pax Posted July 8, 2011 Report Share Posted July 8, 2011 Sorry Pax, I think you may well be talking the best of it as feared. I was not a fan of Fellaini for a good while, I could not see how he could impact the premier league, his lack of pace being the concern. He is one of the most composed on the ball at the club - if not the most. He is one of only two players we have that would get in any premier league team alongside Baines. Tell me a midfielder who breaks up play, offers an ariel threat and retains and shows for the ball as much as him? - £25m? Liverpool paid £20m for a player slightly younger who could not lace his boots. A player who despite felli being injured could not get near him at goodison when sunderland visited. With prices being quoted for others he is £35m plus. Think we'll just have to agree to disagree Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blue 250 Posted July 8, 2011 Report Share Posted July 8, 2011 If someone offered £25 million for Fellaini, i'd do cartwheels. I think Fellaini has put in one of the most complete performances as a midfielder i have seen in an Everton shirt vs Man City. However, i largely think the guy is over rated, inconsistent and simply not up to the pace of the Prem league week in week out. His passing is also pretty awful. Fellaini will only get better, never sell your best players unless they either want to go, or your offered really stupid money.£25 million isn't stupid enough for Fellaini, the only question then is, does he want to leave, if not, then he should stay.Same with Baines and maybe Jagielka. It was a disaster letting Pienarr go, I'm still gutted over that move. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted July 8, 2011 Report Share Posted July 8, 2011 Fellaini will only get better, never sell your best players unless they either want to go, or your offered really stupid money.£25 million isn't stupid enough for Fellaini, the only question then is, does he want to leave, if not, then he should stay.Same with Baines and maybe Jagielka. It was a disaster letting Pienarr go, I'm still gutted over that move. agreed, what people need to remember is that we have no way of attracting the players who have developed into what they are at Everton. We can forever keep taking a gamble that they might, but this is never guaranteed. We could never attract a current form and proven Baines, Arteta, Fellaini, Jagielka or even Cahill - as other clubs would outmuscle us financially and ambition wise. Yes we can attract the equivalent of what they were several years before - but that is not a model for progress. We need to supplement these players and unfortunately we haven't made hay whilst the sun shines. It will only be a matter of a couple of years before we need to back fill a few players past their best - cahill, neville, distin, arteta, saha, yak. Arguably part of what was the best value for money buys the league has seen. What will it cost to replace them like for like? £40m? and that's even before we address our current short falls. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blue4Ever Posted July 8, 2011 Report Share Posted July 8, 2011 (edited) If someone offered £25 million for Fellaini, i'd do cartwheels. I'd rather sell Fellaini than Baines or Rodwell (and maybe even Coleman). I strongly advise you to go and get every head test you can. Other than Baines who was are best player last season by a mile, Fellaini has the most class and he is probably the only player in our team who would play regulary in any team in our league. He has had bad games everyone else has but not many players have got the better of Yaya Toure last season who was my player of the year. Arteta on his day is as good as Fellaini but we might never see him at his best I hope im wrong. I personally wouldnt sell him unless we got a stupid bid I would rather lose Rodwell at 30 Million which after last season is a stupid valuation even though I do think he will become a legend at us if he stays loyal but not many people do these days. Edited July 8, 2011 by Blue4Ever Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pax Posted July 8, 2011 Report Share Posted July 8, 2011 I strongly advise you to go and get every head test you can. Other than Baines who was are best player last season by a mile, Fellaini has the most class and he is probably the only player in our team who would play regulary in any team in our league. He has had bad games everyone else has but not many players have got the better of Yaya Toure last season who was my player of the year. Arteta on his day is as good as Fellaini but we might never see him at his best I hope im wrong. I personally wouldnt sell him unless we got a stupid bid I would rather lose Rodwell at 30 Million which after last season is a stupid valuation even though I do think he will become a legend at us if he stays loyal but not many people do these days. I strongly advise you learn that others have differing opinions to yours and that there is no absolute correct answer, which means no one is right or wrong. I think the best midfield player in the league by some considerable distance is Essien. I think he's twice the player Toure is and on a different planet to Fellaini. Now don't go getting your knickers in a twist, as all the above is my opinion only. I'm not right, i'm not wrong, i'm just expressing my opinion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pax Posted July 8, 2011 Report Share Posted July 8, 2011 Yes we can attract the equivalent of what they were several years before - but that is not a model for progress. Why not? Why in the current financial climate is this not a good model for the future. Buy low, sell high. Seems to be a pretty good way of making