Lowensda Posted July 7, 2011 Report Share Posted July 7, 2011 where you been j? you missed all the fun lol I know...jesus (I don't actually know Jesus if anyone reads that on its own), the party started without me. I feel slightly inferior But im working so it cant be helped!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marcopaulo Posted July 7, 2011 Author Report Share Posted July 7, 2011 No, but rather than get fans hopes up, would it not be better if he had just kept quiet till the deal was done? thats why i said it was "classic" BK problem is man; if he hadn't have said anything, people would be saying what's happening with yobo an that..some matters he can't win whatever he does. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marcopaulo Posted July 7, 2011 Author Report Share Posted July 7, 2011 sheeps and apples Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted July 7, 2011 Report Share Posted July 7, 2011 Q: So what youre saying is that the other teams are spending lots of money but not really improving their team and then complaining that we are not spending money and not improving our team? A: Yes, other teams are spending money on improving their existing players by a slight margin in many cases. We have a serious need to improve on the left side of midfield and up front. Q: Bily isnt a winger, not his fault he is played in the wrong position. Nzog has had how many sucessful seasons in EPL - comparing apples and sheep there. Nzog is a better winger by far, because he is a winger. A: Bily/Osman are played on the left whichever way you look at it - who else can play there? Bily is the most native to that role being left sided. It's not a direct criticism of Bily rather than identifying the attributes of someone we have playing there with our current options. Nzogbia is 25, has been playing in the prem for 6 years and for me is a consistent player with plenty of ability who would improve our left side no end. Comparing apples and sheep? Not really, more like comparing cooking apples with granny smiths. One is more better suited for something than the other. Q: 1st season he scored 10, matching a goal to game ratio along with the best - Whats that got to do with the argument? A: Ratios can seriously distort an appraisal of someone. You talk about comparing apples with sheep? Playing less minutes than your rivals does not make it a level playing field. In prem, for WBA Somen Tchoyi scored 6 in 832 = 139 mins per goal versus beckfords 1 in 167 minutes. Steven Fletcher was 1 in 138, Marlon Harewood 1 in 134, leon best 1 in 125, need I go on? look at stats all you like, I recall the game being 2-2 versus Sunderland and him blasting over a sitter in the last minute = two points dropped. I also recall scoring a goal from nothing to earn us a point against Bolton. The point I am making summarises him perfectly. He can do the sublime but can also infuriate by not doing the minimum expected of a prem striker. Take his petulence when subbed after dropping his work rate against Wolves - the lad has very much to learn - you can't compare him to the best because he is way off that - and way off what we need as a week in week out goalscorer. What that has to do with the argument is everything, we are so close to having a first 11 that would strike fear into any team, the problem we have is our weak areas are comparable with a bottom 6 team. To alleviate that weakness takes money - hence Darren Bent @ £24m is an example of that - the see saw effect of his goals for Sunderland and Villa was there for all to see. With him Sunderland were top table, without, bottom table - total opposite for Villa - bottom table, then top table. One goalscorer = big difference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BristolToffee Posted July 7, 2011 Report Share Posted July 7, 2011 Of course it's hard to stomach when you hear about other clubs making transfers & yes I would love us to have money to spend, but I am still not convinced about the majority of big take overs. I apologise if I get any of the wrong, but the way I see it: Real Madrid - 'Galacticos', spent big for years. Currently living in the shadows of some other club. Leeds - Gamble failed to pay off. Portsmouth - Do they still exist? West Ham - Icelandic owners went bust in the global recession. Birmingham - Discussed in another post. Liverpool - almost went into admin before being bought out by current owners. Now spending over the top on slightly above average players. Blackburn - sacked a manager who was doing well for them. Almost relegated. Man Utd - tonnes of debt. Only able to continue due to the massive commerciality of the club. Any other club would have been in trouble right now. Chelsea - Some success, gone through several managers, ageing squad. Need big investment in order to dominate English football. Investment written off as a loan, meaning when Ambramovich gets bored, they either go bust or someone has to pay of Ambroviches investment. Aston Villa - Not progressed any further than us. Seem to sell their best players (Young, Milner, Barry, etc). Man City - Starting to look dangerous, not won anything yet (apart from the FA Cup). Scared of Everton. UK Banking system - was great & had a system countries across the world wanted. Until 2008. Then everything changed. Had to be bailed out. There may have been other examples i've missed, but based upon the above I can't say i'm too unhappy with our position. Also, as with the UK banking system everything can look great, but then look how quickly things can change. The grass always looks greener.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c1982 Posted July 7, 2011 Report Share Posted July 7, 2011 What pisses me off is nothing is simple with Everton. Recently Bellefield sale/non-sale, new corporate facilities delay, even Kirkby project rejection... In the past Kings Dock, that sport fund thing (Sammuelson?), Stanley Park planning permision... I don't know whose fault it is but something seems very dodgy or are we actually that unlucky or is it because of mis-management from the top? To be honest it's probably a mix of the three... What I do know though... new theme tune? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete0 Posted July 7, 2011 Report Share Posted July 7, 2011 What pisses me off is nothing is simple with Everton. Recently Bellefield sale/non-sale, new corporate facilities delay, even Kirkby project rejection... In the past Kings Dock, that sport fund thing (Sammuelson?), Stanley Park planning permision... I don't know whose fault it is but something seems very dodgy or are we actually that unlucky or is it because of mis-management from the top? To be honest it's probably a mix of the three... What I do know though... new theme tune? Easy answer.. because we don't share the citys name Stanley park was apparently Liverpool council said it would be unfair on liverpool fans Politics King Docks was we had no proof we could afford it Mis-management/Money Kirkby decision was a complete farce and shows how corrupt the government is. Massive investment turned down in a recession due to liverpool, skem and manchester ganging together. I've done economics and from that perspective its hard to see how it was rejected, am not clued up on law but am pretty sure it goes against free trade laws. If that was the real reason Liverpool1 would have been rejected as well. Bellfield wouldn't have been a problem if we weren't trying to go to Kirkby. Politics Also quick mention about the amount of work permits we get turned down compared to everyone else, especially when man u and liverpool can get them for kids and their parents Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marcopaulo Posted July 8, 2011 Author Report Share Posted July 8, 2011 just admit it fella's...a part of us all loves bein able to moan every year Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted July 8, 2011 Report Share Posted July 8, 2011 just admit it fella's...a part of us all loves bein able to moan every year and this kinda answers the question in the title - its far from dull! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SimonButtle Posted July 8, 2011 Report Share Posted July 8, 2011 best thread for ages this, yesterday was such a laugh lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marcopaulo Posted July 8, 2011 Author Report Share Posted July 8, 2011 (edited) and this kinda answers the question in the title - its far from dull! it's dull in terms of transfer action but yeah otherwise it's a laugh/heart attack a minute Edited July 8, 2011 by marcopaulo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pax Posted July 8, 2011 Report Share Posted July 8, 2011 Of course it's hard to stomach when you hear about other clubs making transfers & yes I would love us to have money to spend, but I am still not convinced about the majority of big take overs. I apologise if I get any of the wrong, but the way I see it: Real Madrid - 'Galacticos', spent big for years. Currently living in the shadows of some other club. Leeds - Gamble failed to pay off. Portsmouth - Do they still exist? West Ham - Icelandic owners went bust in the global recession. Birmingham - Discussed in another post. Liverpool - almost went into admin before being bought out by current owners. Now spending over the top on slightly above average players. Blackburn - sacked a manager who was doing well for them. Almost relegated. Man Utd - tonnes of debt. Only able to continue due to the massive commerciality of the club. Any other club would have been in trouble right now. Chelsea - Some success, gone through several managers, ageing squad. Need big investment in order to dominate English football. Investment written off as a loan, meaning when Ambramovich gets bored, they either go bust or someone has to pay of Ambroviches investment. Aston Villa - Not progressed any further than us. Seem to sell their best players (Young, Milner, Barry, etc). Man City - Starting to look dangerous, not won anything yet (apart from the FA Cup). Scared of Everton. UK Banking system - was great & had a system countries across the world wanted. Until 2008. Then everything changed. Had to be bailed out. There may have been other examples i've missed, but based upon the above I can't say i'm too unhappy with our position. Also, as with the UK banking system everything can look great, but then look how quickly things can change. The grass always looks greener.... You and i think in very similar ways It's staggering how many failed takeovers of football clubs there have been and how many Everton fans would still sell the club to the first person who came along telling fables about the amount of money they would make available. People don't seem to understand, that in the grand scheme of things, Everton are in a very very good position right now. Our biggest asset is the manager, we can't afford to lose him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted July 8, 2011 Report Share Posted July 8, 2011 You and i think in very similar ways It's staggering how many failed takeovers of football clubs there have been and how many Everton fans would still sell the club to the first person who came along telling fables about the amount of money they would make available. People don't seem to understand, that in the grand scheme of things, Everton are in a very very good position right now. Our biggest asset is the manager, we can't afford to lose him. Haven't Liverpool been taken over twice under our current regime? - Yes they suffered the dodgy buyer, but people power made sure that they were kicked out of town. Now look what's happening. Given the people behind KEIOC had more insight than our current owners in ensuring Kirby never went ahead, do you honestly think a group or owner could come in and start destroying our club before our very eyes? That the second Moyes made £30m bids, they wouldn't be brought into question? Our biggest asset is not our manager - it is our fans. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lowensda Posted July 8, 2011 Report Share Posted July 8, 2011 Haven't Liverpool been taken over twice under our current regime? - Yes they suffered the dodgy buyer, but people power made sure that they were kicked out of town. Now look what's happening. Given the people behind KEIOC had more insight than our current owners in ensuring Kirby never went ahead, do you honestly think a group or owner could come in and start destroying our club before our very eyes? That the second Moyes made £30m bids, they wouldn't be brought into question? Our biggest asset is not our manager - it is our fans. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted July 8, 2011 Report Share Posted July 8, 2011 Haven't Liverpool been taken over twice under our current regime? - Yes they suffered the dodgy buyer, but people power made sure that they were kicked out of town. Now look what's happening. Given the people behind KEIOC had more insight than our current owners in ensuring Kirby never went ahead, do you honestly think a group or owner could come in and start destroying our club before our very eyes? That the second Moyes made £30m bids, they wouldn't be brought into question? Our biggest asset is not our manager - it is our fans. Couldve sworn it had something to do with the banks calling in their debts.... Now look whats happening? Ok, 70m+ spent since Jan 1st on mostly average players, Suarez the possible exception. They will finish 5th at the highest, they havent bought anyone who will give them that little bit extra. They are close to being a very good team again, but Henderson, Carrol, Adam and Downing (if it happens) are not players that will do that... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted July 8, 2011 Report Share Posted July 8, 2011 Couldve sworn it had something to do with the banks calling in their debts.... Now look whats happening? Ok, 70m+ spent since Jan 1st on mostly average players, Suarez the possible exception. They will finish 5th at the highest, they havent bought anyone who will give them that little bit extra. They are close to being a very good team again, but Henderson, Carrol, Adam and Downing (if it happens) are not players that will do that... Not concerned with who they buy, more concerned that we do not have any money to buy what we need. Too many people looking at reasons not to spend money. Fellaini £15m = now a £30m player. Baines £6m = now a £25m player. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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