Time for Kenwright to buck up or buck off!

[Matt]

and this

 

Former Everton midfielder Mickey Thomas has tipped Cardiff City manager Malky Mackay to succeed David Moyes at Goodison Park.

Moyes will take over from Sir Alex Ferguson at Manchester United in July.

Fellow Scotsman Mackay, who guided Cardiff to the Championship title, is among the names linked with the Everton job.

"Malky Mackay, I've been told, is a strong candidate for that job," Thomas told BBC Wales Sport.

http://www.toffeetalk.com/index.php?/topic/25085-new-manager-rumours/page-4&do=findComment&comment=340937

[Hafnia]

Since Kenwright has been chairman, Everton have had 3 record signings - Johnson, Yak and Felli. Wasnt Beattie a record deal too? anyway, its that simple and like it or not, its part of the good (albeit relatively little good) that the Kenwright reign has done.

 

What you seem to not understand, is that I agree with a lot of what you write, but the fact you cant, and seemingly flatout refuse to present a balanced argument just takes anyway any credibility (in my eyes). I dont like Elstone, I dont do the spin (and yes, your last little question is spin, from you), I look at the facts and prepare a balanced opinion. If I went into a management meeting with all the facts but refusing to accept some of them because Ive made up my mind, Id be laughed at.

 

Our transfer spend maybe relatively low. But we have the best team ive ever seen and that has cost us in wages (taking up most of our income, affecting our transfer budget). Its also happened under Kenwrights reign. How it happened was not my point (there I agree with you), but it did happen.

 

I granted you with more intelligence than to take a strap line that the club use to generate favour in terms of transfer dealings. It's used to hoodwink fans into believing the club are backing the manager - it's absolute nonsense. It's something children wouldn't fall for so why would adults?

 

"Here's your pocket money son - it's gone up from £2 to £2.50, thats the third consecutive rise this year, I trust you will be happy?!"

 

"Get lost Dad, my mate across the road get's £10 a week, he's going bowling today and I can't afford to go"

 

"well whatever, but just remember I broken your pocket money record 3 times this year, so there"

Edited May 10, 2013 by Hafnia

[Matt]

 

I granted you with more intelligence than to take a strap line that the club use to generate favour in terms of transfer dealings. It's used to hoodwink fans into believing the club are backing the manager - it's absolute nonsense. It's something children wouldn't fall for so why would adults?

 

"Here's your pocket money son - it's gone up from £2 to £2.50, thats the third consecutive rise this year, I trust you will be happy?!"

 

"Get lost Dad, my mate across the road get's £10 a week, he's going bowling today and I can't afford to go"

for crying out loud!!! Im not buying into the spin! Its just a fact! And of course the club backed the manager, he made signings! The fact they couldve dont much better is not lost on me at all, but im looking for a balanced argument....

[andydray]

you do speak sense Haf. Unfortunatelly money speaks much louder than loyalty and desire. Unless you desire to get rich very quick that is I guess.

 

With the right backing Moyes could become the next Sir Alex. He'll never be knighted for running in Sir Alex's shoes. Shame on you Moyes, a sign of weakness atlast.

[Matt]

you do speak sense Haf. Unfortunatelly money speaks much louder than loyalty and desire. Unless you desire to get rich very quick that is I guess.

 

With the right backing Moyes could become the next Sir Alex. He'll never be knighted for running in Sir Alex's shoes. Shame on you Moyes, a sign of weakness atlast.

I knew you 2 would get on

[Hafnia]

for crying out loud!!! Im not buying into the spin! Its just a fact! And of course the club backed the manager, he made signings! The fact they couldve dont much better is not lost on me at all, but im looking for a balanced argument....

 

You would get a balanced argument if you didn't labour on invalid points. The reality (balance) is regardless of the spend, we have acquired the best team we have had in years, due to moyes talent aquisition, he's worked miracles.

 

The whole - "oh yes we have supported moyes - look at the club transfer records we've broken" is a complete insult to anyones intelligence.

 

If they came out and said "whilst we haven't provided the manager with funds that you would expect of a club of our stature, we have tried to stretch where we can. We can't go out and break british transfer records anymore and we tend to take far less risk with our funding relative to revenue"

 

I would say - "fair point thats honesty for you" - but to come out with that aforementioned drivel mnakes my blood boil.

[andydray]

Physics states that it is 70 times harder to get something going than it is to keep it going.

 

You can apply this logic to most things in life, anything from splitting an atom to starting an engine or business.