large sums of money, especially when there aren't any other ways that Everton can make that kind of money. We've gone from consistent relegation candidates to consistent European qualification on the base of a good manager and the Rooney, Johnson and Lescott money. Doesn't look a bad option and i think our only option right now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marcus jones Posted July 8, 2011 Report Share Posted July 8, 2011 All well and told when we have saleable assets on the pitch, what happens when ALL our best players are sold? We wont be buying in the next best but the third best players, thus depleting the pool from which other teams will want to buy from. West Ham did it with Cole, Lampard, Ferdinand etc, and replaced them with what? Third rate players, we COULD go the same way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted July 8, 2011 Report Share Posted July 8, 2011 All well and told when we have saleable assets on the pitch, what happens when ALL our best players are sold? We wont be buying in the next best but the third best players, thus depleting the pool from which other teams will want to buy from. West Ham did it with Cole, Lampard, Ferdinand etc, and replaced them with what? Third rate players, we COULD go the same way. Saved me a longwinded post there. West ham prime example, add to that Defoe, carrick, and you are looking at 5 players who have all been on the pitch together in an England shirt... Now tell me it's a model for success. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeO Posted July 8, 2011 Report Share Posted July 8, 2011 Saved me a longwinded post there. West ham prime example, add to that Defoe, carrick, and you are looking at 5 players who have all been on the pitch together in an England shirt... Now tell me it's a model for success. But they've also had the "promised land" of the foreign takeover (which is what the protesters are telling us is the model for success)...£85m in 2006...Mascherano and Tevez signed and they were going to be World beaters. There's no comparison between their position and ours. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pax Posted July 8, 2011 Report Share Posted July 8, 2011 All well and told when we have saleable assets on the pitch, what happens when ALL our best players are sold? We wont be buying in the next best but the third best players, thus depleting the pool from which other teams will want to buy from. West Ham did it with Cole, Lampard, Ferdinand etc, and replaced them with what? Third rate players, we COULD go the same way. At what stage did i say we need to sell 'ALL' our best players? West Ham is not the model i would want to follow and not what i suggested. I always find 'could' to be a very subjective word. The world COULD flood tomorrow and everyone and everything dies. The financial climate is also nothing near what is was when West Ham held an auction for all their best players. The whole business of football has transformed dramatically. Selling a player for a large transfer fee every 4 years to fund the purchase or 3 or 4 more players seems to be quite a solid policy right now. We also seem to have a good record of doing it. Or, we have that other plan to raise large funds for fresh players every three to four years, only problem is, i can't quite remember what the other plan is, could you remind me? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted July 8, 2011 Report Share Posted July 8, 2011 (edited) But they've also had the "promised land" of the foreign takeover (which is what the protesters are telling us is the model for success)...£85m in 2006...Mascherano and Tevez signed and they were going to be World beaters. There's no comparison between their position and ours. Point being made is that selling your best young talent to the highest bidder is not a good model nowadays, scouting is a science. Yep you can get the odd one wrong (Jeffers) but all previous mentioned bar Defoe have a premier league medal. Given the fact that we are now in a position where the best of our talent may need to be sold to fund moves for lesser players is this the way we want to go? Everything the current board have tried to do has failed: fortress, kings dock, ntl, kirby, selling bellefield and now renting a facility a £1m per year that we sold for £7m, the new park end development. Sorry it all amounts to crap. Have we really got much to lose? Many questions need answering: for one are we for sale? Or is the current board waiting for Moyes the decorator to turn a shed into a palace using a toothbrush ? Edited July 8, 2011 by Hafnia Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oztoffee Posted July 9, 2011 Report Share Posted July 9, 2011 (edited) Why not? Why in the current financial climate is this not a good model for the future. Buy low, sell high. Seems to be a pretty good way of making large sums of money, especially when there aren't any other ways that Everton can make that kind of money. We've gone from consistent relegation candidates to consistent European qualification on the base of a good manager and the Rooney, Johnson and Lescott money. Doesn't look a bad option and i think our only option right now. It hurts like hell to say so, but I have to agree. We all would like to have the money to buy a couple of decent strikers,a winger, etc etc. but I'm afraid some on here need a harsh dose of reality. Apart from having a fairy godmother wave a magic wand, where do we get the cash from to buy these players? Let's say you want another car, but don't have the cash. So you go to the loan arranger (and Tonto!) and they say,'What have you got as collateral?' You then remember that you've re-mortgaged the house already to buy the car you've