Dunc but surely the reason that we have had such limited success with our forwards is down to the manager?

 

I have said for a long time now that we need an attack minded coach, Liverpool have had the likes of rush working with theirs, man united have had ole Gunnar, arsenal recently turned to Henry to help Walcott. To my knowledge everton have sheedy who takes shooting practice, whilst he had an amazing left foot is he going to be able to teach victor how to move intelligently?

 

Personally I would love to see someone like Trevor Steven back at the club, we have way too many defensive minded coaches.

[SimonButtle]

Lol Well there an awful lot og knowledgeable people within the game who would disagree and I think I will side with them on this one

 

Suppose we will have to agree to disagree about our forwards as well because I still cant see where you could pick 3 decent forwards from our lot

yeah but the thing is though, its Moyes tactics that make us play 4-5-1 with no real wide players in the team, and thats obvious to anyone,Victor is truely one of the worst players ever in the top flight, he is just not a footballer whatsoever, yet the manager still persists with him, look back at it Beattie,AJ Radzinski,Bent, all shit!! now you can go on about money and that, but we did spend money on AJ and Beattie, and all these knowledgable people, are they pushing Moyes forward for the major european jobs, are they fuck, he has alot too learn imo, but i understand your point bro, just opinions at the end of the day

[duncanmckenzieismagic]

yeah but the thing is though, its Moyes tactics that make us play 4-5-1 with no real wide players in the team, and thats obvious to anyone,Victor is truely one of the worst players ever in the top flight, he is just not a footballer whatsoever, yet the manager still persists with him, look back at it Beattie,AJ Radzinski,Bent, all shit!! now you can go on about money and that, but we did spend money on AJ and Beattie, and all these knowledgable people, are they pushing Moyes forward for the major european jobs, are they fuck, he has alot too learn imo, but i understand your point bro, just opinions at the end of the day

 

 

 

Moyse plays 4-5-1 because it is the system that best suits the players at his disposal, its as simple as that

 

Moyse has done an absolutely unbeleivable job at Everton and that is why he is regarded so highly in the game and he has more than earnt himself a shot at a big club. Sir Alex Ferguson knows a hell of a lot more about football than you or I and if he thinks he's good enough to be his successor then I think that speaks volumes

[duncanmckenzieismagic]

Dunc but surely the reason that we have had such limited success with our forwards is down to the manager?

 

I have said for a long time now that we need an attack minded coach, Liverpool have had the likes of rush working with theirs, man united have had ole Gunnar, arsenal recently turned to Henry to help Walcott. To my knowledge everton have sheedy who takes shooting practice, whilst he had an amazing left foot is he going to be able to teach victor how to move intelligently?

 

Personally I would love to see someone like Trevor Steven back at the club, we have way too many defensive minded coaches.

 

 

I think this crap about Moyse having a bad track record with forwards is complete nonsense to be honest

 

Radzinski was much better at Everton than Fulham and was sold because Moyse wouldnt give him a long contract due to his age, a good decision I feel.

 

Bent played the best football of his career under Moyse and has never done anything since he left. AJ was a good signing for us at the time and again was very succesful in an Everton shirt where he gained the majority of his England caps.

 

The Yak had his most succesful season in English football under Moyse and was a huge success until he got his 18 month itch and reverted back to type and Moyse also did a pretty good job nurturing the talent of a young Wayne Rooney.

 

Beatties' career was in a downward spiral way before we signed him and Moyse took a gamble on him because he thought he could turn his career around and ok it didnt work but he has hardly gone on to bigger and better things since he left so Moyse isnt the only manager to fail to get the best out of him

 

 

The point is I regard Moyse as an excellent manager and it seems that is not a view that many people in here share, however ask yourselves this question, if he was half as inept as a lot of people in here seem to think he is then why is he so highly regarded by so many people within the game, many of whom have played or still play under him?

Edited March 13, 2011 by duncanmckenzieismagic

[EFC-Paul]

No one is saying he's a poor manager or not highly rated and he has done a decent job on a shoe string budget and that is where I think he gains his plaudits, Tho that doesn't discount the obvious that he is poor tactically in our previous stints in Europe he has looked lost on the sideline and even more so if things are against us he has no creativity or "tactical nous", Then you have all the ludicrously negative late substitutions and so on.