 

We were almost ther with Moyes. He's gone for the easy ride at United and money in his back pocket was the deciding factor. Anything he achieves on the field, is a direct result of what Ferguson has left behind.

 

He now has all that money to spend on a team that needs no additions, their reserves could keep them going for decades without spending.

[Matt]

 

You would get a balanced argument if you didn't labour on invalid points. The reality (balance) is regardless of the spend, we have acquired the best team we have had in years, due to moyes talent aquisition, he's worked miracles.

 

The whole - "oh yes we have supported moyes - look at the club transfer records we've broken" is a complete insult to anyones intelligence.

 

If they came out and said "whilst we haven't provided the manager with funds that you would expect of a club of our stature, we have tried to stretch where we can. We can't go out and break british transfer records anymore and we tend to take far less risk with our funding relative to revenue"

 

I would say - "fair point thats honesty for you" - but to come out with that aforementioned drivel mnakes my blood boil.

simple question, yes or no - did it happen?

[marcopaulo]

christ it's groundhog day again

[Matt]

christ it's groundhog day again

yeah, i know!

[andydray]

Kenwight has let us all down, there's no 2 ways about it. Moyes needed cash, it wasn't given to him. End of arguement imo.

 

Statistics are only ther to cover the truth with a white wash of false security, its only at times like now that the people with their heads in the sand dig and dig and dig to bury it even further.

 

Thatcherism and Murdockism can both be blamed for destroying loyalty and passion within business and within the game due to greed of money. Without money in this modern world you are nothing. Passion, loyalty, trust, decency towards others, its all dying quicker and quicker in every aspect of life. Sadly.

 

This is our problem and it has been for years. Kenwright is TOO passionate in a game that has lost it's need for passion.

 

Rich people are ruthless, cold hearted and only passionate about 1 thing, their bottom line. Everton with Moyes must have been a very tempting investment for hundreds of multi millionaires, Kenwright turned them all away because.....well only he knows I guess. Its is his fault Moyes has gone. If we had been in the Champions Leagye for the past 4 or 5 years, think of the money and players we woulld have had. But we couldn't get there because Kenwright wouldn't give him the cash. Is that really that hard to see?????

[Avinalaff]

There is no reason for folk to look to blame anybody, or even be overly negative.

 

Good luck to Moyes, and even better luck to Kenwright in his attempts to make the next decision. If anything, it's a new opportunity for all concerned. Personally, I believe any replacement will be a manager that firstly we can afford, and secondly is young enough to bend with the Premier League breezes. I think Moyes will have discussed a successor with Bill some time ago, and Mackay is my best guess, as he was in a meeting with Davey a few weeks ago.

[andydray]

this arguement about breaking club transfer records is rediculous guys. Inflation for 1 thing, everything goes up in price all the time. Newsagents dont celebrate because they sold a bottle of wine today for more than they sold it for yesterday because thats life. Records will be broken all the time, if things are going well. We broke the record 3 times on players that turned out not to be worthy of that crown. Its a joke.

[marcopaulo]

where was this cash supposed to come from? sell us to the first idiot that walks into the room? look at portsmouth or blackburn..they were promised riches..done them a world of fuckin good hasn't it..anyways that's all i'm sayin cos it's such a boring argument now

[Matt]

Kenwight has let us all down, there's no 2 ways about it. Moyes needed cash, it wasn't given to him. End of arguement imo.

 

Statistics are only ther to cover the truth with a white wash of false security, its only at times like now that the people with their heads in the sand dig and dig and dig to bury it even further.

 

Thatcherism and Murdockism can both be blamed for destroying loyalty and passion within business and within the game due to greed of money. Without money in this modern world you are nothing. Passion, loyalty, trust, decency towards others, its all dying quicker and quicker in every aspect of life. Sadly.

 

This is our problem and it has been for years. Kenwright is TOO passionate in a game that has lost it's need for passion.

 

Rich people are ruthless, cold hearted and only passionate about 1 thing, their bottom line. Everton with Moyes must have been a very tempting investment for hundreds of multi millionaires, Kenwright turned them all away because.....well only he knows I guess. Its is his fault Moyes has gone. If we had been in the Champions Leagye for the past 4 or 5 years, think of the money and players we woulld have had. But we couldn't get there because Kenwright wouldn't give him the cash. Is that really that hard to see?????

I dont feel let down in the slightest, and know a lot of fans that cherish him. In fact, theres only a handful of fans I know who want him out.