got now - can't use that. The missus gets cranky with you because you're not earning enough to keep her in the manner to which she's become accustomed and all your friends give you shit on facebook, twitter and various websites because she says 'you don't perform'. The only way you'll get another car is by trading in the one you have now that's fully paid for and buying another for less money and buying the missus a bunch of flowers. This is reality. This is the way the club has to work to survive. Unless a fairy godmother in the shape of a buyer turns up at the front door at Goodison with a wad of cash, that will be the reality for this club for the forseeable future. As I said,it's crap but that is the reality of the situation. If the board had a way out of this, don't you think they would have taken it? Please don't insult our intelligence by coming up with some sort of conspiracy theory, or say 'the board doesn't care' or 'the board doesn't know football'. Everton FC is a business that also happens to be a football club. Do not get confused.In this league there can be no football club without being a business first. (See Portsmouth FC) So all of you whingers out there, get to your local timber merchant, buy some timber, build a bridge and GET OVER IT! Edited July 9, 2011 by Oztoffee Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duncanmckenzieismagic Posted July 9, 2011 Report Share Posted July 9, 2011 Yes, before his injury he had played very well for a few games. I also know the lad is young and will improve, but i've watched him play a lot and he is cumbersome a lot of the time. He gives the ball away easily and panics when put under pressure. He also isn't the quickest player around the pitch. Rodwell i feel for. Moyes needs to make up his mind where Rodwell is going to play and start playing him there consistently. I see huge potential in the boy and this could be a defining season for him if managed correctly. Being able to play Rodwell in his chosen position would help if we had more options, which would only come from the sale of a valuable player. Fellaini to me is not a £15 million player. He isn't a £10 million player. So if, and if is the key word here, wanted to offer £25 million or more, it's simply not a deal our club could turn down right now. You could easily play JH in front of the back 4, Arteta as the play maker in the middle of the park with Rodwell (who i believe is a good passer) Osman could play on the right and we could potentially go out and get some like N'zogbia to play down the left. Wigan will want around £12 million (not sure when his contract is up) for him, leaving £8 million to fund a new striker. Sell Yobo and possibly Yak, we might get £6 million to £8 million for those to, suddenly things aint too bad. Fell @ £25 million + Yak and Yob @ £8 million. £6 million to service debt, £12 million for N'Zogbia and leave £15 million for a striker and possible another player or two. That's my theory anyway. I also have a feeling i'm talking shite as i can't believe anyone would pay £25 million for Fel just now (or in the future). I have tended to agree with pretty much everything you have said but IMHO you are way off the mark regarding Fellaini He is the most complete midfielder in the Premiership and is certainly the best player in the country in his position. I certainly wouldnt swap him for Essien (long term knee injury yet again) He is very composed on the ball and always seems to find the time and space to bring the ball down and use it well, which ids the sign of a great player. So how you can come to the conclusion that he panics under pressure is beyond me. Felli would walk in to any team in the Prem he is that good. I know its all about opinions but when there are so many people disagreeing so strongly with you and you cant find anyone who thinks your right then maybe its time to admit you have got it wrong. When you say you have watched him a lot and he is cumbersome a lot of the time then I can only assume that you only watch him in training because I watch Everton home and away and more often than not he is the stand out performer! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pax Posted July 9, 2011 Report Share Posted July 9, 2011 He is the most complete midfielder in the Premiership and is certainly the best player in the country in his position. I certainly wouldnt swap him for Essien (long term knee injury yet again) Felli would walk in to any team in the Prem he is that good. I know its all about opinions but when there are so many people disagreeing so strongly with you and you cant find anyone who thinks your right then maybe its time to admit you have got it wrong. When you say you have watched him a lot and he is cumbersome a lot of the time then I can only assume that you only watch him in training because I watch Everton home and away and more often than not he is the stand out performer! Can't quite believe some of those superlatives you have used. Also, having a majority agreeing on one side does not make anything right or wrong. I certainly am not wrong because a few more people on a web forum disagree with me rather than agree with me. That's ludicrous. One or two economists predicted the global financial meltdown we have just gone through, does that mean they were wrong because nearly every other one economists said it wouldn't amount to what it did? Oh and your assumptions are also wrong. So strange how some simply cannot accept other peoples opinions and foolishly think they can tell someone their opinion is wrong or right when there is no wrong or right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duncanmckenzieismagic Posted July 9, 2011 Report Share Posted July 9, 2011 (edited) Can't quite