 

He's a good manager no doubt about it and has done a good job with the resources he has had at his disposal but top club material I personally don't think he is good enough regardless of what people quote.

Edited March 13, 2011 by EFC-Paul

[Bailey]

The point is I regard Moyse as an excellent manager and it seems that is not a view that many people in here share, however ask yourselves this question, if he was half as inept as a lot of people in here seem to think he is then why is he so highly regarded by so many people within the game, many of whom have played or still play under him?

 

Moyes is a very good manager and he has done a hell of a lot for the club, but he does have limitations and in my opinion its those limitations that hold him back from being a world class manager at a world class club. None of the current crop of managers would make the same poor choices (although Wenger does go close at times) and if they do make a mistake and see it doesnt work, they dont try and force it like Moyes does.

 

Surely even you can see they bringing Beckford off for Vic is never going to be a game changing sub, yet he has taken Becks off several times in the same situation on a handful of occasions already this season. Its that type of thing, when we are chasing a goal at home, that I simply cant comprehend and no quality manager worth his place at the top clubs would have done the same, especially against a team in the relegation zone.

[jcrawfor]

Moyse plays 4-5-1 because it is the system that best suits the players at his disposal, its as simple as that

 

Moyse has done an absolutely unbeleivable job at Everton and that is why he is regarded so highly in the game and he has more than earnt himself a shot at a big club. Sir Alex Ferguson knows a hell of a lot more about football than you or I and if he thinks he's good enough to be his successor then I think that speaks volumes

 

Wonderful appeal to authority, however, just because Fergie has a knowledgeable opinion on Moyes, doesn't mean his thoughts are worth more than mine. Shit, there a few biologists around who still deny darwinian evolution because they have a opinion not related to the facts. Fergie's opinion of Moyes may have been valid 2 years ago, and then I would have agreed, but since then he's not earned such high regard from such reputable authority. Moyes' failures to learn new tactics, figure out how to make an effective sub, win a cup game at HOME to a lower div team, etc, show he won't cut it at a big club like ManU. I'll give you he's a good manager, but until he wins something or puts us in the CL again, his promise doesn't mean fuck all.

[duncanmckenzieismagic]

Wonderful appeal to authority, however, just because Fergie has a knowledgeable opinion on Moyes, doesn't mean his thoughts are worth more than mine. Shit, there a few biologists around who still deny darwinian evolution because they have a opinion not related to the facts. Fergie's opinion of Moyes may have been valid 2 years ago, and then I would have agreed, but since then he's not earned such high regard from such reputable authority. Moyes' failures to learn new tactics, figure out how to make an effective sub, win a cup game at HOME to a lower div team, etc, show he won't cut it at a big club like ManU. I'll give you he's a good manager, but until he wins something or puts us in the CL again, his promise doesn't mean fuck all.

 

 

So if you wanted to get an extension built for your house you would just as easily let ballet dancer build it as you would a builder?

[SimonButtle]

Moyse plays 4-5-1 because it is the system that best suits the players at his disposal, its as simple as that

 

Moyse has done an absolutely unbeleivable job at Everton and that is why he is regarded so highly in the game and he has more than earnt himself a shot at a big club. Sir Alex Ferguson knows a hell of a lot more about football than you or I and if he thinks he's good enough to be his successor then I think that speaks volumes

yeah and its moyes who chooses those players at the end of the day, he wants to play that way, regardless of who he has at his disposal, heitinga and billy cost a fair bit of money and even i will except finally that both are shite, and the money could have been spent better, but he chose them, why loan yobo, then spend money on hetinga, and start him in midfield which his not his position(which he was at the start of the season), thats bad tactics for me mate, and thats down to Moyes, we should have spent the money on someone like ledley of cardiff, or kightly or jarvis, the list goes on

Edited March 13, 2011 by theprisoner

[smeghead1]

 

So if you wanted to get an extension built for your house you would just as easily let ballet dancer build it as you would a builder?

Im in agreement mate, when people make comments about Moyes not making great subs half the time we have Kids to come on! When have we had a season when weve had a fully fit squad to pick from? At a club like Man U they have Subs that would make most 1st teams so when your losing or need a goal its easier to do! Lets be honest what Moyes is good at is team spirit, that bonding that makes a decent team good, imagine that at a good team! Thats why he'd be a success!