 

 

this arguement about breaking club transfer records is rediculous guys. Inflation for 1 thing, everything goes up in price all the time. Newsagents dont celebrate because they sold a bottle of wine today for more than they sold it for yesterday because thats life. Records will be broken all the time, if things are going well. We broke the record 3 times on players that turned out not to be worthy of that crown. Its a joke.

its a counter argument to "the board didnt support the manager", this is clearly bollocks. What isnt bollocks is that the board shouldve done better. Signings were also Moyes' choices, so cant blame the board there either....

[andydray]

There is no reason for folk to look to blame anybody, or even be overly negative.

 

Good luck to Moyes, and even better luck to Kenwright in his attempts to make the next decision. If anything, it's a new opportunity for all concerned. Personally, I believe any replacement will be a manager that firstly we can afford, and secondly is young enough to bend with the Premier League breezes. I think Moyes will have discussed a successor with Bill some time ago, and Mackay is my best guess, as he was in a meeting with Davey a few weeks ago.

 

Every action has a consequence. Of course there is room for blame and negativity, we have just lost THE best manager in the world, to probably THE biggest and strongest(trying hard not to say best cos we all know the blues are the best) team in the world. Its sad as fu*k and I do and will blame Kenwright. Sorry.

[Romey 1878]

Come on lads, we don't the divisiveness right now, this is a time when we need to be as one.

 

Yes the board haven't been the best (I would like rid of them) but Moyes left through his own choosing, because it was Manchester United. He wouldn't have turned them down, he's not an Everton man despite being here for 11 years.

 

Moyes is gone. Everton is not. Focus on that.

[andydray]

I dont feel let down in the slightest, and know a lot of fans that cherish him. In fact, theres only a handful of fans I know who want him out.

 

 

its a counter argument to "the board didnt support the manager", this is clearly bollocks. What isnt bollocks is that the board shouldve done better. Signings were also Moyes' choices, so cant blame the board there either....

but if the board are telling moyes he only has 3 or 4 mill to play with in the summer it seriously reduces the players he can look at, if he has 100 mill he can look at anyone and tempt them with big wages. Forget Blackburn and Pompy, what about Chelsea and Man City, have you forgotten about them???

[Matt]

 

Every action has a consequence. Of course there is room for blame and negativity, we have just lost THE best manager in the world, to probably THE biggest and strongest(trying hard not to say best cos we all know the blues are the best) team in the world. Its sad as fu*k and I do and will blame Kenwright. Sorry.

we didnt lose him, he chose to walk and join the biggest club in the world.

 

also, in regards to passion verus ruthlessness. Youre right in that business men should be ruthless in order to make a profit, which could also mean the investment is promised then pulled, as weve seen many times before. The passion is what keeps us safe from groups that might do just that. On the other hand, its a handicap. But Id rather be cautious than gamble and see the club disappear...

[Hafnia]

simple question, yes or no - did it happen?

 

AKA - why let the content get in the way of a good strapline

 

I'd love to see you on holiday...

 

"excuse me sir, why are you taking the TV, Coffee machine and sun lounger with you?"

 

"look at this - on my booking confirmation - does it say "all inclusive?"

 

"yes, but if you read the fine details...."

 

"never mind that - does it say all inclusive!?"

 

"well yes it does, but what it states can be misinterpreted - you need to read the detail"

 

"it says all inclusive"

 

Next thing you are in a police cell........

[Matt]

but if the board are telling moyes he only has 3 or 4 mill to play with in the summer it seriously reduces the players he can look at, if he has 100 mill he can look at anyone and tempt them with big wages. Forget Blackburn and Pompy, what about Chelsea and Man City, have you forgotten about them???

he was being told he had money to play with this summer. He left for a bigger job.

 

Chelsea (falling from grace now), Man City.... Versus Portsmouth, Leeds, Blackburn, QPR, Malaga (i think)....

 

 

 

Come on lads, we don't the divisiveness right now, this is a time when we need to be as one.

 

Yes the board haven't been the best (I would like rid of them) but Moyes left through his own choosing, because it was Manchester United. He wouldn't have turned them down, he's not an Everton man despite being here for 11 years.

 

Moyes is gone. Everton is not. Focus on that.

Good call.

[Matt]

 

AKA - why let the content get in the way of a good strapline

 

I'd love to see you on holiday...

 

"excuse me sir, why are you taking the TV, Coffee machine and sun lounger with you?"

 

"look at this - on my booking confirmation - does it say "all inclusive?"

 

"yes, but if you read the fine details...."

 

"never mind that - does it say all inclusive!?"

 

"well yes it does, but what it states can be misinterpreted - you need to read the detail"

again, you fail to answer a simple question. Yes or no Haf?