believe some of those superlatives you have used. Also, having a majority agreeing on one side does not make anything right or wrong. I certainly am not wrong because a few more people on a web forum disagree with me rather than agree with me. That's ludicrous. One or two economists predicted the global financial meltdown we have just gone through, does that mean they were wrong because nearly every other one economists said it wouldn't amount to what it did? Oh and your assumptions are also wrong. So strange how some simply cannot accept other peoples opinions and foolishly think they can tell someone their opinion is wrong or right when there is no wrong or right. If that was the case then fair enough but its not. Its not merely a few more people its an overwhelming majority You would be hard pushed to find anybody on the froum or at Goodison who agrees with you on this one. It Incidently which superlatives cant you beleive? Edited July 9, 2011 by duncanmckenzieismagic Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pax Posted July 9, 2011 Report Share Posted July 9, 2011 If that was the case then fair enough but its not. Its not merely a few more people its an overwhelming majority You would be hard pushed to find anybody on the froum or at Goodison who agrees with you on this one. It Incidently which superlatives cant you beleive? Actually, quite a few of the people who sit near me in the Park End don't rate Fellaini as a consistent footballer, so that kind of puts your theory in check and proved my theory that no one is right or wrong, it's just opinions. Which superlative? All of them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duncanmckenzieismagic Posted July 10, 2011 Report Share Posted July 10, 2011 Actually, quite a few of the people who sit near me in the Park End don't rate Fellaini as a consistent footballer, so that kind of puts your theory in check and proved my theory that no one is right or wrong, it's just opinions. Which superlative? All of them. Well if you cant accept that you are very much in the minority then we will just have to agree to disagree But thank God Moysie doesnt share your opinion! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevO Posted July 10, 2011 Report Share Posted July 10, 2011 All I can really offer is that if felli was not a good player would he be attracting clubs the size of the ones who have showed interest? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marcus jones Posted July 10, 2011 Report Share Posted July 10, 2011 Jesus! A goal scoring, athletic, great tackling, defensive midfielder who has skill in abundance. David Batty he aint and for the life of me can not understand why he has any critisism at all. He can do so much more than " a Makele". A far better player than some believe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Finn balor Posted July 10, 2011 Report Share Posted July 10, 2011 The lad is going to be a superstar. He would walk into Uniteds, Chelsea's, City's, Arsenals team in a heartbeat. I think felli had Toure in his pocket at eastlands this season in fact embarrassingly so. The game is about opinions and only time will tell who is right but if Felli doesnt sign a new deal this summer we cant have another Pioneer situation as much as it kills me to say it. Felliani can be the COMPLETE modern day midfielder, he is a baby and he is going to get better and better. Too good for us im afraid Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pax Posted July 11, 2011 Report Share Posted July 11, 2011 Well if you cant accept that you are very much in the minority then we will just have to agree to disagree But thank God Moysie doesnt share your opinion! If you can show me where i have once stated i'm not in a minority, then i will follow suit and claim Fellaini is the greatest player to ever touch grass. Stop making things up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pax Posted July 11, 2011 Report Share Posted July 11, 2011 All I can really offer is that if felli was not a good player would he be attracting clubs the size of the ones who have showed interest? Name one actual bid that has been made for him? Not media speculation and rubbish, an actual bid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pax Posted July 11, 2011 Report Share Posted July 11, 2011 Jesus! A goal scoring, athletic, great tackling, defensive midfielder who has skill in abundance. David Batty he aint and for the life of me can not understand why he has any critisism at all. He can do so much more than " a Makele". A far better player than some believe. 11 goals in 73 games is not exactly what i would call 'goal scoring'. Why on earth is he not running the Barcelona midfield if he is the most complete player to ever live, as per your description. He's not fit to lace the boots of players like Xavi, Ineista and Essien and think i'd better leave this thread well alone as i fear some of your are quite mad. Hail Fellaini, the player who makes Maradona look decidedly average Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marcopaulo Posted July 11, 2011 Report Share Posted July 11, 2011 it's more goals than lee carsley not sure the sarcasm about maradona was needed but i can see why you did it with the attitude of some on here at times..i really cannot see what you have against him especially the under pressure thing cos even when he was playin shit near the top he still didn't panic in my eyes but that's fair enough i won't belittle your opinion..and not sure what the big deal is with essien myself..think i'm in a minority over him cos only thing i have ever seen him do was score against barcelona..and then he fucked that up by givin the ball back to them in last