[SimonButtle]

Since Kenwright has been chairman, Everton have had 3 record signings - Johnson, Yak and Felli. Wasnt Beattie a record deal too? anyway, its that simple and like it or not, its part of the good (albeit relatively little good) that the Kenwright reign has done.

 

What you seem to not understand, is that I agree with a lot of what you write, but the fact you cant, and seemingly flatout refuse to present a balanced argument just takes anyway any credibility (in my eyes). I dont like Elstone, I dont do the spin (and yes, your last little question is spin, from you), I look at the facts and prepare a balanced opinion. If I went into a management meeting with all the facts but refusing to accept some of them because Ive made up my mind, Id be laughed at.

 

Our transfer spend maybe relatively low. But we have the best team ive ever seen and that has cost us in wages (taking up most of our income, affecting our transfer budget). Its also happened under Kenwrights reign. How it happened was not my point (there I agree with you), but it did happen.

At the end of the day though Matt, whilst i agree that it's been our best team, what have Kenwright,Moyes and that team actually acheived? Bill could do himself a lot of favours by making a quick(but sensible) appointment and giving that person a healthy summer transfer budget. There have been + and - to the Kenwright reign like you say, and it's only fair to look at both sides of the argument.

[andydray]

Come on lads, we don't the divisiveness right now, this is a time when we need to be as one.

 

Yes the board haven't been the best (I would like rid of them) but Moyes left through his own choosing, because it was Manchester United. He wouldn't have turned them down, he's not an Everton man despite being here for 11 years.

 

Moyes is gone. Everton is not. Focus on that.

His own choosing because Kenwright had let him go as far as he could. If you had a fat Mrs and you were thinkin bout leaving her cos she's fat, then all of a sudden she realised she was fat, sorted it out and became a stunner, would you leave her, or think fuc8 me, im stickin round. You'd stay mate and I know u would!!! Its the same her, if Kenwright had of made it more appealing, maybe staying put would be his CHOOSING. Get ya head out the sand mate.

[Matt]

At the end of the day though Matt, whilst i agree that it's been our best team, what have Kenwright,Moyes and that team actually acheived? Bill could do himself a lot of favours by making a quick(but sensible) appointment and giving that person a healthy summer transfer budget. There have been + and - to the Kenwright reign like you say, and it's only fair to look at both sides of the argument.

thats all im trying to do....

[andydray]

he was being told he had money to play with this summer. He left for a bigger job.

 

Chelsea (falling from grace now), Man City.... Versus Portsmouth, Leeds, Blackburn, QPR, Malaga (i think)....

 

 

 

Good call.

too late tho matt waasn't it. Needed it 4, 5 years ago.

[SimonButtle]

thats all im trying to do....

I know, i think everyone is just a little wound up at the moment thats all.

[Matt]

too late tho matt waasn't it. Needed it 4, 5 years ago.

indeed we did. Like I said, board could and shouldve done better. But to cherrypick bits and ignore the small bits of good they did just irritates me

[Avinalaff]

 

Every action has a consequence. Of course there is room for blame and negativity, we have just lost THE best manager in the world, to probably THE biggest and strongest(trying hard not to say best cos we all know the blues are the best) team in the world. Its sad as fu*k and I do and will blame Kenwright. Sorry.

 

The manager has gone - Long live the manager

 

I understand your pain, but in time it will pass. He has been given possibly the best job in football, and I'm delighted for the guy. Had he gone to Sunderland, I would have been 'sad', but for me, it's like seeing somebody you care about go on to great things, so all the best to him, and I'm a little proud that it was 'our' manager that was considered the best by a club who could have hired God himself to manage them. I was initially disheartened, but now I'm coming to terms with it, and determined to embrace what ever happens with as much positivity as possible.

 

For once, all fans should get behind the club, wish Moyes well, and support the next manager with as much enthusiasm as we did Moyes.

[Romey 1878]

 

The manager has gone - Long live the manager

 

I understand your pain, but in time it will pass. He has been given possibly the best job in football, and I'm delighted for the guy. Had he gone to Sunderland, I would have been 'sad', but for me, it's like seeing somebody you care about go on to great things, so all the best to him, and I'm a little proud that it was 'our' manager that was considered the best by a club who could have hired God himself to manage them. I was initially disheartened, but now I'm coming to terms with it, and determined to embrace what ever happens with as much positivity as possible.

 

For once, all fans should get behind the club, wish Moyes well, and support the next manager with as much enthusiasm as we did Moyes.

Unbelievably, I agree wholeheartedly with this .