minute Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pax Posted July 11, 2011 Report Share Posted July 11, 2011 it's more goals than lee carsley not sure the sarcasm about maradona was needed but i can see why you did it with the attitude of some on here at times..i really cannot see what you have against him especially the under pressure thing cos even when he was playin shit near the top he still didn't panic in my eyes but that's fair enough i won't belittle your opinion..and not sure what the big deal is with essien myself..think i'm in a minority over him cos only thing i have ever seen him do was score against barcelona..and then he fucked that up by givin the ball back to them in last minute My sarcasm was purely aimed at those who have described the worlds best player on this thread, something i find absolutely hilarious. I think i need to reaffirm my point on this. I have never stated Fellaini is a bad player or even not a very good player. What i have stated is that i think there are some major flaws to his game and his consistency. My main point was that if someone was going to offer £25 million for him, then i'd bite their hand off for it. I personally think losing Fellaini but adding four £5 million pound players to the squads, some much needed pace and creativity would be far better for the club than hanging onto a player i don't rate as highly as others. That was it. With regards to Essien. I live very close to Stamford Bridge and a lot of my neighbours and work colleagues are season ticket holders at Chelsea. When they are playing and Everton are not or when i can't get up to Liverpool, i often get chucked some free tickets to Chelsea. Essien for me is one of the most outstanding players i have ever seen. He passes well, he's is powerful, tackles well, read's the game well, good in the air, never stops running and is consistent from game to game. He does all the important work that goes un-noticed in a modern era where flicks, backheels and goals are all that matter. I've always been a person who admires defenders and grafters more than flair players and strikers. Players like Roy Keane are more enjoyable to watch than that little oik Ronaldo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marcopaulo Posted July 11, 2011 Report Share Posted July 11, 2011 you mean he cleans up just like felli does? nothin there you said about essien that isn't true about fellaini in my eyes..mind you if we all used the same eyes how borin would football be eh! plus fellaini make bellamy look like a cunt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pax Posted July 11, 2011 Report Share Posted July 11, 2011 you mean he cleans up just like felli does? nothin there you said about essien that isn't true about fellaini in my eyes..mind you if we all used the same eyes how borin would football be eh! plus fellaini make bellamy look like a cunt As i have already stated, in my opinion, Fellaini isn't fit to lace Essien's boots. Essien does everting at least three times better than MF. Obviously this will enrage the MF is the best player in the world mob, but he really should be better in the air too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevO Posted July 11, 2011 Report Share Posted July 11, 2011 Name one actual bid that has been made for him? Not media speculation and rubbish, an actual bid. In terms of transfers we can only judge by speculation unfortunately, but I always trust notes judgement on players as he looks at them a lot more than I do. He clearly rates him. So one club who have made a solid concrete bid? Everton. And I am very very glad they did. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted July 11, 2011 Report Share Posted July 11, 2011 As i have already stated, in my opinion, Fellaini isn't fit to lace Essien's boots. Essien does everting at least three times better than MF. Obviously this will enrage the MF is the best player in the world mob, but he really should be better in the air too. Yep, essien is 3 times better than fellaini in the air. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duncanmckenzieismagic Posted July 11, 2011 Report Share Posted July 11, 2011 My sarcasm was purely aimed at those who have described the worlds best player on this thread, something i find absolutely hilarious. I think i need to reaffirm my point on this. I have never stated Fellaini is a bad player or even not a very good player. What i have stated is that i think there are some major flaws to his game and his consistency. My main point was that if someone was going to offer £25 million for him, then i'd bite their hand off for it. I personally think losing Fellaini but adding four £5 million pound players to the squads, some much needed pace and creativity would be far better for the club than hanging onto a player i don't rate as highly as others. That was it. With regards to Essien. I live very close to Stamford Bridge and a lot of my neighbours and work colleagues are season ticket holders at Chelsea. When they are playing and Everton are not or when i can't get up to Liverpool, i often get chucked some free tickets to Chelsea. Essien for me is one of the most outstanding players i have ever seen. He passes well, he's is powerful, tackles well, read's the game well, good in the air, never stops running and is consistent from game to game. He does all the important work that goes un-noticed in a modern era where flicks, backheels and goals are all that matter. I've always been a person who admires defenders and grafters more than flair players and strikers. Players like Roy Keane are more enjoyable to watch than that little oik Ronaldo. Why dont you practice what you preach and stop making things up? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.